By Joe Conason

Before Default, Let Republicans Bump Up Hard Against The Debt Ceiling

January 16, 2013 12:47 am Category: Memo Pad, Politics 170 Comments A+ / A-
Before Default, Let Republicans Bump Up Hard Against The Debt Ceiling

A prolonged confrontation over the nation’s debt ceiling — unlike the “fiscal cliff,” which provoked many scary headlines – could truly be grave for both America and the world. While press coverage often mentions the possibility of lowered credit ratings for the US Treasury (again), that might only be the mildest consequence if Republicans in Congress actually refuse to authorize borrowing and avoid default.

Last time the nation prepared to face such an impasse, during the spring and summer of 2011, the chairman of the Treasury Borrowing Advisory Committee – a JPMorgan Chase official named Matthew Zames – laid out a disturbing scenario in a letter to Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner, in which he foresaw a rolling catastrophe that could inflict hundreds of billions in additional borrowing costs; spark a run on money funds, leading to a renewed financial crisis; severely disrupt financial markets and borrowing, killing fragile economic growth; and push the economy back into recession due to higher interest rates and tightened credit.

In short, the economy would contract sharply and the U.S. – along with the rest of the world – might well be plunged back into negative growth. If that was true in July 2011, it is equally true today, and there is no reason to dismiss that warning.

But the Republican leadership on Capitol Hill insists that they are willing to take these mind-boggling risks, solely for the purpose of enforcing an extreme austerity regime that has already done permanent damage in much of Europe. Between the “Boehner rule” demanded by House Speaker John Boehner, which requires a dollar in new spending cuts for every dollar increase in the debt ceiling, and the House Republican budget authored by Rep. Paul Ryan, congressional Republicans evidently want not only to gut Medicare, Social Security, and Medicaid, but to “eliminate more and more of the basic functions of government over time,” according to the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. No education aid, no food safety inspections, no environmental protection, no infrastructure repairs, no cancer research…

From immediate economic jeopardy to long-term national decline, these prospects are obviously appalling – yet many Republican elected officials sound positively pleased about the debt ceiling crisis they have created. Senator Tom Coburn, Republican of Oklahoma, told a right-wing radio host recently that a government default would actually be a “wonderful experiment.” He assured listeners, quite falsely, that their Medicare and Social Security checks would continue to arrive every month, no matter what, and that only “stupid” spending would be cut.

If Coburn – or any Republican senator – is so eager to test the debt ceiling, perhaps he should volunteer to bump up against it first. As the Tulsa World  reported in 2011, federal spending in Oklahoma amounts to three times as much as the entire state budget, with Social Security alone accounting for almost a billion dollars a month there, and Medicaid and other medical assistance amounting to another $500 million-plus. Coburn’s ultra-conservative, deep-red home state is highly dependent on federal employment and assistance, ranking 12th in retirement and disability payments and 11th in per capita federal payroll, despite its small size.

So by all means, let’s find out, as Coburn suggested, whether we can live “on the money that’s coming into the Treasury” without borrowing to finance those monthly pension checks and all those stupid federal jobs — and let’s start in Oklahoma, tomorrow.  Then let’s roll out the same experiment in every state whose senators and representatives are refusing to pay the bills they have already racked up over the years – especially states, like most of those below the Mason-Dixon line, where federal spending is far higher than the tax revenues remitted to Washington.

Surely that would silence all the loud talk about this “wonderful” experiment in fiscal brinksmanship.

Photo by Talk Radio News Service via Flickr.com

Before Default, Let Republicans Bump Up Hard Against The Debt Ceiling Reviewed by on . A prolonged confrontation over the nation’s debt ceiling -- unlike the “fiscal cliff,” which provoked many scary headlines – could truly be grave for both Ameri A prolonged confrontation over the nation’s debt ceiling -- unlike the “fiscal cliff,” which provoked many scary headlines – could truly be grave for both Ameri Rating:

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Comments

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_B6RROC4IUESHT322QS5VJVPYRM Lynda

    I agree that is would be grand to see them self-destruct, but the reputation of the country is own trial here for all the world to see. This nonsense has to end today. If the Speaker can gin up the guts to allow a vote tommorrow this would be behind us and we could move on to the next imaginary monster.

    • neeceoooo

      You are right Lynda, we already look like morons on the world stage because of the mindset of the GOP. Barack has done wonders to improve that appearance since Bush but a few things still stand out in the world eyes.

  • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

    This article is spot on. The least of our problems, if the debt ceiling is not raised and the USA defaults on its debt, will be our credit rating. The U.S. economy will go back into a deep recession immediately due to lack of credit and the distinct possibility of a run on the banks, the global economy would collapse, and unemployment is likely to surpass the levels reached during the 2007-2010 Great Recession.

    Why is this about to happen? Because the GOP, under pressure by Tea Party members, insist on an Angela Merkel style austerity program that would have the same effects her’s had in Europe. Political ideology, and a desire to discredit President Obama, is causing more damage to our credibility and our economy than anything Al Qaeda could have done. Our worst enemy is not Islam, communisn, socialism or a foreign boogeyman, our worse enemy is us.

    There is no question that continuous deficit spending, borrowing, and accumulation of debt is unsustainable and must be brought under control. The problem is the approach being proposed by the GOP to achieve that goal. The modest revenue increases realized during the recent “fiscal cliff” exercise were a step in that right direction, but not enough to make a significant impact on our deficits. Since we re unwilling to pay for what we expect and benefit from the only option left is to eliminate some of the programs we currently have.

    Republicans claim they want to reduce spending, but not only do they refuse to say what should be cut, they refuse to consider further DoD cuts. With that in mind, what is left is:
    Social Security, MEDICARE, MEDICAID, interest on the debt, unemployment benefits, NASA/NOAA, intelligence agencies, border patrol, customs officers, food and drug inspectors, air traffic controllers, medical researchers at the Center for Disease Control, diplomats, immigration officers, the Treasury and a few other departments that even if they were shut down completely would not make a dent on the deficit.

    We have a problem, and the problem is us.

    • old_blu

      Just going by the title of this story. I think they all need a bump up hard side the head. : ))

      • http://www.facebook.com/fern.woodfork Fern Woodfork

        LOL I Agree My Friend!! And Plus The Fact When Your Own Party Big Wigs Start Ripping Their Own Party Members A New Asshole On The Low Down Way They Treat Each Other Within Their Own Ranks, All I Can See Is Big Problems Ahead For These Party Of Thugs!!!! GREAT!!

        • jvaljon1

          Missed ya, girl! Where you been??? Celebrating I hope, as our President gets his SECOND TERM! How ABOUT that??? With ALL THE MONEY, (seemingly) ALL THE POWER, all the EVERYTHING ELSE that Republicans have stolen from this country ever since the first Bush Tax Cuts were enacted (under cover of 9/11!) ….We The People just have OURSELVES, and WE THE PEOPLE, just sent Mitt Romney, chief of the Vulture Company known as Bain Capital—we, just sent him packing!

          Now, we have to get our money back. We have to Repatriate our monies. If it’s US cash or credit, and one person claims it for themselves, these other lands must realize that they’re dealing in STOLEN MONEY, and RETURN IT TO THE US TREASURY. We will give it right back to them to use—but under OUR, AMERICA’S NAME—NOT the name of the crook who stole it from his own fellow citizens! This is not impossible to do, all it takes is THE WILL TO DO IT! To take back what’s ours; the money, the jobs, ALL OF IT! Pour money into UNIONS—Steelworkers, Teamsters—-so that they can gather all the workers under the Union umbrella, and start America’s prosperity going again! (Not for nothing, do the PIGS hate UNIONS!)

          Welcome back, girl! Sit, stay a while, and give us more of those great letters! You always did know how to call a Douchebag, a Douchebag—and that Republicans of today, they’re the biggest (and most UN-AMERICAN) Douches, of all!

          • idamag

            A douchebag has a use. How about a used barf bag or bag 0 barfs?

          • jvaljon1

            Laughed so hard from that picture I cried….LOL!

    • sunmusing

      We have a problem, and the problem is us.

      The problem is not “us”…it is “them”…the right wingers supported by the corrupt corporate entities….the Koch brothers are the domestic enemies we have been warned about…just look at the State Houses…Rachael Maddow nailed it last nite on her show about Gerrymandering the Electoral Vote…These folks forcing all of this legislation through gerrymandered republican control of blue states is the most dangerous program happening right now…all of this under cover of the gun debate…the winger think tanks are the enemies command and control…I use the word “enemy” because that is what the wingers are…they want to destroy our way of life…our government….no one is willing to say it…there are “voices” of sanity but they are being silenced by the money…where’s my tin foil….

      • idamag

        Absolutely.

      • Yappy2

        Another enemy is Fox Cable.

      • jvaljon1

        I have been calling today’s Republicans “enemies of this country” ever since they took office this last time. It’s clear to me and has been for some time, that “we have met the enemy, and he is us”—those of “us” who are Republican, that is. Only people who hate America would wantonly bring it to financial ruin. Why does nobody else see these “austerity measures”, as what they really are—GRAND THEFT AMERICA– (albeit, cloaked in the Republicans’ usual pious bluster, about how “America spends too much, [on SS, Medicare and the rest] so now it’s time for ‘belt-tightening’)…

        Stealing Social Security is what they want to do, and that’s just for starters! There are Ghost Towns all over America which were once prosperous, but then Republicans came to those towns. Sent the jobs OVERSEAS! Without work the town died; and another part of America died with it, killed by America’s enemies that so many Americans unknowingly VOTED FOR! Therefore, this is WHAT I PROPOSE: Most of these monsters are in the South. The South, long in thrall to ‘trickle-down economics’ most of its states are dead broke, and WE THE FEDS are shoring them up.

        Well….let’s just STOP IT! Stop nourishing these vipers in our bosom! Stop looking at them as “our fellow Americans” because they’re NOTHING OF THE KIND…they’re OUR DEADLY ENEMIES! Since WHEN do we give our enemies nourishment, sustenance—only to have them strike at our very heart, and laugh at us because we let them do it????

        Let’s STOP letting them do it. When the Southern States come begging to the Feds, let them be greeted, as befitting such a bunch of deadbeat douchbags—with a nice, upraised middle finger. “Sorry,” we should tell them… “AUSTERITY DEMANDS, that we CUT YOU OFF and QUIT SUPPORTING YOU, AND THE GANG OF CROOKED POLITICIANS THAT YOU’RE ALWAYS VOTING FOR. Hence, go begging among the people whose jobs you cheerfully sent to China. If the rest of the American People knew what YOU had done to them, there would be an Austerity Program waiting around some corner someday soon, for YOU—and it would involve long long jail terms, to say the very least.”

        I’d give anything to see that happen, to see America’s worst enemies, those home-grown Republican vipers in our bosoms, get what’s coming to them. I thought that it was a vain wish, but perhaps now, with that Sandy Hook Massacre (of kindergarteners!) and their selfish insistence on hanging onto their guns anyway, because “Duh Gummint’s gonna come for yer gun–we’re gonna shoot all of ‘em first!” —people are beginning to see Republicans as the deadly enemies of this country, that they have been for a very long time…ever since the South turned Republican.

        Rocket science, this isn’t. More and more, the people who voted Republican are starting to have a huge amount of “buyers’ remorse”, and now FINALLY we have a President willing and able to take the battle directly to THEM. It’s going to be a beautiful four years, American People! Let’s all support our wonderful President Obama, (who’s smarter than any one hundred Republicans combined); kick the Pigs out of any political offices they now hold—and Republicans BE DAMNED.

        The President’s first four years was spent—WASTED, I say—on trying to make “common cause” with Republicans. They want no part of that, because they don’t have anything in common at all, with President Obama. How can they? He’s the President of the United States of America, and the Republicans, are America’s Deadliest Enemies ever. But now the President understands that, they’re not going to go with him or us—they’ll only work against him as they’ve been doing.

        Thank God, we’re starting to understand as well, especially when we hear the Republicans talk about “austerity” (for US, not THEM)—-that: They Are The Enemy—and act accordingly, (for a change!)

        • billbear1961

          One of the best posts I’ve ever read online!

          You understand EXACTLY what’s going on!

          Have you heard that Mr. Obama isn’t shutting down his campaign organization this time around, but will use its many members to help move his agenda forward to restore the Common Good (that the Big Money WHORES in the GOP have been DESTROYING for the past THIRTY YEARS)??

          Some of the most exciting political news I’ve heard in ages!

          I just hope to GOD that they’re doubling, tripling, or even quadrupling his security—because Big Money and the American right are murderous BASTARDS!!

          I tell you this—if they harm a single hair on Mr. Obama’s head, it will be time to lay waste to Wall Street and deal with all the rightwing traitors—like that filthy shit Limbaugh and the corporate-fascist propagandists on Fox—once and for all.

          I enjoyed your post a great deal!!

          Cheers!!

          If tiny ICELAND can stand up to the banksters and robber barons, so can WE!!

          • jvaljon1

            Nice surprise, billbear1961…not quite what I’m used to seeing, in the way of response! Sometimes it seems as if I’m simply posting into a huge rightwing VOID. (Rightwing=VOID [not just ‘void’]!) Thanks for showing me different!

            Totally agree with you on dealing with the Radicals. These Fascists would make America into their own private living hell. Rather than despair, I take comfort in seeing their many recent failures. I would, however, like to know the REAL cause of Karl Rove’s meltdown after the election; I’m not so sanguine as to believe that our beloved people suddenly got a political brain-boost…. rather, that some machination or other of theirs re voting machinery, didn’t work ‘correctly’ (as opposed to the flawless way that it worked for them in 2000 and 2004) and that’s what caused Rove’s emotional excursion.

            I have an idea what happened to the Republicans, this past electoral trip around our Nation…but I’m still left wondering what that was, for sure.

          • billbear1961

            You are not alone!

            Yes, the right savages my remarks, of course; but, then, God help us, there are the “centrists,” who call me an extremist (!) because I admire DENMARK, for God’s sake.

            Only in the USA are you a wild-eyed RADICAL because you admire the Danes, and what they and other Scandinavians—and the Dutch and even Germans—have achieved with their social democratic model. Of the world’s successful, industrialised, democratic states, the U.S. remains the most backwards and socially ruthless.

            I’m convinced today’s GOP want to destroy effective government, leaving us with no defense—other than outright rebellion—against absolute corporate slavery. This explains, for example, the treasonable action of their sick pals on the SCOTUS who gave us “Citizens United,” giving MONEY the rights of the individual citizen. Beijing’s dog-eat-dog capitalism is what they want for us, where only a tiny super-rich elite will have any real rights, at all.

            I think this past election—and the 2008 campaign—proves they’ll stop at NOTHING to achieve their goal. No lie is too big or repeated too often—Romney couldn’t open his trap without spewing lies and distortions. No sum of corruptly-given lucre can be enough, and no effort at voter suppression or vote tampering is too base. (Yes, I’d heard Rove’s meltdown may have been provoked by a failed attempt to steal the vote! After 2000 and 20004, it’s always a major worry of mine, come election time.)

            Hatred and discrimination are encouraged and embraced.

            The bought-and-paid-for media insist on pretending that these corporate-fascist criminals and pathological liars offer an acceptable alternative to the essential underpinnings of a modern democracy. But they ALSO pretend that true democracy is possible without the fair playing field created by progressive taxation—and the equal access to quality healthcare and a good education that such a modest redistribution of wealth has made possible in the world’s most advanced social democratic states.

            Thanks to the incineration of the Fairness Doctrine—the law of the land for DECADES until Big Money and the right took aim at it—the nonstop, 24/7 corporatist propaganda spewed by the One Percent’s lackeys has jerked the American political spectrum so far to the right that nearly half the country believes its own government is more dangerous than the hoodlums who want to make Wall Street their ABSOLUTE MASTER.

            Restore the Fairness Doctrine.

            Subdue the Imperial War Machine.

            Tax the rich at 40 and, later, 50%; close all loopholes.

            Reintroduce FDR’s economic and financial safeguards.

            Introduce strict gun-control laws (similar to those enjoyed by our more advanced and progressive democratic allies).

            Embrace the American SOCIAL DEMOCRACY!!

            Cheers, JV!

    • 101strac

      Mr. Vila, almost without exception, I’ve been in complete agreement with all that you have written now and in the past. I have to strongly disagree with your choice of words in two lines.”our worst enemy is us,” “we have a problem, and the problem is us.” The problem is not us, the problem is them, The Extremest Republican Party that is not only willing, but apparently eager to let not only our economy, but the rest of the world along with us go down the drain. It’s foolish to believe they will ever soften their stance, and allow common sense to prevail. they are incapable of that. The President is left with no choice but to work around them wherever possible, by whatever means is at his disposal. I will not forget in 2014 what that party has put this Country through, and I will once again vote a straight Democratic ballot. I hope enough voters do the same so that, even if we cannot completely eliminate them in Congress, we can at least reduce their numbers.

      • idamag

        People who have problems are often their own worst enemy and so it fits the government also.

      • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

        The reason I believe “we” are the problem is because we – the majority of the population that re-elected President Obama – failed to be more active in voicing our support and reminding the opposition that they lost the election. If you look at the daily headlines you would think the GOP won the election in November.
        Moreover, I believe our fiscal problems require sacrifice by everyone at all levels of our society. Saying that we support a balanced budget, that we do not want to borrow any more, and that we want to bring the debt down to a manageable level, becomes empty rhetoric when we add…as long as the programs I benefit from are not touched.
        There are plenty of areas that should be cut first, before seniors, students and the poor are impacted, but if that is not enough we must be prepared to make sacrifices if we are really committed to fiscal integrity and the long term future of our country. We simply cannot afford to borrow and add debt forever, and that is not limited to the Federal government, the same goes for our corporations and us, the average Joe.

        • 101strac

          Mr Vila, I am 73 years old and this is the first time I’ve been informed that overwhelmingly winning an election was not enough. that we are apparently required to make contact with the losing side, and kiss their collective butts, all in an effort to get them to play nice, and do what they were elected to do, mainly, to act in a manner that puts our Country”s best interest front and center, and not just to serve their own selfish interests and agenda. This is not the republican party of my youth, and in my opinion it will never be that way again. The present day republican party is rife with racists, and too many people who get richer from wars. I have never been unemployed from the time I took my first job. Over the years I’ve paid plenty into Social Security and nobody is going to make me feel guilty about receiving my retirement benefits now. I will fight tooth and nail against anyone who tries to reduce or take away completely, my Medicare or Social Security benefits.

          • rustacus21

            The problem being WE, THE PEOPLE, means we must pay attention to gerrymandering efforts in the states, intended to offset future wins by Democratic Presidents & Congresspersons in future elections. Conservatives mean to completely UNDO our citizens Democracy by any/every means possible. That we have ignored this is the fault of the non-voting block in 2010. President Obama needed THESE helping hands back then. Doubly complicated now, we’re facing a wounded conservative ‘BEAST’ flailing, gnashing & clawing for every means of destroying threats to their ability to complete their work of cutting off ALL ACCESS POINTS by citizens, to OUR Democracy. We need but simply overpower conservatives on EVERY election day from now on, as we ARE the voting majority – no matter how corporate media plays it to the opposite conclusion!!! Believe this & encourage your fellow citizens daily…

          • idamag

            Rust, that is going to be hard to do in those backward areas that send people like Bauchmann and Issa to congress.

          • rustacus21

            … but I must be an eternal optimist, b/c I believe that at some point, they too, will understand what chumps & suckers they’ve been these last several decades… making it all the more possible Bauchmann & Issa ARE endangered political species… But that’s still up to the rest of us pressuring this administration to protect voting rights & laws at the local levels to combat gerrymandering that seeks to tilt whole districts EXCLUSIVELY to conservatives – ILLEGALLY! In a Democracy, we are ALL charged w/the care & well-being of each other (even conservatives!!!), via our votes…

          • billbear1961

            There is no doubt in my mind that the neo-fascist GOP mean to destroy effective government and reduce this country to a state of absolute corporate slavery by ANY means at their disposal.

            They lend their support to the right’s hateful social agenda to get their votes; and the bigots in the party put up with the One Percent’s plundering of the Common Good, our patrimony, as long as their rich masters work to harm the minority groups and independent women that social right-wingers HATE.

            It’s an unholy and dangerous alliance!

            Mr. Obama—bless him!—is making some headway against them.

            But NEVER are these truly MURDEROUS forces more dangerous than when they are wounded, scared and angry!

            I sincerely hope that security around the president has been doubled, tripled or even quadrupled!!

            I’m very proud of him, but also increasingly frightened for him—especially since he’s started taking on the gun perverts, some of the most dangerous psychos this country has ever produced!!

          • jvaljon1

            You are quite right, about these Republicans “not being the party of your youth”. They’re our enemies and you’re doing the right thing by withdrawing your support. You should know this, though:

            Their leadership having created misery all across this great land of ours—and far from owning up to it, have just blamed everyone BUT themselves for the sorry state of affairs that they’ve created here in this country. We need to treat them like the enemies that they are, and extirpate them completely from our society.

            Perhaps someday we can have a “two-party” system again—a system where there are two different schools of thought, but both want what is best for our country. Not like today, when only ONE of the parties wants what is best for our country, but the other, the Republicans, newly stated goal, is to bring America to its knees, and then, flush her down the drain!

            That’s not a political party—that’s an ENEMY. And they take the long view, that we may kick them out of power now, but “they’ll be back…someday.” Let us prepare for that day by restoring all the rules and regulations that they, the Republicans, found so onerous to curbing their own rapacity, and dissolved one after the other when no one was looking…

            Let us restore those rules and regulations and this time, enshrine in some way—perhaps by a monument DEDICATED to the governing principles OF TODAY, that make America what we are—-that these economic principles ARE NOT TO BE MESSED WITH, EVER AGAIN! That “laissez-faire” ANYTHING, doesn’t fly in the greatest and free-est country in the world—-and that it will NEVER be tolerated here, ever again!

        • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

          I did not say our victory in November was not good enough. In my opinion, we must remind the opposition that we won the election and that there are consequences associated when a plurality of Americans reject a candidate and the policies of a party.
          However, I also believe that a winner takes all philosophy is counter productive. I disagree with most Republican policies, but I believe that in the interest of making progress we must be willing to compromise on some issues.
          I worked 44 years, paid taxes all my life, was never unemployed, and never applied for or got a government handout. I am retired, I have been on Social Security and MEDICARE for several years, and since I paid FICA most of my life, and I am now paying hefty MEDICARE fees, I do not consider those programs welfare.
          I believe substantial savings can be realized without impacting the benefits that senior citizens receive and depend on to subsist. The same goes for student loans.
          My point is that if reductions in discretionary spending, Defense, and things like foreign aid, are not enough to balance the budget, we must be prepared to make some sacrifices. Those sacrifices may involve higher taxes for everyone. The bottom line is this, we cannot afford to continue borrowing and accumulating debt forever. We either pay for what we get and benefit from or we must do without.

          • Yappy2

            But the extreme right wing Republicans aren’t asking for any sensible compromise. It’s what they want and nothing else. They have been looking to put Social Security on Wall Street for a long time and they won’t take no for an answer. They have never sacrificed a thing in their life but they don’t want people on medicare to get decent healthcare. You can’t negoiate with them. It’s all ther way or no way at all.

          • idamag

            Yappy, I want to share an article from the Idaho Falls Post-Register that appeared this morning.

            “CEO’S CALL FOR RAISING U.S. RETIRMENT AGE

            Washington (AP) An influentual group of business CEOs is pushing a plan to increase the retirement age to 70 for both Social Security and Medicare and to privatize the health insurance program for older Americans….”

            I won’t print the rest of the article, but it continues along the same vein. Who owns your senator?

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/CGNPY2ND72JDUDOVL7YWY4MRG4 jjrjon

          It’s really a bitter pill to swallow. We must sacrifice due to corporate greed and in some instances corrupted politicians. I guess we are guilty by association even though we had nothing what so ever to do with Bush Administration policies that got us into this mess in the first place. No one is held accountable, yet its business as usual. Would be nice to see some of the perpetrators (Bankers, Politicians, Stock Manipulators (Wall Street) do some hard jail time. That has failed to happen in most cases. The perpetrators continue to play their game of musical chairs. When it gets to hot in one chair they move over to another chair or retire, take their golden parachute, move to a new chair and start the game all over again. Color me as disappointed in our corrupted money driven political system.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/RCV6PTTSY3NRJKVOBMMRXMJ6NA Barbara

        Count me in.

    • idamag

      Greece is another example of what doesn’t work. These tea party people can’t be the brightest people on earth.

    • blueindy1

      Understand this: IF it gets this bad as the article says, there will be OTHER voices out there speaking this time. Other voices remarking on the failure of Capitalism, the corruption of Capitalism, so obivious even in these proceedings, other voices showing another way to handle this. A way that breaks forever the power of the wealthy, the asinine fiction of “Corporate Personhood”, and the power of those fictional “Persons.”

      Other voices telling the truth. Voices that will be heard, and listened to. And acted upon…

      • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

        And that’s part of the problem. The only voices I hear are those of the GOP, who acts as if they won the election. We all need to be more proactive and involved in our political process. As a minimum, we must let our elected officials know where we stand, what we expect from them, and what is unacceptable to us.

    • lana ward

      The problem is spending. We wouldn’t have a debt ceiling problem if omuslim would stop his reckless spending–starting with the millions he sends to mosques around the world, and the billions he gives to the UN. He’s giving all of our money to our enemies

      • Sand_Cat

        Another new low: information-wise, intelligence-wise, common decency-wise. Congratulations; in the face of seeming rock-bottom impossibility, you continue to embarrass yourself and those politicians you support more every day, show greater ignorance and bigotry, exceed your own records for malice.

        • lana ward

          IT’S TRUE!! Look it up-jerk!!

        • idamag

          Sand, I would find her a boring dinner companion. She yammers on and on with the right wing hate blog talking points.

      • blueindy1

        If you really believe that, and you’re not just trolling, then YOU are a part of the problem. As I said above, if it gets as bad as this article implies, there will be those of us talking solutions this time, voices not usually heard in this country.

        It will be the death-nell of Capitalism, its rotten underbelly exposed for all the world to see. Keep spouting your foolish opinions, and let your mindless reps push us over the edge. Stop the Social Security checks. Stop ALL of the social safety net…let it all crash and burn.

        We will be there. We will pick up the pieces. People will listen. Your type will have left them no choice.

        There is a RED STORM RISING, and of a kind never before heard in this country. It will sweep away the REAL cause of our problems…immoral Capitalism.

        Thanks for your help…

        • lana ward

          You’re a communist just like omuslim is. I hope you enjoy the slavery we will be under, under dictator omuslim

          • blueindy1

            Trust me on this: A) Obama is NOT a Communist, not even close. He’s not even close to being a true Socialist. The fact you think he is tells me how much your knowledge of these things is tainted by Reich Wing talking points, and you know NOTHING about them. He’s simply another bought and sold wh@redog of Capitalist greed. B) Neither am I. C) You have no clue what I’m talking about, no idea where I’m coming from.

            And D) You will.

        • idamag

          She, and those like her, are the problem.

      • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

        Lana, would you mind enumerating the spending increases President Obama is responsible for, besides the stimulus package, which cost less than $1T?
        Better yet, since you don’t hesitate to repeat the Limbaughesque claim that our fiscal problem is spending, would you mind telling us which government programs you would eliminate to balance the budget, stop borrowing, and reduce the debt? Here is a list of the largest Federal government outlays:
        Defense, Social Security, MEDICARE, MEDICAID, interest on the debt, unemployment benefits, intelligence agencies, diplomats, customs officers, border patrol, food and drug inspectors, the Center for Disease Control, NASA, the Treasury, Transportation, etc.
        The first six items account for over 90% of the budget. Have at it!

        • lana ward

          The billions omuslim gives to our enemies would be a start. Plus all the pork congress spends on useless projects. He has spent more than all other Presidents combined!!

          • AMADAL

            Back up there for a minute, Lana!! You are so fond of telling people to look it up while you don’t look anything up for yourself. While Dubya and a total Repukelican control of Congress was in effect (That is, the first 6 years of the Bush Administration), The Federal Government passed the largest pork barrell budgets ever in the history of the United States. Look that up and shut the fuck up, dumb ass.

          • idamag

            Like the bridge to nowhere.

          • lana ward

            Obama has spent MORE money than all other Presidents combined!! LOOK IT UP!! And you SHUT THE FUCK UP!! You dumbass, think you know it all, idiot!!

          • AMADAL

            Actually, you should look it up. Obama has spent less than any other recent presedent–It appears he spent a lot but all he did was add the cost to two Bush wars and thed drug benefits into the budget where it belongs. Those were bush expendutures, not Obama’s. Bush kept this money hid like it didn’t exist. Now who is the dumbass? Look it up as you are so fond of telling people.

          • lana ward

            I looked it up. Omuslim has spent MORE money than all other Presidents combined!!!!

          • AMADAL

            No, I’m sure you didn’t look anything up or you would not make that statement unless you only looked it up on Faux News or Rush Limpdick and his radical right tea bagger sites. Obama has added only 1 trillion–the bulk of the rest was Dubya Bush.

          • lana ward

            Omuslim has added over $6 trillion. Where have you been the past 4 years??

          • AMADAL

            It’s more like where have you been? Like I said, that was money spent by Dubya and not added into the debt or budget. It came from Dubya

          • lana ward

            Omuslim has spent over $6 trillion in 4 years, more than all other Presidents combined

        • idamag

          Dominick, she won’t understand what you mean by enumerate.

      • Dmullins84

        Iana Ward, please keep your bubbling to your self. We’re having a sensible conversation.

        • lana ward

          Your conversations are about all that isn’t so

      • jvaljon1

        But—Lana, dear—how about YOUR SPENDING??? How about all the TAX DOLLARS that you DIDN’T PAY?? How about your mansions, and all the other wealth that you have accumulated ON OUR BACKS??? Pay up or SHUT UP. Best is for you to do BOTH. As for America that you and yours have tried your best to BEGGAR??? We’re MAD AS HELL, and we’re NOT GONNA TAKE IT ANY MORE!!!!!

        See, Lana, the time is now, we’re gonna throw off your yoke of servitude that you’ve tried so damn hard to put around our necks, and make sure that you never get to steal from America like you have in the past.

        And quit bad-mouthing our President, Lana. Unlike YOUR ‘prez’dunt’—this one was actually ELECTED—BY US!! He wasn’t SELECTED by some radical bunch of Supreme Court flunkies, stacked that way by the Reagan administration!!!

        • lana ward

          I have worked all my life, you know nothing. And I don’t appreciate my money going to our enemies and illegals. Omuslim won by Chicago thug fraud. Having this fraud vetted is WAY overdue

          • jvaljon1

            Unfortunately Lana, I know people like you all too well.  Born with a silver spoon up your ass, there’s quite a few of them down here.  Morons, too. Just like you.  The only ‘work’ that you’ve ever done, was flatbacking it for a series of ever-richer husbands.

          • lana ward

            I don’t like my money going to our enemies and illegals. What’s wrong with that? You shouldn’t want your money going to that bullshit either!!

        • idamag

          I don’t think she lives in a manion. She is a high school dropout who got pregnant and went on welfare.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/43ZQGGZPH4XAL3T4CNK5A2DTYE Bill

      Seems everyone has forgotten how our nation got here with massive debt and radical politics. Rember the two wars that was funded on credit, billions paid to these nations for rehab and most assets stolen by very people who were crying for our assests. How about Pakistan, billions a year, and dont forget the national banks and wall street who created the greatest ponzi scheme in history by peddeling mortgage backed securities (without any financial backing) This act alone incurred billions in national bailouts to banks and auto industry. The Fed printed 16 trillion dollars that were disbursed thru out the world to prevent economic catastropy. SO, why isnt our government collecting oil revenues from Iraq as president Bush promised, why isnt our judicial systems going after restitution from crooks who made billions on mortgage scam. This government has spent the money, doesnt anyone wonder that we dont have recourse to collect our loans, stop the senseless wars by repub hawks and insist repayment is made by all institutions and partys involved.

  • charleo1

    As failures go, Republicans since the election of Barack Obama rank right up there with
    such epic American Fails, as Custer at the Little Big Horn, the Sutter family’s trip out west,
    or, the Volstead Act. Finally passed through Congress at the insistence of a very vocal,
    very determined group of ideologues. And, just like those anti-alcohol zealots then, these
    one issue ideologues setting in Congress, or in State Governments across the Country
    are unable, or unwilling, to see the unintended consequences of their actions. Now, are
    these people evil? Purposefully intent on harming the Country? Or, is their ignorance
    simply the result of a narrow, myopic, group think, to which they have latched on, or
    perhaps, encouraged to adopt by others, who do carry a malicious intent toward the Country?
    I honestly cannot tell. What is known, is that many of these extremest were catapulted
    from obscurity to the seats they now hold in Congress. Another thing we do know, is that
    the world’s financial markets, will not care where they came from. Only that the economies
    of the wider world are dependent upon the U.S. economy. And not nearly so much as to what
    they may sell us,. Although that is important. What a shaky world must have from the
    United States, the holder of the world’s reserve currency, by which all other currency
    is measured, is the rock solid faith that America always keeps her word. That is what
    some in Congress are purposing to use as a bargaining chip. The word of the United States.
    My feelings as an American, who owes so much this Country I could not repay my debt
    of gratitude, if I had two lifetimes in which to do so. However, if these people do not know
    what they are doing, they should resign. If they do, they should be striped of their citizenship,
    and forced to spend the remainder of their lives, adrift on the open ocean, without a Country,
    or a government to rail aganist.

    • Sand_Cat

      I know what you mean, but the Republicans have been very far from failures. As pointed out by another poster, the headlines read like the GOP won the election, and they’ve been like that for most of the last five years or so, and – unfortunately – in all too many cases those headlines have been spot on.

      At no other time during my life has a minority party been able to set the nation’s agenda, control the debate, get through their legislation, and obstruct the majority’s. Not even close.

      I’m very happy that neither John McCain nor the Mittwit is our president, but I’m not nearly so glad as I should be that Barack Obama is, or that Democrats “control” the Senate the way they have[n’t].

      • charleo1

        It’s my opinion, that yes, the Republicans have been successful in blocking
        legislation. But as elected representatives, that have an obligation to act in
        the best interests of their Country, they have failed pitifully. The Country has
        suffered unnecessarily, and they have done tremendous damage to their own
        Party, by their behavior. And, they haven’t helped themselves in the charm
        department either. Look, sometimes a politician can ride a wave of popular
        anger. Chris Christie did a masterful job of that the other day. But the constant
        belligerence aganist a President trying to clean up, and deal with a mess a lot
        of these guys helped create, got old. Because, after a few months of it, it became
        clear they weren’t trying to solve the Country’s many challenges, that they had
        no answers. But in the midst of war, and economic turmoil, they were playing.
        Amusing themselves, and their fringy hate filled base. That’s why when it came
        time to field a candidate for President, the candidates had no ideas, and no
        platform. Because they hadn’t been working the problem. They had been obstructing,
        to get the White House, and Congress back in their hands. So, after having
        some more fun with their still angry little, base, disrespecting Latinos, women,
        the unemployed, and each other, they lost the election. It has been for many
        years, that one side could block the other through procedure. But, just saying
        no to everything may appear to be controlling the agenda. But sooner or later,
        Republicans are going to need to be in the affirmative for something other than
        cutting programs for the poor, and elderly, while joining into the fight protecting
        the rich.

      • jvaljon1

        Sand_Cat…your analysis would be spot-on, except that you paint Obama as a Democrat loser instead of a winner—and you quote Republi-rags trumpeting lies as truth. One other thing: you want to remember that President Obama had to work to get RE-ELECTED, before he could render these Republicans useless, the way that he’s starting to do right now.

        President Obama did NOT have a majority behind him, he had America’s (and his own) deadly enemies in Congress, who took power in 2010 while the American People were sleeping and thinking that “We won the Presidency, now everything’ll be all right, the Wars are over, the Troops can come home” and bla bla bla, all correct, but then there’s the ECONOMIC WAR that the Republicans declared on this country, and THAT’S THE ONE that President Obama’s starting to fight, right now. I think that the country will be just fine, with our President.

        We need to vow a mighty vow, all we Americans—we need to swear that NEVER AGAIN WILL WE ELECT TRAITOROUS CAPITALIST PIGS to either Congress, the Senate, OR the highest office of the land. Then we’ll be OK—until and unless, we forget that vow. It took Americans 50 years since the last Great Depression to forget that vow—let’s hope that we never again let the Republican Pig Party, into our body politic. Those loser cockroaches don’t belong in the Capitol, they belong flushed down the drain—let’s put them there, and LEAVE THEM THERE!

  • Eleanore Whitaker

    The debt ceiling is the biggest worry the GOP has? Why? The US has been in debt since George Washington was president. Might it just be that the GOP fears that Halliburton and XE (Blackwater) won’t get their bills paid? After all, our great grandkids will still be paying for Iraq, won’t they?

    The Tea Party isn’t a party of anything but anarchy. The fact that they are fighting new gun control legislation to protect our kids proves their anarchy. They should and must be dealt with severely before their perdition becomes violent. They aren’t fighting for other Americans…if they were, they’d never have accepted billions from the Koch billionaires. Once money corrupts principles, there’s no return to morals or honor.

    • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

      The irony, on the issue of gun control. is that the GOP had no problem when President Reagan championed gun control laws in 1986, including the Brady Bill. He called for an assault weapons ban and strict regulation of the sale and ownership of firearms. In fact, he went as far as writing an op-ed piece for either the Boston Globe or the Times advocating gun control. The so called “conservatives” did not even blink when their Messiah championed gun control, I wonder why an identical effort is deserving of impeachment…

      • johninPCFL

        GWB also called for a continuation of the assault weapons ban and more stringent background checks in 2004.

        • Sand_Cat

          Nice to know that in 8 years he did one thing involving good sense.

        • old_blu

          You didn’t hear the GOP and the NRA yelling then I wonder why?

      • neeceoooo

        I am sure we all know why his efforts are hitting such resistance.

      • jvaljon1

        Because those were Republicans, back then. These here are ferocious RAPISTS, striking at this country’s heart, and they have to be beaten back, not only at White House level, but in the Congress, the Senate, the GOVERNORSHIPS especially, and we in the North, have to STOP SUPPORTING the broke Southern States, that then TAKE OUR MONEY and try to drag us under with them! We have to kick OUT the Rapists, EVERYWHERE! Starting in 2014, and we have to get the ground game to do it! We’re off to a terrific start this year….gotta keep it going, is all!

    • http://www.facebook.com/bob.brindell.7 Bob Brindell

      Gun control should not be compaired to the debt issue. We need to see what the Pres. proposes and how Congress reacts before jumping into gun control. Keep the Know Nothings on the run over fiscal issues before going on another tangent.

    • idamag

      Eleanore, I have went a stp further and call the tea party subversive.

  • montanabill

    It might be interesting to stop food stamps, endless unemployment comp, welfare without work, bogus SS disability and see how people really feel about how well the economy is doing. As most of you were all for tax increases and continued borrowing to pay for these goodies (as long as it doesn’t affect you), let’s see what really will happen when you run out of other people’s money. Maybe you will discover that Obama really isn’t doing that good a job with the economy. P.S., your kids and grandkids each owe $50,000. Just 4 years ago, it was just $22,000. But hey, no problem, we’ll be long gone when it comes due.

    • cpbis

      You just don’t get it! Example: the $50,000 as opposed to $22,000 is not Obama’s doing. It is almost all carryover from the Bush years. I know you’ll just say that we always blame the previous administration. Well, where were you in 2003 when S & P warned if nothing was done about the economy it would have to decrease our credit rating within 10 years? Where were you when in 2006 Greenspan warned that we were going to face a terrible downturn if nothing was done, soon? Where were you in October of 2008 when everything exploded and that explosion carried over to 6 months into 2009? How could this administration “fix” what is now over 12 trillion of the deficit caused by that administration while those who originally put us in this mess continually block what the president tries to do to improve the economy? Look around today, the market has nearly doubled, housing market has had improvements for a number of months, unemployment has improved (Bush added less jobs in 8 years than Obama has in less than 4, companies have over a trillion dollars set aside (that’s what Obama meant when he said the private sector was doing fine), the auto industry is flourishing again, on and on! Wake up to reality!

      • http://www.facebook.com/bob.brindell.7 Bob Brindell

        Time to stop blaming Bush. That bumbling SOB screw up enough stuff. It could take an eternity to clean up his mess. We need to keep moving on and get the mess cleaned up.

      • montanabill

        2006. Election of a Democrat controlled Congress. I, like most conservatives, were appalled at the spending and we were vocal about it. The ‘explosion’ was the direct result of the Community Reinvestment Act and ultimately, Democrats thwarting efforts to stop the inflation of the bubble.
        The stock market does not reflect the economy.
        Bush’s worst unemployment year prior to the ‘explosion’ was immediately after 9/11. He quickly got the country back on its feet. At no time, were his true unemployment numbers anywhere close to the true 13 million now unemployed. With pretty much full employment under Bush, the ‘created more jobs’ is a bogus argument.
        And I reiterate my position. Take away all the government largess and see if people remain happy with Obama’s progress on the economy.
        You and the rest of left can and will blame Bush forever, but take a closer look at which party refuses to create a budget or a true spending bill and wants to live on the status quo of borrowing 41 to 46 cents of every dollar government spends.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/HGC4BGWVYXV76PHZBPSPOOU5GA Independent1

          Sorry, but once again you’re wrong. The only thing the Dems got control of in the 2006 election was the house, even with the two independents they only had a 51/49 majority in the Senate which is totally useless; as is obvious even today when they have a 53 to 46 majority because the GOP has used the filibuster rule 400 times in the past two years to block everything the Dems have wanted to do. And with respect to Bush’s employment stats: his administration created 3.1 million jobs in 8 years,
          that’s about 32,000 jobs/month which is the worst job creation record (aside from his Dad’s even more abysmal record) since FDR was in office.
          And the economy during his 8 years in office, despite the two tax cuts that were suppose to produce some economic effect, was also the most unproductive in that time (since WWII).

          And if you’re talking about taking away government largess, be aware that the vast majority is going to Red States that couldn’t support themselves for six months without the influx of government dollars. Six red states lead the nation in sucking welfare dollars for the meager taxes they pay; while all the 8 states that not only pay the most in taxes, and by far are supporting these government giveaways, are all Blue States that are doing very well – thank you!!!

          • montanabill

            I guess you wouldn’t complain then, if the Republicans held the Senate 51/49.
            Bush started his term with 4.2% unemployment. After 9/11 it grew to 6.3% in 2003 then, after the tax cuts kicked in, fell 4.4% and stayed less than 5%. Not a lot of room there to add more jobs. When Obama took office, the rate was 5% and stayed in the 5’s for seven months. Then it started growing.

            The rhetoric about Red states is substantially misleading (surprise). The real trick is to compare on what the money is spent. Who do you suppose those sucking welfare vote for in those Red states?

            Ok, name one blue state you’d like to live in. Did you notice that a number of them elected Republican governors and that every state with a Republican governor has lower its unemployment rate. A statement that cannot be made about states that elected Democrat governors.

          • Sand_Cat

            Your posts are “substantially misleading.”

            Yes, we all know Bush was the best thing that ever happened to this country, Sadam hid all the weapons of mass destruction or sent them to Syria, Bush and his appointees had absolutely nothing to do with the recession, etc., etc., etc., ad infinitum…

            When you can make up your own “facts,” you really can make a strong argument. Unfortunately, all of us end up having to cope with a reality-based world, despite all the denial.

          • montanabill

            The ‘made up facts’ come from government web sites.

          • idamag

            Montana, they also set the rules for voting to a super majority of 61%.

          • montanabill

            Our founding fathers had specific reasons for not wanting to create a pure democracy. Their reasons are just as valid today. Both sides have had to endure the super majority vote and it is usually a good thing. If a bill is truly bipartisan, meaning it acceptable to both sides, then it has no trouble with a super majority. However, as we’ve have seen with Obamacare, when one party is capable of ramming legislation down the throats of the people when half disagree, that legislation is probably not in the best interest of the country. It was a matter of ‘must pass’ philosophy with the Democrats, even though virtually none of them actually knew what was in the bill. The failure to have a widespread analysis of the impact is something this country will rue for generations as health care gets worse, more expensive and rationed.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/HGC4BGWVYXV76PHZBPSPOOU5GA Independent1

          And just another note in case you want to bring up more nonsense, even when the Dems got a super majority in the Senate in 2009, it was only for 8 months – Ted Kennedy died in August of 2009 and was replaced by a Republican (Scott Brown), negating their super majority. They used the 8 months they did have a super majority to follow through on TARP and the auto bailout, which there’s no question saved America and the world from the GOP’s second world-wide depression (which it seems they’re wanting to try and create again); and with getting Obamacare passed; which is already showing signs of benefitting insureds in that the increases in healthcare costs over the passed couple of years have slowed to the slowest levels in 14 years. And you don’t want me to get started on blaming Bush, the most worthless human being on the planet. There isn’t enough room in these blogs for me to list of the things this absoultely disgusting human being did to destoy this country.

          • idamag

            Independent, President Obama has done quite well, considering the blocks thrown in the road by the tea party.

          • montanabill

            I realize it is dogma to Democrats, but the bailout did not save the auto industry. It saved union pay rates.
            TARP is questionable and the stimulus was used as pay-off’s and Democrat pork.
            Obamacare will turn into the most expensive piece of junk legislation ever passed. It has already started the rationing of healthcare, driving providers to other professions, raised insurance rates, imposed innumerable new taxes and added 13,000 pages of costly new regulations. And that is just a start.

        • cpbis

          The Democrats were not in control of Congress in 2006. They won in November of 2006 which means they could not do much of anything until June of 2007.

          • montanabill

            Ok, then how about some real numbers. Spending increased from 2006 to 2007 by $73B. 2007-2008 $254B. 2008-2009 $535B.

        • idamag

          I didn’t feel we had a great congress when they all voted for the phony war. I was sad they weren’t more intelligent.

          • montanabill

            I know most Democrats complain about phoney weapons of mass destruction and that it was an ‘illegal’ war. All Saddam had to do was let the inspectors do their job, but I suspect he didn’t because he didn’t want his neighbors to know he no longer had such weapons. As bad as it was, it taught our military a lesson about what happens if we don’t plan a complete job.
            Now, just suppose that we had not invaded Iraq. What would Iraq’s position in the middle east be with Saddam or his sons still in charge? With his worst enemy, Iran, about to get a bomb, would he still not be trying to build one? Not likely. He had used poison gas, so he obviously knew how to create that stuff. He did, and likely still would, be providing havens to al qaeda.
            I know it is impossible to really know what the situation would be if we had simply let the U.N. go on issuing endless ultimatums, but Saddam was a ruthless bad actor and if he were still there, I doubt the world would be better.

          • idamag

            Montana, using after-the-fact reasons for invading a country is rationizing. We went into war because of WMDs, bio-warfare and the mushroom cloud.

          • montanabill

            I didn’t dispute that.

      • montanabill

        Not Obama’s doing! Holy cripes, I was under the mistaken impression he has been President for four years, two of which he had full control of the Congress. I didn’t realize Bush had been re-elected for a third term.

        • johninPCFL

          Three months of his first two years, and then only when BOTH independents voted with the Dems (which they did sometimes.) At least post the facts, please.

          • Sand_Cat

            “Facts”? Bill doesn’t know the word.

        • idamag

          With the filibuster, he never had a congress. 1. the majority, in congress, voted for the dream act. It was filibustered. 2. The majority voted for 3 jobs bills. They were filibustered. 3. Th e majority voted for campaign finance reform. It was filibustered. 4. The majority voted for equal pay for equal work and it was filibustered. This is how nothing gets done.

          • montanabill

            When a majority is simply one party trying to enforce their will on everyone, especially those who disagree, getting nothing done is the preferred course.
            You refer to ‘jobs bills’. I looked at those bills and called them pork bills. I saw nothing that would have created any long term jobs. The ‘Dream Act’ was a political stunt and not a solution. Your campaign finance reform was designed to curtail Republican sources of money, but not Democrat. Republicans objected to the Democrat version of the 2012 equal pay bill and offered their own. Democrats were not willing to try to work out the differences, so both failed.

    • johninPCFL

      Fine. Now you’ve eliminated $150B. Only $1T more to go. And at the end of GWBs last budget on 9/30/2009 the national debt was $12.8T ($40k per citizen), so your math is a little shaky. Since the government has been running on continuing resolutions since then, the spending is just about exactly what it would have been had GWB stayed in office. Congress determines what to spend money on. Maybe you should write your Congressmen.

      I think a rolling cessation of payments of any federal monies to each state would be in order, for one calendar quarter at a time.

      OK is one of the many red states that gets back $2 or more in payouts per $1 of federal taxes paid in. Six-sigma quality programs teach that the first use of effort should be evaluating the programs that eat the most resources. Surely a program that pays out twice what it brings in should be one qualified as “eating resources”. The band runs across the deep south and up the Mississippi river region. Lets start with the austerity program there.

      • montanabill

        I’d have no problem with that. But before you get too excited about it, maybe you should determine exactly who is getting that money in the Red states. The math comes from published government sources. Why has the government been running on continuing resolutions? Why hasn’t the Senate produced a budget in over 3.5 years? The answers might be enlightening.

        • johninPCFL

          At least you didn’t ask about the President’s budget, which has been submitted on time every year.

          It doesn’t matter who gets the money, does it? If the GOP is so ideological about spending cuts, then they should just cut to zero and let the cards fall. Postal deliveries? Nope. Missiles in Minot? Nope. Central Command in Tampa? Nope. Congress, Supreme Court, Presidency, Pentagon, FBI, CIA, US Marines, Naval Academy? Nope.

          Let’s see, how about FL? Three months with no control over the wars in the ME, SS expenditures reduced by 10%, Medicare costs reduced by 10%, Medicaid expenses reduced by 3%, military expenses reduced by 5%, postal expenses reduced by 2%. That totals well over $200B, almost 20% of this year’s deficit. Add in Texas and Virginia, and the deficit’s zero.

          Budgets are a meaningless exercise in today’s Congress. Spending bills are written independent of budgets, and spend whatever they spend including whatever riders and amendments are attached during the debates. Budgets were passed during every year of the Reagan presidency, were superficially almost balanced, and yet $4T was added to the national debt during his reign. How? Well, military spending was not included in his budgets. GWB presented nearly balanced budgets to Congress every year. Congress passed their own nearly balanced budgets every year, and yet they added $7T to the national debt during his reign. How? Well military costs and the costs of prosecuting two simultaneous wars were never in any budgets.

          Much is made of Obama’s supposedly huge increase in deficit spending. Yet his spending is nearly exactly what GWB was ALREADY spending (that’s how CRs work), so why the huge jump in the deficit, but no corresponding jump in the rate of increase of the national debt? Because for the first time in 30 years, his budgets include the costs of the military and the wars we’re fighting.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/HGC4BGWVYXV76PHZBPSPOOU5GA Independent1

            And don’t forget the dramatic decline in tax revenues because of the economic disaster that Bush allowed to happen; the 14 million jobs that were lost, the hundreds of companies that went belly up including hundreds of banks and financials institutions and the millions of Red State Republicans that were thrown out of work and onto welfare because their nitwit GOP legislators cut spending and state revenues during a downturn, etc. etc., tax revenues were down well over a trillion dollars/year and have
            only slowly rebounded (partly because nitwith GOP legislators have sat on two of Obama’s jobs bills for two years); so even just trying to keep reasonable services in the country with all this lost revenues (and despite that fact that spending has been cut more than 250 billion each of the past two years); it’s just an impossibility without the deficit continuing to go up.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/HGC4BGWVYXV76PHZBPSPOOU5GA Independent1

            Great post! Thanks for pointing out that GWB didn’t include a large chunk of his spending in any of his budgets; which ever since Reagan started that nonsense practice has made virtually every budget submitted by a GOP president nothing more than a sham. Passing these guys budgets has really been a total waste of legislative time; of course as was the GOP house voting 30 times last year on the same piece of failed legislation they knew the Senate would never pass – not really caring that they were wasting millions of dollars in the process of playing their little games.

          • johninPCFL

            Well, Clinton followed along. But he also really cut spending sharply (and kept the GHWB tax increase) and the growing economy allowed him to really close the gap. Althouh his budgets were in surplus, the spending went over revenues, his last year was all of $20B! That’s barely a week of Pentagon spending now. Over his eight years in office, he rased the national debt by around $1T, about the same as GHWB did in four years.

            The real liberal spender in the group is GWB, who added $7T in eight years. I guess Dick wouldn’t let him play with the “VETO” stamp. Maybe Dick kept it hidden where Nancy kept it hidden from Ronnie. Neither Reagan nor GWB ever vetoed a spending bill.

            Obama has cut federal spending by about $250B per year since taking office. That’s part of the reason unemployment remains static. Former federal employees draw unemployment compensation, just like everybody else…

          • idamag

            John, they don’t seem to be able to fathom that cutting government departments puts more people out of work and they lose taxpayers and consumers.

          • montanabill

            No rate of increase in the National Debt? You need to go to usdebtclock dot org.
            The wars added about $2T. Less than 1/3 of the new debt.

          • johninPCFL

            Over the course of GWBs last budget year (that ended on 9/30/2009) the national debt increased by $1.8T. Obama’s first year increased the national debt by $1.4T, the next year by $1.6T, the next by $1.3T. Each has been less than GWBs last year, so the rate of increase in the debt has decreased from what GWBs last years were.

            The wars (not in the budget) added $2T. Military spending (also not in the budget) added another $3T. The prescription meds plan (also unbudgetted) added $Trillions more. Pretty soon, you’re talking real money!

          • truthhunter13

            BUSH DID NOT INCLUDE THE COST OF THOSE WARS IN HIS BUDGETS, GET IT?. Only an idiot will believe that cutting taxes and financing two wars will not result in large deficits.

          • montanabill

            The numbers are not about ‘budgets’. They are the real numbers. Wise up.

    • idamag

      Montana, instead of using emotion, i.e, “your kids and grandkids…” Let’s use logic. If we get the economy back on track we can fix the economy. I don’t like the idea of my kids and grandkids paying for a war in Iraq. I don’t like the idea of them paying for corporate welfare. There are a lot of hands out and it isn’t just the unemployed, and the disabled.

      • neeceoooo

        very good points

      • montanabill

        Nothing I’d like better than using logic. So the question is, how do we get the economy back on track. I also don’t like corporate welfare, any better than I like the excessive personal welfare. We have 47 million on food stamps and only 13 million unemployed or under employed. That seems to be a lot of people getting food stamps who are employed. We have people getting unemployment comp for years. A look at any newspaper’s help wanted section will show there are plenty of jobs available. They may not be the job an unemployed person wants, but one they would take if they weren’t getting endless assistance. The number of new people on SS disability is astounding. That reeks to high heaven.
        We have a tax code with more pages than the bible. How about a nice simple flat tax for everyone earning over the poverty level? No deductions. For a person making $50,000, at 15% that’s $8500. For a person making $5M, that’s $850,000. No complications. No humongous IRS.
        How many new regulations do we really need? Obamacare alone has added 13,000 pages and the count hasn’t even started. EPA is close behind. Dodd-Frank is adding another massive pile. Sure some regulation is needed, but we seem to have greatly exceeded sanity. Each of those regulations is a loss of some freedom and they cost each and everyone of us money.
        The economy can come back when businesses think they can proceed without running afoul of a new tax increase or new regulation. We just whacked the 1% with tax increases, because somebody has to pay for our excesses, but not us. Those are the small businesses we need for job creation. They can adapt, but now they are being threatened again. So what’s a business to do, except hunker down and wait to see what new hurdles they will have to jump.

        Let’s get the Senate to pass a real budget so that the country can see what spending we can plan on. These continuing resolutions are simply keeping spending out of control.

        Speaking of emotion, didn’t the President have a bunch of kids at his ‘gun control’ speech today? The sad part is that his proposals will not have any effect on the next incident until a real mental health plan is effected. Everything else was aimed a innocent, law abiding citizens.

        Here’s something you probably don’t know. Dan Webster, R-FL and Debbie Wasserman-Shultz, D-FL have gotten together and created lunch and dinner meetings between Republicans and Democrats so that they can get to know each other and talk without political theater. That may be our best hope of real, meaningful compromise.

        • idamag

          Montana, I am happy to hear that some of them are going to talk. It is totally childish not to do so.

          All of us, including you, see like through the field of our own experiences. It is hard for us to see it through other people’s experiences.

          I used to work for health and welfare. We had a welfare fraud department. Budget cuts eliminated it. I saw enough, and you will find people who worked for H &W feel this way. I was covering the front office one day so the office staff could have lunch and a guy came in for his wife’s paycheck. She worked for H & W. She had told me to give it to him. He was on SSD (disability) for a “bad back.” He said, “Boy, am I tired. I got six loads of wood out of the forest this morning.”

          For everyone like him there are several who work their tails off and still get food stamps. Those are the ones who have challenges that keep them from getting a decent paying job. I don’t mind a person who works and can’t make it getting food stamps. Those were the ones who worked hard and proud to work.

          Let’s cut the loopholes that allow corporate welfare and bring back the welfare fraud departments.

          • montanabill

            I certainly agree on the need to stop corporate welfare. I, too, do business in the health care arena, but not on an end that sees much fraud. Primarily, what we see are underpayments for services from both private insurance companies and Medicare.

            I’d like to see welfare fraud departments brought back, but suspect our President is not with us on that issue. A key indication of his thinking was shown when he moved the accountability for the work for welfare program to the states, where accountability is greatly reduced or non-existent.

            I’ve worked at a lot of menial minimum wage or lower jobs, some I had to take after becoming unemployed just to put food on the family table. We never took unemployment compensation and there was no such thing as food stamps. There are people who truly need help. But my observation is that is a very small fraction of those on the dole.

          • idamag

            Montana, I would hazard a guess that you, and I were raised in an atmosphere where you don’t take charity. An example: A man with a low I.Q. is too low to get a good paying job and too high to quality for mentally disabled. He goes to work at one place at 2:00 a.m. It is a restaurant and he cleans it when it closes. He sleeps for a few hours and goes to wash dishes at 8 a.m. at another restaurant. He is getting minimum wage and must pay rent, gasoline, utilities and food and clothing. His combined wages are not enough. He works hard enough, in my mind, he should get food stamps.

            The other example: After several generation of welfare for a family, the family looks for free stuff. I always refer to these people as the type who would steal toilet paper from public rest rooms. During the Clinton Administration, welfare reform was enacted. The recipients get a two-year window and have to be actively looking for work all that time. The government provided schooling and placement for them. The fifth generation welfare recipient is no more unless they do have disabilities. Those sleezy takers are still out there.

            One place that still needs fixing is SSI and SSD. It is all too easy to get SSI. We had a family that had their oldest son on SSI because he had a speech defect and ADD. They came to our facility to get their second child, a daughter, on SSI. Our psychologist did an evaluation and said the problem was the family lacked any sort of discipline and not ADD. They found the money to shop around until they found a psychologist who said the child had ADD and got SSI retroactive. The father didn’t work. He had a “bad back” and was getting SSD. The mother didn’t work. She was a caregiver and “housewife.” A housewife who kept getting kicked out of apartments for being so dirty. This is where the reform needs to be directed.

          • montanabill

            You are right about being raised not to take charity. My family was very poor when I was young, but we did not exist on charity. I started working and sold papers on the street when I was 10. I, my mother and brothers used to walk highways picking up bottles and cans to sell. We worked in fields and orchards. Dad worked his way from being a part time floor sweeper to apprentice to journeyman to foreman to President of his local. I was unemployed when my wife and I married. We each lived with our parents until I got a job working midnight to 8AM. That shift was stopped and I had to live on meager savings with a new child until I found another job, taking odd jobs when I could find them. I’ve been fired more than once, been made obsolete, worked for small companies and fortune 500 companies. I’ve been a grunt and management. I’ve overcome polio. I worked my way through college (it took 5 schools and 8 years) to advanced degrees. I started and failed in more than one business. But I’ve also started and succeeded in more than one business. The most successful one was started with a few hundred dollars and financed during tough times by mortgaging my home to make payroll for those who worked for me.

            So excuse me if I don’t have a lot of sympathy for healthy folks on the dole. Some people are born with disabilities they can’t overcome. Some people experience truly debilitating illness or an accident. Those people deserve whatever help they need. The rest, not so much.

            This country was built by immigrants that arrived with little more than a few cents and all their worldly possessions in suitcase or bag. They came here looking for opportunity, not a hand-out. With the freedoms here, they built the mightiest country on earth. Now, it seems, we are trying to build a country like those they left.

  • tman000

    During President Reagens terms the debt ceiling was raised 17 times. But this Congress has a different selfish agenda for America. There’s something astray with their thinking when it comes to ‘right and wrong’… hummmm…

    • idamag

      tman. During Reagan’s time, those were real Republicans. The tea party is a danger and an embarassment to this country.

      • neeceoooo

        You are so right about them being an embarrassment.

  • Dmullins84

    Let them do their bumping up against the debt ceiling raise in all the Red States who’s getting the majority of the money and see how fast these fast talking hoodlums change their mind. Ky, Ala, Miss, La, Ak, Tn, Ga, etc. I’ll guarantee you they will change their mind fast, and raise the ceiling. After all, this is money they have already approved and spent. This should not be a part of the budget talk to reduce the debt.

    • idamag

      Dmullins, and, if Issa gets his way and shuts down the government, they won’t get their welfare checks.

      • Dmullins84

        Idamag, i really would feel sorry for some of the ole folks and poor, but maybe, just maybe it would wake up a sleeping giant and 2014 we could do some damage to their Tea Party asses. Hey my SS, Veterans, and Government Retirement checks could all be on the chopping block. Being 83 I have minimum time left but hopefully enough time left to see all the Tea Party fall.

        • neeceoooo

          We can only hope

        • Sand_Cat

          The giant isn’t sleeping; it’s comatose.

        • idamag

          Dmullins, Your posts are extremely intelligent, so I would say you got time left. I am in your generation. We can remember when people weren’t so narcisitic. They weren’t perfect, but they weren’t so selfish either.

  • http://openid.aol.com/psychicpersona patrick mackondy

    Pat Mackondy · Youngstown State University

    How in the world do politicians get elected with crazy ideas like these republican congressmen and senators who don’t want to pay our debts and eliminate the heart and backbone of america…. social securiy and medicare. Let’s face it…these politicians are greedy and don’t give a damn about what makes america strong….ALL AMERICANS FOR ALL AMERICANS! Stuffing their own pockets without what the consequence would bring!

    • idamag

      The economy tanked. Someone had to try to come in like a knight in shining armor. When Germany was in the throes of a great depression, Hitler rode in on his white horse. People are vulnerable when they are hungry. Then, to add fuel to the fire, the country elected a Black man for president. We have one tea partier sent from this state. The district he came from has a joke about it. There are no branches on family trees there.

      It is the back country. You always ask yourself, “What kind of people would vote for Darrell Issa or Michelle Bauchmann?” We have to blame these people for being so ignorant they are dangerous.

      • jvaljon1

        Yeah, but there’s always been more of US than there has been, of THEM—what happens is, when WE STAY HOME, THEY GET IN. ALWAYS. The Vote is the disinfectant to Republicans—the Insecticide, that’s why they’re always trying to suppress it. You Get Out The Vote, you Get Rid Of Republicans. NOW America’s back on track. President Obama can’t do it all alone and the Pigs made him waste most of his first four years—although you can’t call the Affordable Care Act exactly a failure—how he muscled that one through with every Republican against it, is a story for the ages. Don’t ANYONE downplay the President.

  • Budjob

    Attention,attention,physician in dire need of psychiatric counseling!Please send the men with the nets to his congressional office as soon as possible!If unable to contact,try the meeting hall of the fascists of America,Coburn and Inhofe are probably conducting the same meeting.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/JWPCDWWOQJAS5UTZVN5CE3MZLU PamelaT

    Great Idea….lets first cut the money going to the red states and let them live the dream of no government assistance.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WHHWC52UEG4EX6JDXE3ONWCRYI beau10

    As Pogo said “We have met the enemy and it is…” In this case, it’s the entrenched Pubs who are still fighting the last election and are p.ssed-off with the outcome.

  • elw

    The whole debt ceiling “so called” crisis is a made up one by the Republicans. They know, as surely they knew that taxes were going to go up for the upper 1-2% of the populations, that they will raise the debt ceiling. It is all political theater that is used by the Media to fill their needless 24 hour new cycle. I am sick and tire of hearing about it; I am sick and tired of watching adults acting like adolescents while being paid a 6 figure salary at tax payer’s cost. They will raise the debt ceiling if for no other reason than receiving their own pay check; if they do not, they will pay the same election losses they did the last time they tried playing this child’s game. Not paying bills is no way of solving a debt problem. Maybe if they started acting like adults, they could actually work together to figure out what needs to be done to solve the debt crisis in a way that is thoughtful and balanced.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/VTV55S5BALQIDBQFOLH7WIZNSA Don B

    I think it would be wonderful to experiment in Oklahoma and the other RED states. Let’s give it a whirl!

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/G2PGKUB65EDZJY4AHJISBCBEIE Mildred

      Don B. Please don’t punish those of us in Oklahoma who are Democrats and don’t agree with anything our senators, congressmen, governor or state office holders say or do. I cannot even begin to express how I feel toward the peopleof my state who turned us into a “NO” state.

  • docb

    Here Here..well said, Mr.Conason! Let them rub noses with their manufactured debt ceiling…
    Will get the link from Bartlett

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Jim-Myers/100001512942781 Jim Myers

    No Guts, No Glory!!

    There is absolutely NO WAY the “Conservatives” will do this willingly.

    Only when they think they can burn everyone who apposes them will they throw the lit match into the basement filled with 8 inches of gasoline.

    The idea that they have enough guts to pull the plug on their own State citizens, is beyond imagination.

    They are GLORIFIED CHEST THUMPERS, exactly like the idiot who resided in the White House after President Clinton.

  • TonyinMO

    Obama has known this was coming for over a year why has he not taken the proper steps to avoid another crisis?

    Because he is a miserable failure as a leader.

  • truthhunter13

    GOD HELP AMERICA!!! These Republicans are hell bent on destroying our country!!. They are like the scorned boyfriend. If she can’t be mine, she won’t be anybody else’s either.
    I wonder how those who voted for Bush in 2000 feel now.

  • http://www.facebook.com/trevor.t.carlson Trevor Carlson

    Angela Merkel is like the adult trying to reign in spending of a household where all the kids have credit cards. Yeah all the kids are not going to like what she has to say but that doesn’t mean it’s the wrong thing to do.

    Germany is the strongest of all the nations in the Euro and being much more socialized than we are, we should be able to do at LEAST as much as they have when it comes to reining in spending.

    The Tea Party is more like the Republican conscience as they’ve spent way too much and now it’s time to pay. We need to pay up and cut so we don’t have to pay again. Sometimes being the only adult is un-popular but if it’s the right thing it needs to get done. Democrats will never do it so it’s up to the republicans to be the “bad guy” and force the cuts. That is a Win-win for the democrats long term plan as it means the system won’t collapse under it’s own weight in the next 10 years. I don’t get why they’re so against cuts. Obama says he wants a balanced approach to the budget; what that means to most people is that there will be lots of cutting to get the budget balanced because money doesn’t just come from thin air.

    People need to remember that Democrats have lots of shady and corrupt big-business links too at least as bad if not worse than the Republicans due to the fact that the majority of reporters have a leftward bias and tend not to look for stories that might hurt “their” favored views.

    • johninPCFL

      Democrats have done it in the past and are doing it now. The president can only sign (or veto) what hits his desk.

      Current spending is voted into being by Congress. Obama cannot create new spending, Congress does that. Spending per Congress is currently $250B per year less than GWBs years in office, but is now mostly run by continuing resolutions, which means that it really is just a continuation of GWBs spending levels.

      • http://www.facebook.com/trevor.t.carlson Trevor Carlson

        That’s part of the problem, our President hasn’t exercised his veto power enough! So by your reasoning, Obama is basically rubber-stamping GWB’s budgets by not requiring cuts to them.

        Maybe you can explain further what you mean by “Democrats have done it in the past and are doing it now.”

        • johninPCFL

          Yes,the president can either pay the troops or not. Congress makes the appropriation. The president can either pay federal employees or not. Congress makes the appropriation.

          Get it? A veto means that folks don’t get paid. If the bills from Congress were not at the last posible minute, there may be time to veto them and then negotiate a replacement. As it is, the folks at the bottom take the hit, or the bill becomes law.

    • Interrupting ReplyBot 2012.1

      Then why don’t you refuse your Social Security, Medicare, and if a natural disaster like a hurricane, tornado or flood hits your home, refuse the gov’t assistance for that? Lead by example, man. That’s what Oklahoma should do, too. Coburn should go on television this Sunday and say that, on behalf of patriotic Oklahomans, the state will no longer provide ANY gov’t help. Period. Lead by example.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YQCGVT5GXNC3KV637OFPRXONXQ Kevin

    I am from the same county in Oklahoma as Coburn and he is a total embarassment to the state of Oklahoma and the nation. He had done absolutely nothing for the state of Oklahoma since he was elected, yet the ultra-right wingers here keep sending him back to accomplish nothing for Oklahoma!

  • http://www.facebook.com/nancy.lyttle.7 Nancy Lyttle

    Has anyone noticed the stealth with which the Nazi/Fascist ReTHUGlicans are working to “Fix” our Presidential Elections via the technique known as “gerrymandering”? THIS is where they are going to attack American Ideals and Freedoms next, IF we let them, and make NO mistake, they WILL defecate on this Country IF we do! Forewarned is Forearmed and we MUST remain vigilant! The Newbie “Tea Partiers” are CLUELESS as to the Havoc they are about to wreak on, not only us, but the World. WHEN will they EVER begin to listen to their Constituents? This egregious bunch dance to their OWN tune, the People be DAMNED! I, for one am sick to death of their Bullying Bull-Puckey! We should ABOLISH the Electoral College and let American Citizens, rather than “Gerrymandered” redistricting dictate who our next President will be!

    • idamag

      Nancy, I have noticed.

    • jvaljon1

      That’s one of the things that, yes, has got to go—but gerrymandering works BOTH WAYS. It did and still does, for the Democrats. We will finish getting rid of these a$$holes that we allowed into our Congress in 2010, by NOT VOTING AGAINST THEM—this time, 2012, we voted, and so we’re more than halfway to changing the Congress’ current party. It takes an uncaring public to let pigs in—by the time they start to care, the damage is done, and all that can be done is to REPAIR IT.

      Elections are America’s Repair Bill. This has come due for Republicans in such a major way that most of them can’t begin to fathom what an informed and angry electorate such as this one has become, can–and will—do to them, next time around.

  • Sand_Cat

    Another lost reply.

  • onedonewong

    The only country in Europe that enforced austerity was Germany. They reduced the size of the payment as well as duration and low and behold unemployment went down surprise surprise…As for the US debt let the messiah work his Magic like what he did to GM and Chrysler. Just confiscate the $$ and give it to the unions. He could do the same thing and tell China and Japan and federal employees tough

  • rustacus21

    Common wisdom dictates that EVERY American assume that conservatives are intent on the destruction of the institution of American Democracy. Understanding this, why would the Obama administration & the Democratic/Independent Senate majority continue playing footsie w/a confederacy America-haters? Looking at budget negotiations, gun reform imperatives, environmental, business & job legislation initiatives, their ONLY concern is protecting the rich from American law, regulation & citizenship responsibilities/obligations. The real point here is not why the administration, but rather, why the nations Liberal/Progressive/Moderate socio/political majority continue crippling itself, by allowing the nation to be destroyed from w/in? The entirety of the nation & worlds current crisis’ can be directly traced back to 12/11/00. There are no guarantee’s, but absent only a handful of the insane blunders of the 2001-2009 no-name administration, we are then solvent if only by the absence of rich-only tax cuts & 2 wars that cost the nation close to $15 trillion dollars. FIFTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS! Think of what that money could have paid for here & abroad, in helping Afghanistan modernize (as was carrying forward in 2000-2001), Egypt, North/South Korea’s, Israeli/Palestine peace initiatives completion, Iraq (w/the anticipated Democratization initiative of 1999 forward), the money NOT spent on war, but instead on the Environment, Public Education, health care & the like & growing an enlarged American Democracy infrastructure that would guarantee either incorporation or complete isolation of America’s fanatical fundamentalist, to/from American society, the savings & investments realized are unimaginable now, in this chaotic age of purposeful Middle-Class destitution & working poor, elderly, veterans & the infirmed economic horrors designed to pit American’s 1 against the other, while the 1% laugh all the way to the bank…

  • rockin_the_bay_in_Tampa

    How did these crazy people ever get into office in the 1st place? Some crazy people HAD to have elected them. Now we pay the piper! They obviously don’t give a rat’s ass about any one if they are even thinking about toying with the world economy. Maybe that is what it is going to take to kick them in their long asses to jar the jug heads back from their coma. This country has been in decline for almost 30 years, ever since Ronnie boy blew the Star Wars defense system, back in the 80’s, then Daddy Bush had his fun with Desert Storm which turned into Desert Dust, not to mention, “W” and his fun in Iraq, which did nothing but blow the national debt into outer space. Now, these stupid silly people want MORE military spending and LESS social spending/programs? This country won’t be fit to live in. We will only have part time, low wage “service” jobs, no health care, no clean water/air, food will be poisoned, the old and the poor will just have to starve in the street…too bad!

    God! You could shake them until their teeth rattle!

    • idamag

      rockin, I wonder if this is payback for treating education so shoddy.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/ZEDCQ4URHFFCKH5THB4DT3G54M Brian

    I’m still puzzled by the term “Republican leadership.”

    • idamag

      good one, Brian.

  • bchrista

    You Know I just read a very disturbing artical by a group of CEO from Las Vegas and other parts of the country, to start with they are asking for the retirement age for medicare be raised to 70yrs old I guess they will soon reach the right number before people die and can’t collect their retirement check and as far as Social Security they want to divide into two or three sections so they can destroy it, what pissess me off is the people that want to direct our lives areset for life they have more money than they will ever need we are talking about people that get bonuses in the Hundreds of millions every year and they are complaining about people like me who collects a check every month as the only means of support and from time to time gets a raise of maybe three hundred dollars a year thats equal don’t you think I get 300. and they get 100 million, All the fuck I ask is put the money you stole from us plus the interests and then leave the fund alone and we’ll make out and while yur at it quit blaming us for the deficit Social Security doesn’t draw a dime out of your budget., if you had put our money back we wouldn’t even takling about this subject, Congress nearly bankrupted us and now they are blaming us for the massage drain on the deficit. People I’m a pretty easy going guy but if the time I have to rebel against this abusive government if I’m alive I’m ready there’s only so much the people can take befor we go after the ones that are causing us pain. These people have played the system for so long that they think that it’s legal what they are doing to us but remember the chickens must come to roost one dayand all the money in the world will not save you the streets will run red with blood before we surrender to those who are trying to oppress us, you have taken our honor, our respect, and our dignity there’s not left to take heed my words this country revolted once before and it can happen again.

    • idamag

      Social Security does not add to the deficit. It is a bill that congress owes for borrowing the money to finance a war. They are trying to get out of paying it back and corporations are salivating to get their hands on the money left in the trust fund.

  • bchrista

    Gentlemen, who is the Comander in Chief of the Armed forces?, thats right the President of the United States and who do the Armed Forces Obey, that’s right the Presdent of the United States now if a dire emergency existed who would the Armed Forces obey then if push came to shove I would ask the President to declare marshall law and have them arrest the members of the Congress and remove and hold a special election and replace them with people who have the interests of the country first and foremost and the Teaparty and all the rest of those bastards who have been running the country in the ground would have a choice they can stay and work for a fruitful country for all Americans or they can go to whatever country they have been stashing their ill gained goods and to all those that have been supporting these Obstructionist if they don’t like it form your own Nina,Pinta and Santa Maria and follow them TP sons of a bitches were ever they want to go, We must take back our country right now we are obeying the people we elected to protect our interests and they now rule over us they have taken over the country, it’s quite evident that the election doesn’t mean a thing to them, they are still acting as if they won the election. People things are not going to get any better and by the time the other half of the country come to their senses it will be too late. At this very moment there is a Senator laying out plans on how to rig the electoral college so that they can get the results they want just like the representatives who gerry mandered their state so that they would be reelected even though the Democrats won the election by a landslide the Republicans retained their seats in Congress the time is running out on us.

  • Jean Crawford

    Yes, I agree, let the gop be the first to bump against it and then just for effect as they are very hard-headed, let them directly bump it again and again, perhaps then……

  • bchrista

    Guys to start with you’ve got to ignore that asshole Lana Ward if you pay attention to what she is posting, it never changes because either she is pulling your leg orshe’s so fucking stupid she doesn’t know any better and that’s why she keeps repeating the same thing that omusilin is a commie and supports al quada so if no one replies to her she will eventually go away if she can’t rile you she get bored and go away. Now back to the problems we were discussing several people have mentioned that if a new debt limit isn’t passed no body gets paid and you are right people like me that depend on our SS check every month will be hurting I live from check to check my rent my food bill my car insurance all my bills and no check would put me in a bind I mean I paid in for 60 yrs so I would something to fall back on but the person were stating the Repubs wouldn’t get a payday either, has any during your posting ever stop and think your are talking about assholes that have been selling their souls to the Devil for many yearsand have had a chance to accumilate great wealth, these greedy bastards are bitching about missing a 900 dollar raise meanwhile if you checked you probably find some very substantual savings banked overseas or invested either here or overseas they can miss several 6 figure checks and not miss a lick and even though they are trying to undermine Social Security and Medicare once they retire they go and collect SSchecks rifgt now there are millions of people collecting SS checks that have substantial size bank accounts I mean large figure savings that’s a problem that’s hurting SS recepiants because we are bunched together, for instance I have 0 money in the bank the next guy in line after me could have several 100,000 dollars plus own some property so when the Republicans says Social Security should be cut they are not looking at people like me they are looking at the affliuent person receiving Social Security Checks I agree that Social Security needs a look and an over haul must be done. Although the law states that everyone must pay their share into the fund there should be a screening as to who really needs to be collecting checks. Lets be fair if you have several hundred thousand dollars in the bank and own rentable property and in some case also collecting a pension from a companyto file for Social Security checks. I wouldn’t do it. the check would only woek to put me in a higher tax bracket and who needs that.

  • bchrista

    As Beau10 quoted pogo ” WE HAVE MET THE ENEMY AND THE ENEMY IS US,” you see we have been a little lazy but more trusting in allowing the people that we elected to pull the wool over our eyes and by the time we woke up the horse had been let out of the barn and now we find that to get him back in we have a major fight on our hands and if we don’t persevere we will lose everything and we can’t allow that. We must take back our country at all costs, the buck stops here.

  • Happy2bback

    Okay so now we will be reduced to becoming lab rats that they want to experiment on.

  • http://www.facebook.com/jerry.beck.9659 Jerry Beck

    The wingers of the GOP are out to prove the dooms day preppers right. I know that the GOP has voices of reason,let them speak out or watch this counrty and their party fail.

  • billbear1961

    Terrific article!

    Put up or shut up, fat-mouthed Republican FRAUDS!

    I’m so SICK of the hateful, two-faced PARASITES sitting in self-righteous judgment of everyone else!

  • bchrista

    The problem I have in agreeing with Domnick when he says we all must make sacrifices is WE the people on Social Security are already one of the lowest group on the scale of finances, and WE the people did not cause the deficit because Social Security is not part of the budget, WE the people paid into the Social Security fund for many,many years (I personally paid into the fund for 65yrs) and Medicare and I don’t remember anyone coming to me and saying here’s some money I will pay your Social Security debt for this month yet you can’t read anything about the deficit without Social Security being mentioned in the same breath. It must be cut, reduce the amount of our yearly raise and all leadying to the fact that they want to privatize it so they can steal the money which they are doing anyway by leaving IOUs with no intention of reclaming them. It is emoral what these mother-fuckers are planning to take the little bit I get to keep me alive and the sonsof a bitches got millions and still not satisfied, after they run us in the ground who is next and when they have all the money cornered who do they go after each other you know greed has no bottom

  • bchrista

    The CEOs in the Idaho paper is refering to the CEOs of the Casinos in Las Vegas ain’t this a bitch here you have these guys raking in millions of dollars and they feel that we need to be older in order to collect what is rightfully ours, yes they have a picture of that fat ass bastard that announces on TV that they won’t let you play if you can’t afford it, I guess Las Vegas wants part of the action on SS, what next we are being assualted from all sides. I worked all my life and paid my dues and now someone I don’t know or never met wants to run my life in my waning years the people in this country better wake up or one day there wont be any country to call their own and that goes for all those rednecks in the South when they don’t need you anymore down the road you will go with a swift kick in the ass these motherless bastards have no remorse or feeling for anything except what did you do for me today and their pockets.

  • bchrista

    You know Lana Ward just showed how stupid she really is on this page, she said and I quote omus

  • bchrista

    I will try again Lana Ward just showed how stupid she really is, she said on this page and I quote “omuslin keeps sending billions overseas and the congress keeps spending millions on worthless projects and then she rambles in another comment about all our money is going out by the billions and thats why we are in financial trouble, this person speaks in double negatives and steps over her own lines so that no one can make heads or tails of what shes talking about, I wish you guys luck in trying to exchange a sensible list of points with her. I’m gone!!!!!! tata

  • sleeprn01

    I absolutely love the idea, can we start making those dollar for dollar cuts tomorrow. We can start with Oklahoma then we can move to Alabama, Mississippi, and Louisiana; that should come very close to balancing the debt that the GOP ran up.

  • http://www.facebook.com/velkind Victor Elkind

    “solely for the purpose of enforcing an extreme austerity regime”

    LMFAO … how can you take this seriously??

  • http://www.facebook.com/carmen.renaldyiii Carmen Renaldy III

    What a bunch of yapping losers you liberals are. With the amount of people on food stamps and disability, the unemployment benefits extended into the future, a national healthcare plan, how is this spending going to help an already broke nation? You are all delusional thinking that we are going to slowing recover. Instead of your hyper bigoted fear of people making money, and allowing people who arrived to our country illegally have the benefits of those who worked to build our country legally, you would think you would look at the situation intead of always attacking thos you don’t agree with.
    We are doomed and you are bringing it on!

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/7UBML3AGKJI63N6GFDO4O4MLDE Lester

    Our ignorance, the product of a failed educational system and our arrogance, the result of our full acceptance of American Exceptionalism will be our downfall as a democratic society. A large segment of our population have lost the ability of separating facts from the fiction that feeds their prejudices. They have turned their thinking over to commercial talking heads that appeal to the lowest common denominator among our society and preach of the goodness of the common man, from which they are not. Our belief of Amercian Exceptionalism has caused us to ignore solutions to our problems that have been proved successful simply because they were not originated in America.

    Our ignorance and arrogance have made socialism and unionism into dirty words. Yet these are the same movements that created an American middle class which made us the envy of the world and the power we are now. We have turned to capitalism for the answer to our problems only to fail to realize that capitalism is the cause of a lot of our problems.
    Public health clinics and hospitals once provide free vaccinations as a matter of public health, government protecting its citizen from a common enemy; disease. Government built sewer systems , dams, bridges and highway systems that benefited us all. Provide electricity to rural America though industry found it unprofitable.

    We must change or this great experiment will come to an end. The United States of America will find itself next to the Soviet Union as just another failed experiment in government.

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