Personally, I far prefer a shotgun for home defense as the sound of a round being pumped into the chamber is enough to change any half way sensible person’s mind and if it doesn’t then they should be removed from the gene pool. When I was a LEO others would make fun of my carrying a .45 hogleg (.44 Magnums did not exist then) instead of a standard .38. I would point out that if I was only interested in killing I would carry a .22 but I was more interested in intimidating people into surrendering than in racking up kills.

You are correct that it would be possible to disarm a teacher and use her gun to kill people but that same reasoning proves that we shall never be safe from being killed by someone having a gun illegally until we disarm LEOs. The sterling young gentlemen (gangbangers) have discovered that the cheapest and safest way to get weapons is to stake out a gym where the LEOs work out and pop the trunk of a car. If said LEO happens to be SWAT then they obtain some truly great weapons at no cost. As an ex-sniper I have had no problem shooting someone threatening me. As a deputy I once fired 2 rifle rounds and removed two from the gene pool who were foolish enough not to surrender but advanced upon me firing fully automatic weapons.

Canadian. Good observation. The spell checker works differently on some words here due to British English spelling being used throughout the commonwealth.

That wasn’t the question. Re-read and answer the question. Simply, what has your crime rate done since your gun ban legislation? Compare to the US, not relavent. You’re up over 300 %, Australia up over 450 % since their’s. Their constituents aren’t pleased with their outcome nor are most of your’s in Canada.
I know it’s an old over used saw, but it does happen to be true and you folks are learning this: outlaw guns and only outlaws will have the guns. Why is it so difficult to understand this very basic of dictums: they are called criminals because they pay no attention to the laws. Pass all the legislation you want and all you do is make it easier for the criminal, plain and simple.

Canada’s overall crime rate has been steadily dropping since 1992. There was a further 6% drop in 2011 and the overall crime rate is now the lowest it has been since 1972. That’s from the CBC and RCMP websites.

Australia’s Ministry of Justice and Office of Home Affairs reports that crime rates have continued to fall across most major categories. Some of their stats are:
– break ins have dropped by half since 1996.
– car theft dropped by 61% over the last decade.
– 27% drop in homicides.
– victims of robbery in 2010 were the lowest on record at 14,582 victims
– their homicide rate is 1.2 per 100,000 people.

I would ask where in the heck you got those percentages from but I think I now know. In trying to access official statistics from police and government agencies on the internet, you have to wade through mountains of websites set up by gun advocates making outlandish claims and ridiculous statements. Common sense should tell anyone that their numbers and stats can’t possibly be right. Gun groups have gone to a hell of a lot of effort to fill the internet with their crap. Any search involving any of the key words surrounding guns will bring you to their websites first, and there’s no end to them.

Guess you never took a reading course in grade school

Guns and abortions are currently legal (not everywhere).

The GOP and the Far Right choose to see one as a privilege (guns) and the other as a crime (abortion).

So at this point you have one of your ideals protected. And anyone at anytime can take their rage out on innocent people. A manic with a gun is the sole arbiter of the ILLEGAL choice of action.

Whereas the doctor , the mother and her conscience make that LEGAL choice.

The interpretation of the 2nd amendment allows ownership of guns. It does not establish a right. We do not have a right to drive a car, we are allowed to drive a car. We are required by law to have a license to operate the vehicle. Why not guns?

A fair argument has been had by the public and in the courts on gun ownership. I don’t think it is unreasonable to debate the usage and licensing of.

As far as being in the Declaration or the Constitution. Women’s suffrage was not in there at one time. Nor was protection of one’s civil rights. Prohibition was in and out of the Constitution.

The ability to have an abortion is an off shoot of a Constitutional interpretation by the Supreme Court in its ruling on the right to privacy in Roe v Wade.

You really think this guy and others like him, intent on murder, are going to care about breaking another law.

All I can say is; the parents of those dead children are in total disagreement with all gun defenders. The fact that hand guns are so available. I could go out tomorrow and come home with one. I live in a large city and guns are everywhere. I watch football with some friends they all carry guns, and they said if I want one they can hook me up. Cheap. The talk around my friends is the fantasy of how they would react if they had to use it. At times it sounds like they dream of it, and can’t wait for the day.

I saw a picture recently of Dodge City. They did not allow guns in town. They had a small shack where everyone had to turn in their guns before coming in to Dodge. Gun deaths drop dramatically. I can’t imagine some cowpoke citing the 2nd amendment. Where ever you were in the old west, that law prevailed.

And you have the omnipotence to determined the Rights of a zygote, a blastocyst and an embryo. There is no unborn child. A child is a fully formed human you hold in your arms, nurse and love. Stop with this nonsense.

This scam you certainists are pulling with this person-hood crap. You can’t properly defend your cause, so you invent these clever little ploys.

Here is the ground zero of your problems. You use Religion in your argument. That is an assumption that your belief matches everyone else. It is certainty of opinion with zero evidence to support it. Other than an artificial moral code you pretend to believe out of convenience to make your argument.

You support capital punishment, starving the poor, denying healthcare to Americans,
War for War’s sake, wealth for wealth’s sake, Racism, Misogyny, Homophobia and Xenophobia. No equality in education for the masses. And this constant drum beat of holding the high moral ground. Your hypocrites. A great man, Roger Williams said; “When you mix Religion with Politics, you get Politics. That is the crux of your inability to get anything done that serves all Americans. Other than the chosen few, including yourself, you have selected.

What can be said about people who support their opinions with a mythological belief.

What has me riled up is what happened in Connecticut. How are they able to convince non believers of the existence of this invisible Deity they praise. When this all powerful being stood by and allowed 20 innocent children go to their death. A completely unnecessary waste of way too young lives. I will scream if I get one of their classic, God works in mysterious ways, it’s a test, yeah some test, 20 little children. Or it’s some sort of lesson no one needed.

This is shameful that the Faithful do not accept some blame for this sad event. It is their God, all of the kids and teachers were praying to right before they died.

And the answer form above. Not interested. Please try again later. When it’s too late.

and as a Right Wing hack your agenda is to create a plutocracy to overthrow the democracy we have had for so many years. Give the power over to the Profit takers, whose first concern is money, not the well being of the society. Also, suffer on to the unfortunate more suffering by accusing them of being the sole problem with the inability of your kind to eliminate anything that interrupts your plans for a Utopian world of self sufficiency and every man for himself. Greed, good. Wealth for Wealth’s sake, good. Assassinating those in need, Bad. Unless they can pass a stringent social test to prove their need. Being poor is a personal flaw. Being old is a personal flaw. Being at the bottom of the economic mountain is a personal flaw.

Your selfish, self serving, egoistical people. You satisfy yourself with contempt and negativity. Always at the ready to deny others to advance an ideology built on hate, disgust and self loathing.

Always contesting everything that unnerves your pearly white state of mind.
Guns, suppression of the underclass, denying the vote to win elections, what ever action necessary to achieve this imaginary all white, all Christian, Profit Taking Disney land on the hill. Back when things were less complicated. Denying yourself the truth that things were never less complicated. What you mean is when you were young and care free and the recipient of parental welfare. Unless you grew up in a Christian Conservative Calvinist household, and you were taught that you have to forget about parental help and accept whatever is given to you as all you are worth. Before personal disappointment set in, and responsibility to others, pressured you.

I worked at 12 as well I sold produce form the back of the truck, I ran errands for the elderly and shined shoes. And I did not grow up to resent people who desired to earn a livable wage for the time they put in all week. A chance to move from the not so great neighborhood I lived in, a chance to go somewhere that had better schools and less crime. A chance to enter the middle class, and the unions helped make that happen. The country thrived, the Middle Class exploded, more kids got to go to college and move up in the world. The suburbs grew, better schools were built and hired better teachers, it cost a little more money for the better teachers. And the streets were cleaner, the trash was picked up twice a week rather than maybe once a week where I grew up. The super markets had fresher food, the pot holes got fixed faster, the snow was plowed, our neighborhood never saw a plow ever. The neighbors had to dig each other out. We were a neighbor inhabited by the working poor. Welfare food, before food stamps the Government gave you food, like blocks of orange cheese. These were proud hard working people, kind and considerate people. People looking for a way out. The union jobs paid way better than the factories in out neighborhood, but you had to have a reliable car to get there, public transportation was the greatest back then.

There were roadblocks to getting out of the neighborhoods. Education, literacy, yes we had people who could not read and write. I guess we could have ridiculed them and blamed then for coming from a hard background where the kids had to go to work at 16. So finishing school was out of the question.

When I here the GOP talk about the unfortunate like they have some self inflicted disease. I think back to those decent people who busted their nuts for chump change. But stll could not get ahead, they were in debt to everyone, the utilities companies, the coal company, the super market, the clothing store, you name it they were in debt for it. I knew there were people out side who didn’t like our kind. I was adventurous, I roamed around the big city, met different people, some did not respond well when I told them where I lived. But in time I learned about people like that. MOsltly White, mostly republicans, mostly rude. I realized that was not who I wanted to grow up to be. JFK come through our Neighborhood when he was running for the Presidency. I was lucky enough to have met him and get his autograph. I followed his motorcade. It stopped, he got out of his car, and gave a speech. I had never heard anyone speak like that before. He impressed me. I was told he was a millionaire, but he was amazingly aware of how we lived. He talked about better wages, and stuff that the grownups talked about. He was not condescending like the people I met in my travels who looked down on me becasue of my background. He inspired me to become a Democrat a liberal at 16 and to become more interested in school. I wanted to be able to speak like that and know about what he knew. I became a Union supporter because I saw the improvement in peoples lives who worked a Union job. People loved the Unions. They all dreamed of having a Union job.

It did not appear as though the world was coming to an end. if anything, better cars started popping up, people were moving to the suburbs. We moved to the suburbs. It was a dramatic change, I did not realize people lived like that all the time. The rise of the working class into the Middle Class made America the envy of the world. The working class were no longer the working poor. What made a difference then, there were no Negroes to blame for what problems remained. The white slobs still got the brunt of it for that. So when I hear GOPers talk about the underclass like they know them, and speak of them with disdain, I get a bit annoyed, I still have friends back in the old neighborhood. When fair wages were paid it wasn’t looked at that the employer was getting rob, he may have thought so, for years he got away paying low wages for long hours. Barely enough for a man to raise his family.

If your idea of a new America where the Corporations can set the wages, and hours and days with no benefits. And see anything other than that as stealing from the owners. I’ve seen what that does to people. And it’s not a good idea for the richest country in the world to take out the desire for wealth on the people who do the hard work. You will at some point have to deal with the underclass you so resent. And they are not going to be happy when they can’t feed their kids.

You are ideological selfish and contemptuous. You are constantly on the hunt for any support for your negative, sourpuss view of life. No one can have any more than they deserve. And you want to be the one who decides what deserves means.

As usual you are so wrong about everything. The Unions killing everything, is FOX and Right Wing propaganda. Initiated by big business to be able to lower there labor costs. And they have succeeded, every one on the Right is prepared to tell anyone who will listen about how the Unions singlehandedly put businesses out of business, and destroyed the ability of the multitude of Billionaires in America from squeezing out the last nickle in profits. My favorite is this: ‘Yes they were good at one time, but we don’t need them anymore.’ Look man, they would pay nothing if they could. And they did when they brought boat loads of slaves to America to do the arduous work in the fields for absolutely free, and the slaves could not follow that contemporary pithy Right Wing gem of advice, “If you don’t like the job quit!” Slavery was driven by greed.
Pure and simple. That is the extent of how far people will go for an extra buck.

The sheer fact that you as an American can defend “Profit Takers” when your fellow Americans are out of work, people who have lost good paying jobs. Went to college to learn a skill to enable them a shot at the American Dream, a good paying job, a family, a house for the family, vacation time, holidays with the family. And you come down on the side of people who fired him to cut costs, even though they were earning profits, but they needed to get their stock value up. I am not talking about small businesses, I am talking abut the companies that drive the economy, Companies that are experiencing record profits as we struggle to get out from the 2nd depression in our country’s history. The stock market is booming. Those large profits do not go back in to the company anymore, they go into hedge funds. That’s what I call “Profit Taking.”

I have no envy of wealth, I have a desire for it, and I don’t begrudge any one who has succeeded. I am retired, I made a lot of money in the music business. I have a beautiful suburban home with a 2 car garage. I have been with my wife for 46 years. There is a VW Passat wagon in one garage and a BMW Z4 Roadster (my baby) in the other. We just sold out summer home at the seashore. Luckily right before Sandy hit. I am going to miss that house, I rehabbed it myself. I have multimillionaire friends, some very famous artists, and managers and record company executives, I am proud of them. By the way they are all happy to pay more in taxes. They are thrilled to have made as much as they have in their careers, and don’t think a hundred thousand dollars or more, it going to break them. That’s how Americans are suppose to behave. We are all in this together, all 300 plus million of us. Down to the last homeless person sleeping in a box. Your contempt for people who care about the common man reflects upon something more in you than the accusation against me re: Begrudging the successful. I have been successful. I am now retired. I am vacationing in California in January, I will be staying with one of the most successful artist managers in the business. He represents two of the worlds biggest icons in music. then I will be going to Istanbul in February, to visit one of my other multimillionaire friends who made his money working for BMW North America. He spent his own money to make should the Americans in Turkey got their absentee ballots in on time. And, one more thing. I had dinner last night with one of the biggest restauranteurs in America. He has been a guest judge on may of the cooking shows on Cable. He owns 25 restaurants, on the east coast and in Europe. These three guys are dear friends of mine, we grew up together, we are all from the same kind of neighborhood I described in my last comment. Hard core Working class neighborhoods. And none of them have forgotten the people who busted their humps to feed their families. The four of us are children of Union people, who becasue of the Unions were able to move to places where the educational opportunities were better, and their sons got go to college and get along in life. I can’t begin to thank my parents enough.

No redistribution of wealth, an other propaganda word. Just a return to the situation where the people who do the heavy lifting get paid a fair wage and some opportunity to join what is becoming a vanishing Middle Class. Why is big business so anti American, anti Middle Class, that they would care more about “Profit Taking” not profit making, and let the Middle Class in America, the envy of the World, shrink in size.

There is more going on here my fiend that you choose for some reason to ignore. The citizens of this country are more important than any schmuck on Wall Street. The citizens: the ones who collect our trash, clean our streets, protect our neighborhoods, put out the fires, rush people to the hospital, teach in our schools.
Now they have been relegated to being called selfish and envious because they want a fair wage. They are now the enemy within. Citizens you think should sacrifice for the Corporations to keep the stock price up. But do not get to benefit in the success of the companies they helped to be successful. It’s that simple that is what it is all about. Nothing sinister. You suggest we all suck it up, be happy Walmart is willing to pay just above poverty line wages. Why would Walmart increase their pay scale if they did not have to. While the Waltons live like Emperors, which they have all the right in the world to do. But resenting the citizens who want to be paid a fair wage, not a barely get by wage. The Waltons spend millions for Lobbyists to get the laws they want from people who the citizens sent to congress. And the Waltons pay millions to propagate this anti Union hysteria. They do not want to spend money to further the futures of the rest of America. Their wage scale is shameful.

The 2nd amendment didn’t mention, UZIs, AK 47s, extended clips for semi auto hand guns. Those weapons are protected by the reading of the constitution by gun advocates and activist judges.

Unfortunately you make an inaccurate assumption that everyone agrees with you.
Everyone does not understand it the way you do. There is a beautiful aspect of subtlety to it. The Constitution was written by very intelligent men with a great understanding of the English language and punctuation. That coma is there for a reason. It is not separating independent clauses as you so eagerly want to believe. If that were the case, these highly educated men would have used a semicolon. And why is it, that they did not? The final construction of the sentence was the 5th or 6th version. They were attempting not to have a restriction on gun ownership it they were to suggest a need (“necessary” was their choice of words) for Militias. British Law stood as the law of the Colonies and guns were banned by the British Laws. The new Government was careful not to continue that law if there was to be a necessity for a Militia, other wise there would be no guns available. Due to the British law and the out break of war, the people who owned guns were by law, honored to donate their weapons to the Militias. It a lot more complicated than you choose to perceive it.

If these mass killings continue and the American opinion shifts, the courts will shift with them. Judges are swayed by public opinion. The gun rights thing has been a political hot potato for Judges up until now. And that is going to change. Public outcry will be at first by Municipal laws, which the police want, then state laws. Judges do not like to being on the wrong side of a political issue.

It’s much more subtle than you can grasp. There is the great example of Herman Melville’s “Moby Dick.” Many people make the assumption it is about a Great White Whale, when in fact it is way more than that.

If I may add one other comment: If you are one of those people who thinks the Government should not be the only ones with guns. That is paranoid romanticism.
Syria and Libya are countries where freedom and rights were actually suppressed. It energized the people of those countries to rise up, with the support of the might of the world’s military to overthrow the oppressive Government. The anti Government fervor in the USA is based on Paranoid Conspiracy theories, plus the Militias in the hills of Montana are no match for the US Military.

The supreme court are not a bunch of 8th graders. Over the years they have been challenged with interpreting the meaning of aspects of the Constitution. It is a challenging document. To read is so literally is to miss the genius of the document.
The same flawed thinking goes into the reading of the Bible in literal terms. You don’t suggest we stone recalcitrant children. Or stone rape victims who live in the city and don’t scream loud enough. We have interpreted the Bible over the centuries and stopped literately interpreting it. We have been challenged by it’s complexity. Many of the black and white words have been passed over for what appears to be the obviousness by 8th graders. Which would be if it says stone, they we must stone.

Gun ownership is not codified in the constitution. “A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.” Codified: Arrange (laws or rules) into a systematic code. There is no systematic code here. It’s one sentence, half of which is separated from the other half by a coma, not the word AND. a coma implies the two parts are interconnected. A semi colon would have made the 2 parts independent clauses. Gun people like to ignore the relationship between the 2 parts and incorrectly see them as two independent clauses, which by the absence of a semicolon, does not read that way. Simple punctuation. Any smart 8th grader would know the codified rules of punctuation. And the rules of punctuation are most definitely codified. Period: end of sentence. coma: a pause. A semi colon: separating two independent clauses. Shorthand for AND. According to the codified laws of punctuation, the sentence is one interconnected statement. These were not poorly educated men or eight graders. These were classically trained men. They spoke Latin and Greek pretty fluently. They knew how to grammatically speak and write. They knew punctuation. Comas were moved around quite a bit in the sentence of the 2nd amendment that is at the center of this controversy. The movement was to create clarity. Gun ownership was a sticky subject back then. Using your way of reading, we should have the right to stone people.
Why have we decided that is not acceptable?

I never quite understood this obsession with guns. Is it a manly thing? Is it a stunted growth hobby? Cowboys and Indians? Hunting doesn’t need a semiautomatic 16 round clip in a Glock> I don;t get it. Self defense? That one is a mystery. Maybe if those kids had guns, things would have been different. If maybe is acceptable then, maybe if God had been paying attention he could have prevented the incident. But apparently he was busy and didn’t hear the cries and prayers of the frightened children. That’s the real blunder here, that’s where the fault lies, with God.

You and your infantile type who have to have guns to play with for no clearly defined reason other than wanting to have something that makes you feel like a grown up.

You choose to frame the amendment to defend a position, I have no position on Guns, only on the misinterpretation of the constitution by the arms industry and the NRA. This has nothing to do with rights of gun ownership. It’s a multibillion dollar business that is frightened of losing money. They contribute to the NRA to be their mouth piece. Brilliant solution, arm the principals of the schools. Yeah, guy comes bursting in firing a semiautomatic weapon and the principal can’t get the gun out of the holster, bam dead! Gun man comes in and the principal is on the other side of the building. Bam, dead students and teachers. More is not the solution. I don’t have one.

I suggest the gun companies and the NRA be compelled to pay for the funeral costs.

If this is the price we have to pay, the death of innocent people, then so be it. I don’t want to deny anyone from having a gun, I want them to stop running to the constitution as a means of justifying some suppressed sexual need that guns bring.

There will be more deaths to come, this is part of our society. Mass murders will prevail, guns will remain legal for anyone who wants one. I met a guy who bought a 50 Caliber Sniper rifle at a gun show. I was a Target shoot, love them. Private land in the mountains of PA. Acres and acres. Full Auto AK 47s, UZIs, this 50 Cal Sniper rifle, gernade launchers, full auto shotguns. There were enough military grade weapons to arm a small squad of soldiers and some left over. I personally like the UZI, smooth easy to handle incredibly accurate. Someone could walk into a Mall with one of these a wipe out a hundred people in a blink. The GLOCK is a hard gun to handle, fired one of those with an extended clip. It kicks like crazy, but with the extended clip you can get off a lot of rounds, so you don’t have to worry about accuracy.

In the 1960′s a SciFi writer, John Brunner, wrote a book; “Stand On Zanzibar.” A futuristic novel about the 2000s. He predicted tattooing, dyed hair, cosmetic surgery, Gay Liberation, and Muckers. Not an organization or gang. It’s his name for random people committing random acts of violence. Like walking in to a super market and shooting as many people as the Mucker can.

Well we have Muckers, and they are here to stay, people are just going to have to live with it. News stations will have to just start reporting body counts rather than doing week long reporting on each incident. I am willing to bet there will be a Christmas shooting and a New Years Eve shooting. Ending the year with a blood bath and starting the New Year with a blood bath. These psychopaths are trying to one up one another. This guy took it to little children, next will be a church , then hospital wards.

I don’t care about the availability of guns, as long as the guns rights folks are happy, then I am happy. The dead and their family will have to help pay the price for freedom. Screw ‘em if they can’t sacrifice for the freedom America promised the gun owners via the 2nd Amendment. A few deaths should never interfere with the US Constitution. Start the body count.

Look if having guns is so important to well God Bless You. Then 20 dead children are on your head. The NRA had a brilliant idea today. Their CEO, after blaming Hollywood, video Games, Gay people, Comedians, Prostitutes, Car manufactures, candy companies, Hostess Twinkes. He suggested armed policemen in every school. What about Aurora, CO. He left out movie theaters, Virginia tech, colleges. The guy is as big a putz as you are.

Columbine had two armed guards on campus, Virginia tech has armed campus police.
Banks don’t even have armed guards anymore. If removing semi auto weapons, and large capacity clips impinges on gun ownership, then so be it, let the killing continue. Merry Christmas Mr. Scrooge.

Look at your self. You stick up for the Wealthy who have screwed the economy and the citizens, and now its guns, 20 dead children just the price of freedom in ypur book.

This is not the end. There will be more mass killings. Like I told you, Christmas day.

As Mr. GUNS from the NRA was giving his insulting take on 20 dead children. A gunman killed 3 people in Pennsylvania. One victim a church lady hanging Christmas decorations, I guess my prediction came a little early.

Somewhere along your journey through life up to now, you must have fallen an hit your head. I have yet to meet anyone on the wrong side of so many issues.

Anti American Workers, Pro Guns for everyone, Pro Big Money, Pro Corporate ownership of America, Anti Healthcare for the citizens of the richest country n the world. A healthy population makes for a healthy country overall.

That hit on the head must have knocked you out and you woke up in some land of anger and negativity. So much contempt for things you have decided to dislike. Even if it serves America well.

Looks like your guys walked out on their responsibility to the country because they didn’t get their way. It’s cliff diving for the GOP and the Teahadists.

Come January the mandate the GOP has generously given Obama will commence.
1st up, tax cuts for 98% of Americans, automatic increase in taxes for the 2%. Back to Clinton era taxes. Unemployment payments extended for 2 Million Americans. And a date will be suggested to debate the entitlements. He has no obligation to offer any cuts come January 1st.

Sorry Ducky your world view is getting narrower and narrower every day. You got the GOP where you want them, but the can not Govern from that position of sadness.

Speaking of emptying asylums, when were you released. I have never read so much delusional, disconnected, defensive rambling. Always with the quick, blame the other guy riposte.

It is sad you have only the provided defense for your position. You are on the wrong side of history. This is the 21 st Century not the 1800′s or the Gray Flannel Suit 1950s. The earth has gone around the sun many times since your world view was buried in a time capsule at birth. Women are able to earn their own way through life,
Negroes have the right to vote, miscegenation is acceptable in most of the USA. Gays are allowed in the Military, there is the internet, you can travel form the east coast to the west coast in under 6 hours, The Berlin wall fell, The Soviet Union fell apart, India and Pakistan have the atomic bomb, there is a thing call the European Union, a economically unified Europe. The GOP has become irrelevant, A Negro was elected President. Yes it is a brand new world with new challenges which can not be met with 19th century idealism. Its the time for new and fresh ideas, ideas capable of unifying the citizens of America in a common cause to advance America as the true leader of the World. A country of content citizens, living in safety and comfort. Good jobs to grow their life style, freedom to vote, a right to have your voice heard by the Employer, a Right to a good education, a right to Heath Care, a chance of advancement for every citizen, a Government that is more valuable than just running a military, or a World police force. A government that works for the people, to fight injustice, inequality, disease, job safety, right to vote, right to organize, a right to express progressive views, a right to marry the one you love.

I’m not calling for gun control. I don’t care if people can buy tanks and rocket launchers.

But I am tired of the thousands of people who get killed by guns. A great many are innocent people and law officers. I have 3 nephews who are on a major city police force. I get sick when I hear the news that a cop got shot. U shudder at the announcement of the name of the officer. It a dangerous job, and getting killed comes with the job. But, as my nephews point out to me the cops are out gunned.

I would just like to see a mass murderer go into a gun show and kill one person. With all the guns in the room, a killer will still get a least one or two victims. And he will get killed, they all do anyway, either by their on hand or the police. Yet there will be dead people at the gun show, with all of those guns around.

The NRA should be ashamed of itself. It would have been a lot better if they just issued a letter of condolence. But they really made asses of themselves.

That’s right every mental institution and psychiatric ward in America are empty.
Not one mental health institution of Prison with a psych ward. Everyone of these killers were patients from a mental institutions.

The only inmates on the loose in America are the Teahadist Party, the Right Wing of the GOP, and lonely White Males of America.

I am still amazed with how quickly you guys on the right are able to come up with someone or something to blame without any inclusion of the availability of weapons.

Indeed they may be mental cases, but how do you suggest we find them before they do harm. I assume you watch the interviews with neighbors of the perpetrator, ‘He was such a quiet guy,’ ‘he was always polite, and helped around the neighborhood if he could do so,’ ‘he never showed any signs of being capable of this.’ ‘I am totally shocked.’

For the ones who do show signs of some mental problem, do we round up ever manic depressive in America, in that case we can start with the GOP. Most of these nuts, hold in contempt much of what the Right Wing is pissed off about.

There is no confiscating, why do you insist on saying such idiotic unfounded, paranoid BS, over and over. The Wealth you so fondly defend was gathered by taking it from you. It’s just another form of confiscation. Great tax deals, loopholes, subsidies. The law more friendly to them than you. You transgress, you have no access to a great lawyer. You get a court appointed lawyer, unless you or your family are willing to put up the equity in their home to hired an above average lawyer for you.

The social teetor totter is not ever going to go up and down as long as you are okay with the other side allowed to put external weight on their end of the teeter totter. That’s about as simplistic as I can make the Inequity of wealth in America. I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT RICH PEOPLE. There is an extraordinary difference between rich and wealthy. To some people in the world every American is rich, but those same people recognize the difference when it comes to rich and wealthy. Yet people like yourself still don’t get it. The rich don’t get invited to the Wealthy parties. They do not have enough money to qualify. Now think of how the Wealthy think about you. THEY DON’T!!!!!

You are so typically Right Wing, all fault finding and blame placing, 20/20 hindsight opinions, and absolutely no plans for America, other than being negative, blame placing, anti intellectual, anti culture, anti common sense, anti just about any thing and everything that bumps in to your ideologically overly sensitive world view. And that is something I have yet to calculate as of now. All slogans, Liberal blaming, no ideas, just a constant offending defense of all of that is wrong with what the GOP stands for.

You and the GOP are on the wrong side of life as it progresses along with out you.
Your inertia is the worst aspect of your ideology to the advancement of America as an example to the rest of the World.

The richest country on earth, and they are arguing over heath care for their citizens, and contempt for their poor. We look like social midgets to the rest of the World, no wonder some folks hate us, it’s not all jealousy, it’s the hypocrisy. We go around the world telling people how to run their countries, then they look at what divides us, ideological bull shit about health care, immigration, women’s rights, gay rights, financial inequality. From the supposed leader of the free world we are weak at taking care of our own business. And we a silly in our backwardness and dwarfed social obligations. Thanks to the Grand Old Party and their puppet master the Teahadist/ Fascist Party.

Your on the wrong side of life.

And your solution is let them starve. 2000 years aga, a man walked the earth, he commanded all good men to care for the poor and unfortunate. His name is Jesus. The man your party is so in love with invoking for political purposes, but short on following his commands. The poor have been with us since the dawn of man, and will be with us until the earth meets its end. You can’t just ignore them and think they will suddenly see the light and stop being poor. You have to stop seeing it as a self inflicted situation. That’s just another one of the GOP’s skirting the issue devices.

They are poor because they want to be. They are too lazy to work. You ignore the millions of working poor. Many work for Walmart. They get up every day and go to work, but they can not get by on what they earn, so we as a people have supplemented their lives with food stamps and medicaid, a righteous and Christian thing to do.

And to you that’s a bad thing. We can afford this. If you keep reducing the revenue needed to run a nation of 300 plus Million people, it will certainly look like we can not afford to help. It is an insidious, pernicious and evil concept you on the Right preach from the comfort of God blessing you by not being born into poverty. No empathy, but a boat load of sympathy for people with more money than God.

You really need to get down on your knees and implore God to set you on the right path. Don’t bet on it happening. He ignored 20 little kids praying their hearts out for his help. He must be a Republican.

Hear hear!

I agree thanks to quotas that are rewarding those who aren’t competitive and receive “scholarships” not because of ability but because of color. The US military is a the best way for those lacking $$ for college to get it

Yea silly constitution …as libs we are free to over ride it when ever we don’t like it

Realllly??? History has shown that every time the liberal left gets a hold of the purse strings rampart waste happens and the taxpayers dollars are wasted.
Social spending in this country has been sky rocketing and what has been the result?? The % of the population that are considered poor is unchanged, school graduation rates are worse. there are no trade schools offering skills to those who disdain college. we are spending more on illegals than we spent on our own citizens during Kennedy’s presidency.
What has caused all the problems for this country is this on going adoration of Keynesian economics that says the govt needs to spend $$ and the heck if its borrowed. Of course the borrowing never stops.
What we have today is a socialist govt where those who don’t want to work or produce are able to take from those who do. Rather than requiring them to work, whether sweeping streets or emptying beds pans, the liberal left thinks that requiring work is too demeaning and beneath them.
The citizens who voted wanted more of the same more benefits, more $$$ and confiscation from those who produce. This isn’t the 1st time this has happened in the world but is the 1st time its happened here. Look at where its worked USSR, China, Venezuela, South Africa, Cuba, to name a few

I told you these mass murderers were competitive, one does a college, the next does a movie theater, the next does an elementary school and here we have my Christmas prediction, another sicko shooting, killing fire fighters. What’s next Church attendees, maybe tomorrow, then we can have the night club massacre on New Years Eve.

The Pandora’s box of gun deaths has been opened and no way to shut it in sight.
These sickos are in a race to see who can outdo the other.

This guy starts a fire, then ambushes the fire fighters.

I still believe something is going to happen on Christmas Day and New Years Eve.

We have already loosed the Teahadist Party on America, should we cut the chains on the entire Right Wing, Militants in Montana, White supremacists, skin heads all fired up by the presence of a Negro in the White House. Overwhelmed with paranoid delusions and conspiracies. Thoughts that the Negroes, the Browns, the Yellows and Women are taking over America, leaving the macho men on their own to cook, clean, do laundry, buy groceries, take out the trash, in other words do for themselves.

They are anti intellectual, anti civility, anti polite, the best beer is an open one.

The knuckleheads of America, a big part of the GOP base. Football, Guns, Beer and meth. Plus a hair trigger temper. The mentality that infests the mass killers in America, the strength a gun gives them, the courage of their convictions guns give them, the confidence of their actions, guns give them.

It’s a male obsession with power and revenge. Self Loathing at its utmost.

The Right Wing is infected with this psychotic machismo. They are intellectually impotent, so they boast their egos with anger, contempt, racism,, misogyny, homophobia, and xenophobia. A reliable group of supporters for the Right Wing’s call to arms so to speak. GOP voters, Rush fans, Beck fans. Right Wing warriors. The keepers of the flame, of that elusive dream of a return to yesteryear, when man was the king of his castle, when being white was a pass through every door, when being male assured your opinion of being considered. When intelligence was trumped by cleverness and smarts.

Times have changed. Intellect has currency, civility has value, care and concern for the unfortunate is admirable. A tough terrain for the left over male population stunted by hatred, lousy jobs, dead end lives, hopeless view points, obsessed with blame. It can not be their fault they are where they are. No one brought them to America in boats, no one denied them suffrage, no one denied them opportunity in the work place. Negroes and Women have fought up hill all of these years and have achieved some leverage, and the White male in American does not like it, at all.
This last part was manifested in Rush’s Slut comment about a college student he did not know, her mistake, talking up in public about something Rush did not agree with in the least. So the Macho man digs low and does the injured male bit, calls her a slut.

What else can I say. American Males have an insufferable inferiority complex in their own country. Boo – F**cking – Hoo.

I think I hear a little jealousy of the sophisticated, well educated, urbane people in America.

The beer boys, are the foundation of the Klan, and White Supremacists Groups. Once again you got your history back wards. This country was built on the brilliant minds of those sophisticated, well mannered, highly educated men we refer to as the Founding Fathers. Those men who imported Wine from France and custom made furniture from Germany and read the books about the Enlightenment. Voltaire, Jean-Jacques Rousseau, Isaac Newton. Far from being Conservative thinkers. Jefferson had portraits of these men hanging on the walls at Monticello. The Enlightenment was the seed from which the American form of Democracy was grown. Jefferson was a Liberal. He advocated Government funding for scientific inquiry.

The Enlightenment was, at its center, a celebration of ideas – ideas about what the human mind was capable of, and what could be achieved through deliberate action and scientific methodology. Deism, which is a rejection of organized, doctrinal religion in favor of a more personal and spiritual kind of faith was favored by many of the Founding Fathers. Famous Jefferson letter stated his sadness in not being able to keep God and Religion out of the Government.

Egalitarianism was the buzzword of the century, and it meant the promise of fair treatment for all people, regardless of background.

An I am sure they were familiar with Brie and white wine, probably a nice Chablis or White Burgundy.

Where do you get no completion, Wall Street, Ivy League Universities, Medical Schools, Business Schools, College Sport Programs. where do all of those competitive people come from? I’ll tell you, not Beer Boy families. Nope, from Middle Class families who know the value of education and a modicum of sophistication and taste beyond a six pack of Bud. It was good for the Founding Fathers, it should continue to be good for America. A well educated, sophisticated society. With some decorum, and civility.

Your side of the world are Racists, Misogynists, Homophobic and xenophobic.

Your left with a bunch of beer swilling meth snorting white guys in unhappy marriages, who hate all the thins listed above.

Body counts stopped and so did the unnecessary adventure in IRAQ.

When abortions be come illegal, I will. When Murder becomes legal, then maybe I might agree with you on guns.

How about the National Guard, they are government employees, paid with tax dollars.
Air Force, Navy, Marines, Army….Federal Government employees, paid by the Federal Government. No weapons for them either? They’re the big paranoid fear the White guys in Montana are training for.

This protect us against the Government Right Wing Paranoia is nuts. The military would get rid of those meth heads in Militias in a heart beat, and if you think citizens are a match for the military, maybe they should bring it on, and we can finally free America from the Paranoid disease spread by the delusional Right Wing .

And we can finally address racism, homophobia, women hating, immigrant hating.
And hard working Americans hating. And fulfill Jesus’ command, take care of the Poor.

Then please explain how your side decided to reverse their reverence for America. Their decision to drift Far Right with the election of a Negro, has destroyed the Party you speak of in the opening of your comment. That Party is long gone, no longer with us.

FOX , Rush and Beck, are not news formats, they are especially structured as agitation machines. I listen to Rush, it’s nothing but negative, rabble rousing, name calling rhetoric, it’s sole intention is to made the anger of the listener go through the roof, same with Beck. FOX is not quite extreme, but they do their fair share of anger stirring.

Explain what the following has to do with Policy re: the POTUS:

He’s a Muslim, a Racist, a socialist, not an American, a Kenyan, anti America, his mother was a welfare queen, his wife buys nice clothes, his children have nice clothes, he’s a Negro, he was a community organizer, he’s from Chicago, he is bisexual, his father was Malcolm X, he smoked pot, he did not deserve to go to Harvard or Columbia, his color got him into College, he is an elitist, he plays basketball, he cares about the poor because the are Negroes.

These are all personal attacks. Attempts at Character assassination. What do any of them have to do with Policy. If he offers a plan, stick with the criticism of the idea.

What is the necessity of a constant Right Wing feeding frenzy concerning his person.

Now that he has been reelected. It continues. One personal assault after another. What is trying to be achieved? Discredit the man’s character, and then what is suppose to happen? Nov. 6th proved it was all a waste of time, the voters chose him over your perfectly constructed White man, with no personality , no new ideas.

Your party WAS part of the success of this nation, but somewhere along the line the frustration with the Left grabbing all of the popular ideas, sent you on a rampage of get evenness. Negative, pessimistic, contemptuousness, anything the Liberals liked your side decided to hate. That’s not a political philosophy, that spitefulness, ideology.

Your party has lost it’s way . The Party of Lincoln is now the Party of No to anything the Liberals like. You have no fresh ideas other than to work hard to tear down the New Deal and the Great Society. Not one solid piece of policy beyond anti Abortion, anti Poor, anti Workers, anti Women, anti Immigrant, anti Education, anti Intellectual, anti Health Care, anti Environment, anti America, anti Middle Class, Pro Big Business, Pro Wealth for wealth’s sake.

Not one positive notion. You have painted yourselves in to a tight corner. You’re done. Irrelevant. Of no value The Grand Old Party has had its Grand castrated by the decision to drift Far Right.

You have been pushing the same tired old Right Wing ideas. Supply Side Economics.

What it should be called is Wealth Side Beneficiary Economics. There has never, and will never be any trickle down. It’s proven it self to be wrong and ineffectual, yet your side continues to sell it as a fresh solution to a problem instigated by the very philosophy your side pushes with so much lackluster determination.

Newt is now working on reforming the Right. He suggested they are on the wrong side of the Immigration, and the Gay issues. Curious how he left out the Poverty/Poor issue.

IMHO, it has to do primary with Negroes, and he know he can never sell the GOP and the Right on anything that benefits those shiftless, lazy ass Negroes.

Remember Newt is the man who called Obama the ‘Food Stamp President.’
Free stuff for Negroes.

You only run out of money when you cutoff your income. Taxation has a purpose and to low taxes when you can not afford it is nuts. It is a pernicious ploy referred to as “Starve the beast” The GOP has not been successful at legislating the New Deal and Great Society out of existence, they devised a surreptitious and pernicious plan to decrease the revenue of the Federal Government to the point that the New Deal and Great Society programs would have to be cut, and it would make it easier to sell their cutting of the programs to an unsuspecting public. But, no cuts to the Military, one of the biggest money wasters we have, underfund the IRS making it that much more difficult to get tax evaders, there are innumerable things to be cut that could save a lot of money.
Corporate Welfare for one, defense budget is one, Eliminate Public Education is one, Cut Subsidies to Hospitals, tax religious organizations is a huge one (never understood that one), raise taxes on the people who benefited from the Depression paid for by the tax payers. Eliminate the National Guard, we have a standing army, if not eliminate one of the branches of the military, their redundant, the army has tanks, the marines have tanks, the navy has airplanes, the air force has planes. It’s redundant.
We can eliminate one of the branches of Congress, or pay them what the Right thinks teachers should be paid. They work a hell of a lot less than teachers, plus they get health insurance, pensions, a staff, offices, and other perks. They’re robbing us blind.

$75,000 a year should be more than enough, plus all the perks. That’s more than the average teacher salary. It’s a job congressmen run for, they want the job, they pay to get the job, it’s service to their country. They make way more than the troops, and the troops risk their lives. All the politicians risk is not getting reelected. And the job opportunities are more lucrative for ex-congressmen than they are for veterans.

All of state, why concern ourselves with where we stand within the actions of the world. Isolate ourselves.

All of Justice, let each neighborhood, each township, each municipality, each state provide their own justice.

Completely disband homeland security. Let the terrorists come, we will be well armed to deal with them.

FBI, CIA, useless waste of money. We’re all decent people what would we do wrong that we need overseers of our local and state police and national Guard and Independent Militias. Plus a well armed citizenry. Bring back public hangings.

As far as foreign intelligence, do not allow any travel to the USA from other countries, set up business zones, where corporations can meet with the world market safely away from the USA.

Go back to something the Founding Fathers approved. Only land owning men can vote. Raise the voting age to 30, that’s about when most men are pretty established with a job and a career.

Eliminate all government jobs, local, municipal, state, federal. Privatize the entire work force. Privatize the Military, Privatize the inter state highway system, make them all toll roads.

Privatize education, de-fund any support for higher learning, make it a strictly pay as you go system. Intelligence and grades do not matter, if you can afford to get in you get in. If you let the working class in, your end up with Liberals.

You do realize the states will become the new federal government. 50 small versions. They will need money to operate their states, because after they sell off and privatize their responsibilities there will be some things that will still need administering and money to do it. Or they could expand Right to Work into a Privatized form of Government. Corporations would operate the states business, taxes will be replaced by monthly fees, like utility bills: Police protection, Fire Department, trash collecting, street repairs, Pre-school, high school, all bills sent to the citizen. What ever you don’t care for don’t buy the service. You will be armed so you can protect your own home, and if you can afford it, install a sprinkler system in your home. I think there’s a book here. Oops, John Brunner already wrote it back in the 1960s “Stand on Zansibar” and Kurt Vonnegut covered it in “Player Piano.” A total Corporate run world, all needs were services paid for by each citizen based on usage, like a utility. Brunner had spaces the homeless could rent on the sidewalks, but they could not be there after 9AM or before 7PM. They had to keep moving in the hours in between.

There were only debit cards, no cash. You accumulated points at work and the points were transferred directly to the central banks owned by the Corporations. You could borrow points at a very high rate. Lack of payment instant jail., and confiscation of all property. Which did not go towards your debt. It was a fine for not paying your loan.

That’s the future your cold calculated, lack of emotion and compassion brings you.
Everything in order, no blemishes, no problems, everyone absolutely accountable, except the Wealthy, as usual. Aldous Huxley’s Brave New World. Asamov’s Stranger in a Strange land. These are not new ideas you have, they have been tried before and failed. That’s why Democracy shines brightest. The National Socialist Party failed at it.
Mussolini failed at it. The book 1984 showed the weakness of it. You can not have what you want with out a central enforcement arm. And that is fascism. In the form of a Corporate State, a Social Darwinian State, the wealthy and the powerful know best, Ayn Rands dream for America, unfettered Capitalism, the workers and the underclass were only good for labor, not thinking and planing That should be left to the Wealthy and the successful.

I have as much trouble with the parishioners as I do with the preachers (Shamans).
They have been living among us for at least 200,000 years.

Germany was a fascist state more to the liking their cousins the American Right wing. NAZIs were far right, they incarcerated communists and socialists. The NAZIs ascribed to the Iron Fist approach favored by the Teahadist Party and the Far Right within the GOP. You have your examples backwards. Germany wasted money and 100s of thousands of lives, fighting on the Eastern Front, in an attempt to eradicate the Communists and Socialists. The NAZIs were your people. Right Wing fanatics.
And most of the leadership were Catholics. Catholic Churches celebrated Hitler’s birth day every year.

So let me get this straight, States rule their own destinies with out the overseer, the Federal Government. Alabama decides slavery is okay, no voting rights for people of color, non christian faith, and women. And that’s just fine with you.

Texas decides to raise it’s own army, and looks overseas for arms subsidies, China, Russian, Maybe Iran.

Mississippi decides Homosexuality is punishable by death. Minimum wage should be $3.00 an hour. People of color and immigrants can not drive cars. Marijuana possession is punishable by death. Drunk driving, domestic violence and keeping your kids out of school with no home schooling are misdemeanors.

Montana approves of mining with no regards for polluting rivers or the air. Also, dumping toxic waste where ever the Corporation chooses. Nuclear power plants next to schools, high tension wires running over schools.

Indiana decides to re-institute child labor. Approves of 12 hour work days, no weekends off, no vacations until you have worked for the company for at least 3 years.
That gets you a week without pay. After 5 years 2 weeks without pay. That’s the max.

Nevada shuts it’s borders to interstate use of Nevada’s highways with out paying a usage fee at the borders, trucks and private vehicles.

Arizona decides to put tariffs on anything not produced in Arizona.

Tennessee decides to go back to the Gold Standard. Mint their own coins and have gold backed script. United States currency will be outlawed in Tennessee.

South Carolina decides to charge air lines air space fees for flying over South Carolina.

This is not stuff I have made up, this is the kind of shit people with your view point think is necessary to achieve freedom from the Federal Government.

I for one would love to see it happen. California is going to see a big influx of immigrants for the other 47 contiguous states. As will Hawaii, Washington State, Oregon, New Jersey, New York City, Philadelphia, Chicago, Miami, Boston, The Florida Keys and Canada.

Tell me again, you are not this dumb. The word, NAZI , stands for the National Socialist Party (Nationalsozialismus). The Socialist in their name is not the socialism you think of, they were a right wing, nationalist party, socialism and communism were hated by them, that is why they arrested all known Socialist and Communists and imprisoned them. They were threaten by Russia and the popularity of Communism and Socialism in the post World War One depression in Europe. Why do you think they put so much emphasis on killing Jews (the Intellectuals who favored a more Liberal Government) and defeating Russia?

Here try this on for size:
National Socialism was the ideology of the Nazi Party and Nazi Germany. It is a variety of fascism that incorporates biological racism and antisemitism. Nazism used elements of the far-right racist Völkisch German nationalist movement and the anti-communist Freikorps paramilitary culture which fought against the communists in post-World War I Germany. It was designed to draw workers away from communism and into völkisch nationalism. Major elements of Nazism have been described as far-right, such as allowing domination of society by people deemed racially superior, while purging society of people declared inferior which were said to be a threat to national survival. ( A lot like the GOP’s feelings toward America’s Poor )

Were you out sick when German history; post World War One was being discussed?

The US depression was world wide, and Germany was neutered after they signed The Treaty of Versailles. Their economy went in to the dumpster. They were thrust into a disastrous economic collapse.

Here is an analogy, The Nazi’s experienced success with their right wing ideology during the economic downturn in Germany. The GOP and the Right Wing in the USA have succeeded to a sad degree during the depression of 2008. The GOP and the Right wing have used this economic valley as a means of demonizing the poor, women, Unions, immigrants, people of color and homosexuals. Do you see a parallel here.
The Right is adept at exploiting an economic down turn for their own ideological gains and advancement. 2010 elections and the influx of the Teahadist Party in to American politics. The brown shirts of the GOP. And as the Nazis pulled down the Wiemar Republic, the Teahadists are tearing down the GOP, and the ability of the Government to get anything done. The Teahadist are fascists. They hate anything or anyone that disagrees with them, they have no leadership or plan for America, except to eliminate any opposition to their narrow minded small view of America’s future. They are a dangerous group of people. They would bring back the horse if they could, and teach that the earth is flat.

Its amazing that all the biographers are able to pull a great karnak 200 years aftr his death. The words in the constitution are very clear there is no reason to devolve into should a could of would have. The words are the govt shall make no law “establishing” a religion.

Gee do you think that the 19th amendment to the constitution had anything to do with swaying the SC thinking process?? The problem with the court over the past 50-60 years is its been used by the liberal left wingnuts to advance their agenda by side stepping the constitution. There is no way that quotas and set asides were even envisioned by the framers of the constitution and for the SC to say that they are a short term fix is a slap in Jefferson’s face.

Corporations as people made sense because the Left wing nut were trying to suppress speech. Rather than having free and open elections their agenda was to eliminate the opposition and allow unions goons to run rough shod over any other voices.

Sorry your analogy about Iran is a pure Fail. In Iran Islam is the state established religion just as our founders warned. Funny that you have such a problem with words and and our constitution. No our founders were against a state sponsored religion hence the term”establishment clause”. The word separation isn’t even used regarding religion.

Had Jefferson wanted his thought embolden in the constitution he would have included it. He didn’t because he knew that it would never have past muster in the 13 colonies. The Declaration of Independence was in turned signed by all 13 colonies.

Your world view and the fouders is what is offensive. Unlike barak the founders reached “consensus” in their actions and didn’t believe in a dictator or a supreme leader. I realize for the left its a radical concept but its worked for over 200 years

Very good, ibsyboy, and with that being said, who exactly is it our Founding Fathers are giving the citizens the right to form a militia against?

Mr Hillbilly, it’s difficult to have an intelligent conversation with the partially informed, so please do us both a favor and learn the basic differences between a fully automatic weapon and a semi-automatic weapon. For the record, an AK47 can be either, but not both and no, the semi cannot be converted to a fully automatic. And with your premise, should we not be using sailing vessels and riding horses, too? That may not be fair. Is what is though is to inform you fully automatic weapons are illegal to most of the American public and have been since the 30′s. That’s the 1930′s. Yes, you can get a permit for one at a huge price and after much scrutiny from the BATFE, but few will due to the heavy annual expense. The criminal? He cares less about such requirements, why he’s called a criminal. This whole confusion by the uninformed regarding semi vs. fully auto was nicley accomplished by the far left, mainly the Brady group.
All that is moot in the instance of the poor kids in Connecticutt, however, as those were NOT fully automatic weapons and were supposedly legally purchased, though I really do question this supposed fact. It appears to me to be a possible “Straw Purchase”. My main question is why was this person allowed anywhere near a firearm as the family KNEW he had mental stability problems. The guns should have been in a safe. Is that proof of the whole incident would not have happened? Of course not. My contention is that there should have been a security system in place more stringent than a window that can broken out. There IS bullett proof glass you know, and “gun free zones” are a misnomer as soon as a criminal decides they are not a “gun free zone”. We saw that Friday morning. We saw that in Oregon. We saw that in Aurora. We saw that at Columbine. We saw that at Jonesboro. We saw that in Wisconsin. All were and still are “Gun Free Zones”. Oh REALLY ????

The first part they are telling you why the second part is germane.

I’m really glad I live in Australia where I don’t NEED to carry a gun. I’ve lived 60 years in non-USA countries and never seen a hand gun nor ever met anyone who has suffered at the hands of a gun-toting criminal. I don’t deny gun-related crimes happen in Australia but they are rare.

I’m really glad you there too.

there are people in the USA who want to get rid of the NIH and the CDC. If a deadly virus hits America, let the Private Drug Companies solve the problem. There are folks here that think death by guns, disease and starvation are the price of a free society.

You intend to steal your food? You know go hunting at the local super market. Take no prisoners, only the food. Brilliant idea. I have a feeling your not the only one who is thinking like that. Mini Marts are rob at gun point on a daily basis, they won’t care about one more, you joining in.

According to Australian 2011 crime statistics, one in every three Australians is a victim of crime. In 2011, a weapon was used against the victim in 75% (138) of attempted murders, 71% (172) of murders, and 44% (5,958) of robberies. A knife was the most common weapon type used against the victim in the following offences: murder (33%), attempted murder (33%), and robbery (22%).

Murder rate per 100,000

Honduras 91.6
El Salvador 69.2
Côte d’Ivoire 56.9
……….
United States 4.2 <<< IS NOT #1 WHY? BECAUSE WE HAVE GUNS TO PROTECT OURSELVES!!!

I live in Puerto Rico and gun law is incredibly strict to legally own and carry them yet crimes where guns are involved are at an all time high. My point is that legislation to control guns does not pose a solution just a small measure of a broader strategy and its effactiveness hinges on the ability to curb illegally obtained weapons and the trading of them.

But you still can’t get handguns with barrels less than 470 millimeters or weapons that “center fire in a semi automatic fashion”. They’re all banned. Plus, there is the Possession and Acquisition license (PAL), whose RCMP course you have to pass first. It does make a difference, in addition to the difference in the overall gun culture attitude. Smuggled, banned, weapons will always appear in Canada from the U.S. You can’t catch them all.

That’s another one of those scandals coming from the political right that I’ve never been able to get a handle on once I read up on it. It was apparently a sting operation, more or less, set up by Bush and continued by the incoming Obama Whitehouse. The lax gun laws of a state like Arizona made it impossible to detain and confiscate the weapons of the cartel buyers who were arrested right after the purchase. The question should be…why didn’t the Bush or Obama administrations have a better understanding of these State gun laws before starting or continuing this program?

It seemed to be well intentioned at least and it’s hard to see it as a huge scandal, but that’s just me and I suppose Brian Terry’s parents would disagree.

You are a wise Canadian sir. There needs to be may more like you…

Max:

You Aussies still stealing brown babies to raise them as White? You are a disgrace.

Mx. You need to do your homework pal. Since the ban in Kangaroo land was implemented, gun related crimes are up 33%, murders up 19% and you al have something so devastating now that your government doesnt even know how to classify it. HOME INVASIONS!!!! You just dont get it or you just refuse to believe it… The criminals are laughing all the way to the bank in Aussieland cause they are the only ones with guns and they can prey at will against defenseless citizens that your DUMBASS govt cant figure out how to help. Even the police depts down there are livid at the ban cause now they are overflooded with murder and crime investigations never before seen. STUDY DUDE!!!!!!!!

Right, just like gun violence is rare in the US.
Did you know that according to FBI statistics gun crimes and gun murders have been steadily decreasing in the US for the past 20 years?

The media likes to hype things up and make it seem like people are killing each other right and left, but that simply isn’t true. Gun crimes and Gun murders have decreased by 50% in the last 20 years in the US.

Also, this article is incredibly misleading.
You cannot legally purchase firearms online unless you have a Federal Firearms License, which requires significant background checks, including an IN PERSON interview with an ATF agent.

The average citizen cannot just purchase a gun online.

Hi, Max

Perhaps you could explain that in 2002 the Australian Bureau of Criminology acknowledged that there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime.

In 2006 assaults rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent. Sexual assault increased 29.9 percent.

Australian women are raped over three times more often than American women.

You have a wonderful country, Max, and I hope to visit it one day. But don’t be deluded into thinking that if only you could get rid of the guns everything would be better.

We have three times more people die in vehicular accidents every year than die from firearms here in the States.

Australia? LOL Nice example.

In Australia gun ownership was banned completely by the socialists in 1997. Half a billion dollars were spent on disarming the populace. In the following years armed robberies went up 69%, gun murders went up 19%. Home invasions went up 21%. The gangs could start this crime wave because Australians were defenseless. (So how did the government respond? They banned … swords.)

Australia banned guns – violence went up.

Gun ownership increased in the U.S. in the same time period – violence, including gun violence, has gone way down. Only the rare mass shootings have increased – almost always carried out by people on heavy, reality-altering medication. But Obama won’t go after Big Pharma.

Half of all murders in the U.S. are committed by Blacks, 12 percent of the population. Blacks raping Whites make up 90 percent of interracial rapes. (The other 10 percent: Blacks raping Asians, Blacks raping Latinos, Latinos raping Whites…many years the number of White-on-Black rapes are exactly zero.) Why doesn’t Obama say anything about THAT cause of crime? Because he is a socialist. Socialists always lie. Either by commission or by omission, leaving out vital information. Like Max Overton here.

LOL Right Your crime rate has been up constantly since you passed your stupid gun laws. And besides, I don’t give a crap about yours or any other country. We have to deal with the facts in our country and the facts are, where more guns are, crime goes down. Why, because we have allowed the gang bangers free run in the cities and they pick the people that are unarmed.

Perhaps, but the numbers say that they are not any more rare than before Australia instituted their gun-ban. Hence, it did nothing in reducing firearm violence.

Be glad you’re a man when you’re in Australia. The rape and assault rates are significantly higher there than in the US. Those rates also went up pretty dramatically after the Australian gun ban. I guess when you disarm women, the rapists step up their game.

And why the obsession with gun-related crimes? Is a rape worse when the rapist has a gun or is it just as horrible when the rapist only has a knife or a huge weight and speed advantage on his victim?

Is it really a good trade off if we reduce gun crime but also massively increase overall violent crime? The examples of the UK and Australia are not heartening on this front.

Australia still has some of the highest violent crime rates in the world however. It is oddly enough perhaps, followed closely by the UK.

Bullshit gun crime is very much on the rise on Australia.

So these armed teachers that you want. Where would they carry their guns (handguns I’m assuming), in shoulder holsters, waist holsters or somewhere else? As for training would they just shoot at targets or what? If you are really a blackops then you would realize there is a huge differnece between a firing range and an actual fire fight.

You aslo need to learn how to spell and write coherently. Just because someone differs with you doesn’t mean they have to leave this country. I’m in my 60′s saw action in Vietnam and couldn’t disagree with more. England and Australia (not Austrailia) are hardly Socialist countries. They both have elected Executive and Legislative branches elected by the people. Get your facts straight before you write something.

Wow! That sounds a whole lot like what we heard a few months ago! “Obama isn’t after your guns,” “Obama hasn’t made any gun laws, and isn’t likely to,” etc. Kinda funny, 90 days after his reelection, he’s on the ban bandwagon.

This “No one is calling for ______” line doesn’t hold any water with us.

It took a hell of a lot of backbone for those teachers and the principal in Newtown. The Principal and school psychologist charged him, teachers hid their students and got them away from sight- I’m a parent, and I don’t think anyone, even you, wants the teachers packing with a loaded pistol right within reach at all times, at least not with K-4. So which takes more guts? Going for your gun locked in the bottom desk drawer, or spending those seconds herding your kids into supply closets and keeping them calm? As a parent, I want those seconds spent hiding my kid than for fumbling with locks or safeties while the kids are not being cared for.

I can’t believe you think this is a solution. Can you just imagine the increased numbers of fatalities due to students finding teacher’s guns in their drawers or grabbing them from their holsters?

And wow – disgruntled teachers and people with mental illness or relationship breakdowns having even easier access to lethal weapons?

Man, talk about a militarised state of fear.

So glad I live in Australia with miniscule gun violence in comparison.

So when a killer shows up, should we stop him, or entertain him with a rousing game of hide and seek? “Found you, you lose.”

Some people are pointlessly mad, it seems. I also agree that the gun free signs/zones are not what attract these monsters. What attracts them is a mass of people in a confined space. Unfortunately, masses of people in confined spaces seem to correspond strongly with gun free zones. I’m all for not allowing people to walk in with a rifle over their shoulder, etc – but lawful concealed carry should not be restricted from these places, even for teachers. It’s been around long enough now to confidently safe that it would not add any appreciable danger, and it may just be what saves a lot of lives the next time evil comes knocking.

However, that shouldn’t be the answer – only an aid. Strengthening background checks to include immediate family at the same address, perhaps not denying for others living with you if you have proper storage, and holding people accountable for that, will go a long way towards a real solution. On top of that, a logistical solution to allowing background checks on private sales will allow such a change to have as full of an effect as possible. Lastly, improving access to mental health services (yes, this will have to be paid for somehow, but there’s no way around it regardless of firearms laws) especially for those deemed possibly dangerous.

All of these options, especially taken together, will go a long way towards helping. The previous assault weapons ban was mostly useless and pointlessly burdened lawful buyers over trivial features such as grips and flash hiders (seriously…flash hiders…we can do better than THAT surely…). If we look for REAL common ground solutions as opposed to these biased articles calling for “common sense” to be only what corresponds to their belief and not that of the nation as a whole, if we accept that the rights of our fellow Americans are worth more than hastily written legislation in an emotional state, then we can find a solution that works for everyone. As an added bonus, it will actually pass.

The police don’t agree with you. They call all guns with a magazine an assault weapon. Somehow, they have more credibility than a lunatic gun lover.

I think the Government should provide every citizen over the age of 13 with a weapon, we could reduce our police forces,and state police, allow unlimited speeds on the highways, no need for state police. Privatize the interstates, allow the owners to charge tolls.

Privatize every government service, local, state and Federal, treat the services as we do utilities, you get billed each month by usage of desire to have police and fire protection. Eliminate taxes altogether. No Public Schools, no state or community colleges, everything is pay as you go.

Regarding poverty, let them die. It’s they only way to rid our country of needy useless people. Everything we need we pay for. No Taxes, no services, we pay for everything. No Welfare, no Medicare, no Social Security. Let families take care of their parents like the old days. Heath care is paid for by need and usage of medical services. No health insurance, Hospitals compete for business, will lower the costs. Pay as you go.
If you can’t pay tough luck. We’re not meant to live forever anyway. Cremation only. The land is too precious to be waste on burying dead rotting bodies.

What an idiot your screen name tells it all!

Do you realize how many teachers you need to teach? MORON!

usmcblackops spoken like a true coward…i bet you sleep underneath the bed with the lights on , clinging to your big gun in one hand and your little in the other…hahaha scared little boy are you!!!!!

its people like your dumb ass that we need too take guns away from.

USMCBLACKOPS, I personally believe people that act and talk like you are the most dangerous. Giving people like you guns is down right scary.
One day we will probably see your name in the headlines for having dumped your anger on a lot of innocent victims because you are dead set on forcing the rest of America to accept your position.
You feel that we should accept your opinion like pathetic sheep?
Forget it!!!!
You don’t have the RIGHT to own any and all types of guns. Moreover, your response frightening and leads me to believe you not psychologically stable or fit to own any guns. Period!!!!
If you want the privilege to own a gun, you should have a phsycholigal test and you should insure your guns for any and all what ifs. What if it is stolen? What if it is used in a crime? What if someone is shot with your gun? commits murder with your gun? commits suicide with your gun? accidentally shoots someone with your gun?
YOU should have to pay for any and all damages as a result of your gun(s)!!!

You must have an extremely small penis…………

YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY UNBELIEVABLE! You have no knowledge of any society outside your own little patch. I am an Australian (learn to spell please) and we have one of the lowest murder rates in the world (no guns) compared to you lot. We do not live in fear here. You, on the other hand are in the highest bracket in the world for killing (with guns). If you are too thick to see the blindingly obvious, you deserve eveything that’s comming your way. I have no sympathy for you. You are a fool!
John Nettleton, Queensland.

A hammer, when used improperly, can injure or kill one person. A semi-automatic
is much more deadly ( and how many really use them for “fun ” ?)

But wouldn’t it help if the sale and possession of all automatic and semi-automatic guns were made illegal? Also possession of such a weapon in commission of a crime could lead to very long prison terms.

People with mental illness and criminals are banned from owning weapons.. but that doesn’t stop them from getting guns from people who don’t mind breaking the law. Instead of banning the weapons, which are neutal until they get into the hands of people, how about increasing penalties for illegal gun sales.

Here is a simple way to analyze the issue: look at it from the perspective of the framers of the Constitution in 1789. The nation was structured as a federation of states. There was no national army. As a result, the nation relied on the state militias for its defense. Those militias were staffed by persons who bought and brought their own weapons, uniforms, and other equipment. Thus, the Second Amendment posited that “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” I know that the Supreme Court recently glossed over the predicate to “the right of the people to keep and bear Arms,” but submit that the logic is faulty. With a national military (including national guard units – the modern equivalent of state militias) armed and equipped by the Government, the predicate no longer exists.

Even assuming that the predicate is an unnecessary condition precedent to the “right,” what were “Arms” in the minds of the framers? They were single-shot muzzle-loaded ball muskets and pistols of limited accuracy, and edged weapons such as swords and bayonets. They were not highly accurate automatic or semi-automatic firearms with magazines holding up to 30 rounds of ammunition, much less sniper rifles capable of delivering a kill shot from miles away.

Had Mr. Lanza appeared at the elementary school in Newtown, CT, with a muzzle-loader, he doubtless would have been overwhelmed by faculty and staff as he attempted to reload after his first shot, and at least 25 of the 26 lives he took today would have been spared.

As a civilized nation, we no longer can tolerate the senseless killing of innocent civilians by crazed gunmen defended by the NRA and its sycophants. The time has come for us to stand up together, as a nation, and say, “Enough!” We can start by

– requiring mental health clearance and licensure (by the state or federal government) in the safe and proper use of firearms as a condition precedent to the right to purchase any firearm.

– requiring the prior licensure (by the state or federal government) of any firearm to a specific owner, who shall be the only person authorized to possess and use it, and making possession of an unlicensed firearm a mandatory felony.

– making it a crime to transfer possession of a firearm without prior licensure of the transferee (by the state or federal government), and impose civil and criminal liability on the transferor equal to that of the transferee if the handgun is used in the commission of any crime.

I realize that standing up to the gun lobby and the gangs in our country requires immense courage, but we have to retake control of our collective safety and destiny.

You’re making too much sense.

Analyze this Tony. No laws passed will deter the criminal or the insane. So in your scenario the teachers would be loading their flintlocks while the mass murderer would be killing them with his “unauthorized” weapon. I think the biggest problem we have is that the people who want to change the laws about gun ownership know nothing about guns. Having a ban on high capacity clips will do nothing to decrease the damage that can be done by a criminal with a gun. You can change a clip in less than a second.

MrStoneheep, Is this a discussion you would be willing to have? Would you be willing to ban “military grade” weapons recognizing that at this instant in time we do not have a good definition. Would you be willing to have the dialogue to attempt define “military grade”? You do make some good points. We do need to get to the place that we do not talk past each other. I do take exception to rpg1408 who says “no one should own a gun”.

George, THERE, I will NOT argue with you. I had no problem with that for the ten years we didn’t have high cap mags. You see, all my rifles are bolt action rifles of the hunting variety. Yes, some will call them sniper rifles but only because the military adopted the outdoorsman’s guns for their purpose and we need ask why. Because they are the best for long range accuracy, plain and simple. I have several shotguns, all but two being either pump guns or over and under, mostly OU’s. Then the 1100 Remington that holds 5 w/o the plug and 3 with, and the swame for the Ithaca Mag5. I don’t have many handguns, but what I do have are all cylinder guns (revolvers) of either 5 or 6 shots only. High capacity magazines I’ve no use for, and there really wasn’t a lot of quibling even from the NRA on that issue, but it was a “sunset” law passed during the first Bush’s Presidency and the sun set on it a couple years ago, mainly because it was decided it really had no affect on the crime levels of the gangbangers and the drug folks. Didn’t surprise most of us ‘gunnuts’ but it did Congress and they just let the sun set on it, kinda’ like what’s going to happen in a few days with this ‘cliff ‘ thing if our leader doesn’t get over his ego problem. (before you start, I’m a Democrat and I voted for him)

When Black kids are killed ever day in cities around the U.S. and you say that is ok but when white kids are killed by another white person now is so bad to have guns.Please ,Why don’t you have the same rage when black kid’s are killed. Killing people is wrong no matter what color,and I hope when you ask that guns be taken also from street kids who are killing each other, daily because much different reasons. Mabey jobs and access to free mental health care would be a start. No you ass holes I did not say one has a right to kill because they do not have a job:But a unstable person that can not get free mental health help that a different story.FREE MENTal HEALTH CARE would be a good start

See my answer to Contented1

Those with fame will still want their bodyguards to carry.
Take ALL guns away except for police. See who wants exception and you will hear but I am an elected official or a VIP. I need different rules.
You can’t stop people with an intent to kill. Look at the four who got sprayed with gas.
The Gov makes laws that the honest guy follows. By definition the bad guys don’t.

Hillbilly: You just made a common sense statement. Refreshing!

No, that’s your coma you’re experiencing.

What will unborn babies be if left alone? Frogs?

yea no doubt the Native population is 1600 was 500 Million according to the left wing nuts

Thank you!! And Merry Christmas to you and your family!!

Thank you!! I miss Brad so!! Merry Christmas to you too, and your family