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The Confederacy Crashes In A Week. It Only Took 150 Years.

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The Confederacy Crashes In A Week. It Only Took 150 Years.


The rush to ditch the Confederate battle flag is making the country’s shift in favor of gay marriage look like slow motion. A groundbreaking 2003 ruling from the highest court in Massachusetts was the first to legalize same-sex marriage. In 2011, Gallup reported another first: Gay marriage now had majority support.

If eight years is a sea change in the blink of an eye, the sprint away from the Rebel flag by politicians and CEOs qualifies as whiplash. It was at full speed less than a week after the Emanuel AME church tragedy in which a white supremacist shooter apparently took succor and affirmation from the flag as he laid his plans to murder nine people. “The flag now is owned by him. It’s the flag of the murderer in our time,” South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham, a GOP presidential candidate, told CBS.

Everything that has been said about the flag in the past week has been true for the past 150 years. It represents treason and brutality, white supremacy and black bondage. So how much credit should today’s “leaders” get for their sudden bid for distance from Dylann Roof and that flag?

It is tempting to go with a safety-in-numbers theory. Politicians and businesses may recognize a unique moment of opportunity to act on principle without paying a penalty. It’s like speeding at the same rate as other cars when you’re in a long line of traffic. Everyone’s doing it, so nobody’s likely to get a ticket or — in this case — lose votes or customers.

The risk has been high until now. For instance, a Winthrop University poll last November showed 61 percent of people in South Carolina — including 73 percent of whites — wanted to keep the flag on the Capitol grounds. Gov. Nikki Haley, an Indian-American Republican running for re-election that month, called it a non-issue in her campaign. But this week, surrounded by Democrats, Republicans, blacks, and whites, she called it part of the state’s past and said it needs to go. And with that she set off the swarm.

The GOP’s 2016 presidential candidates were first to say they agreed. They were quickly followed by governors and legislators in other states suddenly feeling moved to exorcise statues, flags and license plates. And then came the national and state business communities. WalMart, eBay, Amazon.com, and Sears said they would stop selling Confederate flag merchandise. Boeing, BMW, Michelin, and multiple chambers of commerce in South Carolina fell in line behind Haley. Perhaps most miraculously, so did the state legislature. The state House voted 103-10 to allow debate this summer on removing the flag. The state Senate agreed by voice vote.

Obviously, it would have been admirable for all of this to have happened without the cruel shock of a massacre of innocents, and without the pressure of an early presidential primary in South Carolina. And there were some people who did what they considered to be the right thing long ago — among them former Georgia Gov. Roy Barnes, who shrank the Confederate battle emblem on his state flag and says that’s the main reason he lost his 2002 re-election bid; and 2016 presidential candidate Jeb Bush, who moved the Confederate flag to a museum when he was the governor of Florida and reportedly advised Haley on her course in the current crisis.

The lightning reactions of the past few days suggest to me that many people have been uneasy about Confederate flags and symbols for many years. Whatever their reasons, they have seized this moment to act. It didn’t hurt that the same week as the church killings, the Supreme Court ruled Texas does not have to issue Confederate flag license plates. Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe promptly announced he would phase them out in his state.

The conversation continues to spread, with Tennessee leaders calling for the removal of a bust of Ku Klux Klan leader Nathan Bedford Forrest from the state Capitol, and a petition filed to remove a statue of Jefferson Davis from the University of Texas campus in Austin. The sudden consensus is that these men, these flags, these emblems, are history. They belong in museums or on personal property. They don’t belong at seats of learning and government, where they contradict our national values and ideals by their very presence.

This discussion is too valuable to quibble about who waited too long and who did not. It’s more than enough that it’s happening at all.

Follow Jill Lawrence on Twitter @JillDLawrence. To find out more about Jill Lawrence and read features by other Creators Syndicate writers and cartoonists, visit the Creators Syndicate website at www.creators.com. 

The Confederate and South Carolina State flags fly during a march in Washington, D.C. (Photo by Andrew Aliferis via Flickr.com)

Jill Lawrence

Award-winning journalist Jill Lawrence is a nationally syndicated columnist and a contributing editor to U.S. News & World Report. She also contributed to The Surge: 2014's Big GOP Win and What It Means for the Next Presidential Race (2015). Lawrence has discussed political and policy developments on television, radio, and many other media outlets. She was an adjunct professorial lecturer at American University in 2014, teaching on the relationship between politics and the media.

Lawrence has covered every presidential campaign since 1988, as well as historic events such as the Three Mile Island nuclear accident, the 1994 Republican takeover of Congress, the Clinton impeachment, the Florida recount, and the 1993 and 2009 battles over health reform.

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  1. bobnstuff June 25, 2015

    Over time the meaning of things change and we look at them differently. The flag in question never was the official flag of the Confederacy and has spent most of it’s history as a flag of division and hate. The media has used it to represent the southerns as dim witted or disrespectful. The term “Good old Boys” comes to mind. Is this the image the south wants to give to the world? Our country has one flag that is for all the nation. Isn’t it time for the south to stop fighting the civil war and rejoin the union.

    1. FireBaron June 25, 2015

      Apparently, many of them thought that Lee’s surrender at Appomattox was really just an opportunity for them to withdraw and regroup.

      1. idamag June 27, 2015

        And they still do. We went to Stone Mountain, Georgia. They have all the southern generals carved into the stone mountain. The KKK’s first meetings were held on top of that rock. We listened to the presentation in the visitor’s center. They said something to the effect that the North attacked them just because they wanted to tell them how to live. So YES the south is still fighting the civil war.

    2. homegirl June 25, 2015

      I speculate but my belief is if the flag had been lowered to half mast when the US flag and the state flag were lowered this act of disrespect would not have had the outburst and attention the media is, rightly, giving this event..

      As for the flag not being fitted to permit lowering to half mast-what a message, built in to the legislation!

      Surely a welder could have installed a hasp on that flagpole in less than an hour.

      1. bobnstuff June 25, 2015

        It’s the mindset, don’t solve the problem, see if you can make it worse. I could have had it at half mast in ten minutes with the tools in my pocket. There are people who like to stick it in your eye.

      2. idamag June 27, 2015

        While U.S. flags were lowered at half-mast for the victims of the racist shooting. the confederate flag continued to fly as the funeral cortege went under it.

  2. Thomas_Blaney June 25, 2015

    Suppose there were other similar examples of former Confederate states flying a flag to respect their ancestral heritage of a lost cause.

    Consider, just for instance, that California, Arizona, Nevada, Utah, New Mexico and Tejas, flew the flag of Mexico on their state capitols on the insistence of hispanics to honor the heritage and valor of their lost cause. That land was formerly part of a truly separate and independent nation. They too are still living on the land fought for and lost by their ancestors in a war of much more dubious origin than the Civil War.

    Would Southerners show any similar sympathy for their cause? Imagine.

  3. AgLander June 25, 2015

    The Confederacy has not collapsed as the headline suggests. Everything is fine and dandy down in Dixieland, thank you. Regional pride and heritage have not been affected one bit. Diversity and harmony among all races continues to outpace our Northern neighbors as evidenced by the horrid urban cesspools of crime and corruption and social/racial unrest throughout that region……Baltimore, Detroit, Ferguson, Chicago just to mention the more recent headline grabbers. The only thing that we in the South have noticed is that there seems to have been a temper outburst (just the latest one) by a troubled segment of the population that goes under the name of “liberals” who are on a 150 year guilt trip. And in the midst of their self-loathing, these liberals have decided to once again do something liberals are very good at…..go for an act of symbolism in hurling venomous accusations at a simple flag and demand its banishment, the same flag that identifies a region that is an example of everything good about the harmonious and prosperous South in 2015 and nothing about what the liberals would like us to do…return to the mindset of 150 years ago. But then, we have come to expect these symbolic eruptions by liberals which is what they prefer because symbolism is very easy and requires very little physical effort, while they ignore the substance, which requires actual work (such as cleaning up their own backyard) and is always avoided by these self-loathing liberals. To sum it up…..we are here, we are fine and we look on with bemusement at this, the latest “kids in the sand box” temper tantrum thrown by children disguised in adult bodies.

    1. charleo1 June 25, 2015

      What heritage does the battle flag of the old Confederacy represent that you are so evidently proud of? Perhaps it’s your version of the Duck Dynasty narrative? That the Darkies were singing and happy down in these parts, until King, and the other Liberals, and Northern buttinskies got involved. Is that about it? You’re all about freedom, and the Left is nothing but a bunch of lying Communists! Yes Sir, Communist! It’s what I hear. Bent on coming down here and destroying everything American stands for! That’s what I’m hearing starting to rumble from the bowels of the 98% White Conservative base. That, and your politicians are nothing but spineless no accounts, if they bend over like they’re doing, and let Obama use the killings of a few Negros over in Charleston, to take your precious flag down, and your guns away, is what I’m hearing.

      1. DEFENDER88 June 25, 2015

        You are correct the second American Revolution against Northern Federal aggression is alive and well but it is no longer race based.
        Race relations, in the North, seem to have gone backwards(Ferguson & Baltimore)while relations in the South (overall) continue to improve, at least the South is not having race riots like Ferguson, Baltimore.
        You have done such a good job there I don’t understand why we(the South) don’t bring you down here to straighten us out.
        In fact the Southerners of Charleston “came together” over the racial murder there. No riots, burning neighborhoods down, shooting at police, etal. Seems you Northern Elites may yet have some things to learn from Southerners. The one thing you do excel at is blind arrogance.
        And your Northern Cities have the highest gun crime rates in the world and you want to come down here and tell us how to handle that problem. Not just arrogant but blind arrogance. You don’t seem to really know much about the real south as it is today.
        No it is not perfect in race relations but is getting better at, seemingly, a faster rate then the North.

        1. charleo1 June 26, 2015

          First, I don’t believe you represent the views of the people of SC. They, their Governor, and most of their legislators have shown themselves to be much more aware of why the flag must come down. For reasons both complex, and simple. Such as in the wake of the massacre, it has become impossible to deny that flag symbolizes the ideals of those who, like Dylan Roof, would enter into a place of sanctuary and murder innocents for no other reason than the color of their skin. Or, the fact that the actions of one Dylan Roof brought into the cold harsh light, a reality that may no longer be denied. That that flag, flying as it does at the Capitol, is an insult to Black people everywhere. And therefore, in SC alone, offends more than a third of that State’s residents. Or, of it’s recent history. The reason that particular flag was adopted, was to stand as a symbol of the State’s enduring White power structure. And to send a message of collective opposition to Federal Civil Rights Laws from White Power entities across the South. And it’s leaders rebel refusal to see, or care about the continued injustice of systematically denying the Black residents of their States, their due Constitutional Rights, based solely on race. Or better yet, maybe the flag just no longer speaks to where the majority of S. Carolinians are. Which is what progress by first acknowledging racism continues exists, and taking steps to remedy it, looks like. Very different than what was going on in the Black Communities in Ferguson, or Baltimore, NY. and across the Country. Where Police were, for minor infractions, or sometimes no infraction at all. Stopping, harassing, jailing, fining, and sometimes killing young Black males. And systematically getting away with it. As mostly White Police Forces refused to properly investigate themselves. And prosecutors, and grand juries looked the other way, and refused to indict. And this situation persisted for years, until they the systematically oppressed took their grievances to the street. As was their Constitutional Right. Very different than Charleston. False assumption on your part. All too typical. Blacks, off the sidewalk, in the street! What do they want now? An increase in their food stamps? Gun violence is worse up North! So our race relations must be much better! Typical White Southern arrogance. Race problem? What race problem? We didn’t have one until Obama, and Sharpton stirred ’em all up down here! Do you listen to yourselves at all?

      2. idamag June 27, 2015

        It is the flag of the KKK. It is the flag that represents treason. It represents hate and Lindsey Graham says, “It is who we are.”

        1. charleo1 June 27, 2015

          I think Lindsey Graham is speaking for people like himself. When he says it. [the flag,] represents who we are. Much like when John Boehner says, Americans don’t want billionaires to
          suffer a dime’s worth of tax increases, to lower college tuition, improve roads, bridges, or expand programs that help the poor. It’s true some Americans agree with that….The billionaires!

    2. chino49p June 25, 2015

      You are blind, deaf and dumb. There is a very good reason why white supremacist groups use the emblems of the southern confederacy and nazi germany. Its racial hatred and the feeling of being superior. The symbols of the confederacy were brought back into prominant display as a direct protest to the civil rights movement. It was meant to say that we are STILL against equality for the Negro people just like we were back in the days of slavery.
      The people of the confederacy were TRAITORS to this great country, they were not patriots. They sanctioned horrible inhumanity not goodness. Everything about it should be relegated to a dark corner of the museum, and given no more respect and honor than nazi germany. Anybody flying that flag is either ignorant of what it actually represents or they agree with what it represents just like the kkk and other white supremacist groups.

  4. charleo1 June 25, 2015

    I think the headline, “The Confederacy Crashes,” is extremely premature. To progress from compromises such as taking down the Stars and Bars, from the capitol dome, only to move it to the front yard of the S. Carolina State House, as happened in 2002. To taking the flag down altogether, does not a, “Crash of the Confederacy,” make. And if we assume for one second those who have kept alive what many consider the second American Revolution against Northern Federal aggression for the last 150 years are ready to throw in the towel over this, I think we make a huge miscalculation. Truth be told there are bigger fish to fry than flags and rusty Civil War monuments. Like tearing down voter Rights Act, and reversing the Civil Right Legislation of the 1960s. Hacking away at Brown V. Board of Ed.school desegregation thru the privatization of public education. Eliminating affirmative action programs, as Chief Justice Roberts sees it, by eliminating discrimination, by simply stopping what is, in his opinion, the unnecessary mandating of discrimination. A very popular concept in the South. And with big business interests everywhere. That says, let’s get the government out of the fairness business, and leave that to us. What Faulkner pointed out about the South is as true today as it was before the Charleston tragedy. That the past is never dead. In fact, for the South, it is never really past. Making new beginnings like the crash of the Old Confederacy, so unlikely as to be absurd to suggest such a thing is even possible.

    1. idamag June 27, 2015

      With all that, why wonder why we think the south is still racist.

  5. Dominick Vila June 25, 2015

    The most compelling blow to the Confederacy, and its iconic symbols, was the response given by the families of the victims of the Emanuel Church massacre. Instead of threats, insults, and over reactions, they demonstrated moral values and a strength of character that is the exact opposite to what Mr. Roof and his ilk expected. They showed the world the difference between mature and responsible members of our society and the white trash that refuses to join the civilized world.
    Having said this, I caution those posters that tend to characterize all Southerners as ignorant bigots. The overwhelming majority of Southerners are no different from everyone else. Let’s not jump into conclusions and blame an entire region for the behavior of an idiot.

    1. DEFENDER88 June 25, 2015

      I agree but would add, the most compelling blow to the Racism of the old south is the way the whole community Black and White came together to mourn and try to do better vs rioting and burning the town.

  6. DEFENDER88 June 25, 2015

    One mad racist killer does not represent the “South” as a whole.
    That is like saying Dzhokhar Tsarnaev and Tamerlan Tsarnaev represent the people of Boston as a whole.
    The way the Charleston community came together “after” the killing is more like the South of today.
    There were no race riots like Ferguson or Baltimore ie the “North”.

    1. Robert Eckert June 25, 2015

      An army of racist killers who left a pile of a million corpses did represent the “South” as an attempted separate government. That is what that flag stands for and always did.

      1. DEFENDER88 June 25, 2015

        No one can justify the slavery that was part of the South.
        Just as it is hard to justify G. Washington & T. Jefferson not releasing theirs.

        But from things I have read about the Civil War, most of the young men who “actually fought” in it were not fighting for slavery.
        They could never hope to own slaves.
        They were typically 16-25yo poor farm boys who often worked as hard as some slaves.
        They were fighting for their brother or buddy down the dusty path at the next farm.
        Or, in battle, for the man next to you(much like today).
        Or their County or State – as they knew it. ie States Rights – bad as some may have been.
        But typically not for slavery, per-se.
        There were many issues involved besides slavery.

        Even today Southerners don’t like Northerners trying to tell them what to do ie how to live. Especially when the race, guns, etc problems seem to be worse in the North then the South.
        Especially when Southerners typically much prefer the South to the North – even now.
        Arrogant a** elite, pr**ks try to tell us how to live while their cities are burning down around them.
        You had quasi-racial incidents in Ferguson and Baltimore and what happened – riots.
        We had a for-sure racial attack/tragedy in Charleston and what happened – everyone(Black and White) came together and mourned. And avowed to do better.
        Good that Back Southerners are smarter than Elite Northerners and realize 1 mad killer does not make the whole town, state or region racist.
        Not burn the place down.

        1. Robert Eckert June 25, 2015

          “They could never hope to own slaves.” But as long as blacks were kept enslaved they had someone to look down on. This is what kept them from being regarded as low-class: “Among us the poor white laborer is respected as an equal. His family is treated with kindness, consideration and respect. He does not belong to the menial class. The negro is in no sense of the term his equal.”

          “There were many issues involved besides slavery.” That’s a lie. Slavery was the one and only issue. Everyone involved in forming the Confederacy was quite explicit, indeed loud and noisy, in proclaiming that. Read any of the Declarations of Secession.

          1. idamag June 27, 2015

            I think defender should read, “Carry Me Home Again, Birmingham, Alabama.” Then he can try and justify the south.

        2. stcroixcarp June 25, 2015

          Maybe Northern Black people will simply not tolerate being murdered by whitey without a whimper. Storm Roof was and is not mad. He is an evil racist terrorist who is trying to incite a race war. His words, not mine.

        3. JPHALL June 25, 2015

          You are so full of BS. Yes, most Southerners fought for a higher purpose. But like the Germans under the Nazis, they were lied to about the reasons for fighting. Just like today their “leaders” ,glorify war, while avoiding war service.

    2. @HawaiianTater June 25, 2015

      “One mad racist killer does not represent the “South” as a whole.”

      Anyone who tries to make the case that “one mad racist killer” represents the South as a whole is just as stupid as someone who tries to make the case that the problems with racism in the South are isolated to this one person and everyone else is one big happy community.

      As someone who was born n raised in Alabama and lived over two decades of my life there, I am plenty qualified to make the statement that the South is still full of racist bigots who wants everyone who’s not a White Conservative Christian Republican to GTFO. Yes, there are many people in the South who are not this way. But, if you think that racism is dead in the South, you’re either severely misinformed or lying to yourself.

      Alabama took down it’s 4 flags at the capital due to the current backlash. If they weren’t a state full of racists, they wouldn’t have been flying them in the first place. They didn’t take down the flags because they wanted to take down the flags. They did it because knew how much hate they would receive if they didn’t.

      Oh and BTW… comparing this to the Tsarnaev brothers is outright stupidity. They were not Bostonians. They were Chechen Muslims. Roof is as white conservative Southern as you can get. In my hometown of Anniston, they firebombed a civil rights bus and tried to force the people to stay in the bus to be burned alive. There is also a story from last week about two Anniston cops being suspended and investigated for belonging to a white supremacy hate group that has ties to the KKK. The South has a very long history of violence against black people. The only reason you don’t see as much violence as you used to is because they can’t get away with it anymore. They’re still plenty racist. They’re just losing their ability to be violent and overt about it.

      1. DEFENDER88 June 25, 2015

        I’ll call your 2 decades in the South and raise you by 4.

        So 6 for me(continuous) + 1 up north, and west coast. 7 total

        I never said racism was dead in the south, you cant show me that.

        Nor does it seem to be dead in the North.

        It is getting better and at times seems to be getting better then in the North ie Ferguson and Baltimore.

        Some would say the South HAS made enough progress that it might be better in the South now than the North – seems so in Ferguson and Baltimore anyway.

        When the racist nut killed the Blacks in Charleston, unlike Ferguson and Baltimore – no one rioted, everyone(Black and White) came together to mourn and try to do better. ie NOT burn the place down.

        And S.C. is where the Civil War started.

        Your righteous indignation make me wonder if you are not trying to overcome some racial bias or incident you now regret.

        1. @HawaiianTater June 25, 2015

          You seem to be concentrating a lot on the “North vs. South” argument. Resentment much? Even IF the South is “better” than the North, that doesn’t mean the South is any good. It just means both suck.

          You’ve made your second erroneous comparison now. What happened in Ferguson and Baltimore was sparked by systematic violence and racism conducted by cops on the black community. Comparing them to what happened in Charleston is invalid.

          As far as the rioting goes… I kinda agree with you to an extent. Burning down their own communities isn’t going to help. If you’re going to riot, go after the people who are causing you harm. Burn down their stuff. Attacking the oppressive government seems like to me it would be something Southerners would support. Oh, right, these are black people being oppressed, so they should just shut up and take it.

          I LOL at your “righteous indignation” wonderings. I’m not trying to overcome anything I have done in the past. I’m just especially disgusted by this topic because that’s the environment I’m from. You can keep your extra 4 decades. 2 was enough for me. I could not stand being around people like that anymore, so I abandoned ship and moved to Hawai’i.

          Oh, yeah… I live in Hawai’i. Alabama the rest of the South can suck it.

          1. ralphkr June 26, 2015

            Speaking of discrimination, Hawaiian Tater, back in the 1950s a couple friends of mine shut down their construction business in Alaska because they were disgusted with the short building season and moved to Hawaii. They were back in Alaska in less than 3 years even though the profits were huge because they were disgusted with the shoddy houses they were building (by Alaskan & Midwestern standards) and they were tired of being treated the way blacks were treated in Mississippi. We Caucasians just aren’t used to being discriminated against.

          2. @HawaiianTater June 26, 2015

            There are still natives in certain areas who hate us haoles but that is more xenophobia than it is racism. They just hate EVERYone who is not them. For the most part though, you don’t see a lot of racism here because there are so many different kinds of people from so many different kinds of places. We truly are one big melting pot of cultures.

          3. idamag June 27, 2015

            I read a book once where the natives, of Hawaii were talking about the missionaries. It was when they were first discovered by the English and missionaries were sent. The passage said, “We raised our faces and our arms to our Gods to pray. The missionaries came and taught us to fold our arms, bow our heads and shut our eyes to pray. While our heads were bowed and our eyes were shut, they stole everything we had.” That might explain their prejudices against haoles.

          4. @HawaiianTater June 27, 2015

            I’ve heard that exact same story before. A lot of them still think the islands are being illegally occupied and want to kick us all out.

        2. stcroixcarp June 25, 2015

          While you are right that racism exists and is actually quite healthy in the North, northern racism in no way justifies the glorification of the confederacy and the adulation of the confederate flag. Both Ferguson and Baltimore show us the raw face of anger and frustration for centuries of racism. Isn’t Ferguson in Missouri? Isn’t Missouri in the South?

          1. DEFENDER88 June 27, 2015

            Yes Ferguson is in Missouri, part of St Louis as I remember and NO it is definitely not part of the South.

            Just arrive at St Louis airport from Nashville, walk around a bit and you know you are not in the welcoming cleanliness, charm and personal warmth and consideration of the South.

            You know you are in “What do YOU want”, “Get out of my face”, Yankee – F.U. ville.

            Much like NY, NJ, Mass, Conn, Phily et al.

            Admittadly, just my opinion.
            On racism – nation wide –
            I think :
            Blacks should acknowledge we have come a long way.
            Whites should acknowledge we have a ways to go yet.

        3. idamag June 27, 2015

          We have racist people, in the Northwest where I live, but they keep it quiet as someone is going to call them on it if they express it. My relatives, in the south, are afraid to speak out. When a racist group WAR came to our city and passed out flyers, the entire city rose up in indignation and they left. That doesn’t happen in the south. I actually heard the n-word used in the south. It is considered profanity here. We have never had cross burnings, lynchings or jim crow laws. If there are good people in the south, they are afraid to speak out. In the Northwest, we have never bombed churches, beat people to death or burned churches. If you are a southerner and not racist, do you dare speak out against racism?

          1. DEFENDER88 June 27, 2015

            I have lived up North and West Coast and traveled all over the US.
            But lived in the South for the last 60yrs.
            The South has come a long way in the past 50 or so years in race relations.
            I would say has made a lot more “progress” then other areas of the country.
            Of course the South had further to go.
            Than again we ALL have further to go – Black and White.
            So unlike some who are just guessing about how things are in the South because of history – I have lived it.
            The South now (in race relations) is not that much different from anywhere else in the US.
            Call it the “New South” if you want.
            Some of the impacts/drivers have been the Civil Rights Act, the bad treatment of Blacks who peacefully demonstrated in Miss and AL but were treated badly, the murder of MLK, etc – all this did not sit well with most whites in the South.
            The advent of National news agencies like CNN, the Intenet, etc and just a general increased awareness of the plight and extra problems that Blacks face in this country.
            So this country, in many ways, is much more homogenous than it has ever been in the past and continues that way.
            There are still cultural differences but the general knowledge, education and awareness gap has closed significantly.
            While we still have red-necks in the South you still have Black haters in the North and NE.
            In general though the Red Necks(down here) are just as much a problem and danger to other Whites as Blacks.
            “I” have been shot at 3 times, all by Red Necks in the mountains.
            They are now a minority, their numbers are decreasing and they do not now represent the norm here.
            However I doubt they will ever “totally” disappear -after-all we still have Nazi lovers all over.
            If you just look at what happened in Ferguson and Baltimore and compare that to what happened after the church murder in Charleston(no riots etc) the whole community black and white come together to condemn it.
            So who now is acting more progressive?
            ps All the church burnings I the last 20+ ys here have been White churches by stupid-a*s red-necks.

    3. idamag June 27, 2015

      I have relatives who were transferred,by their work, to the South. Are you trying to snow us? when we visited, it was obvious that the south still goes by the slogan, “Save your confederate money, the south shall rise again.”

      1. DEFENDER88 June 27, 2015

        Maybe rise again, but not for racial reasons.
        Guns maybe but not race.

    4. Lilowl June 27, 2015

      “I agree that one mad racist killer does not represent the south as a whole,” but you can’t say that about the flag.

      1. DEFENDER88 June 27, 2015

        That is why I have never bought or displayed that flag.

        Even though “I” don’t consider it racist – most Blacks do.

        So “I” have never owned or displayed one.

        ps – Its use and display is diminishing in the South, has been for a while now.

        I have always seen it as just Southern pride in not being a Dam Yankee.

        In that sense you can call me a Rebel but it has nothing to do with Race.

        Exa – Getting pretty sick of Northern elites looking down their noses saying how bad racism is in the South when it is now seems just as bad up there considering the progress the South has made in race relations.

        And about guns being so bad in the South when the gun murder capitals are in the North where gun “control” is the tightest.

        1. Lilowl June 27, 2015

          So you don’t hate black people, but consider someone from the north a damn Yankee. I hate to tell you how many southerners have said nigg*er in front of me, many times used to describe President Obama. Also, I never mentioned guns. I am not an elitist. The definition of an elitist is: 1. A person who believes that they are superior to others (and thus
          deserve favored status) because of their intellect, social status,
          wealth, or other factors.

          2. Somebody who believes that society should be ruled by an elite class.

          I think #2 describes conservative republicans that worship the wealthy.

          1. DEFENDER88 June 27, 2015

            No, not all Yankees act like elitists, not you either.
            I have family up North(Mass/Conn) and have been there numerous times. Like everywhere else – there are a lot of good people up there and some not so good. Most of the elitist I am talking about are the ones who start calling all people who live in the south racists, and gun nuts, and idiots, and worse when they, in fact, don’t really know much about the South as it is today.
            And seem to be educated, elite, northern, know it alls who don’t really know the current “lay of the land” here.
            As for the word nigg*er, I rarely hear it down here. It is (thankfully) becoming less and less used.

            As for Obama – this IS primarily Republican/Right wing territory so yeah they don’t like him.

            “I” am more of a centrist. My family down here is all Republican but none of them would “ever” use the N word.
            Of course most all of us(6 of 7 immediate) are college educated.

            And fortunately the number of “Red Necks” here is diminishing also. That is where most of the use of the word comes from.
            I consider Red Necks just as dangerous to most Whites as to Blacks.
            Since they have shot at “me” at least 3 times.
            And that is exactly what Roof(the Charleston Shooter) was.

            Since I worked for a Black guy for some time and once stood between him and the “Clan” and have lived here for 60 yr, I also know something about Black/White relations in the South.

            I “personally” think Obama might be the smartest pres we have ever had.
            In fact. I voted for him 2 times.

            But I could never vote Dem now because of the now failed gun polices being pushed by the Dem Left Elitists.

  7. socrates2 June 26, 2015

    Could it be due to a demographic shift? My understanding is that many “northerners/yankees” sick of cold winters (and looking for job opportunities/low-cost retirement) have moved to the Sunbelt/South due to affordable (but inclement weather) real estate. Ergo, locals now face possible narrow-margin electoral battles.
    I suspect the bloody actions of this unhappy Charleston narcissist merely placed this issue front and center. Politicians, ever the popularity-contest types, read the writing on the city hall steps…
    Be well.

  8. Kim Serrahn July 2, 2015

    I guess most of them finally figured out they lost the war and the south ain’t gonna rise again.


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