By Jim Hightower

Blessed Are The Rich

July 24, 2013 1:24 pm Category: Economy, Memo Pad, Politics 153 Comments A+ / A-
Blessed Are The Rich

One thing I’ve come to value in the last couple of years is the altruism and keen economic insights of the fourth-richest man in America: Charles Koch.

Even though Koch was raised rich and has now amassed a personal fortune of about $34 billion, he recently gave us a deeper sense of his true worth, measured not in dollars, but in values.

“We want to do a better job of raising up the disadvantaged and the poorest in this country,” he declared. Excellent thought — FDR couldn’t have put it better! Noting that a big problem for the poor is that the Powers That Be “keep throwing obstacles in their way,” Koch cut to the chase, saying, “We’ve got to clear those out.”

Yes, Charlie, I’m with you! Clear out such barriers as the offshoring of middle-class jobs, union busting, poorly funded schools and the lack of affordable health care, housing and child care.

But, alas, that’s not at all what Koch had in mind as obstacles to be cleared out. Rather, he proposes to “help” poor people by eliminating — ready? — “the minimum wage.” Why? Because, explains this clueless son-of-the-rich, having a wage floor “reduces the mobility of labor.”

In case you don’t dwell in the plutocratic, narcissistic, Ayn Randian fantasyland where the Kochs hang out, “labor mobility” is right-wing psychobabble for social Darwinism. Remove all remnants of America’s economic safety net, they coldly theorize (while wallowing in their nests of luxury), and the poor will be “freed” to become billionaires.

As Charles puts it, if the disadvantaged had no protections in the workplace and no government programs to ameliorate their poverty, they would then have to scramble just to live, thus freeing them from reliance on society’s helping hand. Freeing them to do what? Well, Koch says, they could then “start a business … drive a taxicab … become a hairdresser.”

What a visionary he is! Where you and I might see people trapped in debilitating poverty, Charles sees a Brave New World of billionaire hairdressers!

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Blessed Are The Rich Reviewed by on . One thing I've come to value in the last couple of years is the altruism and keen economic insights of the fourth-richest man in America: Charles Koch. Even tho One thing I've come to value in the last couple of years is the altruism and keen economic insights of the fourth-richest man in America: Charles Koch. Even tho Rating:

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Comments

  • Dominick Vila

    The Koch brothers also dream of a world where their companies can transport highly corrosive petroleum through our land, and where their investments in places like Benghazi allow them to get an inside track into what is going on there.

    • Germansmith

      The Koch brothers are a cancer
      I wonder why nobody has taken their time to find out what industries they own, what products they sell and organize a boycott of their products and related industries

      • Jim Myers

        One of the problems with a boycott of their products is that there are so many diverse industries that would suffer dramatically without their products.

        Plus all the spin off industries that would also be hurt in the process.

        Ultimately, the shareholders, workers, and the entire economy would feel the pain from the demise of these monsters.

        They are, in fact, too big to fail.

        Now, breaking up their cartels, and spinning off the end pieces,that might be another thing.

        Also, digging into their personal and business enterprises would almost certainly bring into light plenty of illegal activity.

        • morbius777

          This all started when Reagan stopped enforcing the Sherman AntiTrust act.

      • ThomasBonsell

        It’s all there if you would just look. Try searching in Google, Bing, Yahoo or other search engines for “Koch Industries.”

        • Germansmith

          Thanks Thomas
          But I asked “why somebody has not taken their time”, I did not ask how to do it
          Also, not simple because a lot of their products (oil as an example) are used by other companies to make consumers products that would be the “target” for boycott.
          I am not a committed lefty enough to use my time to do it, but I would not mind seeing it happen.

    • Fern Woodfork

      What Do You Expect The Koch Brothers Are The Founding Fathers Of The American Taliban They Have Been Gutting Out America And Selling Out The American People All Their Lives Plus They Also Were Big Supporter Of Hitler!!! :-(

      • Vazir Mukhtar

        If the Koch Bros were a big supporter of Hitler, they would have to have been born, say, in the 1920s. That would mean that they are in the 90s now. I don’t think they are. Have you any evidence to support your assertion?

        What does “gutting our America” mean? Or selling out America? Have you any figures to support the notion that most/much of what is produced by Koch Industries is made off-shore? that those who work in the Kochs’ factories don’t make a decent wage?

        I’m not a supporter of or fan of the Koch Bros, but rants without evidence to back them up are just that: rants. You may feel better for having vented, but your lack of backup IMO persuades no one.

        If you want to go after the Koch Bros, pls do so with chapter and verse.

        • CPAinNewYork

          You’re wasting your time trying to argue logically with Fern. She’s only into four-word expletives.

          • dpaano

            CPAin: I didn’t seen any four-letter expletives in Fern’s comment….I thought she said it very well. She’s probably very close to being correct….it’s their money in our politics that has taken down unions, right-to-work laws, etc. They pretty much “own” a goodly portion of the Tea Party Movement, and that movement is trying to keep the middle class down! Hang in there, Fern!! I may not always agree with the way you say it, but I certainly agree with what you say!

          • Fern Woodfork

            Thank You My friend!! :-) I Just Have A low Tolerance For Lying Trolls!!

          • dpaano

            Totally agree…..I just don’t have your “colorful” language to discribe how I feel (lol)!

          • Mark Forsyth

            Sometimes those c-ck s-cking low life sh-t eating mother f-cking sons of bitches bastards need a good cussing!

          • Vazir Mukhtar

            CPAinNewYork

            Thanks for the tip.

            If your New York is the city, I hope we make the best choice in choosing a new mayor. I like Spitzer for Comptroller but haven’t paid attention to the other candidates.

          • CPAinNewYork

            In a political arena where morality is a rare commodity, the performances of Spitzer and Weiner stand out as representations of the depths of immorality. It is to New York City’s shame that both of these sleazebags were front runners for the offices to which they aspire.

            I also despise their wives, whose loyalty makes no sense to me at all. If opportunism is their motive, then Weiner’s wife’s actions are strongly reminiscent of her ex-boss’s: Hillary Clinton. I also have a low opinion of Hillary Clinton.

          • BillP

            So I guess the whole state of South Carolina represents an even more depth of immortality. Mark Sanford on gov’t time went for a hike, a very, very,very long hike all the way down to South America. I guess he was trying to improve his foreign relations skills! He lied to his staff, family and the people of South Carolina while on the clock.
            Gee we are so glad you are telling us of your opinion of Spitzer’s and Weiner’s wives. Do you have the same animosity for Vitter’s, Craig’s or Foley’s wives too? What ever went on between the husbands and wives in the marriages is their issue not yours.
            Grow up or shut up.

          • CPAinNewYork

            BillP:

            Right. Sanford is an immoral piece of garbage. By the way, it’s “…even GREATER depth of IMMORALITY,” not “…MORE depth of IMMORTALITY…”

            Now, as to my opinion of the miscreants’ wives forgiveness of the sleazebags: These are public figures and any member of the public is entitled to their opinion of them. Who are Vitter, Craig and Foley?

            As to your last sentence: You are an ignorant piece of crap and not qualified to tell anyone to grow up or shut up.

          • Vazir Mukhtar

            Perhaps the wives are if not loving, at least respecting the sinner while hating the sin. Perhaps they are hypocrites willing if not eager to help their husbands reach their (=husbands’) political goals while disregarding their husband’s behavior. Some may even accept that sort of behavior as a given for some (many?) in politics.

          • BillP

            Excuse me for the typo. I guess you don’t follow politics closely or hav e a short memory. David Viiter senator from Louisiana involved in a scandal with an escort service. Larry Craig from Utah – he off I was only stretching my leg into the next stall at an airport bathroom. Mark Foley from Florida who exhanged sexually explicit messages to an underage boy. Does that refresh your memory?
            There you go hurting my feelings calling me an ignorant piece of crap (is that an accounting term?). Gee you sound so tough I’m afraid to post this comment.

          • CPAinNewYork

            I answer snottiness with snottiness. I don’t like your telling me to grow up or shut up.

            As to the three cases that you describe: I never heard of any of them.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I’m no news junkie but those events were pretty well publicized.Difficult to have your attention on all things at all times eh?

          • CPAinNewYork

            Since you’re so up to date, why don’t you explain them to us?

            Could it be that you just make things up to win arguments?

          • BillP

            From your alias I guess you live in NY state or possibly NYC. Their stories were in the newspapers and on the news shows. I have no love for Weiner especially after his new revelation. He should drop out of the mayoral race.
            Does Spitzer deserve a 2nd chance only time will tell.

          • Vazir Mukhtar

            I find Mr Weiner far more objectionable than Mr Spitzer. Somewhere I wrote that not having looked into the qualifications of Mr Spitzer’s opponents, I cannot say that he is the best qualified. As to his morals, he seems to have learned the appropriate lesson. Finally, we’re electing a comptroller, not a rabbi.

          • CPAinNewYork

            I liked Spitzer before he started to consort with whores. He showed courage, missing from Eric Holder, in prosecuting the Wall Street sleazebags.

            I too dislike Weiner far more than Spitzer. Weiner seems to have no redeeming qualities.

            However, I do believe that our public officials are obligated to conform to the standards of decent behavior. Both Weiner and Spitzer violated those standards.

        • Fern Woodfork

          Hitler Was Reeking Havoc In The 1940′s Duh!!! Hitler Had No Power In The 1920″s!! That’s When He Was Dreaming Of Taking Over The World While He Painted Pictures!!

        • ThomasBonsell

          The Koch brothers were associated with Hitler through their father, who founded the John Birch Society and was personnally invited to sell oil to the Nazi regime in Germany after being shut down in the United States. They were also related to many Kochs in officialdom of Nazi Germany, including Karl-Otto Koch, commander of the Buchenwald concentration camp and his wife Ilse Koch. After World War II, Karl-Otto was tried for numerous murders and executed. Ilse was known as “The Witch of Buchenwald” among other epithets who collected the tattooed skin of executed prisoners.

          The Koch brothers are more gentile than their relatives but not dissimilar in their views of other (“inferior” in their minds) people.

          • Fern Woodfork

            Thank You!!

          • charleo1

            My, my! It was certainly a bad piece of luck for, that “Vazir,”
            fellow you decided to join the conversation. And a very good
            thing for the rest of us! Thank You!

          • Fern Woodfork

            LOL Vazir Wasn’t About To Win!! LOL I’m At Work And Couldn’t Go Into Details!! Beside There Are Many People In This Country And Here On This Web Site That Already Know The Ties Of The Koch Brothers & Family, Henry Ford And A Lot Of Other Rich People With The Nazis!! :-( It’s The Part Of History That The Racist Here In America Always In Denial!! But The Truth Is The Light My Friend!! :-)

          • charleo1

            Well absolutely Fern! I never intended to imply you didn’t
            properly dispatch the fool. In fact, you are the inspiration
            here!

          • Fern Woodfork

            Thank You My Friend And I Think You Are An Inspiration Also!! :-) <3

        • morbius777

          OK… I’ll keep it simple. Look at where most of the recovery increases have gone… to the top 1%. Now look at the increase in average wage for the last 30 years… non existent. Now look at Daddy Koch’s founding of the John Birch society (as radical a right wing organization as has existed in this country). Coincidence? I don’t think so.

          • Vazir Mukhtar

            There may be many reasons to object to the philosophy of the Koch Bros; however, insofar as I know there was nothing wrong with their founding (your words) the John Birch Society.

            If we are truly to have freedom of speech (with certain exceptions) in the US, why should there not be such organizations spewing their propaganda just as long as they do not advocate the violent overthrow of our government, do not give aid and comfort to our enemies foreign and domestic.

            There are many liberal and left-wing organizations offering opposing ideas; some of them advocating ideas just as out of touch with American traditions as those of the JBS.

            If we are to have a marketplace of ideas, then we need an educated public to distinguish the gold from the dross.

          • morbius777

            Your last sentence really encompasses the problem, doesn’t it. Frankly, the GOP COUNTS ON THE INABILITY FOR MANY, SHALL WE SAY, INTELLECTUALLY CHALLENGED VOTERS TO DETERMINE FACT FROM FICTION. In fact, Rodger Ailes, the architect of Fox counted on it:Today television news is watched more often than people read newspapers, than people listen to the radio, than people read or gather any other form of communication. The reason: People are lazy. With television you just sit—watch—listen. The thinking is done for you.
            From his mouth to God’s ear. So I think libel laws should be strengthened. If you knowingly post a falsehood as fact (not opinion, which should be stated as such), you should be open to criminal prosecution. A few of these idiots doing jail time would help the public to see the difference between fact and fiction.

          • ThomasBonsell

            The John Birch society was not formed with your freedom in mind.

            After daddy Koch lost his primary oil customer with the defeat of Nazi Germany he turned to the Soviet Union to be his next sugar daddy. But somewhere in his new best friends forever with Josef Stalin something went wrong and his bromance turned to hatred. It was because of that the John Birch society was born.

            The connections are evident. All three (Nazi Germany, the Soviet Union and the Koch clan ) were and are about totalitarianism.

          • Vazir Mukhtar

            Thanks for the information on the Kochs’ history.

        • holyreality

          Right!
          http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
          It was the BFEE (Bush Family Evil Empire) that performed the “Nazi Experiment” in funding the banks that fueled the German war hardware manufacturers.

          This incorporation of evil endures in the Bilderberg, CFR, Trilateral Commission and the banksters who profit from the debt that pays for war.

          I do not know of the Koch affiliation, and have no curiosity to research any ties.

      • morbius777

        And Daddy Koch was one of the founders of the John Birch society. Surprised???

        • Fern Woodfork

          Not In The Lease Bit!! Not At All!!! :-(

      • holyreality

        “Tealiban” needs to become the new meme.

        • Fern Woodfork

          They Are Ready Are The New Meme!! LOL They Own It!!

    • bechara jamhoury

      Dominic , Hello.
      I’m thankful for the Koch brothers and there intimidating technique. It is possible that they are doing some good that they do not want the public to be aware of. They know that getting to a place where they are expected, seeing smiles, is the only good they can wish for.

  • AlfredSonny

    Is there a greedy anonymous program for money addicts like Koch brothers?

    • CPAinNewYork

      Yes. It’s called revolution.

  • Eleanore Whitaker

    The Koch billionaires are a joke. They were raised to believe they are a superior race of men. BS to that. He puts his pants on like we all do. As for his billions? There is one inalienable fact of life…Money, even Koch money, always runs out. It’s why the Koch bois are so hot to continue to Drill Baby Drill every square inch of the US land. They know the supply of oil isn’t limitless. So they are doing what all greedy loonies do…expending every last drop of this natural resource they have no respect for. So..why should we respect them?

    • CPAinNewYork

      They’re not a joke. They’re dangerous and they along with their rich friends are winning the class war.

      I predict that the rich will continue to press down upon the middle and lower classes until there’s an explosion, a violent revolution.

  • Germansmith

    Before we go on the familiar rant against the rich and wealthy and assume that all wealthy people are dicks like these two, let us also remember that OTHER wealthy people give the majority of the charity collected in this country. See link below
    http://www.nptrust.org/philanthropic-resources/charitable-giving-statistics
    But heck, I guess you do not get to write an article about the good qualities of wealthy hard working people in this web site and be publish.

    • Fern Woodfork

      I Do have To Agree With You There Are Some Wealthy People Out Here That Is No Way In Hell Are Selfish , Greedy And Are Haters Like The Koch Brothers!! :-)

      • Germansmith

        Fern
        Is a lovely day when you and me get to agree on something !!
        Have a Great Weekend!!

        • Fern Woodfork

          Yes!! You have A Great Weekend Yourself!!! :-)

    • clazman

      I thought the discussion was centered on the Koch brothers. Like always, some people get off track.

      • Germansmith

        Feel free to remain on the track
        I am a free spirit, not a trolley

    • Allan Richardson

      The Koch brothers are part of a subset I call the “evil rich” as opposed to the altruistic rich (e.g. Gates, Buffett, Rockefeller (in his old age), Carnegie (in his old age), the Kennedys). The evil rich are also the long-term CLUELESS rich; their fortunes are in no danger of being SPENT out (a billion dollars spent at a thousand a day would last 2000 years even without earning interest), possibly lost in a bad investment or by being caught like Madoff, but when the planet dies, they will die with it like the rest of us.

      And I am grateful for the charitable rich, but all their money (at least in the form of straight charity) cannot make up for what the evil rich have stolen (in a moral sense) from the rest of us, not only in money but in lives cut short, lives ruined, and the health of the planet ruined. Some of their money ought to, and does, go to counteract the political lies of the Koch brothers and the other evil rich.

      • Germansmith

        Well

        I think we can all share a little blame for the raping of the planet.

        The fact that we are 7 billion people and thru our ‘benign” well meaning policies of promoting economic progress in other nations, this is happening more quickly.

        If we removed the current rapacious rich people in charge and change them with people that are now poor…things may not get better, they will probably get worst.

        The rich create jobs and opportunities (while they are getting richer) and I do not think the majority of them are actually evil, but some are probably misguided in their beliefs. Unfortunately when you are powerful, your misguided ideas will affect lots of people. Ex. The Koch brothers
        I hate Fidel Castro and in my opinions his policies have caused the death of thousands of people, impoverish the country and destroy thousands of families….but I really do not believe he set out to destroy Cuba, he probably thought he knew best.
        but the Road to Hell is filled with great intentions.

        • morbius777

          Sir, I would suggest that you read: “American Nations; A History of The Eleven Rival Regional Cultures of North America” by Colin Woodard. I further suggest that reading it will change your perspective considerably. Cuba has long been a thorn in the side of the deep south, who feared it would threaten their slave centered economy. Even today, American business prompts government groups like the CIA to attempt a coup.

        • CPAinNewYork

          Wrong! The raping of the planet is entirely the work of the super-rich. It’s all their fault.

        • john ayres

          I don’t know how Fidel got in here, but there are some pluses with him
          He certainly did not enrich himself and lived in strict austerity.
          He helped those at the very bottom of the scale avoiding starvation and ensuring education, clothing and housing in an economic nightmare created by the USA.
          He held a state together and survived every effort of the USA to assassinate him and/or destroy the state completely.
          He helped Caribbean neighbors supplying skilled medical and other expertise
          I have him down as a hero along with Chez.

          • Germansmith

            John, God you are absolutely CORRECT !!!
            I bet anything there is a great space waiting for you in that Socialist Paradise.
            Please go, and migrate there like many other stupid gringos hijackers of planes, that end up returning to the US preferring a prison sentence that any additional day with our dear commandant.
            And by the way it is CHE, not Chez. The dude was a communist killer, not a chef.

    • morbius777

      Sure, and while we are at it, let’s write an article about the altruistic qualities of Wall Street CEO’s, with special emphasis on the banking community.

    • omgamike

      But I wonder how much of that philanthropy would sharply decrease if we took away their tax deductions? In the majority of those who give to charity, that is the only reason that they do it. They need the tax breaks. Otherwise, they wouldn’t give a darn about the plight of the poor and needy.

      • Germansmith

        Look at web site in my previous post and you will get the answer, but it really does not matter if you give money. If you are in the 35% tax bracket and you give a dollar you only get credited of 35 cents. What is the business sense of that?
        The rich have other deduction opportunities that are far more friendly to their bottom line (cost of doing business, losses, deferrals and so on)
        Hopefully, you realize that some wealthy people studied hard, work hard, make the right life decisions and earn their wealth by sweating. none of my client inherited anything, they all earned their money the old fashion way and most of them are GREAT to their employees paying then a fair wage and helping them when they get in a jam
        What I give does not have much effect in my taxes and I give to help certain causes I care about. Mostly medical research
        I always wonder why democrats always think all rich or well do to people are selfish assholes just looking after themselves….that is as bad as right winger believing all democrats are lazy, greedy leeches out to milk the country of everything they can.

        • 788eddie

          I’m a registered Republican, and I agree that many on both sides have become radicalized in their thinking. Since I count myself as a moderate Republican, as my party moves more to the right, that puts me more in the middle. I’m looking for a party that is more moderate in which to park my vote.

          • Germansmith

            I am as well….and they said we were extinct
            http://www.americanselect.org/
            Not a party, but try this

          • CPAinNewYork

            I too am a registered Republican, but unlike you I don’t anticipate any future moderation. On the contrary, radicalization appears to be the order of the day.

            The rich are hell bent to suppress the poor and the middle class. I believe that they have the clear advantage in their quest to do so and will press that advantage. That will generate violent opposition, which will in turn generate repression. The result will be continually escalating violent opposition and repression. The result will be a revolution.

      • CPAinNewYork

        Omgamike:

        One doesn’t give to charity to get the tax breaks. That is a ridiculous thing to say.

        If one is in the 35% tax bracket, and donates $100, the tax benefit is $35. The donor is still out by $65.

        However, the presence of the tax deduction is an incentive to contribute to charities. A charity’s loss of the deduction incentive might have a somewhat dampening effect on that charity’s contribution revenue.

    • CPAinNewYork

      The only wealthy people in America who don’t talk like elitist pricks are Buffet and the Gates.

      In the late nineteenth century, socialism was threatening the rich in several European countries. In Austria and France this was met with repression. Germany was fortunate enough to have Bismarck as it Chancellor. He initiated programs that mirrored the Socialists’ demands. The result: domestic political peace. Bismarck “killed Socialism with kindness.”

      • Germansmith

        Bismarck, a great example
        He was mirroring socialist demands and screw his cred by starting WW1
        I can see where you are outsourcing your violent revolutionary tendencies.
        Are you now prepare to vote for Weiner or ready to throw your CPA calculator and go into the streets to start the revolution?

        • CPAinNewYork

          Germansmith:

          Despite your handle, you know little about Bismarck. He did not start World War I.Bismarck was demoted from the chancellorship by the Kaiser before World War I. In fact, it’s reported that on his deathbed he made the remark that if there is a world war, it will be because of some silly thing in the Balkans.

          Bismarck was highly intelligent. For example, he knew enough not to get into wars where Germany incurred the burden of occupying the defeated opponent. In the 1866 war against Austria, he refused to agree to the army’s desire to occupy Vienna, going so far as to threaten suicide if the army went ahead and did so. It acceded to his demand.

          Our “leaders” should be so intelligent.

          As to your closing remark: You are a buffoon.

          • Germansmith

            It pains me to admit your are correct about Bismarck……
            and wrong about everything else.
            Now I’ll go and wash my hands

          • CPAinNewYork

            Why do you need to wash your hands? Are you afflicted with a guilt complex?

      • 788eddie

        Your predictions are scary, very scary, but I’m afraid, not outside the realm of possibility.

  • jnsgraphic

    Exploitation of the poor and middle to class benefit corporations, big business and right wing interests… next they’ll try to bring back slavery.

    • Germansmith

      Well
      If you are depending on your employer or your government for your income, your healthcare, they get to judge you for your health habits and weight and they get to check your pee at random testing for drug usage…maybe not slavery
      but you are definitely a SERF
      Long Live Self Employment and Freedom !!!!!

      • morbius777

        Ah…. more “rugged individualistic” bs. Most people DO work for someone else. There is no shame in that; there is honor. The shame is in trying to sell to people things that they don’t need.

        • Germansmith

          You are really a negative person…lose much?
          Fine, go honor your work and bitch about the guy who signs your paycheck behind his back…that is really honorable…..

          • morbius777

            I have a better solution. Let’s work to roll back the so called “right to work” laws, state by state, voter by voter. Let’s get a push back against all the employer “rights” by reviving union membership. Let us have a goal of nullifying Taft-Hartley. Let’s restore balance in the work place again. Let’s identify clearly for voters the aim of the 1%: to impose a feudal society on America.

          • Germansmith

            That would be a waste of time….very grandiose, but a waste of times….and serious unemployment
            In our current times almost all jobs can be send away from the US…even elective medical procedures are now done cheaper in India or Thailand in American Certified hospitals
            The only people then working in the US would be hospitality, retail, lawyers, politicians, self employed and actors

          • morbius777

            Than it’s time to bring back tariff laws. Are you aware that before the second world war, almost all operating expenses of the federal government were pa

            Economic plan[edit]

            Hamilton reasoned that to secure American independence, the United States needed to have a sound policy of encouraging the growth of manufacturing and secure its future as a permanent feature of the economic system of the nation. He argued these could be achieved through bounties or subsidies to industry, regulation of trade with moderate tariffs (not intended to discourage imports but to raise revenue to support American manufacturing through subsidy), and other government encouragement. These policies would not only promote the growth of manufacturing but provide diversified employment opportunities and promote immigration into the young United States. They would also expand the applications of technology and science for all quarters of the economy, including agriculture.

            The tariff[edit]

            Hamilton reasoned that tariffs issued in moderation would raise revenue to fund the nation. The tariff could also be used to encourage domestic (or national) manufacturing and growth of the economy by applying the funds raised in part towards subsidies (called bounties in his time) to manufacturers. Hamilton sought to use the tariff to:

            protect infant American industry for a short term until it could compete;

            raise revenue to pay the expenses of government;

            raise revenue to directly support manufacturing through bounties (subsidies)

            id for with tariffs? Follow Alexander Hamilton’s economic plan:

          • Germansmith

            An strategic economic policy, I am all for it as long as it is done with the input of the business class (otherwise it would be like the Soviet era 5 years plans and we all know where the Soviets end up)
            As much as I like Hamilton, You do realize that the economy has changed a great deal since the post revolutionary, country in debt, no personal income tax days of the era of the late eighteen century?
            The problems with ANY subsidy is that they NEVER go away because our politicians have no balls. You also realize we still have subsidies implemented in the 19th century to help develop the oil industry? Do you think they still need help?

          • morbius777

            First of all, the business class IS the current American aristocracy. I even heard on the radio last night that capitalism is the true agenda of America, not democracy. I think this is where you and I part company. As a matter of fact, I think the interests of the business class are antithetical to democracy. I’m just pointing out to you that the “founding fathers” were advocating what is best for America, not the business class. I realize that the New Netherland, Tidewater, and Deep South regions believed/still believe that Business/Capitalism should be the agenda of America, not democracy. But those of us from Yankeedom do not believe that. As a matter of fact, people from that region came to America to ESCAPE the Aristocracy.

          • Germansmith

            The Founding Fathers were the “Business Class”. There were all landowners or business people with a few lawyers sprinkle in.
            The main drive for independence were a deep dislike for the taxes that England collected to pay for her wars. The actual winning of the Revolution actually meant that the US underclass (Indians, blacks and poor whites) suffered more than under the English, because now taxes were collected to pay for the revolutionary war’s costs from people that had never paid taxes before and land stolen from the natives. There were many rebellions that were stump on by force.
            America is what it is because of their industrial might (business)and geographical luck and a fairly decent constitution that most Presidents try not to violate….too blatantly.

          • morbius777

            You are misinformed. Read: “American Nations; A History of The Eleven Rival Regional Cultures of North America” by Colin Woodard. Yankeedom were not business class. They were Puritans who wanted to build a better life for all. I’ll grant you that New Netherland (New York), Tidewater and the Deep South sympathized with the business class. But Yankeedom, the Midlands , Greater Appalachia, and New France regions were not particularly inclined to the business class, and Yankeedom and Tidewater/Deep South were diametrically opposed to each other in terms of the role of business.

          • Germansmith

            Morbius
            This book suggest that current elections results can be trace back to immigration patterns that happened 450 years ago. Of course since them we had multiples waves of immigration, constant relocation of people and their cultures among the 11 zones and very drastic changes in perceptions. Probably the puritan descendent is now a pole dancer and black slave descendent is now playing for the Miami Heat. The deep south agrarian is now in oil or banking.
            No disrespect, but I rather put more faith in Harry Potter

          • morbius777

            You obviously have your mind made up, regardless of the facts. To quote from Mr. Woodard’s book: “Did not the arrival of millions of Irish, Germans, Italians, Slaves, Jews, Greeks, and Chinese in the course of a single lifetime herald the birth of a genuinely “American” (for that matter, Canadian) identity that cemented the country together to fight two world wars? The short answer is no. The great immigration waves enriched and empowered these two North American federations, but they did not displace their preexisting regional nations.
            You are a typical republican, probably a tea partyer, and no amount of evidence is going to change your mind. Which is why I advocate for Southern Secession. We were never a “united” states in the first place.

          • Germansmith

            You realize that an opinion of a journalist (not even an anthropologist or a social scientist) that claim to be an expert in dozens of subjects do not make his book a FACT. It is just an hypothesis that I disagree with.
            We are so different from the Yankees you claim to descend from that just claiming that the massive waves of immigration from the many different cultures, that the US has experienced have changed nothing of the basic character of the zones that existed over 200 years ago….that is not only absurd, but borderline idiotic.
            Ask Mr. Woodward to spend less time overseas and travel thru America and stop assuming that the little changes experienced in Maine (where there have been little immigration) reflect the vibrant changes we experienced as cultures mesh together in our great nation.
            Opinions are NOT evidences and I doubt much he can pull numbers to prove his point, and you also know nothing about me.
            Von Daniken has more solid evidences that Colin Woodward, but I guess his opinions fit in your vision of how things are, so you are a true believer.

          • morbius777

            Well, I’m certainly not a believer in the magnanimous of American business. And if you do, your a fool or a member of the 1%. He has a compelling historical context, which is more then I can say for you. I think your theory is BS…. period.

          • Germansmith

            Bats do not give you guano because they are magnanimous, they do because they have to go the bathroom.
            If you are still a believer that great countries are created by the communal sweat of workers and poor people, you are definitely a romantic leftist fool.
            No matter where you go, great things are created when forceful men (and now women) put their will and power in controlling and focus large group of people toward a goal.
            The key to a happy society is to make sure we have enough laws to avoid those powerful and greedy people to take over, but at the same time harness their creativity and power for the good of the nation (and their own pockets).
            All of our great Presidents had ran businesses successfully before they gained office, Obama did not
            America’s business was business. We controlled the world with our economy and culture…sadly we are making sure this is going away.
            Instead of reading Colin Woodward, I suggest you read James G Rickards

          • morbius777

            Well, now we know who you really are: a feudalistic fascist. A bigger load of horse hoccy I’ve never heard. It could have come out of the mouth of some 12 century lord. Serfs: you are unimportant… it is I your lord that matters. Without me, you all are nothing. More to the point, it could have come out of the mouths of some railroad baron from our own gilded age. Sir, YOU ARE EXACTLY WHY I WANT TO SPLIT THIS COUNTRY. AND THERE ARE MANY, MANY MORE LIKE ME. One more analogy comes to mind. Remember the French revolution; it wasn’t poor people who were losing their head left and right as you seem to have lost yours.

          • Germansmith

            Do you read history thru a hollow tube, or just the words you understand?
            Far more poor and innocent people died during the French Revolution than the “evil aristocrats” , who had money and the smart ones split as soon as the mob turn ugly (not counting all the grief and suffering brought by the Napoleonic Wars).
            I can guarantee you that a bunch of people sitting around in the ghetto did not suddenly got up and decided to build the Golden Gate Bridge OR were sitting around and said “it would be a good idea to have less expensive steel and cheaper gasoline”. It took men like Carnegie and Rockefeller to get that rolling…YEAH, nasty greedy ambitious bastards make the world go around, the key is to keep them in check and a source of tax income, not to stifle them.
            If believing that intelligent, greedy, ambitious people (sometimes assholes) are a great source of progress makes me a feudalistic fascist (which is kind of dilemma, because fascism was a populist movement)…them be it

            If you want to split the country, go ahead, split…nobody is holding you back. The US is a free country, not a Socialistic Paradise like Cuba and N Korea that are like the Hotel California.
            ….and take your friends too.

          • morbius777

            You mean free for the top 1%. Come on Mr. fascist.
            Work for secession. I’m betting you live in a Red state WHO TAKE MORE FROM THE FEDS THEN THEY CONTRIBUTE. PLEASE, BY ALL MEANS, RETURN TO THE NAZI GERMANY OF YESTERYEAR. AMERICANS DON’T WANT YOU.

          • john ayres

            Sounds like you think signing a paycheck is an act of charity worthy of gratitude, rather than a transaction between equals.

          • Germansmith

            Same as I would not respect an employer that talks about his employees as “little people” I do not respect employees that bad mouth their bosses , specially in our current times when there are more people looking for job that employer needing employees.
            BUT , this remark was directed to a person in particular that that person is NOT you

          • morbius777

            I’m well aware that your talking to me. I just happen to think that an American aristocracy is not appropriate in a democracy.

          • Germansmith

            Well
            In that case let us get rid of our own “princelings” like the Kennedys, Coumos, Daleys, Bushes and Clintons
            Those are the American Aristocracy….

          • morbius777

            Not at all: the new American aristocracy are the 1%’ers: Koch Brothers, Adelison, wall street bankers, probably the half of congress that are millionares, hedge fund managers.

          • Mark Forsyth

            Hypothetical scenario: A man goes up to the North Country to trade for furs.He finds a prime bundle of pelts that a trapper wants to sell.He insists that the trapper accept a Picasso painting as payment for the pelts.The painting is worth several thousand dollars in our culture but is next to worthless in the trappers world.The buyer has done the trapper a disservice if indeed he has not committed a crime and swindled the trapper.A new $400 rifle and a box of shells[something the trapper could actually use] would be fair payment.You must exchange value for value.
            Back in the nineties I had stopped driving tractor trailer OTR after 30+ years but I still was interested in driving employment.I was in the Syracuse,N.Y. area and applied for a driving position with a small pharmaceutical company delivering nuclear medicine around the state,five days a week.The employer complained of high employee turn-over with mostly young ,inexperienced people with poor work habits,but he would not move off his starting wage of $8.00 per hour,insisting that the once monthly free lunch he provided was just compensation. This is one professional driver who did not get bought off with free lunch and went on to another profitable driving position.I always drove for a working wage,not a slimy handed free lunch.

          • Germansmith

            Bad example Mark
            That is the difference between an employee and an entrepreneur
            If I was the trapper and was sure that was a Picasso, I would have taken the Picasso for the pelts, travel to the nearest town, sell the Picasso in e-bay or nearest art house or make a deal doing limited lithographs.
            With the money I earn I could have bought quite a few rifles, a better cabin…and maybe even hire you at the going rate to drive my pelts to town for better pricing.
            In life you do not get what you deserve, you get what you negotiate.
            I am glad you were able to land a job you feel well rewarded

          • Mark Forsyth

            Actually I had no doubt that my example would fail to garner your approval.I have worked both as a trapper and a trucker and I can assure you that in each profession there are times when one may be either an entrepreneur and/or an employee.

            I think that you assume too much but no doubt have little knowledge of a trappers life or their ability,much less their interest,in verifying the authenticity of an art object.So let me try this: One does not do good business with an Arctic resident by offering him payment for his furs with an air conditioner.

          • Germansmith

            No, Never a trapper (I kind of approve animals keeping their own pelts) but among my many odd jobs I have been a commercial fisherman. I’ll take the Picasso, you can have the air conditioner.
            Good Luck…

          • Mark Forsyth

            Quite curious to learn of your commercial fishing experience.I am a retired self employed oysterman/crabber/fisherman from lower Chesapeake Bay[Hampton Roads] in addition to my trapping and trucking career.What’s even more curious to me is that your perspective is so different than my own. I can say that not once in my life did I ever find the need to cheat anyone in order to be successful.Obviously you do not care to address the matter.

          • Germansmith

            Shrimping, but not for human consumption, but to use as live bait for fishermen in South Florida.

            During the day, I was a Field Engineer for COM equipment

            At night we went out and catch live shrimps with nets for additional income. No salary , just we get paid on what we sold to bait/tackle shops.

            I never cheated anybody either. My perspective may be different than yours because as a financial planner that work with both poor, middle class and wealthy people I see plenty of fraud. Since I have a fiduciary responsibility to my clients (similar guidelines as lawyers) I can not divulge anything about individual clients, but it sickens me sometimes to what extreme people go to get government benefits and how sometimes those government benefits bring different outcome that was probably originally intended

    • morbius777

      Exactly… that is their intent.

    • Vazir Mukhtar

      Evidence, please.

      But thanks for mentioning the “poor.” In his speeches President Obama speaks more about the middle class than any other income group. Occasionally he excoriates the rich and the super rich. But if you listen carefully to him, we have few poor in the US.

      • Germansmith

        Vazir, the problem seems to be that most people in the US does not really know what abject poverty really is.
        A person may be in the “official poverty level”, but if you own a 55″ TV set. have a refrigerator. electricity, food and drive a 2 year old car….I would not consider you poor (maybe a poor manager of money, yes)
        There are really some poor people in the US, but mostly in rural areas of the country

        • bfg

          Really? Spend some time going to the SROs and tenement apartments in our inner cities and let me know how many 55 inch TVs you see? Most of those place couldn’t hold a 55 inch TV. You think poor people shouldn’t have refrigerators, food and electricity? Why don’t we just line up every body below the poverty level and shoot them? Oh right, who would be left to work at McDonald’s and Walmart?

          • Germansmith

            What a great idea !!! Who needs Mc Donalds and Walmart anyway.

            I have been to some of those apartments. I am not speaking theoretically, I have been there many times and I spent my first few years in this country there as well. I am an immigrant that went to school and worked at night as a dishwasher while my mother, a pharmacist in Cuba held 2 jobs as waitress…I know what it means to be POOOOR…I also know what opportunities are available to ALL.
            If you think that is poverty, take a trip to India or Mexico, or Guatemala (or the hills of West Virginia or Kentucky) and see what really mean to have no access to food, clean water, education or opportunities and forget about food stamps, Medicaid and all that.
            Having access to free education no matter what project you live in, if you take advantage of it, keep your nose clean, do not have any children until you are economically stable, get a job or join our armed forces…the path to abject poverty in this country is a CHOICE (unless you get hit by a drastic mishap not of your making like a accident or a sickness)

          • bfg

            So you think poverty in America should be more like it is in India? Your caveat about illness is not just a throw-away. The poor have high rates of physical and mental illness and disability. If the path to poverty is a choice why does poverty increase in a recession?

          • Germansmith

            Because in school they teach Algebra, Biology and Music
            but not Financial Planning or common sense.
            The economy has forced me to change careers 4 times in my life (my last one at age 50) and became unemployed, but not poor
            If you live paycheck to paycheck spending all the money you earn (which is what Madison Ave has brainwashed us to do promoting all the goodies we do not need) a person is a financial crisis away from poverty.
            There are 2 types of people in America. Those who work for the money and those who makes their money work them. Since the days I was making $1.60 an hour, I learn to save and years later how to invest.
            Of course stress causes physical and mental illness and of course disability (how else to get disability payments when you are unemployed?)

          • BillP

            bfg that’s the right’s typical response to any conversation on poverty. There is always some person that is buying steaks and champagne with food stamps then wheeling their food out to their Merceds (used to be Cadillacs but the poor’s test has changed). Then they go home to their luxurious homes and watch tv on their 55″ screens. They never seem to mention people in red states especially in th rural areas who are gaming the system. It always seems to be the “inner” city folks.

          • Germansmith

            In none of my post I mentioned “inner city folks”, and it was BFG who talk about tenements? Or Cadillacs or Mercedes?
            Dishonesty and poverty is colorblind and live in the city, suburbs or rural communities.
            My comments about rural poverty is because, when you live in the middle of nowhere and you are poor, you suffer worst that city folks that have access to services. Just because they live in red states it does not make them any less important to us.

          • BillP

            Dishonesty and poverty is colorblind are colorblind not is. Your comment about rural poor people being worst off than urban poor people just isn’t true. Just walk through any urban poor area where people live in tenements, not a great place to have to live in. Your comment that a person may be in the “official poverty level”, but if you own a 55″ TV set. have a refrigerator. electricity, food and drive a 2 year old car….The official poverty line in the US for 2012 for a family of 4 is $23,050, for – $19,090 and 2 is $15,130. They must be very good money managers if they can afford a 55″ inch tv, 2 year old car, food, electricity and a refrigerator.

          • Germansmith

            BillP, You are naive
            I came from that environment , lived there for 4 years, I did not “walked through it”.
            Do you really think all the declared income is their income?
            Do you think they went to Sears to buy the 55″? and I always wonder how they get all that gold in their teeth…
            What is called poverty in the US would be considered middle class in Mexico.
            You want to see real poverty, people that live hundreds of miles away from the nearest hospital, no phone connection, no SS office nearby or food bank…need to go rural

          • BillP

            Do you really think all the declared income is their income?Maybe I am naive but you seem to have view that “they” all have gold teeth. That view seems to be a very biased view, who are the “they” that have all these gold teeth? You made the statement that people at the poverty level can afford all the luxuries of lif – electricity, food, a roof over their heads plus a 55″ tv and a 2 yer old car (you do mean a real car and not a Tonka toy.

            Why comapre poverty levels in other countries, you were talking about poverty level in this country not Mexico. Why not compare it to Sweden or some other contry.

            I have seen poverty in rural area I have lived in rural areas in Vermont and Maine.

            You made broad general statement “Do you really think all the declared income is their income?” Who are these “they poeple” you keep referring to? I know people who work 40 hours or more and barely make the poverty level income. I know there are people who game the system but it’s not a majority of people.

          • Germansmith

            Bill, it is easy to be a “progressive” when you live in Vermont or Maine.
            Try living instead in an area that you have a permanent underclass of people that mostly stop trying and found out is easier to live from the government and on the “down low”.
            Tried living in an area of the US where are thousand of immigrants (both legal and illegals) that speak dozens of different languages and schools and courts have to accommodate their needs. (I am a multilingual immigrant, so I am not against immigration as long as they are willing to work like the previous generations)
            I also want people working and earning a decent living wage, but we can not put all the blame on employers
            If you are a manufacturer, try selling product made in the US paying a decent wage and absorbing the costs of the employee benefits while you competitors sell the same product made in China or India at a MUCH lesser employee cost/regulations.
            How about our current ruling government reviewing the FTA and see what has been beneficial and what has prompted employers to send the jobs away to other countries and doing some about fixing it…instead of giving expensive healthcare to all.
            The root of the problem is that we have unemployment or underemployment. Increasing Medicaid, unemployment payments, disability income or healthcare subsidies are NOT going to solve that problem, these give away are going to increase the deficit and when you combine that with QE1 and QE2 dump the value of the dollar…….
            but them, we will ALL be poor
            Have you been to Sweden lately? Do you also realize that immigration is also causing problems there as well and that there also now a permanent underclass of immigrants changing the political environment in Sweden?

        • Vazir Mukhtar

          Rural areas I know about; for my grandparents and their ancestors came from rural west Tennessee and north Mississippi. Especially in Mississippi to this day you can find shotgun houses with a refrigerator and washing machine on the front porch, a TV antenna on the roof, and a 10- to 15-year-old pickup or car in the gravel or dirt driveway.

          Some will argue that being poor in the rural South is better than being poor in a large northern metropolitan area. Health care is of course worse in the rural South, as are schools. Food is cheaper in the South, and not everything is deep fried.

          Only a very few look like the photos accompanying Agee’s “Let Us Now Praise Famous Men.”

          • Germansmith

            I just love it when people that just think they know poverty , from what they see on TV argue with those that knows what eating beans as the only meal of the day is all about
            I think if we want to save this country, I would want ALL young people to serve a minimum of 1 year in the community working with the disadvantaged of society.
            This will teach the right wingers those people are humans and have the same wishes and desires as the rest of us.
            it would also teach the bleeding heart liberals that a lot of the problems they go thru is of their own making and due to poor decisions and lack of education.

      • jnsgraphic

        The GOP claims to be Christian, yet if Christ came to their door seeking shelter, they would look at him as another ‘poor’ homeless person and turn him away! These are the same people that turn there backs on middle class America, demand cuts to the programs that help them and then turn around and give more power to the wealthy and corporate America, while they take advantage of corporate welfare and tax loop holes when they’re profitable. The GOP has nothing to offer to help move our economy or this country forward because in the end they will make the Presidents 2nd term a success; they would rather see the President and our country fail, than do their part to get involved in democracy. Congress continues to drag their knuckles and get paid to do nothing… in 2014 the GOP house has got to go!

        • Vazir Mukhtar

          I prefer to leave religion out of political discussions for reasons I need not go into here.

          We agree that the Republicans would prefer the President and his programs fail than to compromise and thereby produce legislation that could (would, I’m not sure about) help the country.

          From my perspective, it seems that the Republicans regard Mr Obama as a reincarnation of FDR, only worse. Are the Republicans truly interested only in the rich; have they no concern for the middle class (we seem to have no lower class in the US)? I tend to believe that they are interested in the middle class and not as proles. I wonder if the Democrats’ constant branding the Republicans as only the henchmen of the rich is just a canard. But that’s a topic for another post.

          • jnsgraphic

            It’s just that they are hypocrites hiding behind their religion, light the right wing gun nuts hide behind the 2nd amendment… they hold a cross in one hand and try to burn it with the other, blame the Democrats on the economy while they are bankrupting the country.

          • Vazir Mukhtar

            Your cross image is excellent. As a transplanted Southerner, I am reminded of things I only vaguely remember from childhood.

            Not to start a string of replies, but I do wonder how many of the shenanigans the rich use to their exclusive advantage are permitted by law. A tax attorney friend argues that is precisely what they do: find and exploit loopholes. Hence the number and wealth of such lawyers in New York City. He suggests that the number of truly criminal businessmen, bankers, brokers, et al. is quite small.

        • CPAinNewYork

          jnsgraphic:

          Enlighten me on something. We the middle class and the poor have a huge numerical advantage. Why don’t we just vote the Republicans out of office and get on with destroying the cliques that are turning this country into a dictatorship of the rich?

          Are the middle class and the rich really so stupid that we vote against our obvious self interest?

          • jnsgraphic

            Stupid? Yes! 90% of Republican’s also fall in the range of ‘middle-class’ America, and are too ignorant to see the big picture… they don’t realize they are just as much of a burden to their party and are too stupid to realize that ‘ALL THEY WANT IS THIER VOTE!’

          • disqus_LcxpBv2uzz

            Read Joe Bageant’s book “Deer Hunting With Jesus”. It clearly explains why poor southern whites have voted against their own self interest for years, and sadly, continue to do so while failing to understand the consequences.

      • john ayres

        Observing the USA from afar, one would assume there is only the middle class and the rich. In many countries it is quite OK to be a member of the working class. I think we are talking typical American euphemism. Work there be, but none who do it.

        • Vazir Mukhtar

          At least some of foreigners’ ideas of America come from our broadcast media. Few who visit us ever get to West Virginia or Mississippi. There is more non-farm work in Mississippi than there was when I was a child, and some in the Delta are doing better than they did 15 years ago, though obviously hurt by the recession.

          I’ve been only a tourist in WVa, but what the strip mines have left behind is a tragedy. Not that it improves the living standard, but WVa has one of the best public radio networks in the country — a sensible mix of talk programs and music of just about any non-rock type a person could care to hear — and stations almost everywhere that provide state-wide coverage.

      • charleo1

        A quick example of corporate advantage taking. With the outsourcing
        of the better paying jobs to third world Countries. Of which Walmart
        was a pioneer. What began in the 90′s became a flood in the 2000s.
        With the loss of over 10 million jobs from the manufacturing sector,
        2000-2010. This created a glut of low skilled, and semi-skilled workers, in an economy ever more service oriented in nature. This also added to the uninsured rolls. Creating more pressure on the already imploding for profit, insurance funded system, to rely even more on government, for reimbursement of indigent care. The Gov’t’s share of individuals covered by some form or benefit, be it Veterans, Medicare, Medicaid, Military, Local, State, and Federal public sector, and Government employees, steadily growing for years, to about 40%, even before the recession, Exploded with the loss of an additional, 17 to 20 million jobs, in 2009/2010.
        Okay, these are market conditions. Created not by laziness, nor, Leftist plot. Walmart, the Nation’s largest employer’s reaction to the crisis, has been to satisfy it’s labor requirements, by hiring part time, and instructing the new hires how to apply, and obtain government benefits their low salaries qualify them to be eligible. The reason President Obama speaks so often of the Middle Class, is millions
        of those now applying to Walmart are former members of that class, who’s drastically falling numbers are contributing to so many of the ills of the Country. The public debt that continues to grow. The lack
        of opportunities for upward mobility. The rising cost of education.
        And the more troubling correlation we see between the growing
        inequities of wealth, and the ballooning incarceration rates, indicative
        of societies in decline. This can be clearly seen in large part due to the inability of a growing number of Americans to afford to pay for the minimal basic costs produced by simply existing, on the prevailing wages being paid.

      • CPAinNewYork

        If you listen carefully to Obama and compare his words with his actions, you’ll see that he’s a windbag. He talks a good game, but doesn’t do much. I’m waiting for him to indict the Wall Street crowd.

    • CPAinNewYork

      They’re well along on the path to doing that.

  • JDavidS

    What an offensive piece of shit…This from an asshole who inherited his money. Yes sir…he started at the top and worked his way up….Hypocritical son-of-a-bitch.

    • Allan Richardson

      What they would really like is to amend the Constitution to allow titles of nobility and designate themselves and their families “Lords.”

      Feudalism: a system in which all the land is owned by the King, most of it is “rented” by nobles to build their castles in exchange for supporting the King, some of THEIR land is “rented” by lesser nobles, all the way down to serfs, who “come with the land” and must “rent” the right to live on it by servitude to their noble. Feudalism disappeared with the Industrial Revolution, but it COULD possibly work with advanced industry, and that is what the American plutocrats are trying to do.

      And remember: under democracy, your vote counts; under feudalism, your Count votes.

      • morbius777

        Well said.

      • Jim Myers

        Unfortunately your vote only counts IF you can actually cast a ballot in a meaningful way.

        With gerrymandering in the extreme, voter suppression, shorter voting periods, and MONEY being counted as people, voting has become a sham in most local elections.

        It also dilutes and distorts the vote for higher offices.

        It is no longer a choice between the candidates and their positions. It is now more about distorting facts, and convincing the voters that they should vote against their own best interests.

    • Fern Woodfork

      Just Like Romney And Most Of These Rich Thugs!! :-(

  • sleeprn01

    I am a humanist. Humanism is a rational philosophy based on science, inspired by art and nature, and motivated by compassion and kindness toward all of the creatures of the earth. Humanism derives its goals of life from human need and interest. I would suspect that each of the “gentlemen” above would consider themselves to be good Christians. And this is a problem I have encountered with many of the Christians that I see and hear in the media today; trying to deny certain groups of people of their natural rights. The great Catholic theologian Saint Thomas Aquinas said “whatever a man has in superabundance is owed, of natural right, to the poor for their sustenance.” Perhaps Mr. Koch and Mr. Kessler need to find another philosophy of life other than that of Ayn Rand; which is bases on selfishness and greed. Maybe philosophers Aristotle, Descartes, Kant, and Rousseau to name but a few may help them to understand their place in society. I do not deny them their wealth for they have worked hard for it, however it should not be at the expense of those who are less well off. It would also be good if they remembered they were lucky enough to be starting their life from 3rd base and not in the batters box (Kant’s moral imperative). They should also read Karl Marx as a cautionary tale of what happens when conflict arises between the “haves and the have nots”; they will rise up and over throw the system.

    • disqus_LcxpBv2uzz

      Very well put!

  • sleeprn01

    Mr. Germansmith, The Koch brothers own Koch Industries an energy and mfg conglomerate. They now have interest in ranching, fertilizer, finance, asphalt, pipelines, refining of oil and natural gas. In 2004 they bought Invista which owns brand names such as: Lycra, Stainmaster, Anton, and other polymer brands. They also own Georgia-Pacific which owns Dixie cup, Brawny paper towels, Angel Soft and Soft’n Gentle toilet paper. I personally have boycotted the latter items. This information was obtained from the book “The Obama Hate Machine” by Bill Press. This is an extremely interesting book that looks at the far right agenda, it is well researched with dates, times, and citations. I can’t recommend this book enough, it is not a conspiracy book.

    • Germansmith

      Thanks for the info. I’ll keep it in mind next time I go to the store

  • dpaano

    How does Mr. Koch figure that a homeless person, or someone with no job, etc., will find the money to go to school to become a hairdresser? Seriously, it takes money to make something of yourself….people can’t get jobs if they haven’t got the clothes to wear to interviews, the education to get the job in the first place, or the money to find themselves a decent place to live once they DO start working those low-paid jobs. These rich people live in their own little fantasy world…..I’d like to see them stripped of their money, credit cards, etc., and made to live in the streets for a month. I bet that would certainly change their tune! I’d LOVE to be a fly on the wall for that one….anyone want to join me?

  • Mike Maricle

    Koch-suckers

    • 788eddie

      That would be the conservatives.

  • elw

    The human mind has great capacity to twist and turn facts to fit what they want to believe is true and right. That is the basis of racism, taking things from others because you want them, human trafficking, slavery, and murdering and/or suppressing mass numbers of people. It is also the mind set of the Koch brothers multi-billionaires to whom every penny counts even when it belongs to a child, the sick or needy. it is the mind set of the insane and criminals, all of whom should be locked-up away from society where they can do no harm.

  • OKsettledown

    While I agree with the message, the National Memo is becoming the Fox News of the liberals, using sarcasm and hate speak to make their point. I am so tired of hate speak and it sickens me that the left’s message is being spoiled by it.

    • 788eddie

      And what are your feelings regarding Fox News?

    • Germansmith

      Ditto
      For a while there I thought I can point all the blame for the problems of our country to right wing conservatives….well, I was wrong, the left is equal in the blame
      Probably 60% of the people of this country are reasonable centrists, but the vociferous 40% of each extreme, entrenched in their positions (which are constantly feeding each other) are keeping the rest of us from having a constructive dialogue.

  • Pamby50

    The Koch brothers remind me of the Tennessee Ernie Ford song, 16 tons. Especially the refrain. 16 tons what do you get? Another day older and deeper in debt. I owe my soul to the company store.

  • holyreality

    A conservative is someone who thinks that the greatest sign of intelligence is being born rich.

    LOLGOP

    • Germansmith

      that sounds as intelligent and shortsighted as a conservative saying that a liberal “is a bum trying to get the money from working people’s pockets to keep the lazy people happy in milk and honey”
      Nothing wrong with being born rich as long you are not an asshole about it. Nothing wrong about being born poor as long as you do not use an excuse to be a criminal
      Most of the rich people I know are very proud they earned their status and money themselves and 95% of them are not dicks and remember and honor where they came from.

      • holyreality

        “Nothing wrong with being born rich as long you are not an asshole about it.”

        ALA Donald Trump?

        I’m talking about how the GOP and TP worship the rich to the point of seeing them as entitled to a freeride regarding their tax rates.

        Rich people do not EARN their money. Mitt Romney likely never saw a paycheck in his life.

        Why the Walton family “must” have their $31 Billion income(each) subsidized by their employee’s Medicaid and foodstamps so they can survive off the streets is beyond logic.

        • Germansmith

          You really see nothing wrong with your statements???
          Just because we have a number of greedy rich people , You are making the statement that ALL rich people are greedy bastards.
          If you were doing a similar generalization about Chinese can not drive, or all blacks are criminals or all Germans are Nazis or all Jews are bloodsuckers, you would be consider a racist.
          In fact if all people would learn to have their money work for them instead of always working for their money, there would probably be less filthy rich people (like Koch, Trump and the Waltons ) and more people that would not need Medicaid and food stamps.
          By the way, I do not buy anything at Walmart…who do you think sponsor Walmart by buying there and therefore making the Walton even richer?

          • holyreality

            I never said such a thing, “ALL rich people are greedy bastards.”
            I pointed out how good people are struggling and who buy the TP line of scat WORSHIP the rich as if tinkle upon is trickle down.

            The REAL job creators are those of us who spend the majority of their paycheck. This spending drives the economy, the more disposable income that circulates in the economy, the more businesses hire extra help.

            Rich people are not the problem, rich people amassing more wealth than whole nations can piss away while the majority face starvation is the problem.

            PS thanks for not patronizing the Walton empire.

  • Lovefacts

    People like this make my skin crawl. The wrap themselves in the flag and religion, yet have no idea what either stands for. Whatever your religion, they all believe in helping the poor, widows, and orphans. Being an American means more than just making money. It also includes supporting our civil liberties and helping those in need–be it the poor or those who have survived a natural disaster. Oh, and the US government has been assisting with troops and funding for natural disasters since 1806. IMO,people like these are a disgrace to civilized society.

  • 4sanity4all

    The Koch brothers make a statement that sounds reasonable, but then they follow it up with a conclusion that is wildly unreasonable and untrue. I cannot see how anyone with a brain would believe what they say, or vote the way they tell people to vote. They act normal, but then they say something that reminds you of the crazy uncle that nobody wanted to see at family celebrations, because he is so bigoted and ignorant that it is embarrassing.

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