By Jason Sattler

Geithner: We’ll Hit The Debt Limit Monday, ‘Extraordinary Measures’ Needed

December 26, 2012 5:24 pm Category: Memo Pad, Politics 66 Comments A+ / A-
Geithner: We’ll Hit The Debt Limit Monday, ‘Extraordinary Measures’ Needed

Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner sent a letter to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid Wednesday, explaining that the U.S. will hit the statutory debt limit on December 31 unless Congress acts.

Geithner said “extraordinary measures” could give the government $200 billion in leeway that would allow the government to pay its bills until around March. If we go over the so-called “fiscal cliff,” that would allow even more breathing room, as tax breaks expire and automatic spending cuts would go into effect — despite the contraction it might trigger on the economy as a whole.

MSNBC’s Steve Benen compared Geithner’s warning to the gas dashboard light coming on.

Raising the debt limit gives the Secretary of the Treasury the authority to go further into debt to pay bills that are entirely the result of bills passed by Congress.

In 2011, Republicans held the debt limit hostage for spending cuts for the first time in American history. In the week before a deal could be made, which led to much of our current “fiscal cliff” situation, the stock market erased 6 months of gains.

The president has said that he will not go down this same path.

Whether this means that he’s willing to invoke the 14 th amendment — which reads, “The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payments of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion shall not be questioned” — is unclear.

President Bill Clinton said in 2011 that he would do just that and force the GOP to take him to court.

So 2013 begins with a GOP’s strategy of obstruction yielding ever more completely avoidable crises.

Photo credit: AP Photo/Jim Cole

Geithner: We’ll Hit The Debt Limit Monday, ‘Extraordinary Measures’ Needed Reviewed by on . Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner sent a letter to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid Wednesday, explaining that the U.S. will hit the statutory debt limit on Dece Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner sent a letter to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid Wednesday, explaining that the U.S. will hit the statutory debt limit on Dece Rating:

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  • charleo1

    Some estimates put the cost of the last debt ceiling standoff at 18.5 billion dollars. That no doubt
    included the hit to consumer confidence just beginning to find some courage after the great housing, and credit bubble collapse of ’08. What is clear is, one cannot sell the doomsday fear
    mongering over the national debt, with an economy adding jobs, and housing starting to rebound.
    So, the T-Party will have us lurching from one completely avoidable crisis to the next, as they have
    done since their arrival in Washington. The crisis we need to create is the crisis that ends the
    T-Party’s reign of economic terrorism on our economy, jobs, and businesses! And, a return of
    sanity, and common sense. Where the Country is never intentionally placed in jeopardy to force
    compliance to a rigid ideology. That’s outrageous behavior! And must not be tolerated again!

    • nobsartist

      The best way to do that is to throw the koch brothers in prison where they belong.

      • charleo1

        I don’t think it’s a good idea to imprison Americans for doing that which the law deems
        legal. What we must do is change the law which equates money with free speech, and
        views corporations as people, and once again answer the question of who’s really running
        this Country today. That’s what this tax argument is really all about. It’s not if the, “Job
        Creators,” can pay an additional 4.5%, and still create jobs. That’s ridiculous! They did
        before, when the taxes were 90% at the top levels, and still made plenty of profits. It’s
        about whether anyone in this Country can still require them to pay taxes at all. It’s about
        who owns the franchise of democracy. Can they be regulated, or made to behave in more
        responsible ways? Or, will the practice of hiring a group of attorneys to write the specific
        legislation, and having that carted up to bought, and paid for politicians, and enacted into law, is to be the way our Country is run from now on. It really is that simple, when one clears away all the clatter.

        • nobsartist

          You are right. It is legal to thumb your nose at laws today. Just look at the bush crime family.

          I do think it is treasonous to demand that abortion laws, birth control laws and civil rights laws be ignored and challenged.

          I believe that the kochs should receive worse than prison, I just suggested prison as a more civil way of dealing with those assholes.

          • charleo1

            Well, as you probably know the Republican Party is a cobbled together coalition, of
            which the religious righties are a part. They basically ask nothing of the Party outside
            of overturning Roe V. Wade, incorporate some anti gay rhetoric in their platform,
            along with advocating public funding for religious institutions. In effect, joining Church
            with State, as long as Christianity is established as the religion. Constitution be damned.
            This all accounts for about as many losses of votes, due to some very strange assertions concerning birth control, and rape, as defined by Federal Law, qualifying said victim for public help in obtaining an abortion. But these tend to be one issue voters. They leave
            monetary, and tax policy alone. Going along with whatever other factions of the coalition
            demand there. The Koch Brothers, with their anti union, anti environmental agenda.
            Lowering wages, foisting retirement plans onto the Government. The usual corporate
            screwing of the general public. Creating billions in public debt, while complaining about
            the public debt. Fanning another McCarthy Communist scare, while enriching the Chinese,
            and other Communist Governments around the world. And as usual, depending on their
            constituency to be dumb as fence posts, and blind as bats. But again, all the corporate,
            mucking around, is totally legal. And makes a mockery out of a good percentage of our
            political process today.

          • nobsartist

            Excellent.

  • Scott Mansker

    Just another opportunity for the Tea Party to be outmaneuvered politically by President Obama. Bring on the platinum coin if that’s where they want to take this. The 14th amendment is a far more lethal weapon than the manufacturing of a debt ceiling.

  • http://mohammeddressup.com/ I Zheet M’Drawz

    Just in case we hit the rocks at the bottom of the cliff you might do yourself a favor & have some silver & gold to back you up.

    The dollar could suddenly become worth nothing overnight the way these clowns are acting.

    If we do go over the fiscal cliff can we start the process to remove members of Congress? Maybe even charge them with violating thie oath of office?

    • idamag

      IZheet, We had a president who was immature. I won’t mention names. He had a cabinet and vice president who were not nice people. $$$$ blinded them and they could lead the president around by the nose. Their greed tanked the country. A few people started speaking out and formed what they called the “tea party.” Soon the tea party was infiltrated by anti-government people. And, when the unthinkable happened, a Black man was elected president, the tea party was infiltrated by racists. Then the Koch brothers started pouring money into this mess of a tea party. With enough money they even replaced good Republican legislators with whack tea party people. Our government cannot function if it has too many anti-government people trying to destroy it from within.

  • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

    What is it going to take before our elected officials have the courage to explain to the American people that we must choose between paying for what we need and benefit from and doing without? There are consequences to our refusal to pay higher taxes, the most obvious include not being able to pay for the most powerful military in the world, engaging in foreign wars, paying for social programs, unemployment benefits, the best air traffic control system in the world, intelligence agencies, diplomats, the Center for Disease Control, border patrol, customs officials, food and drug inspectors, teachers, librarians, law enforcement officers and all the other civil servants upon whose services we depend to keep us safe, healthy, and prosperous.
    We need to increase revenues and eliminate wasteful spending to reduce our budget deficits, our dependence on borrowed money, and the subsequent accumulation of debt. Bandaids are not going to do the trick, we need long term solutions and those solutions include sacrifices at all levels of our society.

    • old_blu

      I absolutely agree with you Dominick, I know it cost money to run a country and I’m glad to pay what I should, and I think everyone should be glad to pay their share also.(Including the top 2%)

      • ObozoMustGo

        It’s my boy Blu! How are your Blu? I hope you are well.

        Regarding this constant mantra for “paying their fair share”….. 90% of the taxes are paid by only 27% of the people. What exactly is fair about a system that everyone benefits from but places the burden of payment for that system on only a few? Tell me what exactly is my “fair share”?

        Merry Christmas, Blu!

        As William Voegeli put it in Never Enough: America’s Limitless Welfare State, “Liberals don’t want the government to grow indefinitely. They just want it to be bigger than it is right now. The corollary of this stance is liberals’ refusal even to entertain questions on the dimensions of a welfare state that is exactly the right size.”

        • old_blu

          Hey Bozo, I hope you had a good Christmas and I hope your New Year is good also, I’m not sure what everyone’s “fair share” would be, but I read the other day where someone was only paying 1.1 percent in federal income tax compared to my 28 percent dosen’t seem fair.

          BTW I’m glad I don’t have to figure out who should pay what. : ))

          • ObozoMustGo

            It’s my boy, BLU!!!! I notice this interchange you guys on the left like to make between effective tax rates and the rates others pay. There’s a reason, Blu, that some people pay less of a rate. There income comes from investments, which SHOULD be taxed lower than income. What you guys probably don’t know is that investments that don’t incur any taxes happen to be things like certain government bonds. You lefties love government bonds, don’t you? What if some rich guy buys all government bonds so he pays no taxes? Does that make you mad? Just curious. Besides, Blu, it’s not the rate that matters so much as the actual dollars that matter.

            Merry Christmas, Blu!

            “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation…
            One is by sword…
            The other is by debt.”
            John Adams 1826

        • Sand_Cat

          @ObozoMustGo
          Not that your incoherent babbling deserves an answer, but it could be that the poor, unfortunate 27% you cite get more than 27% of the income, and control WAY more of the total assets in the country. In other words, either you’re a SUCKER passing on propaganda created to benefit someone else at your expense, or you’re a LIAR deliberately omitting relevant facts.

          But most of all, you’re a useless IDIOT!

          Happy new yer to you!

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/ZJ5BBSQIGTUMERPZFALES6HQNY Bill

            I was going to reply to Bozo the Idiot but your answer was more in the line of what I would have said. This is the typical Fox not really the News response the high income people pay a high % of the taxes (that’s dollars not rate). People like Romney, Hedge Fund managers and Private Equity managers pay a low effective tax rate due to their abilty to have a vast majority of their income come from dividends, interest payments and capital gains that are taxed at 15% regardless of how much was earned. There is also a nice deal called “carried interest” that allow some of these managers to claim fees earned as “carried interest” that is also taxed at 15%. I’, sure Bozo isn’t in this group.

            Comparing how much the high earners pay in taxes without also showing the % of total income earned by these same people. It is also disproportionately high.

            Bozo keep fighting for the ultra wealthy and some day you can park and wash their cars.

          • ObozoMustGo

            WOW!!! You are almost as stupid as Fern Woodfork. Did you not read my post? 27% of people pay 90% of the taxes. What part of that do you NOT understand, you idiot? And no one actually “controls all the wealth” you moron. Dude, you are one super stupid fool. Can’t even read English and understand what you read.

            Merry Christmas, and remain oblivious!

            “The difference between being stupid and being a fool: A stupid person at least has an idea about their own inadequacies. The fool is oblivious to them, and is more inclined to believe their own fantasies and lies as truth.” – ObozoMustGo

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/RFEPMKNCBVGJYV2X7LBNDGRUEY William

            I guess that makes you a self confessed fool.

        • WhutHeSaid

          The correct answer to your question is this: We will know when we are on the correct path when both bigots and deadbeats are squealing loudly. You aren’t squealing loudly enough yet, so we need to do more — just like your hero Ronald Reagan, who raised taxes 11 times and supported gun control.

        • 13observer

          you can’t help these people……………… they are addicted to Odumba’s welfare handouts he traded for their votes (souls). The “Prince of Poverty” or “Santa’s Helper” is like a drug dealer to them……….. always feeding their habit!

          • ObozoMustGo

            right on about that, 13. Once dependent, it’s nearly impossible to get them to see what’s been done to them. The game isn’t over yet, but it’s check mate at this point.

            Merry Christmas!

            “The task of weaning various people and groups from the national nipple will not be easy. The sound of whines, bawls, screams and invective will fill the air as the agony of withdrawal pangs finds voice.” — Linda Bowles

          • 13observer

            Merry Christmas to you too! ……….and have a Happy New Year as well!

        • dtgraham

          I think your numbers must be off Obozo. U.S. government stats show the top 20% of people paying 63.1% of total taxes. They had 59.6% of total income. The next 20% of people paid 19.0% of total taxes based on an 18.7% share of total income. That’s 82.1% of total taxes paid by the top 40% of earners, which was based on them making 78.3% of total income. The top 27% would have clocked in at around 69-70% of total taxes paid based on earning roughly 66-67% of total income.

          • ObozoMustGo

            dt… while your numbers are correct in one sense, they are wrong because they are cited based only upon TAXPAYERS. There is a massive number of Americans that are NOT taxpayers. My numbers cite ALL Americans, not just taxpayers. Since ALL Americans benefit from government functions like defense, it is fair to cite that only 27% of ALL Americans pay 90% of the taxes. Thanks for the opportunity to clarify this to a Canadian. :-)

            I’m missing NHL hockey a lot. Bet you are too.

            Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, dt!

            “Don’t let schooling interfere with your education.” – Mark Twain

          • dtgraham

            Nope, I went back to have a second look at it and they were talking about everyone; whatever your status. Total income started at the $13,000.00 mark and they really meant total taxes paid. That was defined as income taxes, payroll taxes, state and local taxes, federal and state excise taxes, and local property taxes.

            I just recently saw a pie chart on the “not taxpayers” thing, meaning federal taxes I presume. About 61% of people not paying federal taxes are paying payroll taxes. They’re employed but don’t make enough to qualify under the present tax structure. Another 22% are retired. The rest are unemployed or disabled or other factors.

            Are you watching the world junior hockey championships from Russia? The U.S.A. has iced a lot of great junior teams over the last 10 years. They blew out Germany and could easily have beaten Russia. They lost 2-1 today and really beat themselves. They’ve got a tremendous transition game and dominated the last 12 minutes. Goaltender John Gibson will be a Vezina type goalie in the NHL one day. I’ve often thought that most Americans have no idea what an international superpower their nation is in hockey, at every level. I know you know.

      • sigrid28

        Me, too. Blue, I miss Fern. Where is she?

        • old_blu

          I don’t know, I miss her too.

          • ObozoMustGo

            It’s my boy, Blu! Come on Blu… Fern has got to be the lowest IQ moron on this site…. and that’s saying something around here. Really, that women is a stone cold idiot. Maybe you miss her because of the comedy she provides. Like the utter disbelief that anyone could think like her and not wander out into traffic on a daily basis. Maybe that’s way you mean.

            Merry Christmas, my boy BLU!!!!

            “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation…
            One is by sword…
            The other is by debt.”
            John Adams 1826

          • old_blu

            Ah, come on Bozo, I like fern, I would even miss you if you were gone.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/RFEPMKNCBVGJYV2X7LBNDGRUEY William

            I wouldn’t.

          • ObozoMustGo

            It’s my boy, BLU!! What up Blu?

            Thanks Blu. I’d miss you, too.

            Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, Blu!

            “Politicians are like diapers; they need to be changed often and for the same reason.” ― Mark Twain.

          • old_blu

            You and Mark Twain are absolutely right about that Bozo, and thanks for the morning smile.

          • nobsartist

            We must all feel sympathy towards your taking the award for the lowest I.Q. and worse judgement.

            After all, you wasted your votes on AWOL coke heads and liars in business with the chinese.

      • 13observer

        Only in America where the wealthy who pay 86% of the taxes overall are repeatedly asked to pay their “fair share” by those who pay no taxes at all!!!!!!!! Aint that a hoot????? “I want my free cell phone and my “(not) earned income tax credit”.

        • charleo1

          The earned income tax credit was a Republican cut in taxes for the poor.
          So naturally, they could be paid less, and the government would take up
          the slack for the big money moochers. Now they are griping they are the
          only tax payers. Boo hoo. They are the only ones with the money. And
          they want our sympathy too.

    • elw

      I agree with you 100%, but we have yet to have a President with the “stones” to do it. Even if we did the media makes so much noise, most people do not know what or who to believe.

    • nobsartist

      Why is the person who created the problem the solution? Geithner was put in by bush and should be fired.

      • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

        Tim Geithner was nominated for Secretary of the Treasury by President Obama. Before that, he was President of the Federal Reserve.
        President Bush’s Secretary of the Treasury was Hank Paulsson, the man that gave us the TARP (bank bailout).

        • nobsartist

          So Geithner was President of the Federal Reserve under bush.

    • ObozoMustGo

      Dommy… while it is quite unusual that you and I agree, we do on this one in general, but diverge on you point that we have a revenue problem. We DO NOT have a revenue problem. The fact is that we have a spending problem like cocaine addicts have cocaine problems. Why would you propose to give the cocaine addict more cocaine in order to alleviate him of his addiction? You’re proposing the same thing by suggesting we give Washington DC more money. The reason we are in this mess is because for nearly 80 years we have had politicians who spent tomorrow’s tax dollars for today’s benefits (read votes).

      One final point. You leftist freaks ALWAYS confuse the role of local or state government with that of the federal government. The Feds should have NOTHING to do with you local police or school or ambulance or fire or local roads etc. etc. etc. Why take the money from you locally to send to Washington so they can siphon off 80 cents of every dollar just to give you 20 cents back? It’s madness. But you leftist freaks have this starry-eyed Utopian view of a large controlling centralized government that rules over all aspects of life to achieve so-called “fairness” and “equality”, regardless of how such ideas impact individual freedom and liberty. And this is absolutely related to freedom and liberty. After all, if I must work 50% of my time for government at all levels, am I not enslaved 50% of the time? Especially if my refusal results in my imprisonment?

      The fact is that we do not have revenue problem. 27% of Americans pay 90% of all taxes. What is fair about that? Do you think that adding another 5% to the burden of a small number of Americans is going to all of a sudden make Washington DC responsible? As Einstein said, doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is insanity.

      Merry Christmas, Dommy!

      “There is all the difference in the world, however, between two kinds of assistance through government that seem superficially similar: first, 90 percent of us agreeing to impose taxes on ourselves in order to help the bottom 10 percent, and second, 80 percent voting to impose taxes on the top 10 percent to help the bottom 10 percent — William Graham Sumner’s famous example of B and C decided what D shall do for A. The first may be wise or unwise, an effective or ineffective way to help the disadvantaged — but it is consistent with belief in both equality of opportunity and liberty. The second seeks equality of outcome and is entirely antithetical to liberty.” – Milton Friedman

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/ZJ5BBSQIGTUMERPZFALES6HQNY Bill

        Bozo as usual you make up some fact. The states send the Federal Tax money to the Federal Gov’t and then a good deal of this money is sent back to the states. The odd part of your argument is that more RED states get more money back from the Federal Gov’t than they send to it. More BLUE states do the opposite.

        Yoou are just a lackey and tool for these wealthy people who couldn’t care less about you or your simple little life. The states that have the most people paying little or no taxes reside in RED states, those same states that voted for Mitt (I really didn’t want to run for President) Romney. Saying we have only a spending problem is being over simplistic but then why would I expect anything complex from Bozo the Idiot.

      • WhutHeSaid

        Why is it that you lying right-wing bigots always CLAIM to be against spending? We know the truth: In the last 30 years, ALL Republican Presidents increased federal spending at a higher rate than ALL Democratic ones. GOP Presidents are the undisputed kings of runaway federal spending — especially Reagan, who also increased taxes 11 times!

      • charleo1

        It’s completely understandable that a person who has no respect for the democratic
        process, would conflate the monies spent to defeat fascism, or put man on the moon, promote, and safeguard the institutions of freedom, and democracy around the world, as a harmful drug. Or see the Government, the world’s first of it’s kind, as a back ally, addict. Incapable of discharging it’s duty. Unworthy of your support. Fine.
        Then, perhaps you would agree it’s better we drown the addict, than pay for such a
        governing body? Which also means you say what government you would support?
        It is more than just opposing a thing. It is supporting the next thing that will
        stanch the crying over a perceived intrusion of your precious freedom to pay nothing. This yet to be magic contraption of your nihilist dreams would ask what
        from you? Whatever you want to contribute? Like the Salvation Army? You want
        to be left alone, to enjoy your birthright, purchased with what? Tax cuts for
        tycoons? Taxes levied then on the earnings of the working class? Or just no taxes
        at all? Or a government that is only a funding arm of the military, that expedites
        the wishes of the corporate, and creates a structure of fifty loosely connected
        Country States, with fifty different sets of laws. Each one more generous than the
        next to the corporate structure that dwarfs all else? Is that what you want?
        If you were a soldier, would you fight, and die for that? Is there anything you believe
        in? Anything, you hold as more important than yourself not being required to contribute a dime to the society in which you live?

        • ObozoMustGo

          Typical leftist freak summary. I haven’t read all 15 replies I’ve gotten yet, but I would be willing to bet most, if not all, fall along the same line of thinking: That if someone opposes a large central government addicted to debt and spending, that must mean that they oppose all government. This is your effed up and clouded thinking, not mine. I have said this at least 100 times in these pages that the real debate is over what the proper role of the federal government is in our nation. Not that it has no role. And so you know, we actually have a Constitution that defines that role. I am aware that leftists do not like that Constitution, but it’s the one we have. Unfortunately, since the days of FDR and his packing the court, our Constitution has been under constant assault as our liberties and freedoms are further restricted in direct correlation to the growth in the welfare state. And we are nearing the end game on that growth in the welfare state and our ability to pay for it. One way or the other, either by choice or by force of the markets, the spending problem will be addressed and programs will be eliminated. I’d rather it be done by choice with a rational adult conversation. Doesn’t appear that it’s likely to be with Obozo, Reid, and Boner running the show.

          Merry Christmas!

          “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation…
          One is by sword…
          The other is by debt.”
          John Adams 1826

          • charleo1

            Talk about typical, yours is as full of Right wing claptrap as the rest. Who is really creating
            the debt? Lazy American Liberals, or the faction that has sold out their own Country, for
            cheap gun to the head, Communist labor? What does the Constitution say about that?
            That we’re all Communists now? If we need a doctor, we can use the same one they have
            to pay for over in China? Why? Because all those pricy programs have just got to go! For
            our collective freedom, of course! Who is, “effed up,” in their thinking? You don’t have
            the mental capacity to realize when you’re being screwed. Why don’t you entertain the
            thought that maybe, a whole majority of people out there across the Country see something
            the crapola they are selling you as freedom, has clouded your thinking? What I see is a
            group that never appreciated the good things set on their table in the first place. Since
            most think they got that retirement they are enjoying, and the Medicare they love so much,
            because they were especially hard workers. Not like the bunch of loafers, and losers today.
            Right? It’s Bull. It’s a big crock of I’ve got mine Jack, I’ll be damed if I’ll pay for yours!
            Well, somebody had to fight for those wages, and some others warned about the loss of liberty that Medicare would inflict on the Country too. Same lying bastards that are pumping your handle today. Go ask your Grandpa if he would feel more liberated, more
            in keeping with old, and dead, John Adams, if he sent his Medicare card back. Tell him
            you’re tired of paying for his lazy liberalism.

          • ObozoMustGo

            Chas… you clearly have your head in the sand. How do you not think that SS and Medicare, and frankly the entire Federal apparatus, is NOT in financial trouble? What’s wrong with you? From your response, it’s easy to see what’s wrong with you. You believed the lies that were told you that it was possible for you or others to live off of the labor of their neighbor without consequences. You believed that robbing Peter to pay Paul economics was sound policy because it enabled you to live the lie. Sorry, Chas, it’s not true. The piper must ALWAYS be paid, and the piper is calling now, but the treasure chest is empty. It’s all been spent. On budget debt will be $16.4 TRILLION on Jan. 1, 2013. Off budget debt for SS and Medicare is estimated at $70 TRILLION. I hate to inform you because I get the feeling you’re one of those living off of others under the lie, but the fact is that there is no lock box, there is no stash of money that’s been put away to pay your bills. It all comes from those of us who work every day. Those of us who have our own families to provide for are being told we must provide for others, too. And the more of you that live off the system, the more of my labor that must be confiscated so that you can continue to live the lie. Instead, what do you do? You demand that I pay for your living and then have the balls to call me greedy for wanting to keep the fruits of my own labor. How the hell does that work? Because you have a complicit media and a Marxist pig in the WH who stir you up into a frenzy about calling people who earn their money greedy for wanting to keep it. And it’s not grandpa who is enslaved with the program, it’s me, and 10’s of millions like me that pay everyone else’s free ride.

            Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

            “There is all the difference in the world, however, between two kinds of assistance through government that seem superficially similar: first, 90 percent of us agreeing to impose taxes on ourselves in order to help the bottom 10 percent, and second, 80 percent voting to impose taxes on the top 10 percent to help the bottom 10 percent — William Graham Sumner’s famous example of B and C decided what D shall do for A. The first may be wise or unwise, an effective or ineffective way to help the disadvantaged — but it is consistent with belief in both equality of opportunity and liberty. The second seeks equality of outcome and is entirely antithetical to liberty.” – Milton Friedman

          • FLYPAINT

            Both parties are liable. What no one seems to recognize is that
            we have been taking care of our own and have put into place a multitude of social programs. So much so that we have simply
            gone a bit to far. Please do not try to tell me that we are selfish in that respect. When it appeared we had the money
            both parties went along(it takes votes…right?) This has taken place over many years. Many Years! Not much different than a spoiled child, you can never give enough. Freedom is very important. What the uninformed people do not understand
            is as we head toward a more socialized system…the things they have now will become less… because ther will be no free people to pay for their benifits. There eventually will be no middle class. Only the Elite people– (OBOZO and PELOSI come to mind…and don’t forget about her husband and his tuna buissiness where she voted to keep the minimum wage
            down from the rest of the country where the buissiness operates thus saving them $$$$$$$ ,She Is A Jerk.)–
            and the rest of us! KEEP IT UP YOU DO GOODERS, WITH ALL THE WHINNING WE HERE FROM YOU NOW…I CAN NOT IMAGINE HOW YOU WILL ALL SOUND WHEN YOU GET WHAT YOU HAVE ASKED FOR

          • ObozoMustGo

            FLYPAINT…. I have only one thing to say to you……………. BRAVO!!!!! You get it. And you are correct, both parties have been liable. The DemonRATS have preferred fast forward into socialism since FDR, while the Repubs, for the most part, have preferred to slow roll it into socialism. They’ve been drunk on America’s success for so long they don’t recognize their own addiction.

            Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

            “Politicians are like diapers; they need to be changed often and for the same reason.” ― Mark Twain.

      • http://www.facebook.com/dominick.vila.1 Dominick Vila

        The adequacy of revenues depend on the level of outlays. Our current tax rates are too low to cover expenditures leaving three options: (1) Increase revenues to cover outlays, (2) reduce spending to match revenues, and (3) a combination of both.
        You believe the Federal government budget can be balanced by reducing spending. Fine, tell us what you would eliminate/reduce to accomplish that:
        Defense
        Social Security
        MEDICARE
        MEDICAID
        Interest on the debt
        State Department
        Treasury
        NASA/NOAA
        Intelligence agencies
        Border patrol, customs, food and drug inspectors, immigration officers.
        Air traffic control system
        Center for Disease Control
        This small sample account for over 90% of the budget. Have at it!

        • ObozoMustGo

          Dommy… what part of being $16.4 TRILLION in on budget debt are you missing? What part of being $70 TRILLION in off budget debt for unfunded liabilities are you missing? Do you just keep telling yourself that this problem will heal itself and magically go away? At what point do you face the facts that we don’t have the luxury of choice we used to have, but instead we must be in control of how we tear down this beast lest it happen automatically and without our control. The monster will consume itself at some point.

          To answer your question, you missed a good number of the other drains of taxpayer money, like OSHA, Dep’t of Ed, HUD, Agriculture, EPA, Dep’t of Energy, etc. etc., of which I would eliminate every one of them, or where needed, downsize them to no authority other than coordination among states, if needed. As to everything else, they all must be cut. No exceptions. The cupboard is bare, Dommy. If you had a child that ran his credit cards up, you’d be telling him the same thing. Time to bite the bullet.

          Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, Dommy!

          “Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program.” Milton Friedman, Good Reads

    • nobsartist

      I am just waiting for them to tell us how much money the CIA flushes down the toilet yearly and how much money AT&T has been paid to spy on us.

      Until someone mans up and divulges these budgets this is all just more horse shit.

  • clarenceswinney

    Great Gop achievements—

    Eisenhower initiated Interstate Highway
    Reagan signed Martin Luther King holiday
    Nixon signed affirmative action law
    Nixon initiated EPA
    Nixon initiated OSHA
    Bush created two wars, moral and economic collapse
    Ike was good–Ford was good–Bush I was good
    Reagan + Bush II were bad for America And the world–Unrestricted Gambling=Disaster
    Redistribution of Wealth & Income Upwards via 2500 Billion in Tax Cuts mostly for rich and increase by Spending and Borrowing.
    Created two awful illegal wars by invading two of most destitute -most unarmed nations on earth
    2500B Tax Cuts and borrowed 9000 Billion to pay for them and major increases in spending(80% Reagan + 65% Bush II). Clinton + 24%.
    Which party won every 20th Century War but one??

    Which President increased Total Stock Market Value by more than thrice all predecessors combined
    Which President never told the people a single lie on policy.
    Which President got more of his Legislation passed in first two years under a Democratic Congress than all but one President (LBJ).
    Which President released more secured documents than total of all preceding presidents?
    Which President implemented more anti-terrorism programs than any in history?
    Which President had, possibly, the most successful domestic record in history?
    answer below

    LORD WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON

  • 13observer

    Wow, the “POOR” may have to go without free cell phones, the unemployed might have to take those jobs back stolen by illegal aliens, and all the “FREE SHIT” Obama traded for votes, just might have to be compromised!!!!!!!!! As far as the border patrol goes…..well we are fighting a loosing battle……. just like gun control…..there is NO STOPPING IT!!!! As soon as the Mexicans have the political power, GOD will be back in schools and we will all be better for it because legal or illegal Mexican males love God and Guns and those are two things people will learn to respect!!!

    • charleo1

      Respectfully, I think it’s you we will all need to tolerate as one does a toddler at a funeral.
      Because, at this point it is impossible to fill a vessel with knowledge that is already brimming with something else. And the occasion is far too important, and sober to let the wailing, and fit throwing, deter the harder work of actually governing, and coming to consensus.
      A two year old, as any parent will tell you, can be a tyrant. The simple, singular demand of
      the one state enterprise of me. The capacity to recognize there is a limit to your abilities,
      or the probability you will be carried kicking and screaming to your room if your fit continues, has not yet occurred to you. But it will.

      • 13observer

        WASTED WORDS THAT HAVE NO MEANING!

        • neeceoooo

          Critical thinking is a quality the not everyone has, and you my friend, are sure lacking in that department.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/ZJ5BBSQIGTUMERPZFALES6HQNY Bill

      Prove your statements. Name one person that got free cellphones. What free shit did President Obama trade for votes and whom did he trade with? So you want to oppose the Founding Fathers in keeping religion separate from gov’t. You are such a twit. By the way which god are you trying to put in our schools, Jewish god, Muslim god, Hindu god or your christian god

      • 13observer

        The Father of Jesus Christ, the God of the Mexicans and Christians who will outnumber all the liberals in a short time and will put religion back in school and all public places! Besides, you liberals never cared much about our Constitution or religion anyway…… but thanks for helping to grow Christianity again in America through your supporting the Latinos in their quest to make religion a bigger part of your life forever!

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/UHE4MJP5FHMFIEAOGEQHETUGDQ Rvn_sgt6768

    The last debt debacle cost us (US) $18 Billion or about what the Boehner plan would have saved. Does this sound familiar? We want to cut waste and who wastes the most? This same scenario is enacted in most Republican led states. Try Fla. with their testing for drugs before being eligible for any aid. Over $100 million wasted to stop 4% of the applicants. We still feel the results of the ME first generation fostered by their hero Reagan. The single reason it is so easy to divide us (US) now.

  • nobsartist

    Thats too bad. I still have not seen the CIA’s “secret” budget and no one seems to want to tell us how much AT&T is paid to spy on all of us. Plus, cops are still retiring 2 or 3 times and when politicians leave office they are still allowed to work for companies that they gave “no bid” contracts to.

    Another problem is, there has been NO investigation into how it was we spent TRILLIONS on iraq and afgahnistan and nobody seems to care that we were lied into those debacles. NO one has investigated wall street crimes and the clueless bastards do not seem to be able to grasp the fact that if we had a jobs plan that created full employment and stopped all H1B visa’s, they would be collecting more tax revenue.

    GET A GRASP.

  • ObozoMustGo

    You mean to tell me that Tax Cheat Geithner has just figured out that we’re running out of money? How friggin brilliant that useful idiot is!!!!

    Guess what folks, we cannot continue spending TRILLIONS more each year than we take in. At some point, the spending needs to be radically cut. Sorry, but this is true. You’re big government gravy train must come to a stop. Hopefully, the Republicans will not give in to Obozo and will NOT raise the debt ceiling.

    Merry Christmas!

    There is no such thing as a free lunch.” – Milton Friedman, his book by that title

    • WhutHeSaid

      Then we must be on the correct path by voting Republicans out of office. Republicans are the kings of runaway federal spending. ALL Republican Presidents in the last 30 years increased federal spending at a greater rate than ALL Democratic ones. The runaway spending champion? Ronald Reagan. The lowest? Barack Obama.

      Oh yes — Reagan also raised taxes 11 times and supported gun control.

      • ObozoMustGo

        what… you ARE stuck on stupid, aren’t you? You keep making this silly claim about the “RATE” of spending as a means to deflect attention away from Obozo’s real spending. You are moron. We have addressed this. Spending must be taken into context in relation to debt to GDP ratio, annual growth in GDP, and growth in revenues to the government. When the economy is growing at 7%+, revenues to the government will grow naturally, and as revenues grow, so does spending unfortunately.

        So your little diatribe, oft repeated, is nothing more than a distortion of facts for covering Obozo’s outrageous and profligate spending habits.

        Merry Christmas!

        “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation…
        One is by sword…
        The other is by debt.”
        John Adams 1826

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_6FRFMASE7UDGFMWKQLXSUBIZOY Angel

    KEEPING IT THOUGHTFULLY HONEST: So let’s go “Over their Cliff” that all of politicians agreed to set up a few months ago! Cut everything since most of it has benefited a few special interests, not Middle Class Americans taxpayer that paid for most of it! So Boehner where are the JOBS as you asked during the Romney campaign? It is the responsibility of our National Press News to accurately on this “political hostage” issue? FACTCHECK who is conducting the republican clown show in House of Reps.? Publicly name each clown! Everyone is entitled to its own opinions but its own facts! But our Free Press and News needs to responsibly remind everyone including Boehner and his republican clowns of the results of this election. So where are the negotiations on the election issue of Government stimulus funding to facilitate more American new jobs growth for the middle class? THE INCONVENIENT TRUTH: The republican’s election issue of 10 years of the continued Bush tax cuts for billionaires and millionaires that significantly contributed to our national debt and created new jobs in Communist China lost! Fiscal Responsible Debt Reduction is secondary. The Ryan Plan was defeated- No voucher or cuts for Medicare and leave Social Security alone for now! This is not rocket science! That’s it! The National Press stop trying to be politically correct, but responsibly call out the republicans that their “hostage taking obstruction” to undermine our economy and intransigence’s on their unacceptable defeated policies will put them out of the political business! America’s middle Class is fed up with you irresponsible idiots with their years of class war on the American Middle Class! The majority of Americans have spoken so deal with the new reality! So where are the jobs?

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_SRF6YP2MHXVY4KTXM3WMOGZ5BA Jose T

    Congressional Pork Barrel Spending is alive and well in Washington!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZBIWKGJLZRDSUYO3Y5WGY4CJPE common sense1

    Obama should make that one trillion dollar coin with a portion of the new (taxes) that come in going toward the coin and beyond, paying down the national debt like Clinton did from all the jobs created, now is the time, but these Republican Congressmen are not going to work with Obama no matter what he does. They are still pissed off about the 13th admendment getting passed two hundred years ago. What was that Einstien said ” if you keep doing the same thing and it keeps failing, maybe your doing it wrong”. Hell that’s 200 years of mistakes, this is crawlin speed.
    Maybe our answer is to quit spoiling the do nothing Congress and make them work 48 hours a week like the rest os the people in our country, and they can weard blue jeans to. They won’t get them dirty either but they have to wear something. What would happen if a Chinaman got President, Our country would just plain stop. It was okay when that black man saved your ass on the battlefield, but help him run the country, come on, we all better than this.

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