By Cynthia Tucker

GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb

June 22, 2013 12:00 am Category: Memo Pad, Politics 801 Comments A+ / A-
GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb

A recent road trip took me into the precincts of rural Georgia and Florida, far away from the traffic jams, boutique coffeehouses and National Public Radio signals that frame my familiar landscape. Along the way, billboards reminded me that I was outside my natural habitat: anti-abortion declarations appeared every 40 or 50 miles.

“Pregnant? Your baby’s heart is already beating!” “Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you. — God.” And, with a photo of an adorable smiling baby, “My heart beat 18 days from conception.”

The slogans suggest a stirring compassion for women struggling with an unplanned pregnancy and a deep-seated moral aversion to pregnancy termination. But the morality and compassion have remarkably short attention spans, losing interest in those children once they are outside the womb.

These same stretches of Georgia and Florida, like conservative landscapes all over the country that want to roll back reproductive freedoms, are thick with voters who fight the social safety net that would assist children from less-affluent homes. Head Start, Medicaid and even food stamps are unpopular with those voters.

Through more than 25 years of writing about Roe vs. Wade and the politics that it spawned, I’ve never been able to wrap my head around the huge gap between anti-abortionists’ supposed devotion to fetuses and their animosity toward poor children once they are born. (Catholic theology at least embraces a “whole-life” ethic that works against both abortion and poverty, but Catholic bishops have seemed more upset lately about contraceptives than about the poor.) While many conservative voters explain their anti-abortion views as Bible-based, their Bibles seem to have edited out Jesus’ charity toward the less fortunate.

That brain-busting cognitive dissonance is also on full display in Washington, where just last week the GOP-dominated House of Representatives passed a bill that would outlaw all abortions after 20 weeks of pregnancy. After the bill was amended to make exceptions for a woman’s health or rape — if the victim reports the assault within 48 hours — U.S. Rep. Paul Broun (R-GA) withdrew his support. The exceptions made the bill too liberal for his politics.

Meanwhile, this same Republican Congress has insisted on cutting one of the nation’s premier food-assistance programs: the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP), or food stamps. GOP hardliners amended the farm bill wending its way through the legislative process to cut $2 billion from food stamps because, they believe, it now feeds too many people. Subsidies to big-farming operations, meanwhile, remained largely intact.

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GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb Reviewed by on . A recent road trip took me into the precincts of rural Georgia and Florida, far away from the traffic jams, boutique coffeehouses and National Public Radio sign A recent road trip took me into the precincts of rural Georgia and Florida, far away from the traffic jams, boutique coffeehouses and National Public Radio sign Rating:

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  • Robert P. Robertson

    Legislating morality has been a mantra of the Republicunt far-right for a long time. Since the neo-Confederate Tea Bag invasion of the Republicunt party, its a way of life. Their wacky, space-cadet analogies of conception and pregnancy gets weirder by the day. Just as the article said, as soon as women start to give birth and seek aide for the child, they turn on the woman and the child like a cobra, deny aide, cut programs that would provide aide, and then castigate women for having “so many” children. It’s an hypocrisy born in hell. . . They are not the ones who go through the uncertainty of a single mother, but they are the ones who are obstructing jobs and the ability of parents to provide for their children. They are not the ones whose daughters go through a horrific rape where a child is conceived and have to live through the constant memory of that inhumanity. . . Besides that reality, a woman’s body is her own, and it is her right to decide what she does with it. Considering the historical immorality of Republicunt/neo-Confederate Tea Bags, they should practice what they preach.

    • Independent1

      GOP legislators only know one thing – how to pander to whomever it is that will donate money to keep them in office. Therefore, they PRETEND to care about abortion and women’s reproductive rights, in order to win the votes of PRETEND Christians – who are really followers of a beliefs that are more akin to that of the Devil than of Jesus. They champion legislation that punishes women and children once they’re born, to pander to voters like the teabaggers who’s misguidedly believe austerity if the solution to everything, in order to win their votes too. And they vote for every piece of legislation that supports subsidies to Big Oil, Agri-business, Big Pharma and any other big voting block, just to win their votes. But note that they refuse to support legislation like Obama’s jobs bill, because the majority of the jobs the bill would create in
      modernizing schools, fixing the nations roads and bridges, fixing government buildings, etc., would generally be done by small local contracts with no guarantee they would donate to GOP candidates’ election campaigns. What-ever the GOP does, it’s all about MONEY, which adds to the proof that the GOP is America’s largest anti-Christian organization.

      • Fern Woodfork

        They Are The American Taliban They Are Out To Make As Much Money As They Can Even If They Have To Destroy Our Country ,Stave, Kill Off Or Sell Out As Many American Who They Think Is In Their Way Of Getting What They Want!! Which Is Power, Control And Mainly MONEY!!!! :-(

      • Robert P. Robertson

        You’re 100% right, as always, my friend.

        • Mimihaha

          Why do you hate women? I mean, come on. The worst thing you can think of to call those people is a disgusting word used to describe part of the female anatomy.

          • kanawah

            Mimihaha, what are you talking about. Please identify the post you are responding to.

    • Fern Woodfork

      Amen I Say It’s Time For Them To Be Voted OUT OF OFFICES!!!!

      • Robert P. Robertson

        2014 is just around the corner. I can’t wait to hit the streets!

        • Fern Woodfork

          Count Me In My Friend!! :-)

    • mike

      Horse manure again!! Obstructing jobs-Baloney. Massive regulations(4000 in pipeline), Obamacare, EPA high energy costs forced on business and home by the closing of plants, highest corporate taxes, are just some of the reasons for the lack of jobs and growth. Dems solution more govt. spending, greater debt. Not much of a solution short or long term.

      Yes the women’s body is her own and she should have the right to decide, but no on my dime. Late term should be stopped only for medical reasons. Not on a whim. Kermit Gosnell ring a bell.

      DOJ underreporting figures, average implied annual figures from 2005-2010
      93k rapes reported(FBI)
      265k total rapes reported or unreported(using DOJ figures)
      6600 abortions in cases of rape(Holmes et al. figures)
      1,218,000 abortions(AGI)
      0.54% of abortion in cases of rapes

      • Robert P. Robertson

        “Not on my dime!”? . . Who gives a damn about your dime? You just proved my point, ass wipe.

      • docb

        The Gosnells of the World are created by these draconian repub bagger laws and legislators…A wire coat hanger for you, mike!

        Lie to yourself with fake right wing talking points..It does not sell to people with a brain! Repubs are NOT PRO LIFE..they are ANTI -CHOICE…for power over women..Sharia style BS!

        • idamag

          If they were pro-life they wouldn’t be so bent on starting wars all over the world.

          • docb

            Or so gungho on the death penalty or a gun in every pot with no checks or or or or.!
            True that, Ida!

          • mike

            Looks like you are one of those “turn the other cheek” guys.
            Good luck with that.

          • Russell Byrd

            I know what cheek I would turn for you, dirtbag. Don’t like the insult. Stop being insulting.

        • mike

          I see you are incapable of looking up the numbers.

          • Russell Byrd

            The problem is not necessarily in the numbers themselves, but in how you, and your ilk view those numbers. Everything is about your personal wants. Everything is skewed to fit. Those that have been made victims, have made mistakes, or have just had bad luck are on their own. AND I am being not only kind, but brief. You just don’t want to be bothered with right and wrong, ethical and unethical. With your kind everything is either about control (I call that a Bully) or about money (I call that a greedy bastard).

          • plc97477

            Could also be a greedy bastard bully.

          • Russell Byrd

            Thanks, I left that out.

          • mike

            Yawning!!! The numbers are there.

            I personally want people to take responsibility for their actions and know the consequences of their actions. You don’t!!!

            Something left just blows off.

          • Russell Byrd

            So humanity is just a set of numbers to you. Especially, when they are “cherry picked” to get the answer you want. That is the thought pattern of a sociopath. Unfortunately, I cannot tell you to get help, because there is not any. You are damaged, permanently.

            I never said one word about not taking responsibility. Not one. Never, never have. What ALL of us are saying in one form or another is this: The nation will fail if we allow large numbers of our citizens to live in misery. As well, it is not a decent thing to do in the richest nation (and still by far) that has ever existed.

          • mike

            i never said you didn’t take responsibility but most don’t they have learned from the left that the govt will take care of them cradle to grave. Remember Julia???

            Misery now that is funny! So they don’t have TV’s, cars, housing, etc..

          • Russell Byrd

            Many certainly do, but a TV is pretty much universal in this nation. Often for the worse, but there it is. As for housing and presumably such options as food, what really is wrong with your psyche? You are a sociopath, as I have repeatedly said. I notice you never reply to that one. To LAZY to look it up or fearful that you will see your picture next to the definition.

            As for “cradle to grave,” prove that is has a theoretical chance of being true. Some do milk the system, but the majority of people on SNAP, for instance, work. And on all assistance programs, most are either disabled or are unable to find useful work, or are children. Children now, not fetuses, those little critters that scamper around on their own and that you hate so much.

            Which brings up the question again? Do you know what the topic of the discussion was? You have been off of it since a couple of posts after you arrived.

          • mike

            Far from a sociopath, only in your warped mind. Actually, I don’t think you know what the word means, but more importantly you sure don’t know me and my life.

            Obama used “Life of Julia” during the campaign which pretty much tells what Obama policies are/will be, go watch the cartoon/slide show, since it is a cartoon character you will be able to relate.

          • Russell Byrd

            That is a spoof moron, used to fight a losing election campaign. You do realize that you lost, don’t you. I declined to watch any of your distorted, right-wing entertainment. I look for facts and truth, and make my decisions on that. You just want to see things that support your bias.

            Are you not smart enough to figure these things out. Why would anyone with any sense want me to look at propaganda aimed at giving you your perverted jollies, when you know I do not find untruth to be funny.

            And a prime sign of a sociopath is a lack of empathy. You seem to fit well, so I do not need a psych exam to tell me exactly how severe your case is.

          • mike

            OMG!!! that is a spoof. You are delusional. CNN, Washington Post, New Yorker, USNews, all didn’t think so All were concerned about the message it was sending. Talked about being full of s**t you are it.

            I have lots of empathy, when it is warranted. Again, you have no earthly idea who I am and what I have accomplished, nor the activities I am involved in.

          • Russell Byrd

            As I said, you have been had. Your damaged psyche tripped you up. And no, you have no empathy, unless it is for a car or boat or easy sex, or something else, which of course you cannot actually demonstrate empathy for. Empathy is not something you carry around in your wallet when you hope to get lucky. Empathy for you is just a word you have heard used. You probably still do not know the meaning, but I bet you will look it up before your next bit of baloney.

            I doubt if anyone here care who you are. We know too much about you already and any accomplishments you have are probably to the detriment of your fellow man. I pale at the thought of the activities you are engaged in.

          • Russell Byrd

            And Mike, it is impossible to discuss anything with closed, evil minds that are filled with hate and only come to a group to spread dissension and irritation. Spin it any way you like, everyone here, including you, knows exactly what I mean.

          • Russell Byrd

            Multi post alert . . . multi post alert . . . multi post alert

            I will give you a more practical reason. At least one you should
            understand, but will try not to. If we continue on the path we are heading, eventually that 47% Romney spoke about will be 80%. Then they will take the country away from freaks like you and do away with you. Boasting and making threats will not change fact. We can discuss this forever, but the facts are all around you. Caring for others is not only truly Christian, it is patriotic as well as it will build a stronger nation. All you want is to look down on people, especially people that are different. THAT is the definiton of racism and bigotry. So wail your spoon-fed slogans about the “race card” if you want, but you will still be one. The truth is what is important to me, not your stupid, unoriginal slogans fed to you by the right-wing oracles you worship.

          • mike

            Don’t even try to put words in my mouth.

            I would love to know what threats I have made.

            The rest of the post is pure diarrhea of the brain. Pathetic and untrue.

          • Russell Byrd

            I will not try to put words in your mouth. There is already to much garbage in there and no room for truth.

            I think you have, but I did not mention it in the post you are replying to.

            Well, truth is, well TRUE. You cannot have the world you want without paying for it some way. We faced the same situation during the Depression and also during Teddy Roosevelt’s term. Both of the Roosevelt’s saved your corrupt system from destruction. Look at how you have thanked them. Ignorance and arrogance work hand in hand and speak loudly, but it is the path of destruction.

          • mike

            Life of Julia is a spoof-your words. You are a joke!!!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

            Fits you to a “T.”

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.” Not “Life of Julia.”

        • mike

          Nice try!!! I guess you are to lazy to look them up. Time for you to head back to your mancave.

          • Russell Byrd

            Actually, mancaves are generally where your supporters live. We generally have other interests.

      • Independent1

        Mike, if you think anyone here is going to believe those fake numbers you just made up (especially the .54% of abortions due to rape) you’re whistling at Dixie.
        And given that abortions have really not risen since Roe vs Wade, they’ve only been by-in-large performed by more qualified doctors, pushing to outlaw abortions is counterproductive – lt’s not going to drastically reduce abortions – anyone who thinks that making abortions illegal is going to necessarily convince a woman who does not want to carry a fetus to term to not have an abortion, is mentally retarded. Do you really think keeping POT illegal has drastically reduced the use of it? Did making booze illegal back in the 1920s keep people from drinking?? It’s only idiots like yourself that think outlawing abortions is going really reduce them that are actually going to accomplish the wrong thing – instead of drastically reducing abortions, outlawing abortions is going to drastically increase the incidence of women dying when they have to seek out quacks on the black market to perform an abortion in much less than safe circumstances!!!

        • mike

          Fake numbers! I gave you the resources but you are unmotivated to see the truth.

          I never said outlawing abortions. So forget that crap.

          Late term abortions are an abomination. If you are for them you are the real killers in this world. Gallup/USA today, 64% are against abortions in 2nd three months of pregnancy.

          Gallup/USA today show 53 percent say they are pro choice but when asked 6 additional questions(life of mother, incest and rape, up to 3 months, up to 6 months, anytime, not at all, the pro life has a 49% to 41% edge.

          • AdoptivMom

            Mike,

            Actually, I don’t think your numbers about rape & abortion are that far off. According to the statistics I was able to find, the % of all abortions to abortions following rape is 1.1% (total more like 17,676.) Also, I suspect your stats about how people feel about abortion based on length of pregnancy are fairly accurate.

            What I suspect you are not clear about is how rare a 3rd trimester abortion is, and why women typically have them. According to Fox News (the last place someone like me would go looking for abortion statistics, but I thought you might trust their numbers), there are approximately 100 3rd trimester abortions each year in the US, out of a typical 1.5 to 1.6 million total. Almost all of them are performed for the reason of extreme fetal anomaly. Often, parents refused to have the abortion during the second trimester in hopes that later testing would prove their babies deformities were not as severe as previously thought.

            I am staunchly pro-choice, but that does not mean I am pro-abortion. It means that I trust the vast majority of women, couples, and families, to be able to make their own moral and medical decisions without any input from me or the state or federal government. Having suffered with multiple miscarriages and infertility myself, I cannot imagine the pain that any of those 100 families go through making their decision not to go full term. But I believe it is for them to decide what they can handle best–a tough decision to abort late, or an also tough decision to go full term and watch their child die. Maybe I wouldn’t make the same decision, I don’t know, but life is not as black and white as some people would like to imagine. Sometimes all the options stink, and you have to go with the one that you feel you can best live with. And that decision is not always the same from person to person.

          • mike

            Thanks for a responsible response. God Bless you for adopting, we also went through the long process for a brother and sister and it has been glorious. To me there are a lot of wonderful parents that would love to have a child that are now being destroyed.

            I am not against a women’s right to have an abortion.I never said that!!

            What makes me sick is this early killing of a life for capricious reasons. This study showed “not ready to have a baby” 48% which is fine.

            The reason I said anything was some post made it sound like the majority of abortions were rape and incest and the Right was trying to stop them from having an abortion. I thought they should know the facts.

          • neeceoooo

            Thank you for your insightful thoughts.

          • Independent1

            Mike, Gallup polls have been totally right-wing biased for decades – SO STOP QUOTING THEM IN THESE COMMENT THREADS!!! Posters here know Gallup will fudge the numbers any way the right-wing wants them to come out!! The last election proved that in spades – Gallup had Romney handily winning and that worked out well didn’t it??? So if you think I’m going to buy the numbers you’re posting from Gallup on abortions you’re sadly mistaken!!!!

          • mike

            So is CNN, Right??? They had the same numbers.

          • Teresa P

            Abortions done in the third trimester are rarely done. They are only done when the life of the mother is in danger or there are severe fetal abnormalities.

          • mike

            Late term abortions are not just 3rd trimester. I never said that. Show me the numbers for 2nd three months.
            Mother should be protected or fetal problems.
            Gosnell would ignore age of fetus.

          • Teresa P

            Late term abortions are 3rd trimester and I dont know what you mean by 2nd three months

          • mike

            I am using the wording that was used in the study cited. I thought it was unusual, but God for bid if I use something other. So, you have 1st three months, 2nd three months, and 3rd three months.

          • Teresa P

            Thats a 2nd trimester abortion. They are usually allowed up to 24 weeks. I dont have numbers on those but they are common. Alot of women dont know that they are pregnant until they are in their 2nd trimester. Some women are poor and by the time they get the money for the abortion they are in their 2nd trimester. There are problems with getting time off of work and if the woman has other children she has to get child care. Makes it harder to get the procedure especially in the state that are making it difficult to get abortions. Mike this really affects the poor women more.

          • mike

            Yes, I knew the meaning.
            Again, not against the right to an abortion. I would love to see the numbers on women not knowing their pregnant after 5 months, I doubt few.

          • Teresa P

            Found some articles. Not recent. Mostly teenagers who are unaware that they are pregnant and low income women.

            http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html

            http://www.livescience.com/17529-trimester-abortions.html

          • mike

            Thanks, some interesting results from Guttmacher.

          • Teresa P

            Your welcome

      • Lorr

        But you have no problem with your dime paying salaries of the worst Congress ever, or paying for two wars, or sending money to other countries to feed their poor.

        Lack of regulations or lack of enforcement lead to the manure plant explosion in Texas. You want your children and grandchildren breathing polluted air and drinking contaminated water:
        That trickle down economics you are so fond of got us into the 2007 mess and the unpaid tax breaks that we lived with for almost 10 years did not produce jobs. The so called job creators have not been producing jobs they are making the large profits and putting it in off shore accounts. Pass the American Jobs Act and than we would have jobs. Pay people decent wages with benefits and there would be less people needing assistance.
        What the Republicans are doing with abortion is going to create more Gosnells. Perhaps you are too young to remember the 50′s and the back street abortions done under unsanitary conditions and done by Gosnells and people who were not medically qualified.

        • Independent1

          Great points! I remember back before Roe vs Wade, with all the stories about women dying when abortions were done in a backstreet alley and the instrument of choice was sometimes a coat hanger. Why is it we remember these things but Republicans never seem to??

          • AdoptivMom

            But wait, but wait! Well-heeled East Side wives in NYC when I was in college were referred by their fancy East Side doctors to very modern, safe abortions in Yugoslavia. There were rich-people programs for safe abortions. Only women who couldn’t spare several thousand dollars had tohave illegal abortions. Oh, and let’s not forget the “therapeutic D & C’s” that were performed at no charge as a professional courtesy
            in American hospitals if you were personal friends of a surgeon and your daughter was “in trouble.”

            Hey, Mike, you like statistics. Have you read “Freakonomics,” which documents the dramatic decline in violent crime rates in America as coinciding with the reduction in unwanted children born to poor families one generation following Roe v. Wade? You may find the economic connection morally offensive or troubling (gee, for your soul’s sake I hope so), but you are the one who said “not on my dime.” What about all those dimes you saved by not having to pay for extra policing and
            courts and prisons? Um, those were your dimes, too, right?

          • Mark Forsyth

            No profit motive!

          • vorten

            I was raised Catholic and gave up on that religion as being too hypocritical. In mid life I started up in a Texan protestant jeebus church and without too much protest I took up most of the hypocritical nonsense culture war issues as my own. Then again a falling out and back to exploring on my own. I recognize but no longer hold the hypocritical anti-science stances taken by the far right. These beliefs are reenforced with twice weekly sermons that explain away science and reason as tools of Satan to wrest control of ‘your very soul’ from the faithful. Their family, newspapers and fellow workers all hold the same beliefs and if challenged a weak rebuttal offered with tons of belief in the ‘Living God’ eases swallowing the bitter hypocrisy as essential work for ‘God’s’ glory. In my estimation it is a complex pathology loaded with enablers and self righteousness. Few of us escape the chains of jeebus.

          • Russell Byrd

            Your difference from those people is you used the mind God gave you to explore for truth. Their minds are seduced, and willingly, with the dope called “religion” that makes them susceptible to any outrageous satanic suggestion their masters can dream up. If God wanted us to refuse to use our minds to explore the world, he would have made us dung beetles.

          • plc97477

            I’m glad he didn’t.

          • Russell Byrd

            But, I am not sure about “mike.”

          • neeceoooo

            I like to think that I have escaped it.

          • demz taters

            Even though I cringe to remember what a self-righteous prig I used to be, I count the several years I spent immersed in “born again” Christian culture the best education I could ever have. It’s invaluable to know just how these people think.

          • plc97477

            repugs are too selfish to care about others. If it hasn’t hurt them why should they care.

          • Independent1

            That’s the unfortunate part – that their totally misguided notions haven’t in fact hurt them; and that there are still so many equally misguided sheep that don’t know any better than to follow their misguided shepards to a life of ruination.

          • plc97477

            But statistics say that the membership of the republican’t party is dropping daily. More and more people are too ashamed to call themselves repugs.

          • Russell Byrd

            They remember the 1950′s alright, it’s just that they think it was all “Leave it to Beaver” and “Hopalong Cassidy.” I am very serious when I say that I work for just such a man. He was even named for the actor playing Cassidy. He has also told me that it is his dream that we return to the 1950′s. Guess which party he votes for. . . . :-)

          • Independent1

            You’re so right! Republicans CONVENIENTLY only remember those things that fit into their obstructionist agenda and which in one way or another end up with them being able to stuff more taxpayer dollars into THEIR pockets!!

        • mike

          I never said I was happy with congress. How about Obama sending billions to Egypt.

          Ask any sharp small businessman what is holding him back and he will say cost of regulations, energy costs, Obamacare, That’s a fact.
          We are in World economy and if we can’t compete we are doomed. What you want is give employees anything they want and screw staying in business. It doesn’t work that way anymore.

          I never said, do away with abortions. There are better ways to finance than from the govt..

          • AdoptivMom

            Mike, I’m repeating this part for you:

            Hey, Mike, you like statistics. Have you read “Freakonomics,” which documents the dramatic decline in violent crime rates in America as coinciding with the reduction in unwanted children born to poor families one generation following Roe v. Wade? You may find the economic connection morally offensive or troubling (gee, for your soul’s sake I hope so), but you are the one who said “not on my dime.” What about all those dimes you saved by not having to pay for extra policing and courts and prisons? Um, those were your dimes, too, right?

          • mike

            Hi, again. Not on my dime is just about govt. paying. There are many foundations and charities and yes many individuals who can pay to keep the abortion organizations running. I am not one of them.

            ONE MORE TIME: I AM NOT AGAINST ABORTIONS.

            What ever happened to Responsibility and Consequences??? Time to bring them back.

          • 4sanity4all

            Mike, the government does not pay for abortions.

          • Teresa P

            The government doesnt pay for abortions. So you are not paying for them. Its called the Hyde Amendment.

          • mike

            Abortions go up and so does fed. funding. 2700 babies placed for adoption, 300,000 abortions, 1.4 million emergency pregnancy kits used.

          • Russell Byrd

            TROLL. Your lies have been repeatedly answered and debunked. Give it a rest.

          • kanawah

            Mikie, you have a few screws loose.

          • mike

            Not really! Look at the numbers. What is not discussed is the overcharges to fed. govt. to the tune of 25 million and they continue to be funded without questions.

            Too lazy to check the numbers aren’t you.

          • plc97477

            Maybe is upset that he has to pay to abort babies he has made.

          • Teresa P

            He’s one of those men who don’t want to wear a condom and then blames the woman when she gets pregnant. He probably would run out on the woman he got pregnant and not even support the child

          • kanawah

            Hyde Amendment is a real piece of crap.
            Abortion is a medical procedure, and all insurance, be it privet or government sponsored, should pay for it.

          • Teresa P

            I agree with you. The Hyde Amendment needs to be taken away. It only affect poor women. They are the ones that need this the most. Basically the government is forcing poor women to have children.

          • AdoptivMom

            I agree, not on my dime is about government paying. I was opposed to invasion of Iraq, but my dimes paid. I did everything I could to oppose Iraq. Took 8 years to get a new President, but by then he spent more dimes in Iraq than I can count. (PS, I did not shoot the President or anyone who supported Iraq, as some have righteously murdered abortion doctors.) (I know you are not one of them, but you’re standing on their side of the line.)

            If you are only against abortions starting 2nd trimester funded by government, are 2nd trimester insurance-funded abortions OK with you?

            What if baby was not government-funds aborted at 2nd trimester, and drug-addicted mother abandons addicted, deformed, AIDS-infected mixed-race baby at hospital? Whose funds should support the baby and provide for its care for the rest of its life? Do you seriously believe that a significant number of this type of baby is adoptable?

            RE: Responsibility and Consequences. Are you sure you are not meaning Crime and Punishment according to Mike? If a 14 year old girl of poverty has sex in the stairwell at school and

            becomes pregnant, who is responsible? I’m getting the feeling you are a sensible person, and will agree that there is a long list of suspects, not just the girl. Yet the one person who will live with the “consequences” if she has the baby is the 14 year old girl. Having the baby could easily automatically condemn her to a life of poverty and God knows what else. Which will cost the government a lot of money somewhere along the line. And please, don’t go to the “she can give it up for adoption” option. Of course she can, but very few people or families will go that route for many, many reasons (some of which I listened to ad nauseum over the phone when I was running private adoption ads.)

            There is also societal and moral Responsibility and Consequence, and those reach as far as your heart and soul and intellect are willing to stretch. If you and I are equipped through good fortune of birth or parenting or genetics to stretch farther than others, don’t we have the responsibility to make that stretch?

          • mike

            Again, not by the govt., our taxes. Many fine foundations, charities and individuals to finance these abortions.

            Again, I AM NOT AGAINSTTHE RIGHT TO AN ABORTION. Late term, Yes.
            Oh, but my dime was used, so your argument doesn’t hold water. Also, you are assuming that all bad guys were saved from abortions,that too, doesn’t hold water.

            Nice try!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            No nice try to it, dirtbag. WE do not PAY for abortions. And quite a number of abortions are because you scumbags want to deny contraception to every woman you can. You are at least partly responsible for the situation you decry. What hypocrisy.

          • Guest

            Admittedly, you tried, but it was not nice.

          • AdoptivMom

            This just shows the power of rhetoric. I have been replying to you as if it were true that there are government-funded abortions. But there are not government funded abortions.

            All the GOP blabber about Planned Parenthood has been about not providing funding for low-income breast cancer screenings to Planned Parenthood BECAUSE THEY ALSO PROVIDE PRIVATELY FINANCED abortions. American service women abroad are not allowed to have abortions in American medical facilities WHEN THEY PAY FOR THEM. Funding for family planning (eg free condoms) is not provided to any NGO abroad that also provides privately financed abortions, even in a separate facility.

            These “many fine foundations and charities” you refer to are providing overall health care and services; the GOP is determined to shut down their entire medical activities because they also provide abortions (not funded by the government). Planned Parenthood and PPIF are not in inner cities and poor developing nations for the primary purpose of providing abortions, but for providing family planning and good prenatal care. They also offer abortions because of what they would have to deal with instead if they did not–the after-effects of botched amateur abortions.

            And, I am not assuming “that all bad guys were saved from abortions.” I suggested you read a book that drew certain conclusions based on public data. If you read it, then you can comment on what is actually in the book.

          • Lioslath

            As a Canadian, I can tell you – your arguments don’t wash. We are proof. So is Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Holland…

            So, really, the best of the ‘world economy’ is just shaking their heads at this mentality.

          • mike

            Which subject???

          • Lioslath

            Well Mike, most of it, actually, though in particular:

            “Ask any sharp small businessman what is holding him back and he will say
            cost of regulations, energy costs, Obamacare, That’s a fact.”

            That is a load of hogwash.

            And before you say ‘the rich create the jobs’, no, they don’t. If that was the case, then that is worse, as the US has more millionaires and billionaires than any other country in the world. How has that worked out for you?

          • mike

            No hogwash!!! Regulations: Gallup 2/15/12 48% obamacare, 46
            % regulations reasons for not hiring.
            American Council for Capital investments: 2014 heightened EPA regulations will cost the nation 475,000 to 1.4 jobs and 47 billion to 141 billion in GDP.
            Manufacturing Alliance for Productivity and Innovation(MAPI), it will cost US Economy between 257 billion and 726 billion to comply with “major” regulations

            I never said “the rich create the jobs”, so don’t try to make your case on misrepresentation of my words. Read it again!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            The technique that you always employ with your freaky statistics is called “cherry picking.” You only pick what you want. Admittedly, everyone does this to some extent, however, you will pick one statistic that supports you out of the same study that has a dozen statistics that do not.

          • mike

            Not freaky or cherry picking. just ones you can’t refute.

          • Russell Byrd

            My comment stands. It is true. Beyond that your arrogant stupidity is impossible to reason with. “You are a legend in your own mind.”

          • Russell Byrd

            “Massive regulations(4000 in pipeline), Obamacare, EPA high energy
            costs forced on business and home by the closing of plants, highest
            corporate taxes, are just some of the reasons for the lack of jobs and
            growth.” I cut and pasted this. What does it say, dirtbag.

          • Russell Byrd

            “Ask any sharp small businessman what is holding him back and he will say
            cost of regulations, energy costs, Obamacare, That’s a fact.” Rather than belabor, I will point out that you must have went to the Texas Modern School of Logic. That is where the teaching of “higher order thinking skills” is forbidden.

          • mike

            Studies show it, U6 numbers show it, lack of growth shows it, continued debt rising shows it. Uncertainty, is the operative word for the business community. All caused by the Obama policies.

            Sorry you can’t understand it.

            Refute the numbers.
            What you can’t change is the obama administration under extreme pressure with the scandals that are not going away, and actually increasing, Obama numbers falling,

          • Russell Byrd

            I don’t think anybody should waste their time bothering. As I told you before, you are just a cherry-picker. You pick the one statistic that does what you want and you ignore everything that does not fit your malarkey. “All caused by the Obama policies.” That is the same BS we have destroyed again and again. We have torched so many of your straw men that the whole barn is ablaze. AND yet, you persist. Now, once again, WHAT WAS THE SUBJECT OF THE ARTICLE?!

          • mike

            Typical late again. This started with Robertson rambling about Repub. and abortions and I pointed out the real facts and the others got their two cents.

            Only in your mind do you think you destroyed anything. Over regulations, Obamacare, higher taxes, IRS, DOJ, all come from the top-Obama.

          • Russell Byrd

            You are still a typical lying dirtbag. My first post was long before you showed up. As well, when things got hot, you decided to start your own thread. I posted to that a few minutes after you began your lying stupidity. My reply was in reply to more of your stupid sass. Leave it alone and it will stay that way. DIRTBAG. You should be reported because you are the epitome of a troll. You have not been on topic since your first post. You are using an obviously unwelcoming venue to bounce all your EVIL, VICIOUS around to harass normal, decent posters.

          • Russell Byrd

            This thread was started by you, a-hole. I never claimed to destroy anything except your stupid, ignorant rants. Once again, you cannot keep to the subject. Obama this, Obama that, Obama, Obama, Obama. You are nothing but stupid, treasonous, racist scum. With scum like you promoting those Teatard values, we WILL wipe you out in 2014. You are too stupid to get this. Eventually, as your numbers keep falling, we will wipe out the Gerrymandering. Then your party will be DEAD! If you remove racism, you don’t have a party now.

          • Russell Byrd

            I do appreciate your posts in one respect. You are totally in left field where I want you, and you do not like the feeling. Seems you cannot handle either pressure or reasoning.

          • mike

            yawning!!! it is not me trying to get thoughts together using multiple posts.

          • Russell Byrd

            Actually, that is the sign of superior organization. I know exactly what I am going to say and have the ability to span across multiple posts. What I have found is the general Pub or, especially, Teatard cannot or will not read more than a sentence or two. You people really cannot handle complex thoughts and information. Sometimes this is a lack of intelligence, sometimes it is willful, generally BOTH. As well, if you have to scroll down to read a message, it generally remains unread. I am just facilitating your ability to understand what is said. I have learned that intentionally ignorant people need assistance as they will not put up the effort to learn anything. In your case you do not need to make any posts, as you have no coherent thoughts to get together. You do however fit in well with my next post.

          • mike

            Now this is not a complex thought but you sure look stupid. Remember when you said “life of Julia” is an Obama spoof. LOL You are a joke.

          • Russell Byrd

            Hey bonehead. Ain’t I just so clever. You posted off topic nonsense all day. I sat back and let you do it. Now I have come to collect AND have logged every post. Have you ever heard of flooding a group with off-topic and harassing posts. Well, so you have. My real thoughts on “Julia” are in another post. You made a mountain out of a mole hill just to give your mouth something to run on about. More of Mike’s Special Recipe Diarrhea:

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2]
            extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a
            forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an
            emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Fits you to a “T.”

          • mike

            Keep trying Doofus. It was your ignorance on “Life of Julia” as a spoof that gives you not credence.

          • Russell Byrd

            As for “Julia,” read my other posts and find out how you have been had. You are in such a hurry to flog an off-topic, and very insignificant news item, that you fell right into my trap. All you are is a troll, a disruptor with an insatiable urge to “win.” To paraphrase a famous old play (and movie): If a man trade his soul for the whole world, but for THIS, Good god, man, you are an idiot.

          • mike

            This post isn’t worth dignifying.

            Julia is a spoof, what a laugh. Ignoramus!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            Sorry mike, you have been had. I just took a guess, maybe a little
            risky, but it came in for me. REALLY, you have been waving a flag
            saying “mental defect and damaged psyche” since you have been here. My
            error was being too cautious to reel you in. You failed to heed the
            underlying warning in several of my posts. You should have guessed this
            would happen. Now, you have made how many posts flogging that one
            stupid little point. “Julia” was probably the only point you have made
            since you have been here and you ran with it, even though it was fake
            and not worth the trouble anyway. You are a very little man, mike, and
            it has nothing to do with stature. Get counceling or at least get some
            Xanax or something.

          • Russell Byrd

            Wikipedia describes: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2]
            extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a
            forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an
            emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion.[

          • mike

            You know, if you are so right and all knowing just not respond.

            Yawning!!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            You really don’t understand do you? Do you lack in God given intelligence and common sense, or are you just obtuse. I did not NEED to post because your lame post’s lack of useful, coherent content shows how mentally bankrupt you really are. There. I feel kind of bad now, because I have given the game away.

            Like I said, I just want you to know I was still here. It seems, we are getting down to what this is all about. You having the last word. Strange that it matters so much as you are losing coherency. Read your own pap and see what I mean.

          • mike

            About time for recess isn’t it? Are you late again? Poor baby.
            It sure looks like the playground fits you well.

          • Russell Byrd

            Meaning? You are breaking up mike. You have not made much sense anyway, but you are going over the edge. Your the one that loves childish cartoons and playground bully tricks.

            Late again? Still do not know what you mean. You have posted so much off-topic shit to so many different posters, you do not even know who you are addressing. Sure sign of a STUPID troll.

            Beyond that, I cannot answer. You are incoherent or are just here for your own perverted amusement. Both again, more likely.

          • mike

            Again if they are so off topic just don’t respond.
            After the last post of yours about Life of Julia being a SPOOF, your credibility is gone. You are the one being laughed at. You have lost it. Plain and simple.
            You are a JOKE!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            Stop lying mike. Just because it comes out of your slimy mouth does not make it true. That is just another sign of being a Sociopath. As well, you cannot understand the difference between made up fantasy and fact. I guess the real test of mental illness is not understanding you are. And you are one sick dude, or eunuch, whatever. And my credibility is not at issue here, it’s yours. You think you sick, Teatard political cartoon is fact. It’s not. If you are laughing at me, then I am proud that I have done my job of confounding you. Like I would care if your sick ass laughed. You abusing me means you are leaving another poor, decent soul alone. That makes me very happy.

          • mike

            “Life of Julia” a spoof, your words. What a crock of s_ _t. LOL
            I haven’t stopped laughing.

          • Russell Byrd

            Repeat:

            Sorry mike, you have been had. I just took a guess, maybe a little risky, but it came in for me. REALLY, you have been waving a flag saying “mental defect and damaged psyche” since you have been here. My error was being too cautious to reel you in. You failed to heed the underlying warning in several of my posts. You should have guessed thiswould happen. Now, you have made how many posts flogging that one stupid little point. “Julia” was probably the only point you have made since you have been here and you ran with it, even though it was fake and not worth the trouble anyway. You are a very little man, mike, and it has nothing to do with stature. Get counceling or at least get some Xanax or something.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            I can’t help but respond to Russel by responding to you – I don’t feel like engaging Russel, who is a psycopath.

            Russel writes: To repeat: You lost the election. In other words, the majority of
            Americans DO NOT know that your analysis is correct. On the contrary,
            everyday more Americans despise your kind.

            He is so far off. Most of the people I know chose not to vote. Because they think both Republicans and Democrats are crazy, they think elections are rigged, and they just don’t care about politics.

            I enjoy your posts. I just wish both Democratic and Republican websites would see how hypocritical they all are. Mob mentality, and blindly following their leaders and forgiving them of their sins.

            You will never make headway with this Russel person. His IQ is in question.

            And he sure likes to define troll a lot. Problem is, he is confusing ‘troll’ with ‘independent thinker’. And is IQ isn’t high enough to understand this.

            I can’t wait to continue reading this thread, and some of the others! Keep up the good work! Even if you will not get most of the writers on this site to see reason.

            Bunch of nasty hypocrites is what they are.

          • mike

            Thanks, If I’ am not called a troll, cherry picker of facts, liar, etc., I wouldn’t consider it a good day. The intolerance of another persons opinion which doesn’t fit their circle jerk echoing means all hell is going to break loose.
            I truly believe the majority of people who post on the left have serious superiority complexes. Their way or else.

          • mike

            You probably shouldn’t be happy, your comment about “Life of Julia” just shows how lame you are.

            If you do not realize(the rest of the America knows it is a fact) it is Obama’s future for women then you are a left wing buffoon.

            When are you going on Leno?? Say that comment to the audience and they will laugh you off the set.

            LOL!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            Actually, you lost the last election. Obama got the same percentage of votes as Reagan did in his”landslide..” To repeat: You lost the election. In other words, the majority of Americans DO NOT know that your analysis is correct. On the contrary, everyday more Americans despise your kind.

            AND, be a man, if you can. At least, try this strange concept (it is to you) called HONESTY. You despise Obama, Liberals, Democrats, and anything that takes a little heart and decency to support. You eat, breathe, and crap the nonsense spouted by your right-wing, Teatard heroes. Claiming to be independent might work if your audience was in a coma.

          • Russell Byrd

            As for “Julia,” read my other posts and find out how you have been had.
            You are in such a hurry to flog an off-topic, and very insignificant
            news item, that you fell right into my trap. All you are is a troll, a
            disruptor with an insatiable urge to “win.” To paraphrase a famous old
            play (and movie): If a man trade his soul for the whole world, but for
            THIS. . . . Good god, man, you are an idiot.

          • Dominick Vila

            I feel about the same way about giving the second largest amount of foreign aid to Egypt as a bribe for leaving Israel alone as I did since that practice began immediately after the six-day war. If it was up to me I would eliminate foreign aid to ALL countries except for humanitarian aid to countries fighting malnutrition, disease and illiteracy.

          • neeceoooo

            Amen

          • Dominick Vila

            Mike, American entrepreneurs invest overseas because of favorable labor conditions, especially wages that are substantially lower than ours, no benefit packages, and a total absence of safety and environmental regulations. Add to that the fact that those entrepreneurs don’t pay Uncle Sam for the profits they realize overseas and, often, don’t pay local governments because of their foreign status, and outsourcing and investing overseas becomes a no-brainer for them.
            The real question is how do we solve the conundrum we have? Alone the same lines, why can Scandinavian countries and Germany afford to pay livable wages and benefit packages better than ours and remain competitive and we can’t? Could it be that the social programs in those countries lower the operating costs of their corporations and allow them to compete effectively against countries like China? Could it be that their focus on quality beats the mass production of shoddy products? Blaming Obamacare for the decline of Americans manufacturing and the tendency of our business community to invest overseas since President Nixon and Kissinger re-established diplomatic and trade relations with China does not make sense. We do have a problem that needs attention and resolution, but focusing on the repeal of a program that is likely to reduce the cost of manufacturing and services in the USA is not the way to go.

          • plc97477

            One way to fix the problem would be to reinstate tariffs.

          • Dominick Vila

            The problem with tariffs is that such move would invite retaliation from our trading partners. Most countries depend and prosper from trade, and we are not an exception to that rule. What a lot of people ignore when they demonize our trade agreements, is that most of those agreements are designed to help American enterprise, not the average American. Our companies, and investors, are realizing huge profits overseas. Some American companies are making more money abroad than at home. There are many reasons for them, some we have already discussed, another is the fact that ours is pretty much a saturated market as a result of competition, a condition that does not exist in some of the countries where we do business and invest.

          • mike

            Dom, I never blamed Obamacare for loss of Manufacturing. The decline in manufacturing has gone on long before Obamacare. So quit trying to put words in my mouth.

            I think that is a stretch that Obamacare will reduce the cost of manufacturing and services. Hell, premium are going up.

          • Russell Byrd

            Says who Mike. Even so, premiums have been rising by double digits nearly every year for over a decade. Laying rising premiums on Obamacare is very disingenuous. Really, we should have went to single payer and eliminated the greed merchants altogether. How do you like them apples.

          • mike

            But you keep forgetting that Obama said Obamacare would lower premiums, keep your doctor, etc..

          • Independent1

            And except for a lot of red states that are refusing to implement Obamacare as it was intended, PREMIUMS ARE GOING DOWN even before the portion of Obamacare that should bring premiums down (when everyone has to be covered) becomes effective next year. And unless you’re totally clueless (which I think you are) the insurance industry would be furious if the GOP actually succeeded in repealing Obamacare because it would cost them 40-50 million new insureds.

          • plc97477

            Yes and it will when we really start using it next year. I don’t think I can find any smaller words to explain this to you.

          • mike

            Only in your dreams. Less than four months to enrollment and what the exchanges will look like, uncertainty will be the norm.

            You must not know that the business exchanges have already been pushed back to 2015.

          • Russell Byrd

            Once again, why not work for something to better the nation, instead of always trying to destroy. Why not give it a chance.

            Of course, you are just a hateful sociopath.

          • mike

            Gee, could it be that it is a disaster in the making. You better head back under the rock.

          • Russell Byrd

            Stooooopid!

          • Russell Byrd

            One thing has slowed the increase in health insurance premiums. (This is a fact that can be found by not reading right-wing rags.) The insurance companies have to spend a percentage of all their premiums on, guess now, HEALTHCARE! If they do not then they must return the money. I work for an employer that has already gotten a refund, so don’t try to substitute some Limbaugh for the truth.

          • mike

            And what you are seeing and going to see more of are the insurance companies walking away from healthcare coverage. I hate to see what will replace it with lower premiums. You keep forgetting there will be a shortage of 91,000 doctors by 2020.

          • Russell Byrd

            There already is! Why do you continue belaboring a losing point. Must you have an orgasm from lying?

          • Russell Byrd

            The worst uncertainty is the amount of Teatard attempts to scuttle implementation. Rather than accept what is a very good deal, some right-wing governors are refusing to help their own people based on bigoted ideology.

          • mike

            Only in your mind is it a good deal. Keep drinking the KOOL AID.

          • Russell Byrd

            Even crazy Jan Brewer thinks so. Just saying your s**t about KOOL AID is not evidence of anything but a loser’s mentality.

          • Russell Byrd

            I am repeating Independent1′s post to me:

            Russell, as I pointed out to Mike, some studies have shown that if Obamacare had not been enacted 4 years ago, insurance premiums today would likely be 30-40% higher than they are. The studies have shown that the rise in premiums over the past 3 years has been at the slowest rates in the past 15 yearsl

          • mike

            Life of Julia is a spoof-your words. One can’t show his stupidity any easier.

          • Russell Byrd

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2]
            extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a
            forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an
            emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Fits you to a “T.”

          • Russell Byrd

            Why is it that your kind is always the same. For just once, why can you not take what was promised, let nature take its course, and then call for appeal when the program fails. This pro-active stance just adds interminable delays and costs to the program. Of course, there is something evil and vicious in your soul. You NEED to have social programs fail and are wiling to waste huge sums of money to see that happen. You are just another hate filled sociopath.

          • mike

            The promise was a lie. Pretty simple, No one read the damn bill and you want us to let you get away with it.

          • Russell Byrd

            I have read it, dirtbag. Pubs did not read it. All they, and you, want to do is fight over something you hate, but know nothing about.

          • mike

            You might have read it after the fact, maybe. Dems. did not read it before they voted. So get off that crap.

          • Independent1

            Russell, as I pointed out to Mike, some studies have shown that if Obamacare had not been enacted 4 years ago, insurance premiums today would likely be 30-40% higher than they are. The studies have shown that the rise in premiums over t he past 3 years has been at the slowest rates in the past 15 yearsl

          • Guest

            I am repeating Independent1′s post to me:

            Russell, as I pointed out to Mike, some studies have shown that if Obamacare had not been enacted 4 years ago, insurance premiums today would likely be 30-40% higher than they are. The studies have shown that the rise in premiums over the past 3 years has been at the slowest rates in the past 15 yearsl

          • Independent1

            Premiums under Obamacare are not going up except in Red States that are not fully implementing the insurance exchanges as was intended by the legislation. In many states, those that have implemented Obamacare as it was intended, insurance premiums are dropping significantly – and that’s even BEFORE the portion of Obamacare that should drop premiums takes effect in 2014. You obvioulsy no nothing about Obamacare except what you hear from your right-wing faux news outlets!!
            I’d suggest you stop making nonsense comments about ACA!!!

          • mike

            Again you are wrong. Go look at CA, Ohio.

            AP had an article on PwC’s reporting that premiums will rise 6.5%, which means twice the rate of economic growth and 4 times faster than overall inflation, based on Federal Reserves projections. PwC also said premiums could rise even higher on insurance exchanges due to the uncertainty who signs up-the sick, the healthy, or both.

            What is clear: the promise made that premiums would go down $2500 is clearing a promise not kept.

          • Independent1

            I am not wrong – 1st off Ohio is effectively a Red State – it is run by the GOP even though it voted for Obama. Secondly, here’s the leadin of an article from CNN Money which says that ACA premiums in CA are going to be much lower than were projected:

            Health insurers in California will charge an average of $304 a month for the cheapest silver-level plan in state-based exchanges next year, according to rates released Thursday by Covered California, which is implementing the Affordable Care Act there. But many residents will pay a lot less than that for coverage.

          • Russell Byrd

            Yes, Ohio is a red state. And the Pubs are working feverishly to Gerrymander the Democratic majority back into the closet. The Pubs paid for Ohio and they damn well are going to have it. Democracy be damned.

          • mike

            LOL!!! Keep reading the left wing headlines and not the substance of the articles. I think you will be surprised to find the real truth.

          • Lorr

            If someone who is employed and has health care coverage is diagnosed with cancer they are so grateful for the health insurance. However, if while undergoing treatment they loose their job, after Cobra runs out you have to get insurance. No one will even return your calls and when you finally find someone they charge you $1200/month. That is one small reason we need Obamacare.
            The small business – a lot will be exempt because they do not have enough full time employees. Those that are not will do what they have done since the beginning of Capitalism when their expenditures increase, they will put the cost onto the consumer.

          • mike

            When expenditures increase they look at increasing the price but to stay competitive they will also have to look at fewer people.

            Why are corporation not hiring?? Pretty simple, fewer hires, fewer costs, better productivity, and better profits. They are not in the business to break even. DUH.

          • Russell Byrd

            I have noticed that when I hear someone spout off like you do, and then say, “everybody in Congress is rotten, they all need to be replaced.” Invariably, they are a Teatard that will vote straight ticket Pub every time. The only exception is when a REAL conservative, i.e. someone that is reasonable, runs for office. Then you ilk stays home and plots on getting that candidate out at the next primary. This is the “divide and conquer” approach that has allowed the Party of No to remain in competition. Unfortunately, this led to the creation of the Teaderthal Party that, like a runaway reactor, is leading to an eventual meltdown and likely catastrophe.

          • mike

            I see you are off your meds again. I never said “every one in Congress is rotten”. You have the wrong guy.
            The rest of your post is pure bull shit, not an ounce of truth.

          • Russell Byrd

            You mean you haven’t noticed that just about everyone in the Teanderthal party is white and mostly men. Have you noticed that the Pubs are hemorrhaging voters at a high pace. The Pubs are almost unable to Gerrymander fast enough to keep control. A few more years and it may not matter. Must be awful to be disproven before you opened your mouth. I realize that the truth hits a nerve with you so you have to mouth off anyway. Why don’t you listen to people that are truly conservative rather than the ultra, Fascists that you are in bed with. Your mob is destroying the Pub party and its leaders know it. They are like bronc riders trying to stay in the saddle.

          • mike

            I guess that is why 9 new Republican governors since 2010, 56 additional house seats, 2 new senate seats.
            If the party was so bad why didn’t Obama sweep the dems back into the majority? I sure don’t see it happening in 2014.

            Obama numbers are falling, his honesty and integrity are now in question.

            Nice try!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            In other words, your well-funded scare campaigns worked temporarily. I see you dwell on 2010. Why did you not mention the current election in 2012. How did that work out for you? Your stupidity is only exceeded by your dishonesty.

          • mike

            The stupidity is within you. Too bad you don’t have intellect to look at the numbers. Since 2008 Obama has led the loss in the house, senate, and governorships for Democrats. Figures don’t lie just you. Yes, dems. gained back a few house seats(8) and senate (2) but the numbers are still negative since 2008. On the coattails of Obama and this “massive” win the Dems still fell well short of a comeback. Mid term coming up and Obama is not on the ticket and his honesty and integrity in doubt, Obamacare questions, it could be an even bigger loss for the Dems.

          • Russell Byrd

            Well, if I were a betting man I would not count too heavily on 2014. Your only hope is more Gerrymandering. I am a very humble man in reality and am not fully confident about 2014, but if I were a Pub, I would be scared sh**less. So, with you, is it arrogance or ignorance. I think it is a heaping helping of both!

          • mike

            I hear your party leaders concerned about 2014 and I think they are the ones that are scared sh**less.

            With me it is not ignorance but confidence the American people have seen the havoc you are bringing down on them.

          • Russell Byrd

            Once again, you gave the game away. You mention “better ways to FINANCE,” So it is about the money. Not right and wrong.

            Oh, by the way, guvmint is forbidden to use funds for abortion, moron.

          • mike

            Well, there are better ways than tax payers money. They run surpluses and sure don’t need our tax money. They are sitting on 1.2 billion in assets and revenues in excess of 87 million.

            Consensus is long standing that fed. money is not to be used for abortions. That does mean it can’t be done.

            Interesting the more abortions they do the more federal funding they get. 2011-2012 fed funds were 45% of revenues. 40% of reported contraceptive services last year were for the provision of 1.4 million emergency contraception kits which can cause an abortion in early pregnancy.

          • Mark Forsyth

            Speaking of those who don’t need our tax money,how ’bout those super rich oil and gas magnates who take the tax funded subsidies anyway?
            O.K. ladies,flush those morning after pills and grab the aspirin.

          • mike

            Are the subsidies illegal?? Talk to your congressional people.

          • Mark Forsyth

            Awfully choosey about your subsidies.The subsidies I recieve are legal and the help people.Providing TAX FUNDED subsidies to the rich oil barons is wasteful,legal or not.

          • RobertCHastings

            The annual budget for Foreign Aid is somewhere in the vicinity of 12 – 14 billion, not much in the large picture. The Great Depression was precipitated by the same UNREGULATED excesses that caused the 2007 debacle. FDR and the Democrats in Congress in the early thirties passed through laws that prevented such excesses for 74 years. When these laws were repealed in 1999, we only had 8 brief years before the shit hit the fan in 2007. Regulation is an absolute necessity when greed is the chief motivator of the people who manage your money. 2/3 of our economy is based on consumers’ spending their money. IF consumers don’t have the money to spend, due to low wages, etc., then our economy is going to collapse – DUH!

          • Mark Forsyth

            Since it isn’t rocket science you’d think the dolts would get it,but along with willful ignorance is their unquenchable greed and money addiction.Even junkies know which side of the bread is buttered but these guys undermine themselves due to wanting everything all the time.

          • Russell Byrd

            That is a fair observation. For instance, wages on hourly jobs fell nearly 4% last quarter. I would be frightened if I were a “fat cat.” If that continues, we may have a revolution rather sooner than I think. Unfortunately, the rich don’t care. I think they believe they have bought the system so thoroughly that they will always be protected from the common man’s wrath. As a historian, I remember the situation was almost identical during the Theodore Roosevelt administration. The robber barons wanted Teddy to use the law corruptly and even troops to destroy striking workers, etc. Roosevelt was not totally pro worker, but he insisted on fairness which was all that was needed. And guess what the far right wing thinks of that Republican president today?

          • Mark Forsyth

            I bet they view the guy who walked slowly and carried a big club as a limp noodle.

          • Russell Byrd

            I forgot to add the conclusion that Teddy saved their ungrateful a**es from a probable revolution. An example of which is the event that brought Roosevelt to the presidency to begin with. One of the elites criticisms was that Teddy was “not really a Republican.” Where are we hearing that from now? (i.e. RINO)

          • Mark Forsyth

            If Teddy were alive today doing what he did back then,he would be completely vilified by the gop turds for being a champion of the people.I had to do a little research on him before replying to you..Teddy was an old ‘trust’ buster and even back then there were those in the party who felt that his programs were socialistic.Considering that he was up against J.P.Morgan and other industrialists who tried to monopolize the western railroads,it’s nothing short of amazing that he secured Morgans’ aid in trying to bring a resolution to the mine workers dispute.
            I don’t think it’s any exageration to say that T.R. was dealing with the stirrings of fascism even then when Morgan and Dupont along with Prescott Bush were indicted on charges of engineering a fascist takeover of the F.D.R. administration because they feared the New Deal policies.
            Well gol dangit,looks like that whole dadburned RoozyVelt fambly was a bunch a dirty socialists-or would that be commies? or atheists.They jest wadn’t Ay mur i cun.

          • RobertCHastings

            You would think the rank and file Republican voters would see the writing on the wall and understand that the Republican party does not have their best interests at heart. To dismantle Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid will not hurt the wealthy (it will put more money in their pockets),but it will hurt the poor and the middle class, which demographically make up a large chunk of Republican voters. By reducing government to the barebones, which entails reducing spending on Education, infrastructure, environment, health care, etc. and maintaining or increasing spending on military does NOT help the poor or the middle class.
            About 53 million Republicans voted in the past presidential election, and the vast majority cannot reasonably expect to receive any benefit by having done so.

          • Mark Forsyth

            There is no doubt that the party is bleeding members,but there are bound to be adamant holdouts no matter how much gop policies impact them. They are the same ones who have their faces buried in the Bible while they ignore the earthly manifestations of God.

          • RobertCHastings

            Ideology and theology appear to be the same thing for many Republicans.

          • Mark Forsyth

            No surprise that they don’t differentiate since many of them see no difference from socialism,communism,fascism,or atheism.

          • RobertCHastings

            Thank you for making that point. On Candy Crowley’s Sunday morning talk show, State of the Union, Cokie Roberts made the point you make, when she referred to Cuba, Ecuador and Venezuela as socialist countries, a point I am sure would be lost on many Republican readers. Mention any of the four isms you refer to and all you get is rant and obfuscation., and a definition is out of the question.

          • Mark Forsyth

            So much easier just to call them commies and not be bothered with accuracy.Given their lack of understanding that our own democratic experiment is social in nature,it’s not surprising that they fail to see why socialism is a viable option in both Latin and South America and why they try to stamp out every social program here.

          • Russell Byrd

            Only because they are too indolent to inform themselves of the difference. I would like to add ignorism to your list. I submit it as the descriptor of the beliefs and philosophy of the Pubs.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I’m confident that they could wear the collective label of Negativity Incorporated.

          • Russell Byrd

            It is unfortunate that they got theology so wrong. They substitute hate, bigotry, and rigidity of belief for the love, open mindedness, and flexibility their Master taught.

          • mike

            This should be directed at Lorr. He was the one having a fit over monies to other countries.

            Clinton wanted deregulation and it all was under his watch that the meltdown started. You need to tell that to all your side. Right now you are talking to the choir.

            Yes, regulation is necessary but over regulation stifles growth. 2011 there 224 “economically significant” rules issued last year and increase of 22 percent over 2009. THIS REPRESENTS THE HIGHEST NUMBER RECORDED since govt. kept count-Federal Regulations: A Review of Legislative Proposals, Part 1, Junes 23, 2011.
            Obama has finalized 193 “significant rules” which is a 40% INCREASE IN MAJOR REGULATIONS

          • RobertCHastings

            Lest we get into a pissing contest to decide who is responsible for deregulation, I will concede that major dereg took place near the end of Clinton’s presidency. There is much more to it than that, as we both know, but not much that will advance that discussion. In all too many area of finance, commerce, environment, etc. we see instances of the fox guarding the henhouse. Having the tobacco industry regulate themselves and tell the public that their products were safe is just one example. To allow speculators free rein (as they are given in the commodities markets) does one thing ONLY, and that is raise the cost of commodities to retail consumers. Speculation in derivatives (an unregulated area) is what drove the collapse of the financial markets in 2007. Glass-Steagall was passed in 1932, followed by the Banking Act of 1933. These two acts dealt with regulating financial markets, including banks and lending institutions. WHOEVER is responsible for their repeal did not do American consumers any favors, for the lack of the regulation these acts provided is what led to the collapse of 2007. I can easily understand the plethora of regulations being now enacted – they fill a void created by deregulation.

          • mike

            Basically we are in agreement!!! OMG!!! the sky is falling. :)

            “WHOEVER is responsible”, come on, both sides are responsible!!!

            What you are not saying is of the 4000+ regulations are not all financial. Many of them do have a major effect on our growth of the economy, higher energy costs, etc..OIRA in 2011 said, between Jan. 2009 and end fiscal 2010 cost of Federal regulations costs between 8 billion and 16.5 billion. Obama proposed budget request for regulatory activities for Fiscal 2013 amounts to $58.7 billion. GWU, WU.

          • RobertCHastings

            Obama has on more than one occasion validated your assertion that there are too many regulations, and that many regulations do, indeed, stifle economic activities and job creation. However, removing regulations and the structure that provides for the implementation and policing of others also does the same. Removing regulations from imported goods, and removing inspectors from onsite overseas inspections has, over the past few years, led to many instances of products from outside the US coming in without adequate inspection and resulting in serious consumer issues. About three years ago China sent us tons of pet food laced with a chemical that enhanced the protein assay, but resulted in fatal kidney disease for hundreds of American pets. We almost weekly hear of something from China coming here with lead or mercury. We are all too frequently hearing of massive food recalls due to salmonella or e-coli contamination that are being recalled ONLY after dozens of cases pop up. These things SHOULD be caught at the site of origin. The FDA has been cut and sliced and diced over the years and turned into little more than an industry-paid organ that, for a contribution, will pass anything on to the consumers. How many drugs can you name that, over the past five years, have been recalled? These drugs should not even have reached the market. The idea of allowing individual industries to inspect their own products and tell the public they are safe is ridiculous, but that is what the Republicans seem to want. The losses incurred due to illness, death, damage to consumers over the past four years due to inadequate regulation and inspection FAR exceeds the $58.7B you quote as Obama’s request for regulatory activities.

          • mike

            My comments are strictly at the regulations controlling how our businesses cope in this massive regulation explosion.
            As to imports that is a whole different topic. FDA is inspecting only about 3% of food entering the country using mostly private companies or relying on foreign inspectors at origin of product. Not good.

            Total pages of Federal code Regulation was 169,301 in 2011. The cost of regulatory accumulation is the main problem, too many reg. cause higher costs and loss of innovation, to no fault of any individual reg.. Multiple regs. interaction has the effect of raising business costs, and forces management to prioritize compliance over innovation and growth. progressivepolicy.org
            Small business spend close to 10k per employee to meet fed. reg., over $2000 more per employee than large business. The small business is where the hiring is found and they are being held back by the costs and uncertainties of regulations.SBA

            Since 2009, Obama has finalized 193 rules that have cost the economy over 100 million dollars and a 40% increase major regulations since 2004.

            A balance should and could be found for both growth and safety, until that happens growth will continue to be slow. The latest growth numbers are 1.9 down from 2.4 stated earlier, with that number we will continue to grow weaker as a nation.

            I just can’t agree all is the fault of the Republicans, I think you forgot to blame Bush.

          • RobertCHastings

            One of the final acts of the Clinton administration was to, by executive order, institute regulations that would have, annually, prevented in excess of 600,000 repetitive motion injuries in the workplace. Along with firing the 80,000 additional policemen Clinton had put on the streets, Bush very quickly ended this program, also. While the regulations put in place to support the repetitive motion issue undoubtedly cost employers significantly, the injuries that were NOT prevented, I am sure, cost significantly more. Safety regulations are in place at the local, state and federal workers to insure the safety and wellbeing of workers which, by definition, will infringe on the ability of business to turn a profit. Environmental regulations that affect business and industry bottom lines are meant to ensure that the fallout from unmanaged environmental issues to do adversely affect the health of all of us or the ability of the planet to survive. Regulations serve a vital and necessary function in enhancing our lives and insuring our well-being. However, many regulations may be outdated or need updating, or may even no longer be necessary. But throwing out the baby with the bath water is not a workable solution.

          • mike

            In the George Washington University and Washington University in St. Louis study they have numbers showing 283,615 govt. employees dedicated to drafting and enforcing regulations while fewer than 50 employees at OMB responsible for reviewing the new regulatory mandates to ensure they are justified and accurate prior to implementation. To me that is a travesty.

            When the business community keeps repeating that the regulations are destroying growth and therefore the economy, some one had better start listening.

            Yes, there are many good regs. but a balance must be found.

            China doesn’t care, India doesn’t care, South America doesn’t care, and at some point in the very near future we will be left behind economically. The World will pass us by and never look back, and we will be the real losers as will the World with the US weak.

          • Independent1

            Mike, you really need to stop trying to sell posters here on the National Memo talking points from the Chamber of Commerce: I’m starting to get the sense that you’re a shill for them?? Numerous studies have proven that the Chambers BS about the cost of regulations, energy and Obamacare holding back small businesses is just that – PURE BS!! TOTAL NONSENSE!! The Chamber doctored the results of some surveys they did just to fit into their right-wing agenda.

            And with respect to Obamacare – the fact is, that if Obamacare hadn’t been legislated 4 years ago, the cost of healthcare to businesses would be 30-40% higher right now than it is – The increase in healthcare costs have gone up the past 3 years at the slowest rate of any years in the past 15. And businesses like Wal-Mart are blaming Obamacare for businesses models that they’ve been using for years – WalMart is saying now that it’s Obamacare that’s forcing them to hire primarily part-time workers when they’ve been using that model for more than 10 years – we have several members of the family who have worked for Wal-Mart for years and have constantly been held back from being put on full-time status – and until this year – it had nothing to do with Obamacare.

          • mike

            The studies show it, people are already getting fewer hours.

            I did not use the Chamber for numbers or talking points.
            This all came from the small business community.

          • Russell Byrd

            I laughed so hard I almost lost my breakfast when I read that. How dumb are you really?

            “I did not use the Chamber for numbers or talking points.
            This all came from the small business community.”

            You obviously did not think that through. . . .

          • mike

            Only dumb in your little mind. I know the facts and you can’t handle them.

          • Russell Byrd

            You mean you are really too stupid to know what you really said. I am going to point people to this conversation so that we can have a real laugh at someone too stupid to even understand his own words. Or too lazy to be informed. Maybe, you are a shill for the Chamber as Independent has thought. BUT thanks for another good chuckle.

          • mike

            Not one fact came from the Chamber, Independent is wrong.

            Life of Julia is a spoof, your words. What a buffoon.

          • Russell Byrd

            “Life of Julia” is produced by right-wing buffoons for right-wing buffoons. As I am neither, by definition, you must be wrong.

            I and a number of people I propagated both of the above remarks to, are still shake their heads over your stupidity. You still have not figured it out.

          • Russell Byrd

            Do you notice Mike, that even when you try to fend off criticism by denying your intent, you do so by taking a swipe at that black, Democrat president you despise. Any idiot knows we ALL are talking about those obstructionist Republitards. You truly are too stupid to even hold an objective conversation. Like most of your ilk you are totally biased and partisan, and only use this sort of defense to deflect the reasonable arguments of others.

        • Dominick Vila

          I hope you don’t mind this observation, but the “job creators” did a wonderful job expanding their businesses and creating jobs…in China, Bangladesh and other countries where salaries are a fraction of what most Americans earn. The solution advanced by the GOP to solve the income inequality problem and make us competitive include (1) getting rid of organized labor to ensure employers can pay Bangladesh-level salaries, (2) encouraging employers to reject better social programs to improve our quality of life and give us greater access to preventive medical care, (3) encouraging employers to eliminate benefit packages to improve our ability to compete with products and services from Third World countries, and (4) eliminating regulations designed to make our workplace safe, preserve our environment, eliminate abuses, and reduce the probability of waste and fraud.

          • RobertCHastings

            That’s it? That’s all you can come up with? While you could expand this list by giving some specifics, I really think that MOST of agree with you 100%.

          • Russell Byrd

            I have always considered that the right-wing’s goal is not to advance America, but bring us down to the level of the worst. I think attempting to fulfill such a plan is the worst form of treason and should be dealt with as such.

          • Dominick Vila

            Speaking of treason, Snowden, the whistle blower and, likely, a counter espionage agent, just changed residences. He is now in Moscow.

          • Fern Woodfork

            What Does That Say About Him??? Hmmmm Let Me See Oh I Know TRAITOR!!!

          • Dominick Vila

            Looks like Snowden was not satisfied with what he did when he gave classified to The Guardian, and he continues to reveal top secret endeavors and information. Although most of the information he has released are things that most people already suspected, the fact that he is confirming it is doing incredible damage to our reputation as a bastion of freedom and democracy, and the de facto leader of the free world.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I think the average American would be much more concerned with the relationship that our politicians[predominantly republican] have with Alec,as opposed to an otherwise insignificant unknown who told the world that the U.S. Intell community has its pants down.I refer you to this mornings Bill Moyers program on PBS that was very enlightening.

          • Dominick Vila

            You are probably, if nothing else because the so-called “revelations” are things that everybody already suspected.
            What amazes me is the number of people that seem surprised when they hear about the activities our intelligence agencies are engaged in. What do they think we have been doing since at least WWII?

          • Fern Woodfork

            YES!! This Is Just More GOP/Tea Party Bullshit Throwing Everything At The Wall And Hoping Something Will Stick!!! After All The (Non) Scandals So Far NONE Of Them Are Doing The Job!! So Along Come Snowden Telling On A Program That’s Been Go On For Years!! It’s All Bullshit Trying To Get Obama Impeached!! But All These Scandal Only Points Out To Their Own Party!!! LOL The GOP Are The Starters Of All These So Called Scandals!!! LOL All These Programs Was Put In Place By Them!!!! LOL

          • plc97477

            That is true. They don’t want to better the world they want to bring the world down to their level.

        • plc97477

          I am old enough to remember the young girls bleeding to death in alleyways after a botched abortion and I hope we never go back to that.

          • jovan1984

            I’ve read about that stuff from blogs, it is devastating.

      • highpckts

        So when, Mike, do you think it’s right to step in? Do we wait for a total climate disaster to regulate pollution? Do we wait until everyone’s out of work because the big companies don’t want to pay taxes here? Just what do YOU prpose we do? It all has to start somewhere and the bottom line shouldn’t be a factor! Greed is ruining this country and you are part of it by stating that none of this will happen on your dime!

        • mike

          Not every regulation has to do with climate. I must remind you Obama put at the head of his recovery panel, Immelt of GE, a company that is a tax dodger. I guess you need to talk to your leader.
          Again, there are ways than expecting the Govt. to do. FYI, we are broke. 40% of our spending is borrowed.

          • Independent1

            And whose fault is that nitwit!! That as you say we’re broke?? Given that every Republican president since Nixon’s 2nd term has run up America’s debt like there was no tomorrow: Nixon’s 1st term was the last time a GOP president didn’t spend like a drunken sailor. And you’re so good at looking up facts, look it up: Reagan took office, America’s debt was 800 billion. Bush Sr. took office, America’s debt was 2.3 trillion. Clinton took office America’s debt was 4.3 trillion. Bush jr. took office America’s debt was 4.9 trillion. Obama took office, America’s debt was 12.3 trillion (which inlcuded 1.6 trillion in budgetted spending Obama could do nothing about ) But also included was the worse financial disaster that had ever hit the country. From a financial standpoint, far worse than what FDR had to deal with after Hoover’s disasterous 4 years in office.
            So tell me Mr. expert, what party is mostly responsible for America being broke as you state – which by the way is total nonsense!!!
            i .

          • mike

            What your ilk won’t admit. The Dems controlled the house for 44 years, first time they lost it was in Clinton’s first term, and in the Senate Dems had control all but 97th, 98th 99th
            Congress.
            So all those years when the Dems. controlled the Congress they sat with their thumbs up there asses and let the Rep. do what they wanted, Right?

            Your attempt to paint it all on the Right sure loses it steam.

            Again, no one is with out blame on the financial crisis. It started under Clinton and that is a fact. Probably not what you want to hear but even Obama’s commission on the Collapse said it started in the 90′s.

          • Independent1

            You have to be the biggest weasle I’ve seen The National Memo. You know very well the Dems weren’t sitting with their thumbs up their asses when a Republican president was in office, they were acting like responsible legislators voting on issuesl based on what they felt was best for the country and not what was best for their party and their pocketbooks like the GOP has been since they got controll of the House in 1995. And you also know that with the Senate, you can’t look at a chart that says a President’s party had a majority in the Senate and really think that means anything: A chart says Obama has had a majority in the Senate during his whole term but YOU KNOW very well that’s been useless to the Dems with the Repubs refusing to play partisan politics for even one minute and have used the filibuster rule more than 400 times. I’m old enough to remember FDR and I’ve closely followed politics since I 1st voted for Eisenhower, and I can tell you for a fact, although there have been many times when Dems and Repubs have been at real odds – the totally devoid sense of partisanship did not vanish in Congress until
            Newt Gingrich and today’s totally corrupt political gangsters took control of Congress in 1995; today’s GOP’s far more akin to the Italian Mafia, than they are to a true political party.

          • mike

            Go back and read your words. You said, “Republican presidents running up debt like it was no tomorrow” your words not mine.
            I just pointed out that the Dems controlled the house for all those years and the Senate for a large number of those years, so the Dems. had to be part of the RAISING OF THE DEBT. NOT JUST THE REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT!!!

          • Independent1

            Yeah! So! That was back in the days when congressional people showed partisanship and assumed that unless there was some great conceptional divide that the President had the right to define the direction of government. Not being overly paranoid about deficit spending as the GOP has suddenly become just because THEIR GUY isn’t in office, the Dems saw no reason to keep Reagan and Bush Sr. from being able to accomplish their objectives. But that in no way changes the fact that every GOP president since Nixon in his second term has chosen to spend like a drunken sailor – while EVERY Dem president has done what he could to pull back from the deficit spending of the GOP president he replaced. And something that may be surprising to you is that the president who was actually able to reduce deficit spending to the lowest levels with respect to a percent of our GDP was Carter – Carter is the only president since WWII to get deficit spending below 50% of GDP – Carter actually had it down to around 35% of GDP.

          • mike

            Carter lasted one term, and was just as inept at leading as Obama.
            “Dems so no reason to _ _ _ _ “, because they were the big spenders. But it was Republ. presidents fault, what a laugh!!!

      • Russell Byrd

        Another troll a-hole. If a woman’s body is her own, AGREED, then stopping the pregnancy is the cheapest option possible, if that is all that matters to you. Want to leave the child to starve and live a miserable life, THEN this article was written about YOU. The rest of your post is just uniformed blather. Go hate somewhere else.

        • mike

          Life of Julia is a spoof-your words. Doofus!

          • Russell Byrd

            Sorry Mike, but I guess you will never catch on that I am playing you. You are a broken record. Even after I told you what I was up to. Admittedly, I am tiring of the “game.” However, it will go on indefinitely, or until we are shut down.

            The truth of “Life of Julia” is clear, did it exaggerate, yes. Is it effective, yes. Have you twisted this totally out of proportion, oh my yes. Here is the deal. When is the last time you thought about posting on topic? That is where “Life . . .” starts to become important and added to all the rest of your shenanigans adds up to what I will tell you from now on:

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2]
            extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a
            forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an
            emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

      • demz taters

        You are aware that it’s a matter of fact that Republicans have outspent Democrats for at least a generation, aren’t you? Why should anyone take you seriously when you’d rather spout your party’s branding propaganda rather than actual data?

    • idamag

      If those hypocrites really loved children, they would want them to have a better life and they would want them to have medical care and a good education.

      • Michael Kollmorgen

        Nope, they don’t want that.

        They want a population that is poor, underfed and ignorant. That way, they can use us in any way they choose to.

        I’d love to hang em all from the nearest lamp post, or whatever structure is higher than their necks – preferably a few feet higher. It don’t need to be very high, just high enough to clear their dangling feet off the ground.

        • Mark Forsyth

          I will gladly assist you in building the gallows when our popular vote proves ineffective to our goals.

          • Mulligatonney

            Careful, you pussy…

            Those people are the ones with all the guns, remember?

            Is that why you are trying to take their guns? So then you can assist in building the gallows?

            Now – try to describe how different you are than the people you rail against.

            Pussy.

          • Mark Forsyth

            Go fuck yourself you piece of shit asshole.I’m sure that I have successfully defended myself in altercations that I did not start for the sixty one years that I’ve been living.First of all they are not the only ones who are well armed.I would gladly forego the construction of those gallows for the pleasure of blowing off a few heads,starting with yours.Or if you prefer,since you call Pussy,I would deal your death barehanded.

          • Russell Byrd

            And well-deserved it will be. Amen!

          • Mulligatonney

            My – what a fearsome Facebook ass-kicker you are!

            I think it is simply astounding that you liberal “intellectuals” think yourselves superior to those backward, brainwashed conservatives while simultaneously demonstrating by your illiterate, profane responses – that your side is worse than theirs by far.

            You are a profane coward and a pussy.

            The typical nutless, leftist parrot in this country spouts constantly of “tolerance, equality, fairness”, etc. etc. and in the same breath people like you talk about hanging and blowing people’s heads off.

            You are the morons that Orwell writes about. Not even enough knowledge of your own liberty and your own Constitution to realize that you blaspheme it with every word you speak.

            The entire liberal utopian fantasy is built on sand – why? Mostly because people like you would unwittingly destroy it before you realized what you were doing.,

            Kinda like what you are doing to our Constitution and our liberty….

          • Mike Rubin

            And the entire Republican dyspeptic fantasy is built on a dead-souled, compassionless, narcissistic, self-absorbed, “I got mine,” “not my brother’s keeper,” anti-social-compact, cheapfuck, objectivism. Between your strawmen and your ‘destroying our Constitution and our liberty” meme, you’ve confirmed our stereotypes. Thanks. Have a nice day.

          • Mulligatonney

            Oh – you admit that you stereotype? I didn’t think liberals did that – I thought they had to pass the “God test”. You know the one – the one where you give yourself the right to decide what to hand out to your favorite stereotype, after you take it from your least favorite stereotype…

            But – that’s not Hitler or Stalin or Mao, is it? – that’s you just knowing what is truly best for everyone – like Hitler, Stalin and Mao….

            And you, being the “compassionate, lively souled, selfless ” individual that you are – encourage the masses to turn their lives their fortunes and their sacred honor over to you…

            I don’t think so, Mr. Butt-face…

            The Constitution was written to prevent people like you from getting control of the government.

            The Russians, the Chinese – even the Ecuadorians are all laughing at the impotent Hussein OBama. They know he is a pussy – just like you are.

            Until he secures enough power – then he becomes a demon.

          • Mike Rubin

            Wow, pots and kettles, dude. But now, mom wants her computer back, so go out and spend some time in the yard. The sun is lovely today.

          • Mulligatonney

            Looks like you have put up the white flag……dude.

            Possibly now you will have time to look for a job, now that you have discovered that formulating an opinion is too much of a challenge for your long neglected brain cells.

            Now for some more legal hemp and pornography… Judging from your lack of ability to write, I would venture a guess that’s where your main field of excellence lies.

          • Mike Rubin

            Oh, that’s clever, in a subby little frat boy “oh, spank me” kinda way, Since my pate is so addled with legal hemp and pornography, I know you won’t take any of my prose seriously, so I instead refer you to sterling examples that will be infinitely easier for you to take to heart. http://progressivepopulist.org/2013/04/12/15-of-the-dumbest-political-facebook-posts-from-right-wingers-face-palm-alert/

          • Mulligatonney

            And now you refer me to someone else’s writing as your web comrades rush to your aid.

            Your humiliation is complete.

            You got nothin’…….dude.

          • Russell Byrd

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion

          • Russell Byrd

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

            Fits you to a “T.”

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

          • Mulligatonney

            And you resort to the dictionary to fill in the blanks that you cannot seem to fill with your own intellect.

            That means all of you little National Memo “Sidewinders” are trolls, since you were the first ones off topic, and you cannot even remember the firing sequence.

            You should leave the battlefield as well – before you have to tell your boyfriend that its his turn to wear the pants tonight.

          • Russell Byrd

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].
            They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous,
            or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat
            room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
            response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

            Fits you to a “T.”

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

          • Russell Byrd

            At least I can use one. And unlike yourself I have a need to provide true and correct answers. You just scream whatever nonsense comes to your little evil mind as true. Ignorant, arrogant a-hole.

          • Mulligatonney

            More profanity.
            The hallmark of your vocabulary.

          • Russell Byrd

            You dishonest SOB. Hypocrite.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Mulligatonney

            More name calling?
            Now, who is demonstrating who they really are?

          • Russell Byrd

            What about that do you not understand?

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Russell Byrd

            You are showing your idiocy again. Rant, rant, rant, whine, whine, whine, See how easy it is to make a point AS VALID as the one you just tried to make. . . .

          • Mulligatonney

            This is a tough one to respond to. I feel like I should call your two daddies or something and tell them to get you into a rehab facility ASAP.

          • Russell Byrd

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

            Fits you to a “T.”

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

          • Russell Byrd

            I happen to know that the percentage of gun owners is roughly the same with us Liberals. The difference is we are not bragging and making bizarre, paranoid threats all the time. We have not misplaced our penises and confused our gun for them. You should keep that in mind, dirtbag.

          • Mulligatonney

            Dear Mr. Confused Penis,

            I am not saying you misplaced your penis. I am saying you never had one.

            That is why you would not be able to tell what the thing was that I had stuck in the small of your back. Until you felt it go off, that is…

            Either way, “Cleanup on Aisle 4″…

            See you at Wal Mart.

          • Russell Byrd

            I do not shop there, never, but please do a good job of greeting the Senior Citizens.

          • Mulligatonney

            I never accused you of shopping there.

            I am accusing you of being the retarded greeter…

          • Russell Byrd

            I hope you enjoy your circle jerk, jerk.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].
            They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous,
            or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat
            room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
            response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Mulligatonney

            The question is, “Are you enjoying it?”

            You are on all fours at the center point of the circle.

          • Russell Byrd

            After reviewing your, and my, posts. I see I have not too much to fear. You have been insulting since you have been here.

            YOU REALLY HAVE A STRANGE FIXATION ON MALE GENITALIA. Why is that?

          • Mulligatonney

            I plead “horrible fascination”… it is simply that the one in your mouth is so obvious…

            Its like trying to avert my gaze from a snake swallowing a mongoose.

          • Russell Byrd

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Russell Byrd

            Oh, how original. You bring up the insult, I beat you by finishing it. And then you steal it. A fine specimen of a Republicon you are. You should have went into business.

          • Russell Byrd

            I will add that humor seems to be lost on you. Just for you I would put a little pine tar on the rope. Just so it will tighten slower. So maybe, you will choke a little longer. . . .

            Damn, I’m doing it again! But it is fun.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I’m told that piano wire works supremely well for neck stretching,though rather fast for your purposes.Barbed wire would do nicely if not tied too tightly.

          • Russell Byrd

            I have heard of piano wire being used on the genitals. Of course, we may not be able to use the technique on this jerk.

          • Mark Forsyth

            No balls at all?

          • Russell Byrd

            Well, maybe they do but I left my magnifying glass and tweezers at home. So it goes. It brings to mind an old saw. All cock and no balls.

          • Mulligatonney

            So – while you two dancers exercise each other’s pelvic regions, the world will somehow get on without this extraordinary exchange of profound thought.

          • Russell Byrd

            Arrogant, ignorant a-hole.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion

          • Mulligatonney

            Maybe you could choke on my confused penis, as you so sensuously describe in another of your prize-winning missives…

          • Russell Byrd

            If that is the best you can do, then I have done proud. Anyway, I have never choked on imagination before. Don’t think I have anything to worry about.

            And I freely admit, your post was not worth replying to, but I wanted you to know that I read and appreciated it.

          • Mulligatonney

            Another liberal self contradiction…

            Declaring my note “not worth replying” to while replying to it… A “wonderment of nature” that you guys never seem to tire of contradicting yourselves.

            As you say – “you have done proud”. Whatever the hell that means….

          • Russell Byrd

            Well, if you ever read what you wrote, or could read, or had enough sense to, then you would see that it was just an eighth-grade insult. Absolutely, no content to respond to. Of course, you will have something lame to say about this post, but that is not news. No contradiction, but even if it was it proves that you have nothing really to discuss. I am quite proud of exposing you as you really are. The real reason for my satisfaction is the fact that you are losing your temper. Never mind objectivity, you never had that anyway, but you are losing that smugness.

            It begs the question, are you stupid or just obtuse? Of course, you are both and therefore unqualified to give an intelligent, honest answer.

          • Mulligatonney

            Speaking of no content – please refer to your last post…

            And your admission to seeking satisfaction simply by trying to get people to lose their temper is exactly why liberal or socialist philosophy will eventually be regarded by history as merely a fad – a passing fancy on its way to the dung heap of the ages.

            Why? Simply because, for all your posturing and blustering – what you intellectual toddlers call “liberalism” or “progressivism” doesn’t work. It has been proven that when a government increasingly takes from those who produce and gives to those who do not produce, the culture eventually collapses, when all the borrowing and printing is no longer able to keep a nation propped up.

            So, it comes as no surprise that you choose eighth grade communication as your high water mark… You simply like to think of yourself as sophisticated because you have been taught to holler “racist!” every time a real issue arises and it makes you feel discerning and somehow – important, although you really do not know why…

          • Russell Byrd

            Actually, without preaching a sermon, what I said was, “I only trouble the troublemakers.” I said variously, “that I hated (or despised) bullies. Then I admitted to much of what you have said as the “tools” I employed to accomplish those tasks. In other words, if you were not a liar with sociopathic tendencies, a bully, and a person that came here just to troll and hypocritically do exactly what you accuse me of doing (in my case, with cause), THEN you would not have heard one cross word from me. Only an idiot and a liar would wonder why I am treating you like I do! The rest of your post is just more hypocrisy and spin to blame the fact that you got disrespect in return for you disrespect. You are the one that started the name calling over a certain male appendage. That is exactly the way eighth-grade boys often talk. As far as hollering “racist,” YOU ARE. I have as much right to note same as you have a right to be one.

          • Mulligatonney

            So much for not preaching a sermon…

            And too late for the “cross words” gambit as well.

            It was you or one of your dancing liberal mutual masturbators who responded with name calling, and now you are back-peddling like a circus clown.

            Racist is one of the favorite words of gibbering liberal idiots such as yourself. You think that word is the trump card for every argument you engage in.

            But – no explanation or excuse from you is required. That is not something a man would do. Now that we have established which side of THAT line you are on, take your punishment like a cross-dressing dancing queen, you insufferable, small, insignificant, whimpering little cockroach…

          • Russell Byrd

            If all you are here to do is create a disruption then, fuck you.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Mulligatonney

            Profanity, then cut and paste.
            Profanity, then cut and paste.
            Profanity, then cut and paste.

            Exactly – the product of a creature bereft of meaning or viability.
            In other words, a liberal.

            At least, you left out the sermon…

          • Russell Byrd

            Arrogant, ignorant a-hole.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They
            may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or
            off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room,
            or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
            response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion

          • Russell Byrd

            I am not in to conspiracies like your mob is, but your syntax and word usage does suggest you are a “twin” of mike’s. Or maybe, a clone, or maybe, you are mike.

          • Russell Byrd

            AND as I predicted, you did have something lame to reply. You seem to have a knack of making the obvious arcane.

            As to what, “you have done proud” means. Simple. You are wound up wasting your time just picking at every little thing and are producing no coherent content. Another way to look at it is, if any normal person reads your post, they do not need to look at my response. You make yourself look like a total idiot. I do not need to say one word. As I said, I just wanted you to know that I was still here. Otherwise, you are making my points for me. Best of all worlds for me!

          • Mulligatonney

            It’s worse than I thought…

            Now you think you are a prophet. At least, that’s something. It means you believe in something besides the God of Social Deterioration. Not that you don’t believe in that god as well.

            You “threatened” to stop responding a long time ago. Does that mean you are a liar or simply emotionally weak and unable to admit that you are too insecure and too much of a pussy to carry out your own declared intentions?

            You are indeed a classic liberal.

          • Russell Byrd

            You have lost these arguments so many times, from now on we will be on topic. Regardless of your views on posting anything you want without ever having to listen.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • RobertCHastings

            Yo’ mama, and sure were gooooooood.

          • Sand_Cat

            Good work, tough guy.
            That make your penis grow to a whole 2 inches?
            Tolerance does not require one to embrace cruelty and willful ignorance.

          • Mulligatonney

            Interesting how you liberal are always comparing things to your appendages.

            You must be sexually liberated and a worker of many marvelous deeds with your amazing instruments of penile extravaganza.

            Maybe that can assist you in winning arguments in the world of the intellectually tortured (I mean liberal), but does not get you far in the world of real thought.

            And you call names and hurl insults, then accuse the objects of those same insults of cruelty and willful ignorance.

            No argument necessary here – you have just defeated yourself with your own words. Don’t worry – you are not alone – most liberals do the very same thing…

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            HAHAHAHAHA! You only have guns because you are chickenshits in real life.

          • Mulligatonney

            …and I hear they are quite effective when hunting curmudgeons…

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            In your dreams. I don’t boast about toting guns. I prefer more discretion.

          • Mulligatonney

            …and neither do most conservatives boast…
            Most only get involved enough to speak up for their liberties as upheld in the Constitution and for your “gun toting” rights as well.

        • Russell Byrd

          I’d rather hang them where their tiptoes will only just touch the ground. Give them time to “hang around” and reflect for awhile.

          • Mulligatonney

            …more of that liberal “love n” tolerance”, which makes you socialists SO MUCH DIFFERENT than the conservatives you villify…

          • Irishgrammy

            What is everyone discussing here, you fool. The GOPTP’s total indifference to poor children, in fact all children in every one of their ideological perversion of ideas. People joke, because if they didn’t they would be furious all the time with what the Republicans are doing in DC as well as red states…..and don’t think there won’t be a price to pay in 2014! Vilifying the GOP is one of the easiest things to do, it’s almost required if for no other reason than a catharsis………The GOPTP give Liberals, Hell, human beings who have a soul, so many reasons with their insane archaic positions. So get off the phony indignation trip… There are solid reasons people are protesting all over the country against these draconian bills being passed in the middle of the night in red state legislatures. If there is one thing the GOPTP is accomplishing is lighting a fire under every thinking Liberal, Independent and Moderate Republican in the country with their far right ideological agenda. 2014 cannot come soon enough!!!

          • Mulligatonney

            You are a big city girl, unless I miss my guess…

            A pompous parasite who derides the host that they suck off of. And you have a soul (congratulations,you egomaniac) … And of course, not one single conservative does.. You should be ashamed of yourself.

            Indifference to children? Are you kidding me? Millions of abortions per year and you talk about indifference to children? Now that liberal government policies have destroyed half the American families, you want to turn around and blame it on the conservatives and their “insane, archaic positions…” taken by conservatives?

            You are in for a big surprise in 2014. Many liberals are now fighting through their denial and admitting that the president and his traveling circus could be the worst in U.S. history.

            I think that is what 2014 will show.

            Name calling won’t do you any good – but if it makes you feel better about your false religion, do it while it still tastes good to you.

          • Irishgrammy

            You are wrong on all of your inane “points” except one, I am a female. “A pompous parasite who derides the host that they suck off of”…….really…..did you use your dictionary to insert every nasty word you could find and suggest I must be a “big city girl” and living off the “Federal Government” by that insult, as I sit here laughing how ridiculously far from the truth that comment is and yet, that would be your first “thought” and response, I can clearly see where your mind dwells………….But let’s be honest, you don’t really care if you are right or wrong, you just love to attack and insult…….That’s why you are here on The National Memo, a Liberal site, with Liberals posting…….You, from reading your many comments here, you just love to insult for the sake of insult, attack for the sake of attack. I am not going to change your twisted mind, and your hateful comments certainly are not going to influence mine. Your words to so many here are laced with such vile rhetoric, and a mindless devotion to the new form of “Conservatism” which is quite frankly an anathema to what Conservatism and good Conservatives used to represent, as to be an utterly pointless exercise in futility. You make ridiculous assumptions casting aspersions that sound “good” to you, but have absolutely nothing to do with truth, reality, and how could it, you do not personally know the people posting here…..so what other reason to post insults and your fantasy characterizations other than your rage and anger, attempting to justify your far right ideologies, nasty generalizations of all Liberals and/or Progressive policies as being from the pit of Hell, and from what I see, frustrations that no one here likes you, certainly they do not respect you and clearly does not or never will agree with you…….EVER.

          • Mulligatonney

            You start your response with insults and expect none in return? That sure reinforces the stereotype of “progressive hypocrite”…

            No one accused you of living off the Federal Government. Do you feel convicted?

            A liberal site? Are you afraid of a different opinion? Is that why you begin your missive with an insult? Because in reality, this is just an orgy of liberals jerking each other off emotionally and a conservative hand on the appendage leaves you in need of a spiritual shot of Viagra?

            Why didn’t you just say so? I thought that ALREADY! You could have saved me an ENORMOUS amount of liberal bashing!

            Respect from people like you would be even more of an insult than the one you began your last writing with. Your own selfishness and insecurity shout at you, but you are too mad with affection for your Liberaligion to see the truth.

            Try starting out your next letter without an insult, you insufferable brain donor. Possibly you will get a kinder response.

            As you said – Fool!

          • Russell Byrd

            I did not realize that sniffing an elephant’s ass would get you that high.

          • Mulligatonney

            Of course it does…

            After simply being in the same house with your mother, even the most hardened trash-pickers have had to be taken by ambulance to methadone clinics just to come down from the “proximity high” or the sudden withdrawal would have killed them…

            Get it, Mr. Butt Face? Withdrawal!

            …stupid bastard…

          • Russell Byrd

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].
            They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous,
            or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat
            room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
            response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • InsideEye

            Why not wait till 21 weeks….or better yet, full term as the Doc in Philadelphia. , any one who waits 20 weeks before an abortion is not worthy to have a child anyway…..a complete idiot. It is used for failed contraception techniques and therefore should be paid by the bearer. …not under the guise of ” female health” issues. Abortion should be mandatory in large cities for such ignorami. As much as I am against it. It may be the best for all of society than propagating more stupid subhumans….that take up space.

          • Mulligatonney

            How about making a 2nd abortion contingent upon an agreement for automatic sterilization?

            I do agree with you – its the stupid people that are reproducing at alarming rates. Look at Southern California. And you are correct again – the big cities. Where the entitlements are more easily accessible and the families are more broken apart.

            And now, apparently – according to the Supreme Court, you don’t even have to be a citizen to vote.

            God help us.

          • Russell Byrd

            You know, dirtbag. It would never have come up if your hateful, vicious, little self (and your ilk) had not plopped down on our doorstep.

          • Mulligatonney

            Impressive.

            You used “ilk” – a favorite word for the priests of the religion of progressivism.

            Hopefully this is a website where a person can freely express his opinion… I realize you are more comfortable in your “circle-jerk” of anti-conservative feel good talk, but every now and then, it may give you an opportunity to expand your vocabulary beyond “ilk”…

            Although after reading your magnificent use of the word “ilk”, I must confess I feel totally abused rhetorically.

          • Russell Byrd

            Oooooooh, you are just soooooo schmart. If all you can carry on about is words and language use, then your ideology, at least what passed for one, is totally bankrupt.

            And, again, I had no need to reply, but I did want you to know how much I valued your opinion. Please think of the word “moon.” That should be more in line with what you can understand.

            So while good words like progressive and liberal lead us forward and give us good things, you can remain and wallow in that pool of shit with your butt buddies, all by yourselves. GOOD BYE.

          • RobertCHastings

            Glad you like us so much. Once again, you totally misuse your terminology. What’s the matter, mommy take away your dictionary?

          • Mulligatonney

            Another Pulitzer candidate – my goodness, I had no idea there were so many pure intellectuals on this website…

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Sorry, but it’s impossible to tolerate hateful assholes.

          • plc97477

            You know I am starting to wonder if we should be calling them assholes. I mean I have one and it is no where near as bad as some of these people.

          • Mark Forsyth

            They are a bunch of lowlife stinky sphincters.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            LMFAO! Good one.

          • Mulligatonney

            That’s because most of you liberals wear your glasses on the wrong end. Or should I say monocle?

          • Russell Byrd

            My sentiments exactly!

          • Mulligatonney

            No need to whine…

            So – you only tolerate people that you like? Or that are not hateful? Or the other?

            What kind of tolerance is that? Have you looked up the word “tolerance”?

            You guys are making this too easy…

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Why should I tolerate a hateful asshole when you can’t tolerate liberals? I’m not intolerant of people based on their race, religion or economic status, something that is rampant among conservatives (Mitt Romney and the 47%). I despise people on the basis of how they act as human beings. That’s why dissing conservatives is shooting fish in a barrel.

          • Mulligatonney

            That is simply not true.
            You have been told by intolerant people with political agendas as well as politicians that conservatives are intolerant. And apparently, you believe them – but that is your choice, even if it isn’t true…. That is called “contempt prior to investigation”.
            And again with your name calling while simultaneously explaining your tolerance and trying to label yourself “altruistic”.
            You are absolutely intolerant. And further, you are intolerant concerning all the things you just vehemently denied being intolerant of…although there are many more things to be intolerant of.
            And still, you miss the point…

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            Ha:) I was going to suggest that method. But, alass, I didn’t want to seem too perverted.

            Emmmmm what a wonderful thought though………………

          • Mark Forsyth

            Can we crop their tongues and castrate them too,huh? Can We Please,Can We?

          • Russell Byrd

            Oh well, alright, if you just have to. Make sure you clean up afterward. The incinerator is on standby. . . .

          • Mark Forsyth

            Careful now,we wouldn’t want to get nailed for air pollution.

          • plc97477

            Please proceed.

          • RobertCHastings

            Just chain them to the bumper of a pickup truck and go trolling for gutter gators.

        • Mulligatonney

          But – upon closer scrutiny – that is what the Democrat Party is doing to the poor and uneducated.

          Cultivating them like a crop for their votes.

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            You’d probably be on that hit list too.

          • Mulligatonney

            …and possibly you are someone’s list as well.

            Pussy.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I wish you had balls enough to come to Alex Bay,N.Y. and say that to my face,you lowlife piece of fascist pigshit.On the slim chance that I lost in that confrontation,it would still be worth it to pound your face for a while.

          • Mulligatonney

            Looks like I have taken you out of your game – but it isn’t much of a trick to anger a retard.

            Sorry to say, you would lose the fight as well – but why don’t you send me a picture of yourself so I can look you up the next time I travel to Bolshevik country?

            You liberal, tolerant types would never threaten people would you? That would be mean and, and, and, – like a CONSERVATIVE, wouldn’t it? And we know how you hate them…

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            OH, I’m sure I am:)

            But, I think people would sooner erase people like you than they would me.

            That’s OK though. IF there is a HELL, Vegas Odds are – you’re going to be there first.

            Enjoy your Journey.

          • Mulligatonney

            You have already erased yourself by your own words…

            Hanging, murdering and sending people to hell – the gentler side of liberalism, yes?…

            This is why the conservative (and many democrats as well) doesn’t want you to have his guns or know that he has them…

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            I’d like to also add;

            Let’s be honest about this. IF given the perfect opportunity to carry it out, you would more than likely destroy me for what I stand for, as surely as I would destroy you for what you stand for.

            As I am also a human beast, I would take that preemptive strike and do it first, if necessary to preserve my way of life and my beliefs.

            The Human “Beast” that is in each and every one of us, whether we like to admit it or not, automatically dictates this as just one of many methods of survival. Like it or not, we all are born killers if left with no other choices.

            This is also why I believe there is no hope for humanity. We WILL destroy ourselves one way or the other eventually.

          • Mulligatonney

            Okay, let’s be honest.
            I have absolutely no desire to destroy you or what you believe in. I do have an instinct to defend myself, and my beliefs, however…
            Destroying you and your beliefs would lead to a nation of pure conservatives… We already know what a far-right nation looks like, as well as a far-left one.
            I do believe in humanity.
            What do you suppose is the NUMBER ONE sin of humans?

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            I appreciate honestly. Thanks:)

            I consider GREED the #1 Sin of mankind. Lust For Power takes a close second place.

          • Mulligatonney

            I always say self-centeredness – that’s almost the same thing.
            All the other subsets of sin are included in that one.

            “Pride goeth before a fall” Proverbs.

            Too far right or too far left both equal tyranny, despotism and the murder of millions.

            America traditionally has always been somewhere to the right of center. It has lurched to the left recently, which I think has caused a lapse in the social discipline necessary to maintain a strong culture and a strong economy.

            Our Founders thought this way, which is why many of their writings (including the Federalist Papers) talk about government being a “necessary evil” and fought to keep its power limited.

            Because they knew men were greedy, self-centered and lusted for power. All men.

            Our government is way too big and has way too much power over and into the private lives of the people it works for.

            That is the entire point.

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            Who can say if we are too far left or too far right.

            Either party will claim their form of victory if they can prove it without any recourse for further investigation.

            I believe we “might be” a bit too far left. But, my reasoning if I stated it, would piss off a lot of women and more than a few bleeding hearts on either side of the isle……….

            Yes, our government is infringing on many of our private lives, no doubt about that. But, I firmly believe it’s not the federal government that is causing most of our problems. It IS the state government(s) hands down. There is no contest between the states and the feds when it concerns how each governmental entity, on its own, affects each and every one of our lives. After all, which entity has the most direct contact with us and controls us the most? Certainly not the feds, but the state.

            This is why I have been saying for years, if you’re going to clean house, you have to start from the local level and work our way up the ladder.

            This might seem counter-intuitive. But, this is the truth.

          • Mulligatonney

            That is a little difficult to evaluate – One can always choose a different state to move to when one doesn’t like what their local and state governments are doing, but the Federal government can take away your freedom as a society. As a culture.

            And – I think I may have an idea what some of your reasoning might be – and if it has to do with an elected politician thinking from a nurturing and giving standpoint vs. a position of strength and practicality, it is a very valid point.

            And one of the contributing factors in the dramatic swing to the left over the last 50 years that we have witnessed and the situation we now find ourselves in.

            It is not a statement of discrimination. It is a statement of fact.

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            I hope I’m thinking what you think I’m thinking because you’d be totally correct.

            Well, that is true, at one time. Sure, you could have moved to a different state and started all over again. But, that was many years ago. I moved out of Ohio to three different states back in the 70s; Florida, Arizona and California.

            Florida was great, but the wages even back then were horribly low. So, I left there as fast as my butt could run. Arizona was nice. California, ha, if I had to do it over again, I would have never left. In just about any situation, family obligations forced me back to Ohio.

            I consider Ohio to be the Black Hole of the United States, putting it as politically correct as I can.

            Here is the thing about doing something like that. Times were very different back then. Jobs were plentiful, wages were pretty good too for a guy such as myself who only had a high school diploma and with some knowledge in the machining industry.

            It ain’t so easy anymore to just pick up and go.

            The people who are leaving Ohio, in droves, are the young, the educated and people with a solid career and do lots and lots of planning before hand. And, these people are happy they left and have no intention of ever looking back.

            I’d also like to add, there are many people not only leaving their state, but the country as a whole. They are smart enough to know not to get caught with their pants down and no where to go when this country finally does go totally to pot.

            Many of these people are highly educated, mostly scientist, engineers who don’t want to waste their talents here. And, honestly, I don’t blame them either. I would do the same under other circumstances than the one I current exist in.

            Ohhh, about 15 years ago, I think it might have been Argentina, their government was recruiting people who had ANY bachelors degree to teach in their school systems. Long term contracts, twice as much salary as they were getting here (in US Dollars), provided a real nice home too.

            I saw it in the paper, sent for the application. I didn’t qualify only because I didn’t have a degree. I knew I wouldn’t anyway. But, what the hell, I wanted to find out if it was a real opportunity. And, it was!

          • Mulligatonney

            Understood…

            It is also difficult to evaluate how close to the tipping point America is.

            Our country has an ENORMOUS capacity to absorb the kind of social and economic punishment that this administration is doing to it. Not to exclude previous administrations, but this one is the worst one from my perspective.

            And – again in my opinion, the worst part of it is that the present people in power are doing it deliberately. No one can be this stupid, or even if they are, they would not be allowed to be that stupid by their staff (theoretically)…

            Even though I remain optimistic that our voting population will realize that the empty promises made to them in 2008 are only illusions, our capacity to absorb the neglect and abuse is not infinite, and the abuse has been taking place for fifty years under most of the Presidents. For votes. For power.

            For greed, as you previously stated.

            Notice how the OBama Administration and the politicians running for office have stopped talking about the debt all of a sudden?

            The debt is still there – growing and very dangerous, despite the liberal claim that money is merely fiat and therefore presents no real imminent danger.

            It’s 2013 – Elections are just around the corner and the politicians don’t want to complicate their incumbency by addressing such a bothersome thing as the debt. They are closing ranks.

            Black Hole indeed – Apparently, Johnson lost the War On Poverty. I think it was due to greed.

            Hang in there – there is a shift in the political winds in this country – the politicians are having a really tough time spinning the truth with what has happened over the last few years. Nothing they said is proving true – and eventually, even many of the cult members will come to realize this.

            I think most of us have finally had enough.

          • Michael Kollmorgen

            I remember back in the 70s or so. Inflation was, I think around 9% or 10%. BUT, EVERYONE was working, everyone had tons of money to blow. Ever since, according to government figures, the inflation rate is extremely low, some might even say O, the economy is barely doing anything, yet Wall Street is Booming.

            To me inflation wasn’t a bad thing in that respect.

            As far as the Debt, its really nothing more than Confetti. It’ll be passed along for the next generation and the next and the next. We won’t collapse because of that. People will still keep working, wages will have to improve or else.

            Who ever owns that debt will control us eventually. It will probably be China too. We’re the ones that created Communist China during WW2, then Nixon “opening up” china to american corporate greed.

            The only country who has woken up the Sleeping Dragon is the United States.

            And, we’re all going to pay one hell of a price for that one of these days.

          • demz taters

            You’re right…the poor and uneducated should vote for the party that opposes a mandatory minimum wage, workers’ rights, education funding and universal health care.

          • Mulligatonney

            You actually have a point – rare on this website.

            But ask yourself – Johnson declared war on poverty over 50 years ago… If the Democrat Party was interested in lifting the poor out of their misery (which is still a fairly high standard compared with most of the world), and providing them with good education and good jobs – why has this not been accomplished?

            Could it be that they know they have a dependable block of voters that will put them in office time after time because they can point to their situation and blame it on the Republicans? Where is the education they promised? Where are the jobs? They have the poor, uneducated and minorities on the ropes, right where they want them.

            …voting for them repeatedly out of fear of what the dreaded Republicans “will take away from them” instead of being encouraged to be independent and make their own living.

          • Mark Forsyth

            Unlike your fundamentalist knuckle draggers who were bought off with the construction of a few well placed mission churches,the poor don’t require cultivation. Assholes like yourself belonging to the Death Party give them all the motivation needed to gravitate to the opposition.

          • Mulligatonney

            Then, do away with entitlement spending, butt-face.

            See how long you get away with THAT. You have gotten them so dependent upon government money, many of them no longer know how to take care of themselves.

            Oh! I forgot my manners…

            I meant – Mr. Butt-face…

          • Russell Byrd

            Teatard slogan spoon fed into the mouths of idiots by their spank daddies. Signifies nothing.

          • Mulligatonney

            Another sublime literary achievement by the best of the intellectuals on this website.

            You ought to submit this for a Pulitzer – just like your long-legged Mack Daddy Hussein OBama, who received a Nobel Prize for – what was it again? Picking the NCAA Tournament winner?

        • whodatbob

          Be sure to hand the knuckle draggers arms don’t reach the ground.

    • highpckts

      At the same time, they cut sex ed in schools, ban any talk of contraceptives! It seems to me they have the cart before the horse! If kids were given free access to contraceptives and sex ed. wouldn’t that somewhat negate the need for abortions?

      • Mark Forsyth

        A popular reply to that intelligent argument is that the education and distribution of contraceptives promotes immoral behavior. In knuckle dragger lingo that would translate as ” We don’t want our kids runnin’ round an’ fuckin’ like bunnies.”

      • plc97477

        The gop would just as soon no one was having sex except of course themselves. I think that is why they spend so much time trying to describe real rape.

      • Mike Rubin

        That matters not to them. There’s something in their makeup that requires these fetuses to be used as shaming devices. No matter that they call themselves “pro-life”; they merely are “forced birthers.” For all the talk about “murdering innocent babies,” these folks show themselves as degenerate phonies who are ruled by such a pathological hatred of sex that they gladly inflict unwanted children on women who dare have non-procreational sex, just as though those children were modern scarlet letters. There’s nothing more and nothing less to their concern about fetuses than that. It also explains their opposition to sex education and contraception.

        The ONLY interest whatsoever that these New Puritans have in the fetuses they won’t prevent from being conceived and require to be born is to use them as scarlet letters; otherwise, they are the usual dead-souled, compassionless, self-absorbed, narcissistic, “not my brother’s keeper,” “I got mine,” anti-social compact, cheapfuck objectivist Republicans who lose all interest in children the moments the heads crown. These same “anti-murder” activists work incredibly hard to ensure that no unwanted child is given prenatal care or is fed, clothed, housed, educated, or cured of disease on their dimes.

        At the end of the day, do you know who their sexual pathology hurts the most? It’s the unwanted kids they want to inflict on people who don’t want them.

        If there’s a God, surely He or She is saving a very special place in hell for phony degenerates like these people. They should take their pathology out of public policy and get it to where it belongs: the therapist’s office. They are unspeakably cruel and the only thing they hate more than sex is the children they require be born.

        • RobertCHastings

          “forced birthers”, I LIKE that one.

        • FredAppell

          Your post is brilliant. It matters not to conservatives that people
          will have sex no matter what, only that every embryo has to be carried to full term. They don’t give a crap about the hardships that child may face in life. Conservatives are constantly preaching about personal responsibility. When a women has an abortion, isn’t she in fact exercising some form of personal responsibility? I don’t appreciate their portrayal of women being too willing to have an abortion without giving it a
          lot of thought first. Women aren’t treating it like it is as easy as going to get their nails done.

        • Independent1

          What Republicans are also failing to acknowledge is that when they insist that a woman carry a fetus to term; a fetus that for her own reasons she does not feel she is in a position to carry – in addition to burdening her with an unwanted child – they’re potentially saddling her with the costs of raising that child to age 18; which is now estimated to be in the neighborhood of $275,000.

          • Mike Rubin

            That’s actually an instrument of the punishment, having to bear that economic burden. With that figure, you’ve quantified the cost of “slut shaming.”

      • RobertCHastings

        Especially since it has been proven in those districts that provide abstinence only sex education that teen pregnancy rates are higher, significantly, in those school districts that offer abstinence only. And when schools make the mistake of offering condoms, their parents raise hell. Kids are NOT going to practice abstinence UNLESS they attend school in sexually segregated schools and are given drugs to reduce their libidos.

        • Mark Forsyth

          You may remember as I do,that back in the fifties and sixties those young and creamy,frustrated Catholic girls were some of the hottest stuff going. I ought to know as I am a recovered Catholic who walked away at the age of sixteen when the doctrine just didn’t mesh with reality and I had enough of being told that sex was evil and the domain of married folks only.Not the kind of thing that a young man with raging hormones and cum in his viens wants to hear.And niether did the girls.

          • RobertCHastings

            While we have heard about studies touting the effectiveness of the “abstinence only” curriculum, statistics show just the opposite. On that single point there need be no discussion. Teen pregnancies, teen births, lower birth weights, greater incidence of STDs – all the signs of what would happen in society when parents and schools withdraw from their responsibilities for training young people – inevitably increase when children are NOT taught about sex. Kids (Catholic or otherwise) are going to experiment, especially when they find out how great sex is. The relatively few cases of young people actually holding out until marriage are the exception, not the norm. Teen sex is not a new phenomenon, either. If our parents and grandparents were truthful with us, we could really hear some stories. The back seat of a car was invented for a reason. Drive-in theaters were invented for a reason. And condoms were invented for a reason.

          • Mark Forsyth

            Robert, the pages of my mental memorial sex rolodex are spinning wildly.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Yeah, Catholic girls were known to be especially adept at blowjobs because they were “saving themselves” for marriage.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I can testify to that statement.In the neighborhood of one of my sweet old girlfriends,their was not a single chromed trailer hitch to be found.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            AMEN Brother!

        • plc97477

          Don’t tell them that. I am sure they would be trying to implement it soon.

    • Susan Dean

      I’m old enough to remember the debate on the Civil Rights Bill, and the Republican line on that–repeated ad nauseum–was “You can’t legislate morality.” And now that’s all they’re trying to do.
      Robert, I’d like to mention something that has disturbed me–your use of the word “Republicunt.” Believe me, I have the utmost respect for your opinions, and agree that almost any awful word one can think of applies to Republicans. However, “cunt” is a word that has been used for centuries to denigrate women, and I find its use in any form distressing. I can’t think of a clever alternative, but maybe we could take a phrase from the George Bush Dictionary and just call them Evil Doers, since that is what they are.

      • plc97477

        How would republican’t do?

        • Susan Dean

          I’d go for that, especially since most of what they say is cant.

      • William Ray Walters

        Would republi-bitch really have been much better? I’ve never understood why some women (not most, but some) take such offense to the word cunt. The word dick is used to describe almost exclusively men (men who are being dicks, in most cases), but men don’t seem to take offense to it at all. So why the over-sensitivity?

        • Susan Dean

          Wouldn’t it be a better world if we could talk to each other without derrogatory language? There seems to be an increasing amount on this board, and it adds nothing to the discussion. By the way, I can’t recall ever hearing a woman use the word dick to describe a man, although I’m sure it’s probably happened. But it mostly seems to be a word men use about other men. Why the obsession with anatomical epithets?

          • William Ray Walters

            I was just curious as to why such offense is taken to that word, that’s all. Women call guys dicks all the time, and it is certainly not a word used only by guys.

            Robert apparently feels very passionately about this subject and when people feel passionately about something they will sometimes use colorful language. To me, words are just words. I don’t personally take offense to any of them, but I can see where people would. I was just surprised that that word bothers you so much as to derail the subject of the thread to point it out, and I was curious as to why you personally are offended by it in such a way. That’s really all, I was just curious.

          • Jim Myers

            Actually, I refer to Cheney as “DICK” quite often.
            Seems appropriate.

          • Russell Byrd

            I have heard quite a few women use the word. I think the use may be apt, “IT” wants what “IT” wants and has NO conscience. So I think it does describe a lot of men very well. You are right of course about the derogatory language and I am an offender. However, most of this language use is due to the “opposition.” They either start the name calling or are so disgustingly obtrusive, and especially, prolific with their postings that they invite it. Like I fairly politely told off one right-winger, that after he had changed the subject repeatedly I had no idea what the subject of the article was about. Or more simply, several of these posters just come here to stir up the group. They have come here on a Quixotic quest for no other reason than to make us angry and gain control of the group. As for myself, I use an occasional insult to try to get their attention. I have found that right-wing trolls are often extremely prolific posters, but are extremely poor readers. Of course, that may be a personal defect of mine, as I know very well “Tea” folks couldn’t care less what anyone else says. They have demonstrated that repeatedly and a showcase of that is our very own Congress.

          • Susan Dean

            I wish we could just have a rational discussion without all the name-calling. But I agree that the TPs who post here are incapable of doing so.

          • Mark Forsyth

            You’d sooner have pie in the sky Susan than a rational discussion with that bunch.Notice their collective refusal of logic and reason.

          • plc97477

            It is just to difficult to have a real conversation with crazy people.

          • Russell Byrd

            Exactly, but I persist because I am not going to allow them to run me off. That is their primary goal and one which I will work to deny.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I have observed that their comprehensional skills are lacking,especially when encountering abstract thoughts or concepts.

          • plc97477

            Or basic english or math.

      • Robert P. Robertson

        If it is offense to you, Susan dean, please accept my heart felt apologies. You’re not the only female who has told me that. I have a deep and humble respect for women, so much so, it’s almost spiritual. But, as you can see just on this site and from the historical behavior of republicans, I can’t help it. But, take it from me, it is not nor has it ever been directed at women.

        • Susan Dean

          Thank you, Robert.

    • Mulligatonney

      I must hand it to you – you surely know how to spell Republican in a unique and satirical way… You must be a University Professor or something impressive like that…

      How does the nonsense in your narrative make a moral argument for killing a baby in the womb? Its such a simple question, really… But it is definitely against the “progressive” religion to answer it directly, if at all. I suspect the reason is because you know in your conscience that it is wrong.

      But I agree – we must not legislate morality – so let us stop this practice of “morally legislating” funding for abortions with tax dollars. Provide it with your own funds. That way, those rotten conservatives cannot so easily “morally legislate” or spoil your plans to murder your own children.

      Finally, then – this “sophisticated, culturally superior” utopian society that you socialists dream of will have the opportunity to flourish unfettered by those who would oppose the practice of executing all the unwanted bastards who arise from the undisciplined debauchery of your own sexual freedoms – and you can do it over and over with absolutely no consequence.

      Or can you? The Christian religion thinks that you cannot. The Democrat religion thinks you can.

      • Mark Forsyth

        Those dadburned socialist commies,fuckin’ all over the place.

        • Mulligatonney

          A true liberal.

          Words with no meaning behind them.

          • Mark Forsyth

            You- a true brainless,shit eating asshole fascist pig,.the gops’favorite kind,with no meaning behind your existence besides that of serving as a bad example.

          • plc97477

            But he does do a good job of that.

          • Mark Forsyth

            I am reminded about something to do with practice .

          • Mulligatonney

            You can be the White House spokesman when that Carnival Barker Carney is tossed aside.

            Toss in a bit of ebonics with that, and you could get get Hussein’s job after he is impeached.

      • Russell Byrd

        I will say this for what its worth. No Pub can ever truly be a Christian. Reading Christ’s teachings would show that it is impossible. Of course, you can hypocritically call yourself a Christian and you can thump the “good book,” but that will not make you truly a follower of Christ.

        • Mulligatonney

          Congratulations.

          You have just identified yourself as a Pharisee.

          All are welcome in Christ’s Kingdom.

      • 4sanity4all

        Abortions are not funded by tax dollars. The government does not pay for abortions. Women do pay for their own abortions The government does not pay for abortions. By law, the government may not pay for abortions. Do I need to state it any other way?

        • Mulligatonney

          Have you read the OBama Care Bill?
          Are you kidding me?
          The pigs have already moved into the farmhouse.

          • 4sanity4all

            The Affordable Care Act does not provide funding for abortions. It does provide access to birth control, paid for by the insurance companies. So, people will get birth control as a benefit of the insurance that THEY paid for. Which should prevent a heck of a lot of abortions.

          • Mulligatonney

            How naive can you be? Of COURSE it funds abortions, whether direct or indirect.

            It also forces medical staff who do not believe in it to participate or lose their jobs.
            It is tyranny. And at its head – a communist despot.

      • Robert P. Robertson

        I’d like for you to present where in the Bible it mentions abortion, or where any of the Prophets spoke of it, or where our Christ mentioned it. Don’t tell me any twisted misrepresentation about “murder” or “What you do to the least of these”. Point it out to me where it describes abortion or condemns abortion? . . , many of us are planned births between our mothers and fathers. Many more of us were unexpected. Quite a few were surprises that we call “miracles”. We are here because our parents wanted us. Many more are here because our parents accepted us and loved us just the same. But what about the hundreds of thousands of children in orphanages who will suffer from a lifelong abandonment, sadness, and loneliness becasuse a young mother was forced by poverty, rape, incest, or molestation to give them away? That is a traumatic experience for the mother and child, in many cases unbearable. What about the ones we hear on the news, babies being beaten to death, starved to death, and tortured by mothers and fathers who for reason or other has no affectionate bond for a child because there was no one, no social program, no church with an open door, no grandparents who cared enough, to teach that mother and raise a child that her circumstances began to cause her to resent and despise? The narrow prism that many of us view things through needs some revamping seriously before we condemn any woman for taking her rights to make her own decision what she wants to do. It’s not up to you, me, or politicians. She is a woman and a human being with certain inalienable rights. Her body, her decision. We need to respect that.

        • Mulligatonney

          If you are a Bible reader, you already know the question and you have already justified the killing of your baby and have decided to not call it murder.

          But only because you have declared it by your Almighty Word not to be a real human. The Bible does have a name for THAT. You have to call yourself God in order to decide that. I believe the Bible covers that quite nicely.

          …and how many potentially huge contributors are sucked out out of their mothers wombs as a form of birth control, because it is INCONVENIENT for them to take care of a kid?

          Just because your liberal doublespeak allows you to call murder for convenience the “right to choose” does not make it moral. Why then, does your philosophy allow the killer of a pregnant woman to be tried for a double homicide? You cannot make the rules up fast enough to cover your helter-skelter laws that you make up every time you want to do something the law does not presently allow.

          You guys care more for puppies than you do human babies. But it is not something the politicians should decide, I agree. I am fine with God doing the judging. Just don’t ask me to be complicit with it or participate in any way or spend any of my tax dollars to promote it.

          • Robert P. Robertson

            I knew you were unable to answer my questions, Mulligan, because there is no spiritual answer to abortion. I understand that you, as well as any suicide-bomber and jihadist terrorist are leaning to your own understanding and misrepresent and misinterprets the Word of God. You think you have a righteous cause under the banner of God and Chrisitanity, but God has turned away from you. It will send you into the reprobation described in Romans. You will burn in your own hell.
            Besides that, you need to learn to respect other people’s humanity. If a woman chose to abort an unwanted or violence induced pregnancy, her decision is between her, God, and her doctor. If you know anything about the procedures of abortion, you would know that a woman or child or young woman requesting the procedure is counseled against it every step of the way. By the time she does go through it, it was her decision alone. Everyone should respect that. As you’ve said, it is “her right to choose”. It is not just moral, it is her inalienable right. If you don’t want to participate in it with “your” tax dollars, ask your employer to stop withholding income tax. Tell the retailer where you shop that you will not pay sales and federal taxes on the commodities you purchase and see where “your” righteous stand not to “participate” will lead you. All I can say is HAPPY TRAILS TO YOU.

          • Mulligatonney

            Only in the liberal mindset can the killing of a baby be equated with a commodities purchase…
            …and I am also sure, since you know God’s mind – you already know that he will congratulate you on killing what He has created and thank you for making decisions that belonged to Him.
            “Judge not, lest ye be judged”, yes? And yet – nothing but judgment and condemnation in your writing…
            This is the contradiction of the liberal of today. No actual logic at work, but plenty of judgment – and all the while accusing the other side of being judgmental…
            The Bible has a word for that as well – try “hypocrite or Pharisee”…
            “There is none righteous. No, not one”…
            That includes you.

          • Robert P. Robertson

            See what I said. Heh-heh-heh.

  • Dominick Vila

    Republicans are not pro-life, they are pro-birth. There is a difference between the two. A party that advocates taking a peanut butter sandwich from a hungry child to make sure we have a few extra bucks to buy the latest cell phone, a party that supports the death penalty, and a party that legislates who should live – a mother whose life may be endangered by pregnancy or a fetus – does not deserve to be called pro-life.

    • Fern Woodfork

      They Are Pro Bullshit!!

    • stcroixcarp

      They are also pro-war and pro-gun. How can you be pro-life and also be pro-torture? How can you be pro-life and support the rights of the insane, spousal and child abusers, and mass murderers to own and use guns?

      • Robert P. Robertson

        Beautiful perspective, my friend.

      • Russell Byrd

        I wonder sometimes if these arguments can be simplified by dividing everything into what is Human and what is animal. The liberal Human is always looking around for answers about the truth of life and the world about him. While the animal is always looking straight ahead for his next victim. They do not see, in fact they refuse to see the human wreckage about them. They are only concentrated on themselves and their base animal desire to control and accumulate, without regard for those about them. That is why Wall Street and the Banks equate in my mind the same as your impoverished local strong-arm criminal. The big difference is we punish the impoverished criminal. The rich ones thumb their nose at us

      • Mulligatonney

        …and how can you kill your own young and claim the “right to choose”?

        More liberal doublespeak…

        • atc333

          That is the choice of the individual forced to make it, based upon all the circumstances at the time, including the issue of how far into the pregnancy, the stages of development, medical issues of the mother, and/or the fetus,potential or real long term disabilities, financial consequences to the remainder of the family, for some not an easy decision.

          It is obviously much harder for most than the caviler manner in which the Right Wing attempts to mandate their dogma upon America, diligently cutting safety nets for the poor, defunding Planned Parenthood which provided much needed medical care to poor women, attempting to block changes in the health care laws which require contraceptives at no copay for women with health insurance (That is really GOP Insantiy, considering use of contraceptives reduce pregnancies, and therefor the number of potential abortions)

          Unfortunately, the Right Wing puts greater value upon a undeveloped fetus than it does on its young, and adult citizens for which this Nation has a very substantial investment, very callously choosing to abandon them with spending cuts and blocking programs which would restore our economy. choosing instead to continue to attempt to impose its failed economic policies upon this Nation and its people.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            AMEN!

          • Mulligatonney

            How about the cavalier manner in which people use abortion for birth control? Or the cavalier manner in which they discard their young?
            Or are you saying that all of those millions aborted every year are “real nail biters”…
            Of course, that really IS the liberal mentality – a drive-up window for everything – including the life of your child.

          • atc333

            For most people, choosing an abortion is not a”cavalier” choice. Most people do not chose to use abortion for birth control, after all, it is rather expensive, compared to pills or other contraceptives. Discarding their young? That is exactly what the Right Wing is doing with all of the children which you, and the Right Wing are insisting must be born, then once they come into existence, then immediately abandoned by the very GOP which out of the other side of its mouth is insisting that most safety nets must be greatly reduced or shut down, yanking the rug out from under the very children you are so concerned about after they are born.

            Put your money where your mouth is. If you want to mandate all pregnant women must bear their child no matter the consequences, then also insist that the GOP introduce legislation imposing an additional tax on all Americans to provide a designated fund for the support and care of these children (at 250k per child) you and others are insisting be brought into this world.

          • Wanda Davidson

            what Anthony said I am shocked that anybody able to earn $9575 in 4 weeks on the internet. did you look at this site w­w­w.K­E­P­2.c­o­m

          • Mulligatonney

            Sigh…

            Of course, that is not the point, you random collection of hammered synapses…

            Go ahead and have your abortions. Just do not try to justify it, legitimize it, make others out to be intolerant because they don’t believe in it, pay for it with their tax dollars, or force them to participate in it.

            Murder is a crime. You liberals worked very hard to get laws passed that allow you to murder your babies. You worked even harder and convinced yourselves that the babies were not real people. But you didn’t convince everyone. And that makes you liberals angry. Very Angry.

            Now you call those people that do not agree with you every venomous, judgemental name in the book – but you are very kind to those who agree that it is okay to kill your babies.

            But you are not kind and tolerant to those who disagree with you.

        • suburbancuurmudgeon

          The right is “TO CHOOSE” not “Have the government make the decision for you.” Big difference. How can you force women to give birth to unwanted children but then ignore those kids once they’re outside the womb?

    • mike

      Percentage of abortions caused by health of mother or fetus-4%. AGI 2004
      Incest-.5%
      Baloney, that the right wants the mother to die.
      Talking about phones how about the Life Line govt.subsidized program. 2008, $822 million and by 2011 2.1 billion spent by govt.. Another govt. program out of control.
      FCC claiming 9% fraud.

      • Jim Myers

        You forgot to mention the 99% fraud by the Tea Party…

        • plc97477

          Is it that low. I would have said higher.

          • Jim Myers

            Thanks for the comment.

            Jim

        • mike

          Now that is funny!!!! Wrong but funny.

      • Dominick Vila

        Are you comparing the Lifeline program put in place by the Reagan administration in 1984 to irresponsible tax breaks to people who don’t need them? The Lifeline charter is to provide information and access to programs designed to help people those whose earnings are at or below the poverty line, such as MEDICAID, temporary assistance to needy families, the National school lunch program, the Bureau of Indian Affairs, Head Start, etc.

        • mike

          Again you are off the mark again. Surprised you are not aware of this govt. program. Yes, Reagan had put into effect a program for rural areas to have phone service when there is an emergency but in 2008 cell phones were added.

          One of the names now it is Obamaphone.

          FCC say 41% are not eligible and 275,000 have more than 1 phone.

          Hell, Clarie McCaskill, D from Missouri was incensed when she got an offer of a free phone. “There is money clearly wasted here” she said on the Floor. “It sure gives the impression that govt. isn’t paying attention” she said, she wants to scrap it and start over.

          • Dominick Vila

            For some reason your statement reminds of Reagan’s claim of a woman driving her Cadillac to collect her welfare check.
            There is fraud, waste and abuse in every government program, at all levels of government. And there is also fraud, waste and abuse in many private sector institutions and programs. The key is to identify where there is waste, correct it, and make the existing programs more efficient and cost-effective.
            Blaming President Obama for something that has been going on since long before we were born is a bit of a stretch, don’t you think?
            What I have found is that the intent of most government programs is usually good, the problem is their execution and inadequate oversight. A case could be made about the fact that more effective regulation may reduce the incidence of fraud, waste and abuse, but I doubt you will agree with that. Not surprisingly, the only thing we get from the “conservative” side are claims of wrongdoing, never viable solutions.

          • plc97477

            One area that Obama has not gotten credit for is in eliminating fraud and waste in government. He has done more to clean up waste in our government than any president in many years.

          • angelsinca

            I want to believe this just like you do, I really do. But, the latest first family vacation kind of blows this myth to pieces.

          • Independent1

            What utter nonsense – it’s people like you that make the term human being a bad word. The Obama family, has BY FAR taken less vacation THAN ANY OF THE PAST 5 PRESIDENTS. George Bush took almost as much vacation in his first 18 months in office as Obama took in his 1st 4 years. Tell me, were you adding up the millions of dollars everytime Georgie Boy flew from Washington to his Texas ranch which happened almost every two to three months??? Are you aware that Georgie tied Nixon for the longest vacation ever taken by a president when he took 30 consecutive days JUST BEFORE 9/11 happened?? I’m still trying to figure out why he just happened to be away from Washington again on the day the 9/11 attack took place when he had been back to Washington for less than a week after just returning from a 30 day vacation. Did he actually know something might happen and wanted to make sure he wasn’t at the White House???? Hmmmm!!!

          • angelsinca

            It isn’t necessary to toss personal insult. Hit a nerve did we? It isn’t THE vacation, it is the timing of the $100 MILLION opulance, in light of the supposed hurtful cuts causing ‘children to starve’ and white house tour closures. Still comparing to Bush infriggincredible.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            As opposed to the $1billion a day in Iraq?

          • angelsinca

            “As opposed to the $1billion a day in Iraq?”

            The subject is the $100 million dollar extravagance during this, the ‘historic’, the Unlike Any Other, the One, the Only, The Great Recession, not the oranges in Iraq. But that’s an excellent point too. So much for promises.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            When I hear you complaining loudly in the streets about the money wasted in Iraq and Afghanistan, given to rapacious bankers who are STILL giving themselves lavish bonuses, and the rape of the middle class, THEN I will grant your rant about Obama’s vacation. Otherwise, go talk to the wall.

          • angelsinca

            “THEN I will grant your rant about Obama’s vacation”

            Your concurrence is unimportant. Depicting the conservative with actions of the liberal is confusing. The fact remains that a $100 million vacation is flipping off everyone that is struggling now due to cuts and policy and mandates. Everyone. So, here’s a healthy salute to you too, Mr. President.

          • Russell Byrd

            The worst waste I have ever seen is in the private sector. The difference is there are no aggrieved “tax payers” to have to explain things to. At best, small private shareholders just get the glowing reports the company brass releases to them.

          • jovan1984

            Me too! Time to take the UNDESERVED tax cut handouts away from the private sector!

          • imabrummie

            There is a great deal of waste in the public sector also. For example, the department for which I work has laid off a large number of people who do the actual work but has increased exponentially the number of “management” folks who receive excessive salaries and benefits for basically doing absolutely nothing. There are now three individuals receiving at least $50 per hour to “manage” less than half the number of clerical staff of a few years ago.

          • angelsinca

            “the only thing we get from the “conservative” side are claims of wrongdoing, never viable solutions”
            This exaggaration doesn’t carry much in the way of solution, Dominic. It is interesting to note that most suggestions from the right are summarily dissected and dismissed by the left, simply because they are from the right.

          • plc97477

            No simply because they will not work. And have been proven so many times.

          • angelsinca

            “No simply because they will not work”

            Assuming you are trying to say, “Republicans won’t work”, this is plain and simple BS. It’s the LEADERSHIP that has declared the GOP the enemy. YOUR leadership in the WH. Replay the tapes, just try a different channel that isn’t slobbering all over Obama, the first black president to successfully polarize an entire nation.

            I really miss MLK. He would have made a fine president. His agenda was concise and sincere for the benefit of mankind, not just ‘his’ people. Obama just wants to make a name for himself, nevermind the exhaustive toll on the nation. Have a good safari.

          • Russell Byrd

            What a lying dog. Isn’t this the one that everyone thought was Lana. Sounds like her without the vulgarity. I have to say that because I think you have outdone yourself this time. The only truth and common sense in your post are the words “the, is,” and “and.” If untruth and insincerity were damnable offenses, oops they are, then you will wind in in the lowest pit of Hell.

          • angelsinca

            Dogs don’t lie. Look, Russy-pooh, before claiming intellectual high ground, you should ALWAYS look around to make absolutely sure you aren’t the only dumbass in the room. That was (is) Lana Ward. bye.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            MLK would have been hung by the GOP.

          • angelsinca

            That’s a myth.

          • Dominick Vila

            Recent history indicate Democrats are more likely to work with Republicans on a variety of issues, than Republicans are to seek compromise when Democrats are pushing for legislation that is important to them. Examples range for the willingness of Speaker Tip O’Neill and the way democrats, including Hillary Clinton, surrendered and supported almost every single initiative proposed by George W. Bush after 9/11. In fact, the Democrats tendency to capitulate is one of the few concerns I have about the Democratic party.

            Yes, Dems have rejected proposals to privatize Social Security, dismantle MEDICARE, get rid of MEDICAID, and underfund social programs designed to help the middle class and the poor, but since that is one of the most important differences between the two parties., it is not surprising. The same would be true if Democrats criticized the GOP because of their position on issues such as abortion.

            As for what has happened since President Obama was elected President in January 2009, very little, if anything, has come out of the GOP other than obstructionism and criticism. There are still many issues that deserve bipartisan attention and resolution besides the core values of each party. Sadly, very little is being done to resolve them.

          • angelsinca

            Thanks . This take sounds a little more reasonable than your previous exaggaration that Republicans NEVER offer solutions.

            To say Democrats ‘surrendered’ to the will of GW Bush isn’t entirely sincere. Maybe they agreed with the president’s policies as doing the right thing.

            BTW: Tip O’Neil, the Speaker Democrats love to hate, was able to develop partisan cooperation during his 77-87 tenure. You can (and do) blame the current GOP for the president’s difficulties in legslation progress. Perhaps the GOP and its constituents simple don’t agree with Obama’s agenda. They ARE discussing the proposals, afterall and debating them (unlike Reid shelving of all gop-sponsored bills). Cooperation with the GOP though lies in LEADERSHIP skills like Reagan and O’Neil practiced and NOT the demonization of the entire party as Obama as his devotees continue to proliferate.

          • Russell Byrd

            More untruths. These groups have debunked your nonsense again and again and again, and yet here you are again espousing the same old lies.

          • Russell Byrd

            Let us correct the exaggeration. The Pubs offer constructive solutions every time Hell freezes over.

            Democrats did surrender even though most knew not to trust GW and his minions. It was mostly out of patriotism, which is often misplaced, and out of self-preservation, in case he was right.

            Tip O’Neil was neither that well respected nor that good, but he was a damn sight better than Boehner and company.

          • Dominick Vila

            The problem is that what the GOP considers “constructive plans”, such as the privatization of Social Security, dismantling MEDICARE, getting rid of MEDICAID, cutting food stamp funding, filibustering the Veterans Jobs Bill and other such initiatives are deliberate attempts to destroy the middle class and turn the United States into a plutocracy. If opposing such “plan” is considered “demonization” I’ll have to reconsider the evils attributed to Lucifer.

          • Russell Byrd

            The worst lies are about “demonization.” The right-wing media has been
            crucifying Obama since he was first elected and it is totally impossible
            to downplay the racial aspects of much of that demonization. Your mob
            will not discuss anything with anybody, except to say NO.

            Reid shelved those bills, (you exaggerate here), because all the Pubs
            want to do is filibuster by telephone. Useful debate is nearly
            impossible.

          • angelsinca

            And THERE it is…the RACE card. It didn’t take long to play it this time.

            Since there is only one ‘right wing media’ aka FoxNews, you must be talking about the challenges to questionable policy from this administration, just as they did with the prior admins. You do not take criticism of Obama well, that is for suresies. Calling the criticism lies and then calling your opponent names is the summarizing word from the lib library of faux logic.

            Sorry Russell, but I’m getting bored again. Have a nice life, really. Bye for the last time for now…see you for the next round of Lies About Conservatives and Other Pointless Pursuits (and we really have proof this time); I’ll wander in to call BS on the con-hate.

            Next time, maybe you could just prop up your poster child of unpleasant liberals, Fern Wood. Between it and Lana, I choose neither. But I do get bigger laughs from the one that gets all up in your face when she’s stuck in the back of the bus and has nothing but hostility and insult to charm her audience.

          • Russell Byrd

            You are disgusting and a racist. I can prove, and have done so before, that you are a racist by word and deed. With that being true, why should I not say so? And it is not a card, you spoon-fed, right-wing propaganda moron.

            As you say, when you show up we will start having a round of lies. Why do you mention Fern Wood? She only seems hostile to insufferable liars, such as yourself.

            Don’t let the door hit ya . . . . Time will tell if you are really gone. I doubt it, untruth is your vocation.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            The “race card” is vaild. Try googling “Ni%%er President” and see how many hits you get.

          • angelsinca

            “Try googling “Ni%%er President” and see how many hits you get”

            LOL. This is your ‘validation’ for invoking the race card? The results are 1) Racist Teens Forced to Answer for Tweets, 2) Woman Who Called for .. Assisin-ation, 3) one extremist racist webste, and 4) the infamous Santorum misquote.

            Most people have forgotten by now that Obama is black.. Yet, everytime you draw The Card, the racial slur pot continues to be stirred just to remind everyone the president is black. Who is stirring the racial pot, really? Honesty counts for extra points.

          • Russell Byrd

            I can also point out to the opinions of the real
            Conservatives. They know their party is finished and has been corrupted
            by a bunch of obstructionist crazies. Of course, they are not heard
            from much as they are a dying breed, like the party they supported.

            Your solution to fix the lack of communication and “demonization” is for anyone that has a dissenting opinion to just shut up and let you do what you want.

          • angelsinca

            “Of course, they are not heard from much as they are a dying breed, like the party they supported”

            Not really. They are busy working while you are busy whining about all things unlike yourself. bye.

          • Russell Byrd

            My comment was true and based on fact. My comment stands. Sorry for your rotten luck. Bye, I already know that is a lie.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Nope, we’re all working, waiting for the GOP to finish imploding. When that happens, we’ll pull together and finish rebuilding the country from Bush’s destruction. Honestly, how can you spew all that crap and continue to believe it?

          • angelsinca

            “we’ll pull together and finish rebuilding the country from Bush’s destruction”

            The GOP might implode, but it seems the DNC will beat them to it. The democrats have had four and half years to rebuild from the supposed destruction. It has managed to balloon the debt, hold unemployment to within 0.2 points from 7.8, witness a steady decline in the middle class wage, oversee the doubling in the price of fuel, continue to operate under a deficit, continued transfer of wealth out of the middle class, promote wars on religion, women, white men, the aged, all conservatives, assault the states with a steady stream of lawsuits and finally insult the boundaries of the constitution. ‘Nice job’ all around. Are you sure you were actually ‘working’? Facts aren’t that hard to believe, unless you disagree with them on a partisan level.

          • Russell Byrd

            Finally, I point to the topic of the article. Yes, THAT article above. Your wonderboys passed a law that is patently unconstitutional and did not listen to any dissent whatsoever. If I were to go on, how many times have these reasonable geniuses voted to repeal Obamacare. I have heard Pub Congressmen discuss it as a necessary “right of passage.” They need to keep doing it so that new Pub reps. can brag about it back home. Are they really listening to the American people, or their political opposition? I do not expect a rational answer from you.

          • Dominick Vila

            Wow, and you have the nerve to talk about exaggeration? Democrats demonize the Republican party? Where have you been the last 4.5 years? Obama would be blamed if a cold epidemic struck the USA toilets stopped flushing.
            As for the way Democrats behaved after 9/11, most of them did not support Bush because they agreed with his policies, but because they were terrified of the high probability of retaliation by the master of deceit.

          • angelsinca

            ” Where have you been the last 4.5 years?”

            Hoping for a leader to emerge that would bring the parties together for solutions. Or for someone to show Obama how to become one. I remained hopeful he was The One, up until the point that he 1) admonished the Supreme Court Justices at the SOTU address for not rubber stamping his constitutionally-challenged agenda, 2) When he appointed a gaggle of ‘czars’ without sharing the reasons or causes, 3) when he trashed America on his world tour of speeches and campaign promises (pick any trip-they are all apologetic and self depricating on OUR behalf, as he was in Germany this week), 4) When he staged actors in white lab coats to fake support by the medical community for the ppACA, as he did when he announced support for the ACA by the AARP, which they denied. The list of reasons goes much much deeper. But I don’t want to alienate you anymore than I already have.

            “Obama would be blamed if a cold epidemic struck the USA toilets stopped flushing”

            Not really. The proclivity to blame Bush (still) doesn’t allow much blame to be focused on Obama. This alone has discredited Obama in the eyes of most conservatives. The practice is immature, dodges responsibility, and demonstrates a clear lack of integrity and command expected of the president. No wonder Putin, the Irish House, China, the Saudis, the Queen Mother, and a growing list of others walk all over him. The cheesy gift probably did it for the Brits.

            “Democrats … were terrified of the high probability of retaliation by the master of deceit”

            Really? GW Bush striking FEAR in the hearts of the supposedly most intelligent party on the Hill? I had no idea you were so good at sarcasm. I barely controlled the urge to giggle since Bush is the most least likely to be threatening. If this is code-speak for Republicans being afraid of Obama, then there must a good reason for it. I claim duh on this one. I don’t get the fear factor.

          • Dominick Vila

            Examples of overt demonization and contempt for the Office of the Presidency by the Republican party or, more accurately, by the Tea Party, range from calling a U.S. President a liar during a State of the Union address being broadcast to the entire world, to questioning his eligibility to be President by attacking his persona, from questioning his citizenship and religion, to ridiculing his scholastic record.

            The Supreme Court deserved to be reminded of the fact that their charter is to interpret the law and defend the Constitution rather than engage in politics.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            There is no way ANYONE can bring the parties together when one party is committed to obstruction. THe GOP vowed on Day One to never cooperate with Obama.

            And, as a physician, I didn’t support ACA because I think we need a single payor. But the ACA is better than nothing.

            Frankly, I’m not sure what you DO want.

          • angelsinca

            “And, as a physician, I didn’t support ACA because I think we need a single payor. But the ACA is better than nothing. Frankly, I’m not sure what you DO want”

            THANK YOU for asking, Doctor. As a two time near-death patient, what I want is for us to stop convincing ourselves into settling for the mediocrity of what everyone agrees is a flawed ACA, when we can do better.

            The ppACA scheme needs to be pulled back and simplified, to be centered around single payor/payer, and filled with choices using the free market to promote what Americans do best; compete. There should be more healthcare clinics than WalMarts. If healthcare is THAT important, there should be more accessible, affordable and convenient clinics than places to be entertained.

            How serious are we about the health priority, really?

            We need choices to improve our lives, not dictates. I appalud those that are willing to put the brakes on those dictates. If Democrats were the ones obstructing the wild ride to Anywhere But Here, I’d cheer them on instead of the GOP.

            Some of us would like our choices and a few reminders that this government is supposed to be (and still is) US, not those that are compelling us to do things they exempt themselves from doing.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Uh, who exactly is dictating, and dictating what? And frankly, I think choice is overrated. Americans want to think they are exceptional and they’re not.

          • angelsinca

            ” Americans want to think they are exceptional and they’re not”

            Do they, now. These claims of American exceptionalism usually come from people that aren’t Americans or Americans that are unhappy with the actions of their government.

            “Uh, who exactly is dictating, and dictating what?”

            The dictatorial positions have been assumed by those that place restrictions on life, liberty or the pursuit of hapiness. The mandates of the ACA makes 64% of the country quite unhappy presently. After people get their first notice of wage garnishment for not having health insurance, surely more will join those ranks. That is, if people still have a wage to be garnished with the rapid contraction of the jobs market caused by the ACA.

            “frankly, I think choice is overrated”

            You would make a fine dictator

          • Inthenameofliberty

            Well said Angelsinca. Very well said.

          • Russell Byrd

            Whoa, that statement is not an exaggeration and, as well, is an off-topic attempt to confuse the original discussion. Even if it were an exaggeration, it is not meant to give a solution, just identify the root cause. You people need lessons in elementary logic. Ever hear of “higher order thinking skills” that moron Texas Pubs are so hot to eliminate. You need some.

          • angelsinca

            Thanks for off-topic insult, Byrdshit. The topic was ‘solutions’. The reply was ‘solutions’. Whenever the adjective ALL is used, it usually flags exaggaration. Dominic is honest enough to admit it, though reluctantly. Bye.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Republicans have no solutions.

          • angelsinca

            “Republicans have no solutions”

            I hear an echo. This is what Mr Vila already said and is simply a partisan jab easily debunked by the sequestration approval. You may not like that ‘solution’ example, but the goal was (and still is) to manage the national debt where no other solution could be agreed on.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            No, they are dismissed because dissection proves them both wrong and hypocritical. Had Gore been President on 9/11, Republicans would have been howling for his scalp.

          • angelsinca

            “Had Gore been President on 9/11, Republicans would have been howling for his scalp”

            Hard to say, but could be true after the dissection proved him culpable of profiting from his carbon credit scheme.

          • imabrummie

            They blame Obama because they are incapable of believing they themselves are in any way responsible for what has happened to this country and what was once a flourishing middle class. Ironic considering the majority who put these clowns in office are themselves middle class. Seems they are bent on self destruction!

          • Mark Forsyth

            I have one of those phones you condemn.I automatically qualified when I became disabled and my income was drastically reduced. I like the phone and am grateful to have it,no thanks to you.

          • mike

            I am sorry you are having trouble. You are one of 59% that are eligible for the program. I guess you didn’t read that the 5 carriers have so many(41%) that are not eligible.
            I hope all goes well for you.

          • Russell Byrd

            I think once again you missed the point (no surprise there), people like Ms. McCaskill and myself should not be getting these offers. The private entities that run these programs for the government only are interested in getting these phones in the hands of anyone that will take them. The more phones the better. They do not care if they are needed nor do they care to take the expense and target individuals that could benefit. And, when you do your typical blub-blub response, remember, I did get several offers for these phones from major providers.

          • mike

            Listen to Sen. McCaskill when she says it is being abused and needs to scrapped and replaced. 800 million to 2.1 billion in 5 years.
            NOT SURPRISED, that you are not concerned about wasteful govt. programs. Looks like you and Dom have never seen a govt. program you didn’t like.

          • Russell Byrd

            Clean out your ears. Asked and answered! Too much to expect you to have reading comprehension.

          • Independent1

            Russell, based on a number of the issues Mike has championed and the arguments he’s used, I’m getting fairly certain that Mike is a paid troll of the US Chamber of Commerce – which in my estimation is the next most corrupt organization in America following the GOP itself.

          • Russell Byrd

            Agreed. I just hate people like Mike that think they can invade a group and take control even though the majority despises his ideas. Very typical Teanderthal. I have pushed it rather far, but I just HATE liars and bullies. Admittedly, I am not a regular poster so I may not be welcome either, but I cannot stand those that sell injustice as a reasonable viewpoint. Good night.

          • mike

            Looks like you can’t see the waste in this program.
            As to “asked and answered” only in your little mind.

          • Russell Byrd

            It has been answered before. You are just a low-life troublemaker that harasses and will not take no for an answer. Every time someone says anything you change the subject or create a new thread. You are unreasonable in so many ways and are just here to disrupt.

          • Russell Byrd

            And here’s another “multiple” post:

            Wikipedia describes: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[

            That’s you Mike, NOT me. i am harassing no one. I am only here to put a boot in your rear.

          • mike

            It has not been answered and it is not me changing the subject every time I prove your point wrong.

            Again, don’t respond Jerk.

          • Russell Byrd

            Mommy, mommy, mommy, he is being mean to me. Make the bad Russ go away.

            I am not the one changing the subject. I only reply to you to criticize the drivel you have spewed.

            Again, do not suggest you can curtail my posting. After all, you are just here to troll. I may be the least favorite poster here, but I am batting for the home team, so to speak.

          • mike

            Russell, how’s Julia? You know the one Obama made a spoof of. The one that insulted women, hated men.

            Life of Julia an Obama spoof. LOL

          • Russell Byrd

            Answered Mike you sorry, lying sack.

          • mike

            So you didn’t say the Obama’s “Life of Julia” was a spoof. Liar, liar pants on fire. You big Joke.

          • Russell Byrd

            Sorry mike, you have been had. I just took a guess, maybe a little risky, but it came in for me. REALLY, you have been waving a flag saying “mental defect and damaged psyche” since you have been here. My error was being too cautious to reel you in. You failed to heed the underlying warning in several of my posts. You should have guessed this would happen. Now, you have made how many posts flogging that one stupid little point. “Julia” was probably the only point you have made since you have been here and you ran with it, even though it was fake and not worth the trouble anyway. You are a very little man, mike, and it has nothing to do with stature. Get counceling or at least get some Xanax or something.

          • mike

            Not going to dignify your loser comments. LOL!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            BBBBBwwwwaaaaahhhhh! I am glad I pulled this scam, but I never thought anyone would fall this hard. Of course, this is the way it is supposed to work. I just need to get back into practice.

            All that time spent, trolling for something that was not worth having to begin with. I mean, if this was the best you had, you should have stayed home. And to post that much BS to prove a point not even worth bringing up. AND TOTALLY OFF-TOPIC, as well. Upon review, I even found that I gave the game away and you were too stupid to catch it. Really, overwrought may be a better description. I really, really enjoyed doing business with you!

            I have logged the posts and I will remember with pride this little episode. So for tonight, I will leave it to you to continue your BS all on your lonesome. :-)

          • mike

            LOL!!!! Life of Julia is a spoof by Obama-YOUR WORDS. Pretty much sums up the stupidity, ignorance and world you live in. ZERO CREDIBILITY.
            Even more ridiculous is that you said this was your plan all along. Better yet, you are a fraud.

            LOL!!!! Life of Julia is a spoof by Obama-your words.
            What a f_ _ king idiot.

          • Russell Byrd

            Cheap trash. This was posted hours after I revealed that the only “spoof” was on him. He made post after post belaboring an unimportant off-topic subject. Then I revealed he was being had. It did shut his mouth for a while, but now his urge for the last word, even if he has to lie, is too great for him to resist.

            You picked the OFF-TOPIC subject that was not even important. When I fed you the slop about being a spoof, you ran like a hog after slop. Again, again, and again. Fixated to make a useless point to prove my ignorance. Then I pulled the rug from under you. I did shut you up for awhile.

            Looks like I ran a train on you! Remember this when we meet again. Choo choo!

          • mike

            Still laughing at a pseudo intellectual. Finally, found the real you, a stupid, uninformed, Doofus!!!

            Life of Julia, a spoof by Obama. LOL!!!

            What I find most amusing are your remarks about “Cherry Picking” the facts, but you never produced the counter point. Too lazy or no facts to refute, probably both.

            There will be a next time and I will remind you each time of your lack of credibility and small mind.

            Life of Julia, a spoof by Obama. Russell you are one very intellectually dishonest person.

            LOL!!

          • Russell Byrd

            YOUR ONLY REFUGE IS TO EMPLOY YOUR MOST BASIC AND FAVORITED SKILL: LYING . . . .

            CHOO CHOO!

          • mike

            LOL!!!

            Life of Julia a spoof by Obama. Ignorance is bliss in your world.

          • Russell Byrd

            Cheap trash. This was posted hours after I revealed that the only “spoof” was on him. He made post after post belaboring an unimportant off-topic subject. Then I revealed he was being had. It did shut his mouth for a while, but now his urge for the last word, even if he has to lie, is too great for him to resist.

            You chose this OFF-TOPIC subject that was not even important. When Ifed you the crap about it being a spoof, you ran like a hog after slop. Again, again, and again. Fixated to make a useless point to prove my ignorance. Then I pulled the rug from under you. I did shut you up for awhile. The tragedy is you MUST cover up your errors and have the last
            word.

            Looks like I ran a train on you! Remember this when we meet again. Choo choo!

          • mike

            Now you are sending repeats. More diarrhea of the brain, I hope it isn’t Dementia. That shouldn’t even happen to you.

          • Russell Byrd

            YOUR ONLY REFUGE IS TO EMPLOY YOUR MOST BASIC AND FAVORITE SKILL: LYING . . . .

            CHOO CHOO!

          • Russell Byrd

            Since you were too stupid to get it. Who forms the Chamber of Commerce? What is its primary membership? If you ask the Chamber for statistics and THEN ask its members for the same statistics, DO YOU REALLY THINK THEIR WILL BE A DIFFERENCE?

            You have got to have the last word. I just want your lying a** to go away. Don’t think you are winning as I will go on until this group is shutdown. . . .

            From now on their will only be on topic posts AND a LOT of repeats.

          • mike

            Life of Julia, a spoof by Obama. Perfect example of your thought process.

            LOL!!!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            You are only advertising your own stupidity, but I guess when you are this stupid, you cannot tell the difference.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.” Not “Life of Julia.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

            Fits you to a “T.”

          • mike

            Did you not emphatically say, “life of Julia was a spoof, Yes or NO???

          • Russell Byrd

            AND MADE FUN OF YOU FOR CHAIN POSTING AN OFF-TOPIC SUBJECT THAT IS OF LITTLE IMPORTANCE EXCEPT TO KEEP AN OFF-TOPIC ARGUMENT GOING. I MADE A FOOL OF YOUR STUPID LYING ASS. NOW YOU WANT TO SPIN IT BACK. SORRY, EVERYONE THAT I HAVE SHOWN THIS TOO IS LAUGHING..

            YOU ARE TOO STUPID TO REALIZE THAT THE CHAMBER IS MOSTLY COMPOSED OF SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS. ANY STATISTICS FROM ONE WILL MIRROR THE OTHER.

            DID I EMPHATICALLY REEL YOU IN WITH A RED HERRING? YEP, THAT I DID.

          • Russell Byrd

            AS I SAID, THE SLIDESHOW IS EXAGGERATED, BUT TRUE. IN THE REAL WORLD,
            IT IS NOT VERY IMPORTANT. REMEMBER, YOU BROUGHT IT UP. I JUST REELED
            YOUR STUPID ASS IN.

          • mike

            Your post is delusional as usual.
            Exaggerated-tell that to Obama. LOL!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            Arrogant, ignorant a-hole.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They
            may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or
            off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room,
            or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
            response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion

          • Russell Byrd

            Your racist fixation with Obama is amazing.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Russell Byrd

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They
            may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or
            off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room,
            or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
            response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Russell Byrd

            To stop this all you have to say is, DONE. That simple and you even get the last post.

            I realized I neglected to say that, but that is all that was ever necessary.

          • mike

            And let a Doofus have the last word. I don’t think so.

          • Russell Byrd

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • Russell Byrd

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.” Not “Life of Julia.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

            Fits you to a “T.”

          • Russell Byrd

            And mike, until you brought it up, I was not even aware of “Life of Julia,” but after watching it I hatched this plan. So, in a sense, this entire episode of events is due to you. Thank you!

          • mike

            Baloney, Doofus!!!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            And mike, until you brought it up, I was not even aware of “Life of
            Julia,” but after watching it I hatched this plan. So, in a sense, this
            entire episode of events is due to you. Thank you!

            Bbbbwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh!

          • mike

            LOL!!! “Hatched this plan”, HORSE MANURE.

          • Russell Byrd

            As I have tried to say, though maybe not the best post, their is waste in every program I have seen. Public and private. It is just that the private sector does not have to answer for it. The point of the program is that it help Americans that are having trouble keeping up with the successful. No one is buying houses or cars for these people, regardless of your fantasies. This is about helping people, that need it, in a consistent manner for as long as they need. If you want them to instantly have good paying jobs, why don’t you take a reasonable chance on the President’s job bill. Already know your answer. . . .

            By the way, this thread of yours is grossly off-topic.

          • Independent1

            As I mentioned in another post, Senator McCaskill is wrong about the program, it is not paid for by taxes controlled by Congress, it’s paid for by the USF fee that every telephone user pays for as part of their fone bill. And there are already numerous things being done to minimize/eliminate the waste, fraud and abuse that some see in the program. Here’s more info on that: (So YOU and Senator McCaskill need to leave the program ALONE…it has helped millions of low-income folks over the years.)

            On January 31, 2012, the Commission adopted comprehensive reform and modernization of the Lifeline program. As a universal service program that fulfills Congress’s mandate to ensure the availability of communications to all Americans, Lifeline for the past 25 years has helped tens of millions of low-income Americans afford basic phone service. Access to telephone service is essential for finding a job, connecting with family, or getting help in an emergency, and the percentage of low-income households with phone service has increased from 80% in 1985, when Lifeline began, to nearly 92% last year.

            Changes to eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse, saving up to $2 billion over 3 years

            •Setting a savings target of $200 million for 2012, and putting the Commission in a position to adopt an appropriate budget for the program in early 2013 after review of a six-month report and one-year report on the effects of the Order.
            •Creation of a National Lifeline Accountability Database to prevent multiple carriers from receiving support for the same subscriber. The database will build on FCC efforts in 2011 that eliminated nearly 270,000 duplicate subscriptions in 12 states following review of over 3.6 million subscriber records, saving $33 million.
            •Creation of eligibility databases from governmental data sources, enabling fully automated verification of consumers’ initial and ongoing Lifeline eligibility. This would reduce the potential for fraud while cutting red tape for consumers and providers. A database based on the three most common federal benefit programs through which consumers qualify for Lifeline will be created no later than the end of 2013.

            •Establishing a one-per-household rule applicable to all providers in the program, defining household as an “economic unit” so that separate low-income families living at the same address can get connected.
            •Establishing clear goals and metrics to measure program performance and effectiveness.
            •Phasing out support for services such as Toll Limitation – subsidies to carriers for blocking or restricting long-distance service—and ending Link Up – subsidies to carriers for initial connection charges. Link Up will continue in Tribal lands.
            •Reducing burdens on carriers by establishing a uniform, interim flat rate of reimbursement, allowing carriers to obtain a subscriber’s signature electronically, and streamlining enrollment through uniform, nationwide eligibility criteria.

          • mike

            So the FCC telling lawmakers that 41% subscribers could not demonstrate eligibility or didn’t respond request for certification with another 287,000 have more than one phone are wrong. You also don’t think 800 million 2009 to 2.1 billion in 2012 is not a big leap. This year FCC predicts $400 million fraud in 2013.

            Yes, new rules are in place and that is great. Good luck with that.

            McCaskill got the solicitation in Feb. of this year. They have promised to create a data base, elimination of waste, fraud and abuse. Again, good luck with that. Just remember FCC pays $10 for every phone distributed.

            This program that gave access to first responders in an emergency has now gone from land lines to cell phones and is now headed to the internet all at the expense of those NOT eligible but also having no choice in not paying the fee.

          • Independent1

            Mike, the fact people are solicited for the Lifeline program does not mean that the phone company servicing their area would provide them with the service unless they met the following requirements (the service is paid for by Cell Phone users whose phone bills include a USF charge (not taxpayers):

            The Lifeline program is available to eligible low-income consumers in every state, territory, commonwealth, and on Tribal lands. You must be eligible to enroll. To participate in the program, consumers must either have an income that is at or below 135% of the federal Poverty Guidelines or participate in one of the following assistance programs:
            Medicaid;
            Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (Food Stamps or SNAP);
            Supplemental Security Income (SSI);
            Federal Public Housing Assistance (Section 8);
            Low-Income Home Energy Assistance Program (LIHEAP);
            Temporary Assistance to Needy Families (TANF);
            National School Lunch Program’s Free Lunch Program;
            Bureau of Indian Affairs General Assistance;
            Tribally-Administered Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TTANF);
            Food Distribution Program on Indian Reservations (FDPIR);
            Head Start (if income eligibility criteria are met); or
            State assistance programs (if applicable).
            Who Pays for the Lifeline Program?

            All telecommunications service providers and certain other providers of telecommunications must contribute to the federal USF based on a percentage of their end-user telecommunications revenues. These companies include wireline telephone companies, wireless telephone companies, and certain Voice over Internet Protocol (VoIP) providers.
            The fact that people may receive a phone to solicit sales means nothing unless the individual who receives a phone qualifies for the service as specified above. Senator McCaskill needs to better understand the program before she discontinues a service many low-income people are depending on to find a job, maintain their safety, keep in contact with other family members and more. Here legislation is a Big Mistake!!!

          • mike

            I guess you want to ignore that 41% are not eligible, but have the phones-FCC. Govt. program has jumped from 800,000 million dollars to 2.1 trillion in 5 years. 287,000 people with more than one phone.

            Another govt program out of control. Which doesn’t bother you since you are a big govt guy.

          • Independent1

            No, I’m not a “Big Government guy”! I love that Obama has reduced the size of governmnents across America by over 600,000 after Bush increased the size of governments during his 8 years by more workers than all the presidents since WWII combined (by more than 2,000,000). But I’m also not a “Let’s make people suffer because some folks are abusing the system guy” THAT’S NOT HOW YOU DEAL WITH THESE SITUATIONS!! You don’t PUNISH folks who are playing the game fairly because there’s fraud in the system!! You do like the FCC is doing – THE FCC IMPLEMENTED A PROGRAM LAST YEAR TO FIX THE FRAUD AND ABUSE IN THE SYSTEM!! You either missed my post where I sent you what the FCC was doing or you purposely ignored it so you could continue to make waves!!!

          • mike

            I never got your post.
            It seems it is still going on since McCaskill just received the offer in the past few months. There are a number of you tube videos showing the scams this spring.
            I never said “let’s make people suffer”, i said the program is out of control, numbers prove that.

            There you go again with strange figures. Politicus USA, “real liberal politic” has Bush 43 at 53,000 increase of fed. employ, and Obama through 2011 at 275,000 fewer fed. employees. Wonder where the other 325,000 went in such a short time.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            How about that $1billion/day in Iraq?

          • Independent1

            Russell, what Senator McCaskill and Mike are ignoring is that the FCC established a program in 2012 to work on fixing the abuses in the Lifeline program. Here’s some information on that:

            Changes to eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse, saving up to $2 billion over 3 years

            Setting a savings target of $200 million for 2012, and putting the Commission in a position to adopt an appropriate budget for the program in early 2013 after review of a six-month report and one-year report on the effects of the Order.

            Creation of a National Lifeline Accountability Database to prevent multiple carriers from receiving support for the same subscriber. The database will build on FCC efforts in 2011 that eliminated nearly 270,000 duplicate subscriptions in 12 states following review of over 3.6 million subscriber records, saving $33 million.

            Creation of eligibility databases from governmental data
            sources, enabling fully automated verification of consumers’ initial and ongoing Lifeline eligibility. This would reduce the potential for fraud while cutting red tape for consumers and providers.
            A database based on the three most common federal benefit programs through which consumers qualify for Lifeline will be created no later than the end of 2013.

            Establishing a one-per-household rule applicable to all providers in the program, defining household as an “economic unit” so that separate low-income families living at the same address can get connected.

            Establishing clear goals and metrics to measure program performance and effectiveness.

            Phasing out support for services such as Toll Limitation –
            subsidies to carriers for blocking or restricting long-distance service—and ending Link Up – subsidies to carriers for initial connection charges. Link Up will continue in Tribal lands.

            Reducing burdens on carriers by establishing a uniform, interim flat rate of reimbursement, allowing carriers to obtain
            a subscriber’s signature electronically, and streamlining enrollment through uniform, nationwide eligibility criteria

          • Russell Byrd

            Thanks. Was it you that noted that there is a difference between receiving an offer and actually getting a phone? The Republitards do not understand the difference.

            I am still sparring with these nuts. I have even explained my rational for doing so, but they can’t seem to understand. What is weird “mike” and “angelsinca” both claim that they are neither Tea Baggers or Pubs. They insist they are open-minded independents. I even spilled the beans on one of my favorite life tenets: When they bad mouth me, they are leaving someone else alone. They are so fixated on “winning” that they do not care if they are being played.

          • Russell Byrd

            You know Mike, one reason I dislike your kind so much, is that you will never take correction when your ideas are pure boners. When you get exhausted flogging a dead idea, you just change subject and move on to the next loser. You are just a troll that is here to stir s**t, not express a reasonable opinion. What was this conversation even about? I had to go and re-read the article to find out. Your just here to cause dissension because you know that we cannot reach through the network and stretch your neck. People like you really do need to take your meds.

          • mike

            Mine are far more reasonable than yours.
            Show me the boners!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            We have been busting that ego bubble of yours all day. What boners have we NOT shown you.

            If this is the best you can do, I guess we can assume you plead no contest on the rest of my post.

          • 4sanity4all

            How about your insistence that the government is paying for abortions. By law, they do not. Never have.

          • demz taters

            The phone companies aggressively market the program. Actually getting the phone requires means testing.

          • mike

            Baloney, tell that Sen. McCaskill. Tell that to FCC and tell them the 41% who they say abused the system were means tested.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Uh, I do believe the “Obamaphone” started under Clinton and continued under Dubya and Obama:

            “Who qualifies?
            The free cell phones only go to those who qualify for the program under the exact same eligibility requirements that have been in effect since 1996. An applicant is generally eligible if they are at or below 135-150% of the Federal Poverty Guidelines (depending upon the state in
            which they live), or if they already participate in one of many public assistance programs such as Medicaid, food stamps, energy assistance, public housing and others.Nothing about the Lifeline eligibility has changed since President Clinton’s days. Nothing has changed since President Bush’s days.”
            http://www.freegovernmentcellphones.net/faq/obama-phone

            “If you’re upset that Obama is giving “freeloaders” gratis cell phones paid for with your tax money, don’t be. Firstly, Obama had nothing to do with the Lifeline program: the “Obama phone” narrative is a myth that both liberals and conservatives have fallen for since 2009. Secondly, Lifeline isn’t paid for with tax revenues. Rather, Lifeline is funded with a pool of money, called the Universal Service Fund, which is paid for with revenue donations from telecommunications providers. Some of those providers—like Verizon, for instance—pass off that cost to their customers with a Universal Service fee, but the government doesn’t mandate that the money come from citizens, meaning
            it’s technically not a tax.”

            http://gawker.com/5947133/the-obama-phone-program-has-nothing-to-do-with-obama

          • mike

            No, it started under Reagan for land lines in rural areas. 2008 cell phones were added. What you can seem to not understand is the FCC has shown that 41% who have received the phones are ineligible, of which 287,000 have more than one.

            I never said any thing about Obama having any thing to do with the phones, what I said the people that have them call them “Obamaphones” thinking he gave them out.

            The point of this is that it is another govt program out of control. I know where these monies come from for this program, but again I have no choice. In 2008 before cell phones were added $800,000 million was spent, it is now 2.1 trillion. That is the point.

      • demz taters

        Funny how right wingers not only never address the most out-of-control sector of government, which is defense, but they actually hold it sacred and are always agitating to throw more money at it.

        • mike

          I sure don’t see many democrats in congress really wanting to address the issue. Patty Murray, (D) sure doesn’t want to see cuts, nor Ohio Senator Sherrod Brown, (D).

          Funny how left wingers are not addressing the out-of-control IRS. or DOJ, EPA mancaves. Or the administration in free fall with no leader.

          Bigger yet is the left not addressing the Entitlement programs that are in serious trouble.

          • jovan1984

            Defense is more out of control and bloated than so-called entitlements. By about 20 times at least.

          • mike

            Typical, left winger burying its head in the sand over Entitlements. Even Obama in December wanted to put on the table during negotiations and the left cried to high heaven over him doing it and he immediately took it off. It can not survive as it is now but that means nothing to you and your ilk.

          • jovan1984

            Typical right wing nut burying his head in the sand over bloated defense spending that is totally unnecessary.

            Even most conservatives are opposed to undoing the defense cuts that are part of the sequester because it could embolden the left to undo all entitlement cuts that are part of the sequester.

          • mike

            Keep trying some day you might have a point.

          • Russell Byrd

            Not an argument, dirtbag.

          • Russell Byrd

            I hate to correct you, but I think that is a dungheap.

    • plc97477

      Good point. Thank you for bringing it up.

    • jovan1984

      AMEN!

    • Mulligatonney

      Sounds like you are describing the Democrat Party. Except for the buying the cell phone part…

    • JSquercia

      Adding even further to the irony is the fact that many (most notably the Catholic Bishops) are not only antiabortion but anti birth control , one thing that would prevent unwanted pregnancies .

      The same folk are just as crazy at the other end of life, as illustrated by the terri Schiavo case where they fought to keep her alive but also gleefully cut the very Medicaid funds that paid for her care

      • suburbancuurmudgeon

        Fortunately, the Catholic rank and file are just fine with contraception.

        • JSquercia

          Most Catholics I know simply IGNORE the Church position on Birth Control and this has been the case since the 60′s .We at time had hopes that Vatican II would change THAT .Unfortunately Pope John Died and Pope Paul added people to the group that was studying the issue .In spite of that it their recommendation that the position be changed . Pope Paul overruled their recommendation .

  • Eleanore Whitaker

    Once you dig deeply into the psyches of GOP bull males you see what they are. Grossly insecure individuals who must constantly feed their bloated egos. Usually at someone else’s expense. I have no respect for men like McConnell who nicely and conveniently accuses THIS president of conducting a secretive presidency. And when the GOP gangsters pulled off a Whitewater secret mission? And a secret slush fund paid to snoops that came from taxpayers?

    But, let’s not digress here. There’s a really smelly reason the GOP men want more babies born…Theirs are the states who rake in billions in tax ratables for all those military industries…No war? No profit. No war? No men and women to fight..and no reason to GO to war. No Profit? No red state pork that comes mainly from federal funds. See? And you thought these GOP bull males were just protecting life? Wrong…they are protecting pork…for every baby born, they know at least in one five will join the military and all they have to do is keep repeating how they are “fighting for their country.” Since when is this “country” comprised of red states who feast on pork? When it comes down it, the only important thing to GOP bull males is how much slush they can create to send to their states while other states get the biggest stiffing. Pro-life? Wrong…Pro-Birth and only pro-birth.

    • Nana

      After pushing this “support our troops” mantra, I guess once you become a veteran, the Republican support is no longer there. Any child of a vet only has to look at the treatment his mother or father got for defending our freedoms and think twice about enlisting. Of course, if fewer or fewer people enlisted, they would just enact the draft. What an unholy mess.

      • Russell Byrd

        But if more kids are born into poverty AND receive little education, there will be a larger pool of unemployed underemployed young people to recruit into their (industrial-) military complex. The under-educated remains attractive because they will be easy to brainwash into the ultra-conservative (Fascist) way of thinking. History has demonstrated that repeatedly. That is why our Founding Fathers did not want nor did they trust a standing military. That is why they gave us the Second Amendment with all its unfortunate consequences. BUT that is an entirely different subject. However, we need to watch our military closely. Military brass has already been caught using brain washing techniques on our Congressional leaders to influence the outcome of votes.

      • Eleanore Whitaker

        The reason the GOP bull males don’t think it’s of any consequence to send men and women off to war and then drop them like hot cakes as veterans is because GOP bull males only believe war is “business.”
        Therefore, the human element doesn’t come into the picture for them. To them and their warmongering military industrialist cronies, war is profit. Period. End of discussion. Lives lost don’t matter to them. Because stewards of CEO crony wealth, that would invite emotion into the picture of war and emotion is anathema to CEOs and their stewards. So as long as they remain immune to the realities that in order to grow wealth through war as a major US industry, they won’t see other peoples’ children dying to make them rich. See the entitlement in their attitudes?

        • angelsinca

          Too bad it isn’t the GOP sending our kids into war under this want-to-play-soldier president. Theory fail.

          • Russell Byrd

            Not a theory, therefore no fail. In any case, the current administration has inherited a war (remember your heroes W & Dick) and is stuck with trying to find the solution.

        • plc97477

          I am not sure it would make a big difference if they did see the devastation.

          • Eleanore Whitaker

            And therein lies the greatest danger to our human, civil and Constitutional rights. Facing head on the GOP implied immunity to these rights is all that remains of the American dream. How many of the men who served active duty in Viet Nam today now realize why there were so many millions protesting that war? How many who fought in Desert Storm and Iraq will feel the same when they realize they weren’t fighting for their country but for military industrialists profits?

            These men and women in our military enlist believing they are doing their duty. Then, they return home to no jobs, no futures and end up like the vets in CA homeless and without adequate care. A worse obscenity than this can only be guys like Eric Prince formerly of Blackwater who can laugh at the dead and maimed through his wads of profit.

    • plc97477

      I think you hit the nail on the head. I have wondered for some time if that was what this was all about.

    • angelsinca

      “There’s a really smelly reason the GOP men want more babies born…Theirs are the states who rake in billions in tax ratables for all those military industries”

      Another conspircay theory. Too bad is isn’t worthy to wash the hogs. Abortion is about preventing the 800+K deaths each year from abortion. Period. All the spin and lies about the ‘evil’ GOP doesn’t change that fact.

      • Russell Byrd

        Doesn’t change the fact that in a Democracy they do not have the right to invade and control the bodies of other people. If you think you have a right to say yes, then I have a right to say no.

  • howa4x

    It is really time for all the women to stand up and say we are not going to take this anymore from older white men that have been suppressing them for centuries. A lot of women elect these uncaring people to office. Michelle Bachmann for all her devotion to Jesus is a leader in cutting programs for the poor children. Sarah Palin who had a baby with disabilities should realize that government support needs to be available to women who don’t make the salary that Fox pays her. Republicans always had a history of attacking poor children. During the Regan administration ketchup was declared to be a vegetable in the school lunch program. He was the first to attack children and is considered an Icon with the republicans so that should tell you something. Today with the fascination about the writings of Ayn Rand, a selfish, self absorbed, venal, uncaring person, the republicans have found a justification to separate the makers from the takers. Makers need to be rewarded and takers need to be punished is the republican view. Republicans now preach about Rand’s writings in the same way they talk about being saved by Jesus. This is a party that has come off the rails. What makes this work for republicans is that the religions are silent about the treatment of children. You don’t hear the US council of church’s condemn the republicans for cutting SNAP. They collect millions from everyday people so where is the money spent. Mostly on lavish salaries, and construction of palace like houses of worship. Catholic priests have remained silent about the treatment of children since it would seem hypocritical while sexual abuse of children charges are still being flung at them. We are in a deep moral crisis when the accumulation of trinkets and wealth mean more to a society than the welfare of all it’s children.

    • Independent1

      Great assessment! To me, the really sad part is that millions upon millions of supposed Christians are so blind to what you’ve obviously described so accurately about many of America’s religious leaders – that they are blindly letting these leaders lead them to damanation rather than salvation.

      • Robert P. Robertson

        You know, Independent1, it’s a sad commentary that the church, spiritual people, has ham-strung themselves in such a way. It’s like they are between a rock and a hard place. They are doing what Christ admonished: “You can’t serve two masters”. They can’t serve Mammon and God at the same time. That is why religion has fallen from grace, and a many people are leaving the church to go into their prayer closets.

        • Russell Byrd

          Now, now Robert, we do not need anyone steering us from the true path of Mammon to this God character. Oh, how uncool.

          I agree and I find it revolting that the same characters will claim that America is a christian nation, though they seem to hate everyone that has a different viewpoint, including Christ.

          • plc97477

            The Christ they want to follow would have had to be a liberal. There is too much hate on the other side.

          • Russell Byrd

            . . .Amen!

        • demz taters

          Jesus’ harshest condemnations were reserved for those who would berate and blame the poor while extolling their own self-righteousness.

          • Russell Byrd

            Let’s face it. The “typical” American Christian despises Christ. Put one on the spot over Christ’s teachings and you find that he does not know any, gets mad, quotes off topic scripture, or interprets an escape clause into the Christ’s command.

      • howa4x

        sadly it is all about the money. Human values are laughed at by the republicans who call people soft for caring about children. Remember they are tough white men.

    • Robert P. Robertson

      Not to mention that Booby Jindal’s son was born with a mental disability and has cut planned parenthood, social aide programs for children and single mothers, has privatized health care as his solution to ACA, and has dismantled and privatized mental health programs in Louisiana.

      • Michael Kollmorgen

        Why should he care what other people have to pay for out of their own pockets. He can very easily pay for his own son’s treatments and care.

        Wealth does not spread around that easily for everyone to afford it. The top 10% is what is killing this country. This is what we need to change very soon or we won’t have a country left to save.

        As far as I’m concerned, I think we’re already too late. We can try. But, I doubt, no matter what we do, it won’t make any difference by working from within. The only real choice we have is to totally dismantle the entire governmental system from the local level and start from scratch.

        Nothing short of a full revolution, hopefully peaceful, is going to change anything. This country was corrupted from its first day of being created.

      • howa4x

        Republicans hate the future generations and live for the here and now

        • plc97477

          They seem to hate all generations except those that can donate to their elections.

          • howa4x

            so true

    • plc97477

      Nuns on the bus tried to help but were lambasted.

      • howa4x

        Lambasted by the pope and priests

  • option31

    and the Democrats are pro choice until they leave the womb. Then they want to make our eating decisions, buying decisions, insurance decisions, ad infinitum Neither party is truly pro choice. They support pro choice JUST for their narrow thinking

    • Independent1

      Can you spell out please how Democrats are maing your eating decisions, buying decisions, insurance decisions etc? If you’re talking about Bloomberg in NY, he’s an Independent now and who at one time was a Republican.
      And the Dems push for healthcare reform, which I assume is your comment about “insurance decisions”, has nothing to do with influencing your “buying decision”, it’s all about providing affordable insurance to 50 million people who don’t have it today – and by the way – in a way that will GREATLY INCREASE YOUR DECISION CHOICES!! No one is forcing you in what you decide on – they’re only FORCING YOU TO MAKE A DECISION!! And not foist your healthcare costs on everyone but YOU.

      • option31

        You can twist i / justify it in your mind however you want but requiring anybody to buy anything is NOT pro choice. They are forcing me to buy something I do not have the choice not to buy. If I decide not to buy I will be fined. That is FORCE. School lunches – the federal government has set the calorie standards so low athletes are not fed properly.

        • Independent1

          Sorry, but you have no right to choose not to buy insurance which is nothing more than your decision to make me and others pay for your care should you ever needed it – and I guarantee that the time will come WHEN YOU WILL – need it.
          Millions of younger folks in this country are already making the bad decision to not buy health insurance (heck I’m only twenty something years old why would I need it). Only to end up in an auto accident with injuries that cost thousands of dollars, maybe hundreds of thousands, that without insurance they can’t pay. Which is why hospitals charge hundreds, even thousands of dollars for procedures and medications that should cost much less – because they have to make up for treating people like you who say: Oh! I don’t need insurance – how rediculous!!
          If states can require that you have to have insurance to operate a car, because of the probability you may get into an accident which you wouldn’t be able to pay for fixing without insurance, then the government can require that you have insurance to pay for something every person has a high probability of needing at some point regardless of their age, healthcare, which they also couldn’t afford to pay for without insurance.
          Sounds to me like you need to take up your concern about the calorie requirements for school lunches with a nutrionalist- but my guess is, that any required number of calories is better than NO REQUIREMENT, which could well mean school kids could get no lunch at all (which is something Republicans are pushing for these days – underfunding everything!!).

          • option31

            So using force for ideas you support is okay but using force for ideas you don’t like is not? Who’s the decider? Using government force has not helped anybody. Some doctors are now opting out of government and private insurance programs because they can provide better service at better prices.
            A recent CNN story stated “… cholesterol test done for $3, versus the $90 the lab company he works
            with once billed to insurance carriers. An MRI can be had for $400,
            compared to a typical billed rate of $2,000 or more.” When the government mandates anything or 8inserts itself in the market prices go up. The regulations, the compliance the paperwork all add to the costs. It will be the same with government mandated healthcare
            Sorry but school lunch calories ARE mandated by the Federal Government. The “My Plate” pyramid guidelines and limits the amount of protein, sugars,
            carbohydrates and sodium students can be offered throughout the week.

            Allowable calories (550) for elementary aged students per offered
            meal, with middle school students being entitled to a bit more (550-650
            calories), and high school students’ topping out at no more than 850
            calories per meal. Since the 70′s when the government started sticking their nose in our diet with their suggestions we have become an obese and unhealthy nation. With 70% of the population on some type of prescription drug, diabetes exploding and mental illness increasing at an alarming rate their is something wrong with what we are eating.
            That said Corporate America runs both parties, big ag – big pharma – big insurance really call the shots the politicians just follow orders and implement the plan.

          • Independent1

            Sounds like Obamacare is having a good effect – it’s pushing some practicioners to offer cheaper services. Are you aware that the rise in insurance premiums and healthcare costs over the last 3 plus years since Obamacare was passed have been at the slowest rate in 15 years? And that, had Obamacare not been passed that insurance and other healthcare related costs would 30-40% higher today than they are?? Yes, despite what most Americans think, Obamacare has already made healthcare more affordable – and the part of the law which should really reduce costs hasn’t been implemented yet? Reguiring everyone to have insurance!! It sounds to me from reading your posts, that you just love to complain – a pretty normal trait for lots of people. Sorry that I’m not going to fall into that trap.

          • Landsende

            According to you 850 calories for high school students is not enough. If they eat three meals a day at 850 calories they would be consuming 2550 calories and that doesn’t even include snacks. At least the 850 calories they are getting for their school lunch are healthy. You complain about the My Plate dietary guidelines which limits the amount of carbs, salt, sugar and protein which would make for a healthy meal but then rant about 70% of the population being obese and unhealthy. Are you perhaps part of the unhealthy and obese that don’t want the government telling you what to eat?

          • Russell Byrd

            This is another one that is only going to find something else to complain about. These people literally hate life, the world, and everyone in it that does not think exactly like they do. He already talking about menu choices, which are largely budgetary matters overly influenced by right-wing mantras. Of course, we are entirely at fault for that to. Anyway, good post!

          • option31

            No Landsende I am NOT part of the 70% I am part of the 30% 54 yo male, 5-5 140 lbs taking no prescription meds or any med what so ever. I did follow the old USDA pyramid and at that time I was 165 lbs and gaining. Once I started educating myself and looking around at what is in our food supply I started eating the way my grandparents did. That is when I started loosing weight and feeling better. I do farm part time and know a thing or two about putting fat on animals. When I feed cattle, hogs or chickens I feed them grain, grain makes fat not protein.
            The USDA has changed their diet suggestions over the years and for the most part it reflect big ags desires and health of corporate profits not what is healthy for a human diet.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            Amen.

          • FredAppell

            See! We are truly a silly species. The conversation goes from abortion to calorie counting. Lol!

          • Inthenameofliberty

            :-)

          • Russell Byrd

            Give us some beneficial ideas that you support. That is, ones that benefit others and the nation as a whole, and not just you and your ilk.

          • Russell Byrd

            I don’t think you can see that your “evidence” is proving the opposite of what you intended. Why should anyone, especially a poor one, pay $2000 for an MRI. This is why many people have gone bankrupt that could not afford insurance. They do not get to negotiate price. If everyone were covered, EVERYONE would be eligible to negotiate. And I have first hand experience, so do not give me more of your malarkey.

          • angelsinca

            “If everyone were covered, EVERYONE would be eligible to negotiate. ”

            It is clear you do NOT understand the nature of compensation for the insured. They said the same malarkey about auto insurance when it became mandatory.

          • Russell Byrd

            Unlike your Teatard Distopia, I realize that this will not be perfect. Another point, read what I said in its entirety, if you are capable. Lastly, “It is clear you” choose “NOT understand the nature of compensation for the insured. . .” or for much of anything. You choose to spread malarkey.

          • angelsinca

            “Unlike your Teatard Distopia”

            Wrong again, Byrd. I am not in the TEA party. But, based on the dismantling of the Democrat supermajority in 2010 by the newly emerged TEA party, I’d say THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN. Too bad for you, as you refuse to listen to what the people have been saying.

            As far as the the mechanics of how insurance works, you seem to have naively bought into the rhetoric, err, the weak attempt to sell the POS ACA to the people, where BS promises of reduced expenses and increased coverage prevail. Our rates have gone up by 40% and there seems no end to cost escalation or assurance of increased coverages. I now wait 6 weeks for a cardiologist appointment. It used to be 3 days.

            Based on the current exodus of health care pros, and the susequent expected shortage of services, and the increasing prices (a specialist thru inurance now cost $60, it was $35 before the ACA) it is looking ugly as the ACA conitnues its disruption of the supposedly broken health care system.

            All they had to do was fix the broken items such as pre-existing condition and lifetime limits and cost controls and release of interstate commerce restrictions. But, they (you genius democrats) just had to reinvent the wheel. Thanks for a ‘solution’ that is worse than the ailment.

        • Jim Myers

          Does anyone force you to buy auto insurance?

          Do you get fined if you do not buy auto insurance?

          • Independent1

            Jim, Option31 seems to be someone who just loves to complain – no matter what the topic.

          • Russell Byrd

            Amen!

          • angelsinca

            “Does anyone force you to buy auto insurance?
            Do you get fined if you do not buy auto insurance?”

            Yes, and yes. Can’t register a vehicle here without it.

          • plc97477

            If you don’t have a vehicle you don’t need insurance for it.

        • idamag

          $800 dollars out of every $2500 in medical costs goes to pay for those who don’t, can’t, or won’t. Why should I pay your medical costs because you would rather play than buy insurance. An example of insurance mandate is automobile insurance. I have to have auto insurance. It is a state law. Those who don’t have auto insurance are irresponsible people and it is irresponsible people who brought about the ACA mandate.

          • option31

            When something is mandated the price goes up. Mandating effectively eliminates competition from the market. This is going to bring a whole raft of new paper pushing jobs that will again inflate the cost of medical care for all of us. Do a google for Dr’s stop taking insurance. You will see the effects of eliminating the myriad of regulations and extra paperwork. For instance cholesterol test done for $3, versus the $90 the lab company he works
            with once billed to insurance carriers. An MRI can be had for $400,
            compared to a typical billed rate of $2,000 or more.

            A big part of the problem is the overhead – paperwork Dr’s / hospitals have to navigate to get the insurance money. Cut the overhead and prices fall dramatically. This sis the rule not the exception.

            If you do a little more research on hospitals and the way they are set up it is a scam. In many cases – at least the area I live in the building is owned by a for profit corp and hospital operation is run by a non profit. If the operation is making a profit the building owner raises the rent.

        • Russell Byrd

          WRONG, as far as school lunches are concerned, the menu is greatly influenced, too much so, by what business wants to sell and what politicians (GENERALLY the REPUB ones) want to pay for. To put it simply, school menus are largely set by REPUB business men and REPUB politicians to benefit their own pocketsplatform.

          • demz taters

            This is also why soda is an allowable purchase for EBT beneficiaries – it’s a way to move gallons of flavored high fructose corn syrup.

          • option31

            LOL Russel I agree with your statement with the exception you forgot to add the Democrats. Both are in the pockets of corporate America. Yes Big Ag is setting the food agenda to sell protect their high profit products.

          • Russell Byrd

            You can say nothing without bringing in the Democrats. Really. If we were to get all your big money idols out of our election process, trim expenses in elections down, and force elections to be fought on issues, rather than just dig dirt, then we would have solid Democrat majorities and plenty of good, decent representation to kick Big AG, Big Oil, etc. in the seat of the pants. No Pub can say that as they are completely sold on, NO, sold to the rich such as the Koch bros. Any other response is a bold face lie. As it is now, everyone, and especially the Democrats, has to work non-stop to get enough money to compete.

          • option31

            Russell, I throw them all in the same kettle, they are ALL bought and paid for by Corporate America. I bring the Democrats in because I want both parties held accountable. I am not a Republican nor am I a Democrat. I am an Independent because I seen years ago the two parties are playing Americans against each other and as long as we play their game with their rules we will continue to be sold out and yes have to work day and night to put food on the table. To get the money out of politics #1 give the politician receiving the money 24 hours to list the donor and the amount so WE can see who is buying who. #2 take the power away from the politicians and the money will disappear. Pretty simple stuff but we have to look past our individual interests/prejudice and do whats right for the country and our kids. Playing this gotcha game is not going to solve anything. It keeps us fighting all the while the politicians laugh at us.

          • Russell Byrd

            D**n liar. I wrote an article describing behavior such as yours. You claim to be independent to worm your way in, but your politics are pure hateful Teatard. So regardless of what you claim, you are at best just misguided. Rather more likely a lying troll. You come here only to bash a very well written and reasonable analysis of the Republicon Congress. Now suddenly, you want to act reasonable. I will have no part of it. As I view it, the Democrats are far from perfect, but a Republican is plain nasty. They may both be bought by corporate interests, but at least the Democrats try to represent everyone. Repubs represent only the top 20% at best, but really do very poorly with any group below the top 1%. Therefore, take you nonsense and cram it. You are the one that came here for a fight.

          • option31

            Russell why so nasty and hateful? Trying to bring another point of view – outlook is not hateful not looking for a fight. To claim the Dems are better than the Reps is just plain wrong. Look at what Bush did at the Ag Dept vs Obama. Same results – Monsanto controls it. It goes on and on. We change the guy in the suit but the suit stays.

          • Russell Byrd

            I guess I will say this directly as you refuse or are unable to understand. I have never said the Democrats are perfect. I have never even said they are great. Yet, there is a deep seated evil rooted in the Republican heart which makes a decent person shiver when you consider it. Add to that the current popular Pub group of Tea Baggers, with their STATED refusal to discuss solutions. This mob is driven by racial hatred, bigotry, ignorance, dishonesty, and especially, dangerously, PARANOIA. Even a simple thing like gun background checks is impossible to pass. The only people in the world that believe background checks are bad are Tea Baggers AND terrorists. This is literal truth. Enough of this off-topic discussion, but it is what it is.

          • Russell Byrd

            Once again, a little humor that encapsulates the problem with the rank and file Pub voter and their partisans such as yourself,

          • option31

            Russell, unlike some I’m not the one defending any political party no matter what. I’m capable of thinking for myself and making my own decisions. I don’t need a party hack telling me what to do or to defend their criminal activity. I blindly support no one or no party. You also seem to some how know I’m rich. Sorry to disappoint you buddy, but I make less (around 30k) than the average teacher in this country and certainly less than the politicians you and the rest of the defenders of the criminal ruling class are defending.

          • Russell Byrd

            Let’s see. You are independent. You make your own decisions. Your open minded. But you come to what is basically a group that is frequented by liberals. Liberals which you have plainly indicated you hate. A president that is Democrat that you hate. Political strategies, that you universally hate. Let me stop there. If you are in the midst of Liberals and you came here intentionally why are you always disrespecting everything and everyone. It takes little intelligence to realize that quite simply you (wait for it now) YOU LIE!

            And I never said you were rich, no, never. But I have tried to indicate that you are unable to quit kissing the a**es of the rich. Even if it is just figurative. You know one of the problems with talking with you Teatards is you think you can say anything and you have the only viewpoint. Anything I say to bring equilibrium to the conversation you take as surrender. If I catch you in a lie, then I am the bastard.

          • option31

            Nope not tea party member either. I NEVER used the word hate either. To disagree with somebody have another idea politically or otherwise does not constitute hate. In fact if you would drop your intolerance for anybody that does think lock step with you, you would see I have been civil and never name called. Nor have I claimed people were ignorant or liars. That is what you have done, you are good at critiquing your scribs but not mine. I come to this board to see what others are thinking and saying – some I agree with some I don’t, that is life. Having an intelligent conversation on opposing views shows tolerance and can be mind stimulating/thought provoking.

            I even agreed with you on a couple of points but your intolerance of even one idea or statement that disagrees with your narrow thought band results in raving insults. One thing I have notice here – the liberal board and other so called conservative boards is a lot of you talk tolerance but don’t practice it. Both are intolerant of any ideas that are not lock step with the theirs. The other thing is the inconsistency of what and who is supported. My guy is okay your guy sucks even when they do the same thing. When Bush was caught spying the liberals sounded like pigs under a gate ( I stated on the so called small government conservative boards he should be impeached ) now we have another guy doing it and liberals say its okay and conservatives are the pig under the gate.

          • Russell Byrd

            You told two lies on the first line alone. I stopped reading right there. The rest of your post went to waste.

            BUT, I am still here.

          • option31

            Where is my use of the word hate anywhere in any of my posts to this board? I am definately not a tea party member either. You are the one filled with hatred. I’ll tell you what in the future you don;t post to my posting and I won’t post to your. Works for me how about you?

          • Russell Byrd

            Sounds good, but as long as you hang around causing grief to others, you have to factor me in for a potential reply. So, the answer is no, if you want to persist. I never said you did not have a right to post, but you have been rather over the top with people that did not want to listen to you. I bet you just can’t leave it at that.

          • option31

            Over the top how? Causing grief how? By stating my opinion? and politely rebutting or answering their questions with facts when the answer required facts? BE SPECIFIC!

            I have not name called, been rude, threatened to “stretch somebodies neck” – violence – or disrespected anybody by tagging “tard” on the end of tea, lib, con or any other classification that seem to be the norm on this and conservative boards. Really I try to stay above that and would never show that kind of disrespect for mentally challenged people. I have good friends that have children that have autism so for somebody to tack “tard” on the end just shows their lack of compassion and decency.
            You can throw all the barbs you want I am here to learn and educate myself on other opinions and to try to have intelligent discussions not have we all agree fan club.

            This will be my last post on this subject so throw all the arrows you want. No I am not running away just not going to waste anymore of my time with you. BTW I’ll stick to my side of the deal – I WILL NOT POST TO YOUR ORIGINAL COMMENTS but I will respond if you decide to post to mine.

          • Russell Byrd

            A prime example of your thinking for yourself and being of a fair and even mind is your last line. Even when you are trying to prove your open mindedness, you cannot help but “let the cat out of the bag.” ” . . . the criminal ruling class . . .” I do not need to say more, you have done that for me. If you do not like what I say and cannot handle truth, then do not address me again and move on if you cannot take it..

          • Russell Byrd

            And fighting we will continue to do. Odd since if you really are independent, the fight is between an individual that is at the political center versus a liberal that is only left of center. Of course, you are not independent and you are farther right than Mussolini. As I have said, Democrats are not perfect, but Republicans are generally so vile that only an insane person could swallow their crap. As I have written an article about, right-wingers like you always claim both parties are to blame. But 90% of those are liars trying to plant dissension and uncertainty. As has been shown, the disaffected and depressed tend not to go to the polls. That is exactly the reasoning of these Pub bastards, as they know most of these people are UN-Republicons. You do not have a platform. It takes no morals to lie and cheat. It takes no guts to be a conservacon, because all you people do is say NO. So tell us some more whoppers. Why don’t I save time and just call you a liar now. You are a Tea Bagger, plain and simple.

          • option31

            Well at least some progress is being made and you will admit the Dems are not perfect. I’d really have a hard choice as to which is worse, I’d call it a draw between the Dems and the Reps as you know.

            And now more name calling and now stooping to calling me a NAZI. No surprise as that is the easy way out.

            Also no surprise that you could NOT be specific on your charge of offending others – its in your head – no where else on this board.

            Well now it is obvious you do not what the NAZI’S stood for, so I will try the impossible and attempt to educate you – I know wasting my time but what the heck!
            Below are just a few of the thing Adolf Hitler promoted while he ruled Germany. SORRY NOTHING there that backs your assertion as the only thing I would support – maybe is the animal testing. But if it came between animals and humans I’d choose animals he choose humans. So back at ya with that Nazi charge.!
            Hitler was a decorated army war veteran, an avowed nonsmoker and dedicated public health advocate. His public health interests include the fostering of medical
            research and his dedication to eliminating cancer. He opposes the use of animals in conducting such research. He favored government-determined occupational health and safety standards, as well as the promotion of such foods as whole-grain bread and soybeans. He advocated government gun-control measures.and believes in the importance of sending troops into foreign countries in order to maintain order therein.”

          • Russell Byrd

            The lack of reading comprehension that you exhibit should be illegal. Stooopid!

          • Russell Byrd

            I said the Pubs were vile.
            I said the Pubs were much, much worse than Democrats.

            I did not call you a Nazi.
            I believe I did compare you to Mussolini, at some point.

            I have called you a Fascist, at some point.
            I have called you a liar, repeatedly, because it is true.
            I am a historian and I am well versed on Nazi
            Germany. Since you brought it up, you do exhibit Nazi tendencies.

            I do have an education and the odds I have a much, much higher degree than you do.
            You have a very damaged psyche and lack common sense if you think for one moment that you have not offended anyone. I find it especially troubling that you can lie that breathtakingly. Please do not insult everyone’s intelligence by claiming to be an independent as EVERY bit of your posting denigrates Democrats and Obama.

          • option31

            I bash Reps just as much if not more because they claim to support freedom and individual rights but in actuality they are big supporters of a police state.

            Now I understand you better you have a superiority complex. You think you are more educated therefore you are a step above me and everybody else – Yes I’ve read some of your other rants and yes you do think you are superior.

            To quote you “Since you brought it up, you do exhibit Nazi tendencies.” How – what did I say that leads to that conclusion? I sent you what Hitler promoted in Nazi Germany, nothing there that I support – nothing is the fascist line up either – you on the other hand have stated you support gun control. I would guess you support government healthcare, among other statist ideas.

            You make all these charges but its all talk and has no basis in fact. (it is borderline bullying, but in fact you just think you are smarter than anybody else because you have some degree. ) If I insulted anybody you would put it here for all to see to prove your statement. It’s not here because you cannot find it – that’s because it does not exist.

            Facist, Nazis, communists all have this idea that they are superior and therefore they should tell people how to live, what to buy, who should live who should die and when etc….

            I THINK INDIVIDUALS SHOULD MAKE THEIR OWN CHOICES NOT SOME EDUCATED OR ELECTED PERSON THAT THINKS THEY ARE OF SUPERIOR STOCK. ( Yes I put it in caps as it seems you have a issue reading and understanding lower case normal talk.) People are not cattle or slave or test dummies for ordering around or experimenting on.

          • Russell Byrd

            You post just to see in on the screen. This is nothing but spin of the most useless variety. I can expect nothing else from a sociopathic liar. And it won’t improve. I will continue to reply, as you seem to be totally consumed with having the last word. You ramble aimlessly “from pillar to post,” making little if any sense at all. I am trying to be charitable. There is no purpose in continuing to destroy your argument, you do not seem to be able to read, and you change topics like the weather.

            You have not been on topic since you got here.

          • Russell Byrd

            Let’s see. You claim to be critical of both parties. You claim to be independent. Yet, you came to a topic discussion largely frequented by Liberals. You knew you were going to be upsetting. That by definition makes you a potential troll. Now, excepting where you claim to be aligned with neither party, HOW MANY POSTS HAVE YOU MADE CRITICAL OF THE REPUBS? NONE, NONE, NONE. That makes you a liar and a troll. If you are too stupid to understand your own mind then you are one lost little turd.

          • option31

            follow these to put your mind at ease that I do not criticize Reps.
            I’m sure you’ll find fault and come up with another name for me, call me a liar etc… but so be it.

            http://www.nationalmemo.com/its-time-to-repeal-the-patriot-act/

            http://www.nationalmemo.com/watch-paul-ryan-and-john-mccain-attack-president-obama-over-edward-snowden/

          • Russell Byrd

            You postulate that people that are informed and educated are inferior to the uninformed, the bigoted, and the uneducated. Garbage such as yourself is the factor ruining this nation. And is largely what the article above is saying. YOU CLAIM TO BE FOR FREEDOM TO CHOOSE, BUT THEN YOU WANT COMPLETE CONTROL OF OTHERS. YOU ARE “CONVICTED” BY YOUR OWN WORDS. And again, you have proven that you are a Tea Bagging Pub.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            AMEN!

          • option31

            Hey you forgot teatard!!!!

            Yep I’m insulting everybody here left and right and center but YOU taking part of a word that disrepects mentally handicapped children and adults and applying it to a group of people you HATE is not offensive to the mentally handicapped and those of us that have friends that are. Yep your Mr. Manners. Your superiority complex is pretty deep isn’t it?

            Now I have pointed out EXACTLY where and how you have insulted people, Now spend some time looking back and see if you can find where I have insulted anybody. Me defending myself, stating and idea in a CIVILIZED MANNER is not insulting in normal circles of people.

          • Russell Byrd

            You are the one doing that in order to cover the fact that you have no coherent argument. In fact no argument at all outside of a Teatard play book. You have not been civilized since you got here and are only fixated on lying. As for superiority complex, look in a mirror, dirtbag. I am only resisting your standard, right-wing, bullying attempts to break up rational conversation with dissension, deflection, and falsehood. For you, I will change to using Teanderthal. Of course, Neaderthals are still around. It is just that now they are the “Tea Party faithful.”

          • Russell Byrd

            I understand you very well. Unfortunately, you are too stupid to understand that you are seen as you really are. Your attempts at psych warfare are pretty lame.

            Your tactics are based on your supposed superiority and cleverness. You break into conversations with lies and bullying. Then you claim to be an open minded independent. All this to cause dissension and disrupt legitimate discussion. Then you think that because you are so clever, and I am so dumb, that I do not understand you ingenious technique. Unfortunately, I have seen you as you are since you first arrived.

        • demz taters

          Shorter option31: You’re not the boss of me!

        • 4sanity4all

          Do you drive a car? I bet you hate it when they force you to buy insurance for that. How many school athletes do you know that are going hungry? The caloric intake numbers are set for average students. I imagine that the athletes could bring extra snacks from home.

        • LivinginVA

          School lunches are not designed for athletes, they are designed for students. Atheletics is an EXTRA – students are required to provide their own extra food, just as they are required to provide proper footwear for their sport.

      • angelsinca

        “No one is forcing you in what you decide on – they’re only FORCING YOU TO MAKE A DECISION!!”

        Sounds just like the abortion debate. Except, you are allowed 20 weeks to make a decision before the choices become limited.

        Your expectations for the ppACA of enhanced choice and affordability seem to be buried deep in a fantasy crystal ball of talking points promised by the sponsoring politicians. Look at the long waits and rationed care at the VA hospitals for a sampling of a more realistic future of medical care under this flawed scheme. If you don’t have your exemptions in place (or aren’t one of the political elite) then you are screwed like the rest of us. There’s a little comfort in not being alone, I suppose.

    • plc97477

      I can’t say I understand most of what you said. I probably don’t need to though so don’t try to explain.

    • Russell Byrd

      The basis for all this is, if you make bad decisions on your own, you leave your fellow citizens and the government to pick up the extra tab. Like being obese. It does not just cost you more, but me and everyone else as well. Beyond that your post shows a total lack of intelligence and integrity. No surprise there.

    • jovan1984

      Who are the ones trying to limit what taxpaying citizens of South Carolina can order on their Food Stamp cars? The GOP, NOT the Dems.

      They are no different than Bloomberg.

      • plc97477

        Except Bloomberg cares about the health of other people.

  • Rick2101

    Abortion is a decision between a woman and her doctor, no one else. Just because some male made a small contribution to the process, it does NOT, by any means give him an equal say in the matter.

  • Lovefacts

    And people are surprised by this why? I’ve been saying the same thing for years. In fact, I’ve said it here. What’s always amazed me is how when running against these hypocrites, Unfortunately, Democrats shy away from calling them on this and using it in ads.

    Can’t you just see the ads? Show two photos side-by-side–one labeled US and the other from a named third world country–displaying the hunger, lack of education, and decaying infrastructure, or lack therein, while a voice says: “Rep or Senator X claims he is pro-life. That is a calculated and callous move to gain your vote, His votes for corporate welfare and against America proves his/her lie. If Rep or Senator X is re-elected s/he will turn America the Proud into a third world country under the thumb of multinational corporations.”

    • plc97477

      Won’t work. Most dems do not like dirty politics and that sounds a bit to dirty to work.

  • charleo1

    Republicans are odd birds indeed. The things they must support, and the things
    they must oppose, make them hypocrites of the first order. In spite of their small
    government rhetoric, and their kvetching about the Democrat’s nanny state. They
    can be as authoritarian as hell. Especially when it comes to people’s private lives.
    Well, it’s just weird, that’s all. The oil companies screw up, and spill millions of
    barrels into the Gulf. Or, collude to fix the prices as high as possible. Or, Wall
    Street damn near torpedos the world economy. And they call for less regulation.
    Oh, it’s just awful. The government is too big, too expensive, and too intrusive. And everyday they call for smaller government. ObamaCare is going to put a bureaucrat between you, and your doctor. Then, what do they do? So they obviously are not concerned with government nosing around your doctor’s office. The fact is here.
    No one is pro abortion. Yet the majority is consistently for keeping abortions legal. Because they simply do not want the State barging thru people’s business. And
    that is exactly what overturning Roe V. Wade, would enable.

    • angelsinca

      “ObamaCare is going to put a bureaucrat between you, and your doctor. Then, what do they do? So they obviously are not concerned with government nosing around your doctor’s office.”

      You must have missed the part about Obamacare being an exclusively Democrat concoction, based on the failed ‘experiment’ of Romney’s MA plan.

      • charleo1

        Medicare, and Medicaid, are Democratic concoctions. ObamaCare,
        is a Republican concoction, using Republican ideals, of personal
        responsibility, mandated participation, and market based solutions.
        The program was formulated by a Heritage Foundation think tank,
        in 1994, as the Conservative’s alternative to Hillary Care. The fact
        that they now call it Socialism gone wild. Or now believe the Gov.
        is destroying freedom, by incentivizing those without healthcare
        insurance, to provide for themselves a method of making sure that
        any medical bills that they may incur, does not become the public’s
        responsibility to pay for on their behalf. It’s not the public’s fault
        that the GOP, that once upon a time, proposed this very program.
        Has now, completely changed it’s mind, and now favors no healthcare reform at all.

        • angelsinca

          So, which is it? Obamacare is bad because the ‘GOP concocted’ it or Obamacare is good, because it is long overdue and a crowning acievement of Obama? If you paid atrtention to what Romney said about Obamacare instead of his bank account, you would have realized he condemned the plan in MA as a failure. Yet the DEMOCRATS of the 109th Congress, led by Pelosi and the DEMOCRAT senate led by Reid and the DEMOCRAT super majority, forced the passage of ppACA. And now, you are trying to BLAME the GOP for its own failings, Business as usual.

          • charleo1

            Are you trying to miss my point? The Healthcare Reform Act,
            is what it is. And so is it’s history. What Gov. Romney did say,
            is that he thought it was fine for MA. But, said he didn’t think
            it was a good idea for the entire Country. But, then did not
            explain why, or how he came to that conclusion. Or what
            had changed about the Country, that caused him to reverse
            his opinion about the MA plan, he signed into law. And, the
            truth is, MA residents very strongly support the continuation
            of a plan that has 98% of people in MA acquiring health
            insurance.

          • angelsinca

            “Are you trying to miss my point?”

            I’m sorry, what is your ‘point’? Before Romneycare, 6% in the state were uninsured. Now, it’s 2%. Not only does MA have the highest insurance rate in the nation, it has experienced a dramatic increase in health care spending by the public. Fraud by those ‘gaming’ the system has exploded. From 2007-2009, the number of medical-caused bankruptcies increased by over 30% (Romneycare began in 2006).

            To agree, it seems most MA residents like Romneycare (~69% from 2009 poll, compared to 67% satisfied in 2007). Also, there seems to be a slight increase in the healthiness of the population with reductions in the average body-mass index being cited. I suppose people have less to spend on food now.

          • Russell Byrd

            Point was plain, you are just a troll that is here to harass. . . .

          • charleo1

            I suppose there is going to be those like yourself that
            will continue to say what a disaster it’s going to be,
            no matter what. And those who are benefiting now.
            And those who have yet to see it’s benefit, until it’s
            fully implemented.

      • Russell Byrd

        Hard to argue with a delusional person. “The failed ‘experiment’ of Romney’s MA plan.” So that makes Obamacare an entirely Democrat plan. As well, your mob was literally begged to discuss the plan. Your bunch of gangsters would not participate. For instance, McConnell was busy planning Obama’s one-term demise. I have discussed this with a number of Pubs. The best of them say, “there is a better way.” I ask, “what is it, then”? There has never yet been any reply, except the same “there is a better way.” There is no Pub plan. There never was a Pub plan. There is, and has never been, any wish to discuss a plan.

        The best of them means individuals that did not curse or make racist remarks. Ones that would actually talk rationally about it.

      • Russell Byrd

        “‘ObamaCare is going to put a bureaucrat between you, and your doctor.
        Then, what do they do? So they obviously are not concerned with
        government nosing around your doctor’s office.’”

        Now you have to use your own false propaganda to win a point.

  • Bill

    The reason the GOP is pro life, they need people to do their work for next to nothing “Slave Labor” plus they need a lot of people to fight their Wars, after all the GOP has never seen a War it didn’t like, including the War against Women.

    • Russell Byrd

      Yes, when a Pub talks about our children’s future they are really saying we need enough children to work as slaves for them and THEIR children. Am I exaggerating, some, but this is an important aspect of the true Pub platform. Teabaggers would be ideal, but the Pub hierarchy is finding them difficult to control.

      • angelsinca

        This is what happens when a room full of Democrats giggles together in the shadows. You feel it’s ok to exaggarte to the point of believing lies about the GOP. I thought you were more honest than this, Russell. Yes, I am wrong.

        • Russell Byrd

          We are very serious, dirtbag troll. We are not exaggerating. If you thought I was honest and now have changed your mind, then I am ecstatic. Be associated with a pathological liar like you would not be good for my reputation. Oh yes, my post is exactly true. You did not even bother to contest that because you know it is true. So you got you Teatool out uses your standard slur.

          If you actually knew anything about the real Pub party, the one that existed before the Koch soakers showed up, then you would know that the party that was run by bigots is now run by insane bigots.

        • Inthenameofliberty

          You can’t debate Russel – low IQ there. All he’ll do is call you a troll and call you names. He can not debate most things calmly and reasonably.

    • angelsinca

      Dumb assertion. Get real and at least TRY to be honest.

      • Russell Byrd

        Maybe, we mistook that everything you say means exactly the opposite.
        Clever!

  • stephven

    where are all the republicans retorting? oh yeah, they have absolutely nothing logical to say about this. what a fucked up political group: claim to follow the teachings of jesus, only until it suits them to ignore, no government intervention, until it suits them to administer. obviously logic has nothing to do with what they “believe.” how can a party so conspicuously able to be called out on their inconsistencies and contradictions in government and religion (not that religion matters) have so many blind followers? how come there IS a republican party anymore after the stupid antics they employ in congress? morons just want to keep voting red because most of them can’t handle being fed the truth. i was there. i used to side with republicans. for any intelligent person like myself, it came to a point of critical mass and i could no longer look at myself in the mirror and really believe the bullshit republicans are all about. i am, however, amused at the buffoons they select to try to oppose people who know what they’re doing in politics. they don’t have a chance at 2016. 2014 will be big; anyone else ever notice that republicans always have a look on their faces like they have shit in their pants. crack a smile and enjoy life you downers!

    • plc97477

      You are not alone my friend. The repug party is losing membership at an alarming rate (at least as far as the repugs are concerned). Soon there will be nearly no one willing to admit being a repug.

  • Daniel Lambert

    What is even more ironic is that the GOP/Tea Republicans can’t seem to wait for other people’s kids to grow up and serve in the Armed Forces just to fight for their own greedy interests while supplying them with substandard equipment purchased by the US taxpayers from their military–industrial–congressional complex constituents at inflated prices, then tossed into for-profit prisons if they happen to survive the wars that they started in the first place, all the while incessantly bitching about the cost of everything and everyone when it comes time to pay for the prosthetics, pensions or anything else called social welfare except for their 501(c)(4) tax exempt Organizations…..Whew, that was a long sentence.

    • plc97477

      But worth saying.

    • Mark Forsyth

      I was going to make a joke about employing an economy of words,but since I enjoyed your comment I will simply say: Good Job!

    • Russell Byrd

      But spoke volumes of truth. Well done!

  • 788eddie

    I’ve just read all of the comments below, and I must say, I’m, on the whole, very impressed! If these comments are any indication, we’re heading in a healthy direction.

    Hey Everybody! VOTE! In every election that you can!

    And contribute to the candidates that support fair-minded agenda. It is the only way to counter the “dark money” contributed by the ultra-wealthy (their “dues” for this fight).

    Thank you Dominick, Robert, Independent, Fern, Idamag, Highpkts, howa4x, Charlieo1, Eleanor, and everyone else who just lifted my sagging spirits!

  • Pat Brown

    What’s very interesting is that the Southern states that are so rabidly anti-choice and government programs to aid the poor, use those programs more than the northern states do. They’re cutting off their own noses here.

    But the solution here is simple. Women need to get off their asses and vote. Every woman who can’t be bothered to vote or worse, votes GOP, is aligning herself with misogynists. Cutting off your nose indeed.

    • angelsinca

      If the GOP are such mysoginists, why do Democrats mock and ridicule ANY women that have chosen to run for office under the Republican banner? There seems to be more hate regularly directed at women by the Democrat than by the the imagined boggeymen of the GOP.

      • jovan1984

        The GOP are misogynists, if you even BOTHERED to look at their deeds and actions, like I did. I no longer vote conservative because of their contempt for women — this has been the case for 10 years.

        The conservatives’ war on women is definitely real — look at some of the legislation that has been talked about on blogs, even in Cosmopolitan, the latter of which promises to post more politics.

      • plc97477

        The reason liberals mock the females on the right is cus they are even stupider than the men on the right.

      • Pat Brown

        You compare mocking to destroying a woman’s right to control her own body? Or denying equality in wages? Or claiming that there are legitimate rapes and rape babies are a gift from God?

        And that’s not to mention the sheer contempt the GOP has shown for women and LIVING children and their drive to push them even further into poverty without even the option of keeping their family levels low so maybe, just maybe, they have a chance of pulling out of the poverty trap.

        Oh yeah, it’s definitely much worse to ask why any sane woman would join or support such a party than it is to blatantly show your misogyny with laws aimed specifically at removing women’s rights..

        • angelsinca

          “You compare mocking to destroying a woman’s right to control her own body? Or denying equality in wages? Or claiming that there are legitimate rapes and rape babies are a gift from God?

          Pat, no, I am not. You seem to be describing the very few extreme sentiments that are NOT welcome in the GOP and certainly not representative of the typical conservative. I’m not sure who these faceless radicals are, but the anti-women stance sounds a lot like those beliefs supported by Sharia. This isn’t the GOP party and certainly isn’t the conservative.

          I would be interested to know more about these laws that are ‘aimed specifically at women’s rights’. We’ve all come too far since the 60′s to tolerate ANY mysoginistic practice by anyone, especially by our lawmakers, if true.

          • Russell Byrd

            You must belong to the GOP of Uranus, because your ideas are not of this world. Everyday we multiple examples of why you are completely full of hogwash.

          • angelsinca

            Back off piss ant.

          • Russell Byrd

            Or what troll.

            Wikipedia describes: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[

          • angelsinca

            Please finish that blunt and get some sleep.

  • LotusJoan

    Why it is that they only want to legislate the morality of women? It does take two to tango but even in incidents of rape – they want to let the men off the hook.

    Why are the unborn more worthly of care and compassion.

    • angelsinca

      “they only want to legislate the morality (of women)”

      The only ‘morality’ being legislated is trying to avert the practice of ending viable life. If a woman can’t make her mind about an abortion in the first 5 months, she has fewer choices ‘They’ didn’t outlaw the morning after pill, but could have. If a rapist is ‘left off the hook’, please direct your anger at local law enforcement or the scumbag violator, not the GOP or all men.

      • jovan1984

        The conservatives are ALSO the violators. As well as rape enablers.

        Conservatives support parental rights for child molesters and rapists.

        • angelsinca

          “conservatives are ALSO the violators. As well as rape enablers”

          That’s right. Conservatives sit around all day long planning ways to rape and invade vaginas and molest children. WTF?. My God, you are rather special, aren’t you? If this is contagious (and I’m afraid it’s already an epidemic within the DNC), we better start preparing for World War Z.

          • Russell Byrd

            Like I said, if we take every thing you say as an opposite, then you begin to make honest sense. First, what is the subject of this discussion? Read the article to find out because that is how it is done. Second, your the mob wanting to probe. i.e. invade vaginas. Third, statistically Pubs are by far the worst sexual offenders and predators. Of course, we all know that you automatically lump gays in with predators because of your stupid bigotry. World War Z? A zombie attack has been underway here since the exact moment you showed up!

          • angelsinca

            Disregard

          • angelsinca

            Russell Byrd you ARE the control freak. Or maybe you just dig the freaky part. You really should do something about the constipation, being full of sh-t as you are. Have a good evening.

          • Russell Byrd

            How many times does that make you leaving tonight?

            Wikipedia describes: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[

            I think you “lit up the charts” dirtbag.

  • Pamby50

    I believe a national registry for all pro-life proponents. Once a child is born, they are given the child to raise. They can’t give the child back. I wonder how many will remove their names from the list once they have to start raising children of color or children with a disability.

  • RobertCHastings

    When confronted with this same moral dilemma as Speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich advocated opening more orphanages. I wonder if he is as proud of that moment now as he was in about 1996(?). To be honest, he just doesn’t have that much to be proud about, anyway.

  • Nicholas Jacob Underwood

    I personally believe that life begins when the brain is fully developed, so I don’t get what the big deal is about abortion before that time is.

    • Rob

      So you’re not a person until what, about 20 years old?

      • Russell Byrd

        At least, he has or will get there, unlike yourself.

      • Nicholas Jacob Underwood

        what I meant was that I believe that person hood begins when the brain finished with the part of development that occurs in the womb, meaning when the brain is able to function outside the womb

      • plc97477

        depends on your politics I think.

  • Rob

    If my neighbor is beating his kids am I to look the other way or help the kids? If his kids are hungry or dressed in rags should I help them out? In both cases the moral answer is yes. Knowing that life begins at conception an abortion is the murder of an innocent life, The idea that government welfare and other government programs for the poor are charitable just isn’t true and it’s proven time and again to be an ineffective way to stop poverty. Conservatives stand for economic freedom including the ability to contribute to charitable organizations that work rather than government that forces contributions by taxing and is inefficient and ineffective in distributing the funds. It is well established that people considering themselves Conservatives give far more of their time and treasure to Charity than those labeling themselves as Liberals/Progressives.

    • Russell Byrd

      Name the private institutions that are there everyday that they are needed and actually give the aid that is needed without strings attached. Giving money to your church is not charity, it is an obligation, and mostly goes to support the recruitment programs that they run. Your inability to separate your pre-conceived beliefs from the facts tells me you kind are incapable of addressing these problems properly. First hypocrisy is you judge too much and I have heard from your kind that you think it is your right. Of course, you will deny that fact, but it is still a fact.

      Even if you could survive the first task, I will point out that history has plainly shown that your theory does not work for the bulk of the people in need. Like Medicare. It was created because private health insurers would not touch higher risk seniors. Private charitable organizations were not providing anything either. Ditto, Social Security. Even long term lending for housing was pioneered by government programs. (VA & FHA) The list is long, but this is a start.

      • plc97477

        Money given to churches are not only not charity but the fact that they do it only to (hopefully) ensure their place in the afterlife it is more a waste of money for most.

    • Russell Byrd

      For years I have heard many complaints about your private charity. Just about everyone talks about it bitterly. One thing has always been obvious. When times are good you kind is out there doing the Lord;’s work, but when things are bad, i.e. when hunger is really stalking, you do not have anything to give. Unfortunately, only the government has been able to fill that void.

      The economic freedom you refer to has always kept the disadvantaged poor and hungry. The fundamental unfairness, e.g.selfishness, of the “system” keeps those at the bottom on the bottom. Do not insult my intelligence by saying it is all down to a lack of effort. When people with many advantages strive and fail, any person with common sense knows that it would take a superman to succeed without assistance.

      I will also point out that we do not know how well some of these programs work, because people like you have spent much time and huge sums of money obstructing them. Right-wingers will poison the well and then yell the water wasn’t any good.

      • angelsinca

        “Right-wingers will poison the well and then yell the water wasn’t any good.”

        And left-wingers will drain the well and blame the republicans for making them thirsty.

        • Russell Byrd

          Using your own perverted logic, the right-wingers poisoned the well and intended for people to drink it. I, for one, am proud that the a decent lef-winger drained the well.

          The analogy is not lost on anyone with half a mind. What you said is true, but only proves the vicious evil that constitutes you Teanderthals. Thanks for playing, but you are too easy. Arrogance and ignorance work hand in hand to ensure that you only have hare-brained ideas.

    • LivinginVA

      ” It is well established that people considering themselves Conservatives give far more of their time and treasure to Charity than those labeling themselves as Liberals/Progressives”

      Actually, once you factor out donations to their churches (and in many places, the donations to church go almost exclusively to church upkeep/salaries/etc), the numbers become almost identical. Once you factor out donations to specifically religious causes – ie: Catholic Charities rather than Red Cross – the Liberal/Progressives donate more.

      • angelsinca

        ” once you factor out donations to their churches … the numbers become almost identical”

        So what you REALLY are saying is the Democrat almost gives more than the Republican atheist. Nice spin. In the world of data analysis, we used to call this number fu_king. Giving away ten percent as a tithe to the church or a LivinginVA-approved charity, is still an act of charity.

        • Russell Byrd

          Insanity is starting to gain total control over you. Do you ever read the garbage you post. A tithe goes to do the work of the church, unfortunately, regardless of what that is. In other words, a tithe does not go to any needy person unless they decide to use it as such. It can, and in our nation often, goes for political purposes that have nothing to do with charity. The rest is primarily spent for the ministry, the church, and the pastor.

        • Russell Byrd

          A lesson to learn. A tithe is not charity in any case. It is an works above the value of the tithe.

        • Russell Byrd

          I once had a Teatard argue that he could prove liberals were less charitable. ABC? set up a collection point outside of a WalMart in Minnesota. They asked he donator what is political views were. They did this two days in a row. Guess what, Pubs won. If I have to explain why this is a pathetic joke, then you are a truly certifiable moron.

          Your going to crow over that one, but what this “study” proved was three things:

          ABC News does not know what a “survey” is or how one is conducted.

          Our news media is not remotely “liberal.”

          If you think this shows the true state of affairs, then you are of dangerously low intelligence.

        • LivinginVA

          When I donate to the Red Cross, a large portion of the money is going directly to people in need. When I donate to a church, a large portion of the money is going to support the church itself. Donations to churches, are, in essence, donations to charities that only donate a small percentage of their proceeds to their stated cause. The amount of money given that supports those in need is the same in both liberals and conservatives. Catholic Charities was actually a bad example for which I apologize.

          • angelsinca

            Charity is tough sometimes, especially when you find yourself as one of those in need. We give anyway, even when we don’t have enough for ourselves, and usually end up under better circumstances. This is too inexplicable to be coincidental. So, we give thanks and we praise the source of blessings.

    • plc97477

      The beating heart idea to limit abortions reminds me that every single little bitty sperm has a heart. So… masturbation should be illegal. Think of all those little beating hearts.

      • angelsinca

        Monty Python.lol

      • Rob

        Sperm do not have hearts.

    • charleo1

      I fail to see how Republicans favor general economic freedom, Their policies
      seem to continually support laws, and protections that greatly favor the wealthy. Often at the expense of the overwhelming majority. Who are struggling with such issues as affordable healthcare, falling wages, lack
      of upward mobility, and opportunity. And a years long fight aganist unions,
      raising the minimum wages. While showing no concerns about the growing
      problem of wealth disparity. A condition, that if allowed to continue unaddressed, will have very negative consequences for the U.S. economy.
      And, when it comes to private charity versus government, The claims that
      private efforts could possibly raise the amounts of money necessary to fund
      the billions of dollars of indigent care, that is provided each year, free of
      charge, simply do not comport with the realities of the situation. To say that
      Conservatives contribute more than Liberals, is not something that is even
      provable. But, certainly does not support your argument aganist government
      safety net programs.

      • angelsinca

        Charlie, you can’t use the ‘overwhelming majority’ from something like, ‘Do you favor taking guns away from crazy people prone to using them on other people” and apply it to everthing on the Democrat agenda.

        Thanks, btw, for listing those things on the DNC platform that have negatively affected most of the nation already such as,
        “affordable healthcare, falling wages, lack of upward mobility, and opportunity”. To be fair, all of these social/economic issues existed long before Obama, but not nearly quite so acute or far reaching as now. Instead of dirt-poor, we have more poor, but with smart phones. Bringing people down from the top does not bring anything up from the bottom.

        • Russell Byrd

          I think this sums you up:

        • Russell Byrd

          We have more of all these bad things because the Pubs are only interested in transferring the wealth the workers have created into the hands of their rich thieving benefactors. And that is 99% true!

      • Rob

        Union activity and minimum wages price the poor out of jobs. Why do you think unemployment is so rampant among the young and unskilled labor pool? It’s because Democrats raised the minimum wage to pander to voters who never took an Econ 101 course. It is unfortunate that the middle class has in large part borrowed themselves into a hole that will take years to get out of. The problem was that too many middle class families attempted to live beyond their means for too long. As for the disparity between rich and poor that will continue to grow as the reward for new innovation and productivity continues to grow while the value of doing nothing will be stuck at zero.

        • charleo1

          Actually Rob, the numbers will not back up what you say.
          As records show, average wages for rank and file labor
          have not seen an increase, in terms of buying power, since
          1972. And that’s despite productivity of the average worker
          increasing 250% since 1972. In that same year, the salaries
          of top management was on average, 50% higher than
          production line, labor. Today, top management salaries are
          300% of the average base pay of labor. The numbers show
          a direct correlation between falling wages, and the increase
          in the number of workers not able to collectively bargain for
          better wages, healthcare, and retirement packages. What
          this has essentially created is the conditions where higher
          productivity has not been rewarded by compensatory pay.
          This, along with regressive tax policies, have served to
          distribute, and concentrate the additional income created by
          increased production, with fewer workers working longer
          hours, up the income scale. Exacerbating the root source
          of a slowing, or sluggish economy, by further reducing
          aggregate demand for goods and services. So, far from
          what you suggest. That profits on product, or service sold,
          is too low. Because the costs of labor is too high. Just the
          opposite. The price, and therefore the profits, must be adjusted down, to accommodate the general decline in
          discretionary income from the consumer class. And, yes.
          I continue to value the efforts of Republicans, who are
          doing nothing to address the economic problems of this
          Country, as less than zero. As the compensation for their
          labor, as it relates to it’s value, is outrageously over priced.

          • Rob

            Charleo, I think we agree on the basics here. I said that the reward for new innovation and productivity is causing an increased disparity between rich and poor. Your numbers are bearing out that the reward for this is primarily going to the top and not the middle class. I don’t believe that the solution to the problem would be to further raise the cost of middle class labor through collective bargaining or government action. The best way to raise the middle class living standards would be through better education. As for the Republicans not contributing anything I can agree that they have spent an inordinate amount of time on defense trying to stop bad ideas rather than being on offense providing good ideas but when it comes to Congress the biggest problem is the overreach into our daily lives. Washington has become unaccountable by taking on so many tasks of governing so as to muddy the waters in terms of being able to vote on the issues. Washington shouldn’t be involved in so many things in the first place. Many Republicans are trying to just stop the downward spiral.

          • charleo1

            Education is all fine, and wonderful. But, an educated person
            can be just as easily under paid as a lesser educated person,
            if they are dealing with a repressed economy. Look, in the post WII era, late 40s, there was an enormous amount of debt from the war. Republicans then were saying exactly the same things they were saying now. Don’t waste money on things the government has no business doing. Like the GI bill, or the Marshall Plan. Cut corporate taxes, which were as high as 90% at the top end. And labor unions represented about 37% of the workforce, Strong unions led to better pay, the better pay led to record profits, and a heretofore unmatched thriving economy. That also eliminated the debt acquired from the war, in 10 years. Today, the GOP could not name you five things they agree on, that is a proper role of government Why? Because the government taxes, and regulates, the only constituency they are concerned about
            serving. And, for an ever increasing extent, the government has filled the breach left to government, by a corporate culture, that to an ever increasing degree, leaves workers
            with poor, or without healthcare, retirement plans, and by sending the better paying jobs out of the Country, often fail
            to pay Americans a living wage. So sure, now the Congress is overreaching? To do what? What the jobs Americans once
            had, paid for. You know I believe these corporations can
            cut wages, reduce benefits, outsource, and use the over
            abundance of people needing jobs to the number of jobs
            available, to drive down wages, and increase profits. And
            they may do this for the entire working life of their employees.
            But, then, they don’t get to turn around and say, well this reliance on the government is simply awful. Because, you know in f-ing Bangladesh? When we’re thru with people, they don’t expect us to pay extra taxes for Social Security, or Medicare. They just go quietly back to their little grass huts, with their dirt floors, and two or three cows. And, if we’re
            lucky, one day the whole world will be working for us for
            whatever it cost to keep them alive. If that sounds like a
            downward spiral to you, it sounds like one to me. And,
            so how is it again, the Republicans are trying to stop it?

  • suburbancuurmudgeon

    Interesting, the only conservative troll to reply here doesn’t address the GOP’s disdain for the poor, but resorts to disparaging liberals’ “love and tolerance.” Ah, the irony.

    • angelsinca

      If there really was ‘disdain for the poor’ by the GOP, there might be something to address. Please don’t confuse the conservative’s desire to allow business to operate under reasonable minimal government intervention with taking food from the poor.

      It’s a common but thoughtful mistake to make a connection where one doesn’t exist. Conservations are too stupid to create these fantasy connections all by themselves, so says the left. But if you click your heels together and believe real hard…

      • Russell Byrd

        SO, stop taking food from the poor and we might not think you are a trolling liar.

        • angelsinca

          “SO, stop taking food from the poor and we might not think you are a trolling liar”

          Yep, that’s what ‘I” do, take food from the poor. At this point, what the collective ‘you’ thinks is not as important as you seeking treatment for the delusions.

          • Russell Byrd

            You take stupidity and arrogance to new, exciting levels.

            By the way the topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
            discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
            people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

          • angelsinca

            Then why did you change the subject by repeating dictionary entries and call people stupid, Troll Genius?

          • Russell Byrd

            Posting ‘dictionary entries” that describe your objectionable behavior and your off-topic posting, are in fact ON-TOPIC.

            I realize that a dictionary is filled with a lot of scary, threatening, big words, but if you were to try to use one sometime, you might find some fascinating things in there.

            By the way, the topic of this discussion is, “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

            As I do not want to frighten you too much, I will forego that frightful “dictionary entry.” Still, you are a troll

          • angelsinca

            “Still, you are a troll”

            Whatever flips your skirt there Russy-poo. You win. You remain the Jerk of the Week. But, it’s still early.

          • Russell Byrd

            Yeah, but as you say, it is still early. I am sure that no matter how hard I try, you will take the title of Jerk of the Week. You always impress in that category. Fifteen years, tra la la. . . .

          • angelsinca

            “Fifteen years, tra la la. . ”

            This is a clear example why you cannot be trusted Russell Byrd. I shared personal information about my incarcerated son to make a point with another commenter. You, the opportunistic liberal that you are, were presented with a choice to 1) demonstrate some of that compassion you preach by being sensitive to the predicament of a parent with a child behind bars for 15 years, or 2) capturing the information to try to use against me with “..the intent of provoking an emotional response”.

            Like a big boy, you made a choice. You chose poorly and failed the Test of Character, miserably. Nothing less was expected from Russell Bryd, the troll. Looking at the bright side, you managed to highlight you own hypocrisy with assurances you are indeed the piece of shit you portray of others.

          • Russell Byrd

            If you want enlightenment, read carefully:

            Actually, I have already told you the truth on that matter before. I understand your pain. BUT guess who keeps spamming and trolling this topic. As well, WHO felt the need to stir this crap up again. I am not an arrogant or self-important man. I have very little ego. My honesty and charity are undoubted by my employers and by those that know me. I have not been granted much success in return, not economic anyway. BUT that is not what is really important to me. I am not a man that seeks fame or fortune. and I haven’t gotten any. I have never gotten anything for free, but unlike yourself, I know what it is like to be hurting, or go without. I do not begrudge charity to my fellow man. I do not know if there is a God, but unlike the “good” American Christians I fully believe in Christ’s benevolent teachings. Charity, humbleness, the Golden Rule, etc. You apparently do not. And most important in this case, remember the Golden Rule. No, that is not the one that says do anything you need to do to make a stack of cash at your neighbors expense, nor does it say “Do unto others before they do it to you.” REMEMBER, you are the one that has a vulnerability. I have done nothing to you, until I TREATED YOU AS YOU HAVE BEEN TREATING ME! I do not know for sure that you are even real. If I had to profile you, I would predict a pimply faced, under achieving, anti-social, twenty-something, computer geek with sociopathic tendencies that is faking all of this so he can snicker at the replies. The kind of person that gets their jollies doing vandalism and then having an orgasm dreaming over the how ingenious they are. A lover of others people’s pain. The problem is, AND THIS IS THE TRUTH, you picked the wrong guy to mess with. My ONLY concern with you is the amount of time I am wasting posting replies to a troll. I imagine, that if my “profile” is really wrong, you are wasting a lot of valuable time that you could be spending doing important things, like talking to your son. Right now, I do not care either way, but if you wanted MY sympathy, give it a rest.

          • angelsinca

            “If I had to profile you…”

            (the quote here is just a mechanism I use to keep my replies focused, and to easily recognize, in the Disqus Dashboard, what I’ve replied to-thanks).

            Good to hear you have the right mix at work and hopefully at home too. As far as profiling, I counted 18 traits you’ve assigned to me in this latest exchange. You are correct on one of them. That’s only because I consider myself a ‘puter geek since so much time is spent on them and I maintain all my own equipment.

            You know those memes that have 4 or 6 panes, where It shows a picture of how we see ourselves vs how others see us? Well, you and I could probably share the same one in a lot of respects.

            To lessen the likelihood of further misunderstanding, and at the risk of appearing terse or curt, this probably ought to be kept as sensibly brief, as possibly.

            Without leaning on much more of your time or trying to psychoanalyze you, I am a near-60 yr old father of 3 and GF of 4. I am a Vietnam Era Vet. I have been married to the same south american woman for almost 30 yrs. She is a legal immigrant and now a US citizen. One of my children now lives in the country her mother hails from. Three in my family all have dual citizenships. I’ve never left the country because I was the one always working when the opportunity came to travel.

            Eighteen months ago I had rdaical emergency open heart surgery. I had to be paddled back to reality several times to become the unintentionally annoying poster you’ve spent so time with here the past several days.

            We had post-op complications. To keep it short, 6 months ago, the state disability expired. Could have easily qualified for SS disability but would have realized a 45% reduction in fixed income. The spouse works but is $2k short monthly of what we need.

            Too young for social security, to disabled to work, having lost most of the meager retirement savings during the Jan ’08 Screwing of the People by Wall Street, I had to opt for unemployement since my job went away when the disability ocurred.

            Skipping the details of why legal action wasn’t pursued, I HAD to make myself better and good enough to be ‘ready and able to work’, according to UE guidelines. I got the doctors permission to try to work.

            Sixty days ago, when the UE expired, and being ineligible for the sequestration-revised federal UE extensions, I found myself out of options. I had to find anything.

            So, here I am; an aging white male with a pair of degrees, no job, no prospects, needing physical rehab, and trying to hide his disability (employers don’t want a physically challenged aging worker if they don’t get EEOC credits as granted for hiring veterans, women, minorites and the disabled.)

            I found some extremely physically demanding work that requires I sleep away from home 3 times a week. This is my penance for ‘surviving’, it seems. I’m starting to realize there’s a lot of people worse off than me. Maybe they have real pain they are holding back too, I don’t know.

            It seems everyone needs a break. I don’t expect one but remain hopeful these trials are for a higher purpose, eventually.

            Since i am fully aware how life can take shitty turns without rhyme or reason, there is nothing to be gained personally for me to come here to have others go thru the same crap. I don’;t even like sharing the story.

            If it seems like I am ‘messing’ with YOU Russell, it is not intentional. I only stay to defend against assaults on the things I believe in. If the Pope was here, bless his heart, and he was trash-talking conservatives, or the church or my family or my values, he would be challenged too. Dominoes or Nabiscos.

          • Russell Byrd

            This gives me no pleasure. I see it is useless to try to talk reasonably with you. You are the one that began with the over the top posting. I stated clearly that I targeted bullies. I am comfortable with my “profile,” but freely admit that I had no way of knowing. I would have to have more contact with your “works” to know exactly. Anyway, the exact profile is meaningless. By my count, depending on how you determine a “trait,” at most I assigned you seven. Everything else, about three examples, was strictly comparative. Obviously, you did not understand that I really did not think I had a correct profile, just the infantile behavior you exhibited gave me a vague picture of who you might be. My point here is not that I expected to predict your characteristics exactly, but in hindsight, you do not act as one would expect a middle ground sixty-ish man to act.

            As far a your last paragraph, I have seen you in action, and I told you, I target bullies. I hate bullies. The only thing worse is a liar and I have never seen a bully that didn’t. As well, consider this: Continuing to post off-topic, shows absolutely no respect for others, no intelligence, as you cannot keep to the subject, no character, as most change of subject is to just confound the other posters, and causes tempers to flair. Of course, that is what a troll wants.

            As far as defending conservatives, the conservatives you speak of are farther right than Mussolini. In any case, you WILLFULLY came to a group that you knew was populated by people with a reasonable liberal view. Yeah, I said that for your benefit. You then act the smart-ass and play your teanderthal games trying to piss people off that you do not even know by using total disrespect. That by definition is a troll. If you are not, then you should have said your little jaded BS, and then moved on. BUT as a troll you cannot ever really leave. You are looking to punish your fellow man for holding different views. No, we do not own the group, but if you were not a troll, you would find a more suitable place to air your views. You are here to disrupt and plant dissension. Don’t deny it. AND deny other people their Constitutional rights. You have a right to speak, but you cannot interrupt the speech of others in your frenzy to control a group where you are not welcome.

            You do not use any real reasoning except your lame opinion. When you get nailed, then you chain post and try even harder just to disrupt.

            Now you gave me hate for what I have said, and even seemed to be crying about me using your own words against you. What did you expect? You have it coming. Even the way you talk to me and others shows your contempt and ego. Yeah, Mr. Fairy Pooh. I think when they shocked you back they must have short circuited your brain. From now on, I will just say what I please without even bothering to give you a rationale that we both know you will either never read or immediately disdain. To make that simple, I will just say what I please without explanation unless I please to do so.

            Everything you damn conservacons do is designed to denigrate, destroy self-respect, and control people that you see as weaker. That by definition is a bully, which I despise. If you want things to change . . . change!

          • angelsinca

            It seems we have reached a final unapproachable impasse in the ad hoc peace talks. Thanks for trying. I purposefully limited analyis of your on-line personality in order to avoid provoking more unintended reaction. That didn’t work too well. Something causes you to read between the lines to see things that simply aren’t there. It could be the way I write. Not sure, But i will gladly assume responsibility if it will cause you to relax a little. Contrary to your opinion, I am appreciated everywhere I go and remain a bright spot in most people’s day. I smile a lot and and assure the insecure that everything is alright. I am helpful, thoughtful of others and never demand anything of anyone except a best effort and honesty. I am loved, appreciated and respected, as we all should be when we put others above ourselves. Yet, you condemn as though I am the scum of the earth. No one needs that kind of negative reinforcement. Not sure why you hate so bad, RB. When I offer my deepest, most honest attempt at sincerity, stamp me as a liar. I could go thru every point of contention about how flawed you feel my character is, to try to dispel your assumptions, but it won’t change your perceptions. I gave peace a chance, the best I know how. That obviously wasn’t good enough since you continue to refer to everything i say in derragatory terms thru unrelenting name calling. Yuck. There seems to be no solution to this barrage of extreme negativity except absolute avoidance. Again, have a nice life. bye.

          • Russell Byrd

            Shove it up your ass. You made no attempt at “peace talks.” The problem is the sense of perfect entitlement that you have. I hate liars, bullies, the ignorant, and the arrogant. As one of your heroes said, you “are a legend in your own mind.” You may be a bright spot in a blind man’s day. He cannot see you as you really are. As far as you accepting responsibility, I kind of get a laugh at that. I have never been particularly tense. That is just another of your morally superior stances. What I am is disgusted that somehow a waste of skin like you is walking around somewhere. As far as putting others above yourself, you have left an entire encyclopedia of evidence contradicting that nonsense. You put no one above yourself. You see that what a person needs or wants in their life is subject to your prior approval. You are a dishonest man. The only thing I ponder is how much of it is by nature. That is, have you ever been able to help yourself and just cannot do any better. The easiest explanation I can give is you lack empathy. That is a characteristic that is quite common with Pubs, especially far-right tea baggers. Oooops, you are a middle of the road kind of guy, aren’t you. Disgusting lack of truth.

            In summary you are insincere, not very honest but consider yourself so, have very limited empathy for your fellow man, talk about right and wrong but that goes out the window when a dollar comes up, and a serious hypocrite.

            What I can guarantee is your view of your own self-importance. You know everyone MUST listen to your opinion, because you have freedom of speech. WE DO NOT have freedom to not listen. That is the one trait I can guarantee based on direct personal observation.

            You may say that you do not, but you are ideologically opposed to everything you need. You are a burden and a sponge on the very system that you oppose so much. And that is hypocricy based on dishonesty. That alone will mean that we will never come to agreement on anything.

            As I have said, I am not angry, but I am disgusted by the dain, day out load of malarkey your kind produces.

          • angelsinca

            When you throw a lot of maybe‘s on the wall, maybe something’ll stick. A couple of things did this time: empathy and moral superiority. The other stereotype Republican traits don’t fit that well here. Appreciate something new to think about. bye

          • Russell Byrd

            There was no maybe. . . . There was no stereotyping. A fair analysis of exactly what you are.

          • angelsinca

            Nice try with the amatuer psychoanalysis, sheriff. You have tried to force fit nearly all of the supposed conservative traits and they just don’t match here. You are way off on nearly every single guess. They say the radical lib has to silence all opponents with incriminations and lies wrapped with a cloak of wild assumption. They are correct this time. You really don’t know what you are talking about, but please don’t let that prevent you from continuing your foolish tirade. You must be the life of the party…..at a funeral with no other attendees. bye.

          • Russell Byrd

            I think you just proved that they DO match, dirtbag. You are just a chain posting troll, stuck on your view of your own self-importance. Arrogant and no where near as smart as you think you are. You are so wonderful, in your own mind. People probably cringe and try to get out the door when they see you come. As well, you are a useless sponge that thinks you should get top drawer treatment from a “system” that you claim to despise. A system, by the way, that you want to destroy and deny to people that really need it. I cannot hold you in the contempt that you deserve. The contempt you deserve would be soul searching. Maybe, if you do have a religious belief, you should learn a little about the teachings of Christ and actually follow them. As it is, you are nothing but a self-righteous Pharisee that wants religion, but despises Christ.

          • angelsinca

            Let’s review your latest post. TGhis one is typical of your mutliple hit & miss attacks that are filled with generalization without specific example:

            “I think you just proved that they DO match”
            Wrong. You rarely actually ‘think’. You usually ‘react’ with imprinted paradigms of what someone else has said. Haven’t heard anything new here.

            “…, dirtbag.”
            Wrong. The name is not dirtbag.

            “You are just a chain posting troll”
            Wrong. Simply replying to your relentless personal attacks.

            “, stuck on your view of your own self-importance.”
            Wrong. I am not important to anyone but my family anmd friends. I believe you might be confusing self-importance with ‘minding one’s place’ since you admonish when soemone speaks up against something. Especially a conservative on liberal turf.

            “Arrogant”
            Maybe. It’s an acquired defense mechanism to survive the plethora of on-line crapola.

            “and no where near as smart as you think you are.”
            Wrong. Have never claimed to be smart. Actually wish I was smarter most of the time.

            “You are so wonderful, in your own mind.”
            Wrong. I don’t usually look at myself in any light except to reflect on how to avoid repeating a mistake. Thanks for the compliment. The spouse calls me that too.

            “People probably cringe and try to get out the door when they see you come.”
            Wrong. I usually cede the entryway. I’m in no hurry.

            “As well, you are a useless sponge”
            Wrong. Sponges are useful. I have had to use disability but only to survive through a physical difficulty. Thanks for this post because I wanted to point out how you use frailities that people reveal to you, in order to assault them. This is bullying.

            “.. that thinks you should get top drawer treatment from a “system” that you claim to despise.”
            Wrong. I don’t expect anything. I was surprised to learn that I was eligible for disability because of heart disease. Want to trade? I Have never said I despise ‘the system”. I have called out flaws in the system in order to effect solution. But unless fully corrupted, most things can be fixed.

            “…I don’t”
            Not sure. I don’t stalk your posts to assemble fantasy dispersions as you do. Speaking of dispersions, doesn’t the commandment, “thou shall not bear false witness” mean anything to you?

            “..thanks”
            Near hit. We both know you aren’t thankful, especially toward a conservative. Not bad compared to the other posts with mostly misses. You are welcome.

            “A system, by the way, that you want to destroy and deny to people that really need it.”
            Wrong. I totally support a safety net for those that need it.

            “I cannot hold you in the contempt that you deserve.”
            Wrong. Already have, numerous times.

            “The contempt you deserve would be soul searching.”
            Wrong. But good point. We should all look at OURSELVES before casting dispersions and judgments on others.

            “Maybe, if you do have a religious belief, you should learn a little about the teachings of Christ and actually follow them.”
            Wrong. Unlike yourself, I continue to obey the ten commandments to the best of my frail human abilities.

            “As it is, you are nothing but a self-righteous Pharisee”
            Wrong. I do not belong to the ancient Jewish sect. However, I have no control over whatever opinion you choose to project onto others. I can only ask you to reflect on your own shortcomings. And, in this case, report to you that you are wrong. Again.

            “… that wants religion, but despises Christ”
            Wrong again. Already ‘got’ religion. For the hating Christ comment. please refer back to the ten commendments.

            bye. it’s been real.

          • Russell Byrd

            Thank you for confirming my earlier posts describing your behavior. I do not need to “see” anything further.

            In Internet slang, a troll is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with theintent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion. From Wikipedia

          • Russell Byrd

            And a blasphemer too. If you believed in the ten commandments, you would never have come here. . . .

          • Russell Byrd

            In Internet slang, a troll is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topicmessages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion. From Wikipedia

          • Russell Byrd

            And thank you once again for confirming my views of you. It turns out not only was I correct, but your pathology is worse that I first suspected. Maybe, you should just change your name to Mr. Freeloader. When you called me Bubba, I knew you had me confused with your son’s roomie. I don’t do “squeal like a pig.”

          • angelsinca

            I should have explained the ‘Bubba’ moniker from a dozen posts ago. It was prompted by your repeatedly narrow-minded and bigoted views. Red Skelton is flipping in his grave from your misuse of ‘freeloader’. Have a nice day.

          • Russell Byrd

            In Internet slang, a troll is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic
            discussion. From Wikipedia

          • Russell Byrd

            You have also just proved everything I have said. I specifically passed on replying to your last small-minded self-glorification. However, you have a pathological need to stir shit. You are not defending anyone or any view. You are a willful troll, that is here to disrupt.

            I will leave you with two indisputable truths.

            1. If I were incorrect about you and you were a real man, then you would not need to dispute with me, again and again, over what you already know is false. As it is, you know I am right, but you want to beat me into submission like any lying, bully would. (We know from your posts that you are one of those girly-men your kind is so fascinated with.)

            2. You are only here to disrupt. Intelligent, rational conversation is not even a secondary consideration. You want to stir up people with your useless prattle.

          • Russell Byrd

            As an afterthought, your entire post can be summed up like this: You are writing as if you are excusing yourself from any responsibility. You are not placating. You are alibiing your own behavior. You are finding excuses for the fact that you have never done anything objectionable. You come off as one smug bastard. That is not contrition.

            I am sure everyone loves you.

          • angelsinca

            Thanks for another pick-me-up. The problem with no face time is, it’s a lot easier to look a man in the eye to find a better connection. This one is just another dropped call. bye.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            I MUST jump in here. Russel, the ‘interesting IQ man’ [how I will look at him from now on in my mind, because he's certainly not in his right mind] wrote the following to you:

            “In any case, you WILLFULLY came to a group that you knew was populated by people with a reasonable liberal view.”

            Well, that was an interesting comment. Reasonable, liberal views. Most of what I find is hate. How about you?
            I find it on Republican sites, too. But I find it interesting to read all points of view. I have engaged in thoughtful discussions with some frequent posters. They are, in fact, reasonable.
            Russel? He’s just lost his mind. He and his friend Fern are nothing but hate mongers who make themselves feel better by bullying others. They don’t want to listen to you. They won’t listen to you. Because their worlds would come crumbling down if they were forced to admit their hypocrisy.
            I have not been on this site for some time. I am enjoying reading your posts. Russel – he’s just plain nuts.

          • Russell Byrd

            I will give you the simple answers now.

            You, by definition are a troll.

            I told you this could stop at any time, but not to your sick satisfaction. I narrowmindedly believe in justice and truth, not in another’s sick ego trip.

            Finally, I warned you from the beginning that I only bullied the bullys. The only thing I hate worse is a liar, and I have never seen a bully that wasn’t a liar as well.

            READ: The post that follows carefully. I have a lot more to say, but time does not allow.

          • Russell Byrd

            Something occurred to me. Why do you post this drivel anyway. You got whacked before and the episode is past. So far, you have failed miserably to best me either intellectually or ethically, you are not doing so now, and there is no expectation that you will in the future. So why persist in revisiting an embarrassing loser for you? Do you think you are harming the world by wasting my time, or are you so interested in the last word, that you just have to keep trying? Remember what is said about doing the same failing thing over and over again and expecting a different result. I told you, I would not run away from ignorant trolls and bullies. If you just have to have the last word, just say adios and be off with you.

          • angelsinca

            “So far, you have failed miserably to best me either intellectually or ethically”

            Finally, we have identified the problem. You play to ‘best’. I play to defend against the hate projected onto conservatives. The good news, with you as the ‘bester’, you can continue hating. The other good news, now that your true intention is revealed, is you can more easily be dimissed, along with all the other assholes that choose to hate on conservatives and republicans and anyone else that wanders by who doesn’t agree with your depictions of the non-liberal. Have a nice life Bubba, after you focus on, then correct, your own issues. Thanks again for the info.

          • Russell Byrd

            Stooooopid, this entire exchange is not only entirely off-topic, but was initiated and sustained by you. And I told you what I told you, exactly by the words I used. You know what I said and there was no great admission. But your inane posting speaks volumes. You can’t handle the fact that you are an intellectual midget. As well, you think bashing your hard head into the same stone wall will have a different outcome. That is the definition of madness. In any case, you lose. Sorry!

          • Russell Byrd

            Here is some analysis. The truth in other words. I always enjoy doing this, instead of using your tactic of lying about what was said. And remember, you started up the discussion with your off-topic postings to a dead discussion.

            “Finally, we have identified the problem.” Yes, you are deranged.

            “You play to ‘best’. I play to
            defend against the hate projected onto conservatives.” Now that is funny. That is what I have been saying to you and your kind for years. VERIFIABLE. What are saying is provably untrue as you keep starting this discussion back up.

            “The good news,
            with you as the ‘bester’, you can continue hating.” I hate only haters that foist their hateful views on to their fellow man. That of course means I should hate you, but you are so easy to deal with, I only feel pity. I might point out that your sentence is nearly incomprehensible and its structure shows a real lack of education.

          • Russell Byrd

            “The other good news, now that your true intention is revealed, is you can more easily be dimissed, along with all the other assholes that choose to hate on conservatives and republicans and anyone else that wanders by who doesn’t agree with your depictions of the non-liberal.” What a messed up, run on sentence. Of course, it reflects your disordered thought process. Of all the pertinent replies I can make I will just choose one. What happened to the moderate, open minded, not Tea Bag, non conservacon, and non republicrap angelsinca? I am going to log your post and make it go viral. You will never get away with that whopper again.

          • Russell Byrd

            “Have a nice life Bubba, after you focus on, then correct, your own issues.” Any issues I need to correct are not manifest here. But as you have given the advice, then I will make it my mission to correct the true issue. I am going to post the “troll” definition once more, and then turn it over to the moderators.

          • Russell Byrd

            “Thanks again for the info.” No, thank you for giving me the tools to abolish you. I see now why HE is doing 15 years and i hope he does it all. We both know he was righteously guilty and where he got his meanness from. And please use my real name and not, Bubba, the name of your boy’s roomie. Bye, bye.

      • suburbancuurmudgeon

        Explain to me how cutting food stamps and the safety social net is “allow(ing) business to operate under reasonable minimal government intervention.” Our ideas of “reasonable” are different. There was a time business had more of a conscience than it does now. It operates within a large community of its fellow humans and owes that community.

        Conservatives don’t “create those fantasy connections;’ rather, they embrace and embody them. Conservatives really don’t like poor people and feel the poor are that way because they choose to be.

        • angelsinca

          “Explain to me how cutting food stamps and the safety social net is “allow(ing) business to operate under reasonable minimal government intervention.”

          This is difficult to answer curmudgeon. Sadly, the sense of community is rare anymore, as you likely know.

          The cutting off of food stamps by itself is an unkind act. But even more unkind is promoting the program to entice more people into it. The recent explosive increase in participation is alarming, growing from 32 million participants in Jan 2009 to almost 50 million now.

          As time marches on, it will be increasingly difficult to wean people back to self reliant/community-supported sustinance. I’m curious what caused the increase in the program exactly. In less than five years, we have ‘evolved’ into a dependent mindset where the govenment is now expected to feed you, in addition to taking care of your health and education.

          The cost of the food stamp program is huge. In FY 2009 it was at $50B and now at almost $85B, a 70% increase under Obama. This over-dependence on governement entitlements costs more than it can afford and remains a frightening indication of future dependence on the government for survival while the goverment struggles to meet entitlement demands.

          This isn’t working out so well in socialized societies like France, Greece, Italy and now Brazil where the people are rioting because rthe govt’s can no longer afford the free stuff.

          People should be taught to fish, not provided free fish.

          “Conservatives really don’t like poor people and feel the poor are that way because they choose to be”

          This is nonsense. I am a conservative, as are my spouse and adult children. We go to church, we do community services for the poorer in the congregation. I help the neighbors where I can if I can afford it.

          If you really NEED a reason to parrot fallacies about conservatives, at least try to come up with original, truthful or honest reasons, and not just echo what someone else pontificated.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            Food stamp use went up because we had a recession and a 10% unemployment rate. It wasn’t a grand design to entice people onto food stamps to get votes, a common conservative fallacy.

            There is no “dependent mindset.” Unemployment is still 7.6%; employers hire part-timers to avoid paying benefits; people working at Wal-Mart make so little money they have to resort to food stamps. In case you haven’t noticed, the poor are getting poorer, the middle class is disappearing, and the gains all go to the 1%. I’m not sure what you want people to do. If there were jobs out there just for the asking, we’d have a zero unemployment rate, something that will never happen.

          • angelsinca

            “There is no “dependent mindset.”

            If this is true, then taking away the entitlement should hardly be noticed.

          • suburbancuurmudgeon

            I don’t parrot fallacies; I repeat what I see. When was the last time you did something for people OUTSIDE of your congregation? The inner city poor? The rural poor? The homeless? The forgotten. When was the last time you toured the backwaters of Mississippi? When were you helping out on the South or West side of Chicago?

            My church is one of several that provide meals for the homeless. Most of those homeless people actually have jobs and would otherwise live in their cars all the time. We took a single black mother, not part of the congregation, and gave her a second chance through a program with stringent requirement. I donated an old car and put $2500 towards a replacement when the engine finally blew. She has a job, an apartment and has turned her life around.

          • angelsinca

            “When were you helping out on the South or West side of Chicago?”

            I haven’t since I live 2,000 miles from Chicago. Sorry, won’t get into a pissing comntest over who helps out more.

  • angelsinca

    Lame article. It trolls for the reader that wants to reinforce its disdain for the GOP, and then delivers a weak connection between support for abortion beyond 20 weeks and clamping down on the food stamp free-for-all. Nothing new here. Same old conservatives-are-meanies hatin’ goin’ on.

    • Russell Byrd

      No, it amply explains the disdain the GOP has for women, and anyone not adhering strictly to their Stone Age platform. As for trolling, I guess you are hoping for a “mate.” So you can raise little trolls. Scary.

      • angelsinca

        The imagined war on women was assigned to the GOP as a political tactic to pass the contraception mandate for the Dem’s ACA. You can drop the politicking now and get real. The GOP as a party gains nothing by harboring disdain for women. Why does your Obama house a mostly-boy’s club, anyway?

        BTW: attempting to silence all opposition with accusation of stupidity and ‘trolling’ is indeed stone age mentality of the narrow minded.

        • Russell Byrd

          Wikipedia describes: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset people.[1]. They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[

        • Russell Byrd

          “Obama house a mostly-boy’s club. . .” Why don’t you tell the truth about the state of “your” house, i.e. because you are too stupid to understand, means Repubs.

          The war on women is real. I have dealt with enough low-lifes to know that most criminals deny being criminals. I work with and make my personal decisions based on evidence. The evidence is there is spades. There is no place here to post a thousand page volume. Again, simply saying you do not do something means nothing when you are caught doing it.

          • angelsinca

            Again, you confuse a commenter on a blog with the Republican party. I am just onee, they are tens of millions. Here, I am holding one finger up for you to catch the visual. God save us all from your involvement with jurisprudence. People like you find guilt where none exists to fit a warped sense of justice. I have a son doing 15 years because of a lying opinionated confused asshole like you that sense they are better than those they condemn. While you go to sleep counting the lives you’ve ruined thru your bigotry and biases, please do GFY. Enjoy the show Byrdshot.

          • Russell Byrd

            With a name like that I thought you were a girl. Sorry, I guess eunuch is the true situation. All cock and no balls.

            I am a liberal, that means that, unlike yourself, I actually need evidence to decide guilt. For me, beyond a reasonable doubt means beyond a reasonable doubt. Not just an impassioned plea by a crooked cop or prosecutor. Anyway, I hope that son of yours does the whole 15. He sure has got one hell of a freak of a daddy as a life coach.

          • angelsinca

            Nope, won’t take your bait. If you must insult people you don’t know with sexual vulgarity, you should practice in the mirror first. The disappointment you find may help to dampen that peculiar urge of yours to to incite discourse.

            It isn’t you that decides guilt. The evidence does, LIKE YOU SAID. Wishing anyone to sit in jail for 15 years is an odd desire that reveals a mean streak. You have no evidence to judge his guilt. You have lied about what you claim to need to decide guilt.

            I try not to play with flaky liars. But if I was to impersonate a judge, you would be found guilty of social perjury and purposefully avoided. bye, genius.

          • Russell Byrd

            But of course, you would be only impersonating. In your view, like most of your kind, holding a different opinion is a punishable offense. NO, I do not wish any person to sit in jail for 15 years. It does no one any good. But it is the best we can do with those that offend society. I only said he should spend the whole 15, because I see where he has probably gotten his sociopathic view point on how to treat other people. From you. And everyone has heard that song and dance about being innocent and framed. Some are, and part of the liberal creed is to try to stop this. Every conservative I know either believes you are guilty WHEN you are accused or thinks that an innocent convicted is just the cost of them living a safer, happier, and more affluent life. I SWEAR, I have never met one that thought differently. YOU are playing for the wrong team. You have let racism and bigotry, especially bigotry this time, confuse the issues you should care about. Now did I really have to say any of this.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            I have never been so furious in my life. What he said to you was inexcusable. I am so sorry that you have to deal with low life scum such as him.

            So very sorry,

          • angelsinca

            Thanks for the support, friend. But, it isn’t your responsibility to guardian the hateful words of others.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            Yes, you are correct. My reaction was visceral. I can not tolerate that kind of unkindness. Be well.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            ” I hope that son of yours does the whole 15′.
            YOU ARE A BULLYING SON OF A BITCH AND A LOWLIFE HUMAN.
            You should be THROWN OFF THIS SITE.
            I have been reading days and days of your rhetoric, catching up with the posts on this site.
            Then I came to this,
            My reaction – you are a piss poor excuse of a human. I sincerely hope you apologized somewhere for this pathetic response. You are an animal, saying something that low and vile.
            GO BACK UNDER THE ROCK YOU CRAWLED OUT UNDER FROM YOU DESPICABLE EXCUSE OF HUMAN BEING THAT YOU ARE because you are doing a grave disservice to the people that post on this site.
            A grave disservice.
            Did you find the comment worth it? Did it make you more of a man?
            You are a little boy. And nothing more than the WORST kind of bully that exists.
            If your friends on this site condone this kind of behavior, I would be shocked.
            I’ll read on now. I have NEVER been so disgusted by a posting. Ever.

          • Russell Byrd

            I could tell by your name that you are just another “teanderthal.” Maybe, if your kind, and the scumbags you refer to would quit trolling these sites trying to stir up trouble, then I you not respond to you the way I have. I only bully, BULLIES. His, and your, First Amendment rights do not abridge the rights of the other posters. Most of whom do not agree with your vile, vicious, and evil viewpoints.

            My “rhetoric” is just fine. I have had to read right-wing doofus comments about one grammatical error that was correct usage. By an a-hole that had a serious grammatical error of his own, AND three spelling mistakes. I have nearly pleaded with jerks like you to have a little compassion, or maybe get some information that is not just something to feed your prejudices. I have been called names and had to read off-topic comments until I am sick of it.

            Did I find the comment worth it. Yes, an individual that came here to harass, who had not posted ON-TOPIC since he arrived, finally quit. There are people in that group that have become sick and tired of hard-heads that only want to disrupt.

            This is my first, last, and only reply to you. As far as I am concerned you are just more garbage mouthing words of outrage because you are not in total control. So I hope you do not take it to unkindly when I tell you to f**k yourself and raise your own bastards. That line is a lot more on topic than anything your bullying mob has said in here.

          • Inthenameofliberty

            Good.

            Don’t reply.
            Just realize that the regular posters on this site go mute once you start your pretty words.
            That is quite telling.

            Guess you don’t have as much support as you think.
            I certainly don’t see them backing you up.
            You can tell me anything you want. The fact that you think it is fine to rip into a father about his incarcerated son……nope….I didn’t see anyone on this site supporting you.
            Not in this.

          • Russell Byrd

            I will make one exception for our new pet troll: Simply, only an idiot would think that doing right needed a public opinion poll. As well, only an even worse idiot would think that a seven day old thread would be of interest to the regular posters. Only a colossal idiot, that needs help just crossing the street, would think I am impressed by a willful lie. That is exactly why I am abusive. I set the tone of my posts to match the tone of the bully. Since, I will have to explain it to you, the regular posters are silent because they are long gone. I am only making an exception to reply to your stupidity.

            Thanks for proving my point, moron. The regular posters post very well when I am around. They receive no problems from me. I think if you had anywhere near that half a brain I earlier gave you credit for you would understand that trash trolls like you are the ones that are seen as problems.

            As far as anyone supporting me, I have had single posts that are more popular than everything “angelcreep” has posted in its entirety. In fact, I have had posts that are more popular than EVERYTHING all you have posted – IN TOTAL. So, that is just more bullying and trolling. As far as any one “liking” this post, well doofus, this topic is from a week ago. On the internet, this is ancient history. In any case, being “loved” is not why I came. If it is that important to you, then you should not even be wasting your time posting because you will rack up few “llikes” here.

            Now, let’s get down to why I said it. The SOB earned it. What is more his son is certainly guilty. I have gotten tired of that “framed” nonsense and lack of justice in the system. Hmmm, it seems I am sounding a little like a Teanderthal. Well in this case I think it is warranted. Angelblahs sense of self importance and immunity from the opinions and wishes of others, and his scoffing at decent behavior, probably warped his son’s views of the rights of other people. Apparently, “angel…” cannot even keep a relationship going because he sees no value in other people. People warped by being exposed to this “value system” often do not obey the law.

            Now, since you proved your true self-worthlessness, I will tell you something I know. The only real reason you would target me for more bullying and trolling is you were sent by “angelsoft” to get revenge. An excellent possibility is you are old “angelsoft” himself with a new nick. Hmmm?

          • Inthenameofliberty

            I’m sure you must be correct.
            You seem to believe you are correct about a lot of things.

        • Russell Byrd

          By the way, I call you stupid because it is impossible to reason with you or have a conversation with any expectation that you will be tell the truth. As for calling you a troll, quite simply you fit the textbook description. . . .

          • angelsinca

            You confuse truth with being like-minded, Sheriff. Hope you feel better in the morning.

          • angelsinca

            Russell Byrd wrote: “By the way, I call you stupid because..”

            Because you are a smug asshole? Yes.

          • Russell Byrd

            Your inane reply does not really require an answer. I think I can chalk that up as a “win by forfeit.” BUT, I just had to let you know that I had read your ignorant remark. Let’s say that I plead no contest to your cute little blurb. So I am an asshole. That still will not change that the “shit” fits you to a “T.”

          • angelsinca

            Look sweetie, I promise to remember you as that annoying little prick. I will not go away. I will continue defending the conservative against opinionated little shits like you with your head so far up your ass, you meet yourself.

          • Russell Byrd

            So you have just admitted for all to see that you are neither open-minded nor an independent. By claiming to not be a Pub you have placed yourself to the far-right of the far-right. That critter is commonly called a Tea Bagger, but as I prefer a Teatard.

            Anyway, you are not defending anything. You willfully came here to attack, disrupt, and sow dissension. Once again, you are by definition a troll. If you cannot handle that leave. Of course, that will be how many times? Eight? That I know of.

            I will give you an old and wise adage I adopted as one of my tenets: While you are bad mouthing me, you are leaving some other poor decent soul alone. So thank you, and kindly.

            And “sweetie,” I am all for an individuals right to a free life, but I am not into that. Sorry.

          • Russell Byrd

            Oh, sorry, SMUG asshole, but you are still a troll by definition. There is no plausible denial to that fact. Yes?

  • atc333

    Finally, Someone has opened up a discussion of the real flaw in the GOP pro life mindset. Once again, it is the GOP doing exactly what they claim they are against, Big Brother stepping in to tell individuals what they must do. If the GOP is so pro life, then the GOP Right Wing should simply step up to the plate and create a special tax based fund for all women who would have sought and abortion, but were denied the right of that choice. Considering that it costs an average of $300,000 plus to raise a child, and rapidly increasing, child, the purpose would be to substantially assist and pay for the care, feeding, medical, education, clothing, and transportation of each child which the GOP Right Wing mandated be brought into the world with a new special Federal surtax upon Registered Republicans. What is wrong with this proposal? After all, the GOP claims the Left Wingers should simply volunteer to pay more taxes, if they think the current tax rates are not high enough on the “job creators”, why shouldn’t the Pro Life members volunteer for this special tax save all these lives, which otherwise, following their birth, they would immediately choose to ignore, and abandon?

    Unfortunately, the GOP and the Pro Life Radicals never put their money where their mouths are. T

    • plc97477

      Unfortunately they don’t completely abandon them after they are born. They still need them to fight in their wars.

    • angelsinca

      “What is wrong with this proposal?”

      Plenty. Special tax based on political ideology is unconstitutional. Two, even the uber-right wing extremists aren’t forcing anyone to make babies. They are proposing expectant mothers have 20 weeks to make a decision for themselves to abort or carry. Please keep in mind that for every right wing nut, there is AT LEAST ONE in left wings

      • Russell Byrd

        But people do make babies. If they are unable and unwilling to care for them, are you going to be there and help. Forget your “pass the blame on to someone else” routine. Might be a nice discussion topic, but does not face the challenge that needs to be addressed. We have had a knock-down drag-put discussion in an earlier article on that Texas dirtbag that wants to cut food stamps even more. Are you willing to do the right thing or do you just want to sit on your a** blaming others.

      • Russell Byrd

        No one thinks a tax will be placed on the pro-fetus starving-child bloc. BUT decent people know it should be done.

      • atc333

        You missed the point. 1) The special tax just for Radical Right GOP was tongue in cheek, obviously what you, and apparently many others don’t realize is that the 20 weeks goal is temporary, the long term goal is to outlaw choice entirely, once the 20 weeks is passed,, and if it stands, will allow the GOP Radical Right to chop away at a woman’s right to control her own body. Many of the ultra Right Wing are also against contraceptives being part of any woman’s health care plan, if provided at no charge, which the Right considers to be “government provided free contraceptives as we saw with their claims last year.

        The point is, that the goal of the Right Wing of the GOP is to require that a woman must have an unwanted, ill timed, pregnancy, one which may have complications, for the mother or fetus, emotional, financial, or medical. The GOP does not care, just as the GOP does not care about the child once it has been born, saddling State, county, and City hospitals with the ever increasing costs of childbirth, and all the related complications.

        Are you by any chance become aware of the fact that in the years following Rowe v. Wade, the actual numbers of crimes per thousand has gone down because of the fact that less unwanted, abused, and unloved children are growing up into disturbed, angry, and criminal adults? When you combine the GOP assault on Choice, as well as its continued assault on Federal, state, and local safety nets in their continued attempts to shrink government, which is nothing more than abandonment of the poor, unemployed, or underemployed, many who are more than willing to work to support themselves, or if they have a full time job, at current minimum wage, cannot even pay their current bills, much less the costs of pregnancy, childbirth, and the $250k additional expenses which the GOP is attempting to impose on those living at, below, or just above the poverty level.

        The GOP, legislating life, then callously abandoning live it demanded be created.

        • angelsinca

          “.. the goal of the Right Wing of the GOP is to require that a woman must have an unwanted, ill timed, pregnancy, one which may have complications, for the mother or fetus, emotional, financial, or medical”

          This is NOT a goal of the GOP. Some religious groups may want impose forced pregnancy, but the GOP is not a religious group. To say the entre right wing and the GOP wants it just isn’t true.

          “The GOP does not care, just as the GOP does not care about the child once it has been born”

          I see zero proof the GOP doesn’t care. I suspect you want the government to pay for raising a child in its entirety IF the gov’t says you must carry it to full term. I agree.

          But, the GOP doesn’t get a women pregnant or mandate you MUST carry it. This argument is used by Dems so often, It seems like some want to use abortion solely because they won’t be able afford the cost over the baby’s lifetime.

          If you don’t want a child, don’t have it. Just make your decision before ripping the fetus out of the womb after it’s able survive outside the body. IF there is ever an absolute yea or nay by the government on abortion, many in the GOP will run to the defense of the opressed. The GOP’s platform is MINIMAL govenrment intrusion. The GOP is not the opressor here.

          Again, the government, and especially the GOP, doesn’t force a women to carry or abort a baby. The choice remains hers. The current abortion laws and allowances are, after 40 years since Roe v Wade, a balance between the zealots that scream “murder!” and those that dispose of babies like underwear.

          Hopefully abortion will remain a choice into the future. And hopefully, people can take the responsibility not to get pregnant if they don’t want to be pregnant.

          Just please stop blaming the GOP for things it doesn’t do. If a person relinquishes its decisions to the government, it WILL make those decisions for you. And the government is a lot more than just the GOP.

          • atc333

            Then consider this, why are Right Wing GOP Red States defunding Planned Parenthood, and shutting down their clinics, simply because Planned Parenthood will refer out women to clinics which do offer such services for women who are seeking an abortion?
            Who suffers because of this direct attack on Planned Parenthood? Low income women who cannot afford to pay the high cost of medical care during pregnancy.

            Check out what is going on in Ohio with the GOP Legislature.

            There is your proof.

          • angelsinca

            Thanks for the examples. But it is interesting that not paying for female medical services is now seen as an assault on women. My mother who served in the Navy would never have approved of the entitlement mentality. Because the gov’t won’t pay for my de-circumcision or prostate exam or vasectomy, maybe there is an assault men too. Not likley.

            As far as the growing trend for states to defund planned parenthood, it seems to have a lot to do with political and idealogy differences surrounding the PP’s function as an abortion mill and as a supposed ally to the sex trafficking trade outside the us where over a million PP clients reside. The PP has ensured no-parental consent laws and no ultrasound testing before abortions. There is also Obama’s special protections offered to Planned Parenthood through the ACA against the objections of the legislature and the will of the people in those states that don’t want federal dollars subsidizing abortion. Brief research shows it isn’t the Republicans but the Susan B Anthony activists spearheading the drive to defund the PP. The battle continues. Thirty three years ago, we had to use thier abortion services. If they are going to be defunded out of existence, where will women go for the procedure? Many steps backwards in reproductive health services, it seems.

        • Russell Byrd

          These right-wingers are unfamiliar with sarcasm, satire, subtlety, etc., as well as higher order thinking, for example reason and logic. Add to that an allergy to truth, poor reading skills, and a short attention span makes conversation near impossible. Their strength lies in the notion that they are infallible. That of course is what is wrong with their own party.

  • jovan1984

    Thank you Mrs. Tucker for telling the whole truth about the fascist far right. We’ve been saying this for years. The lamestream media does not want to tell the truth about the miscreants who want to confiscate every woman’s uterus and control their lives from birth to death.

    • angelsinca

      “the miscreants who want to confiscate every woman’s uterus and control their lives from birth to death”

      Well, of course, so that women will produce more soldiers and taxpayers for the State. Simply absurd notions oozing from the left this morning. Ridiculous.

      • jovan1984

        It is not absurd. It is the truth. I figured you cons out a long time ago. The rest of the mods and the left is finally catching up to me.

        • angelsinca

          Of course, there is absolutely no absurdity saying the right wants to “confiscate uteruses’. Poor thing, you actiually believe this BS. The ‘cons’ figured out the liberal a long time ago. You tend to believe something as fact when at least one other liberal agrees. Or you saw it in print. The internet is your bastion of truth…lol.

          • Russell Byrd

            You have no point. You know what was meant and yet you must continue to disrupt and lie. TROLL

          • angelsinca

            Cool, we got the race card and the intellectual high ground AND mutliple Troll! cries today. Good job Russell. Sorry about your bad luck and rough ride. Maybe there will be a witch burning in your area to regain that comforting sense of collective persecution.

            This reminds me of Donald Sutherland in the remake of Invasion of the Body Snatchers, where, as one of the townsfolk infected with an alien, he raises his arm and points with a shrieking call toward a couple that hasn’t been infected yet.

            btw: nothing screams TROLL! like following someone to denounce what they say and calling them a liar because you don’t agree with them. I ended up here because you replied to me. Before you cry out loud with , “Leave me alone!”, I am really, really going to have to say g’bye now. Enjoy the trolling.

          • Russell Byrd

            I repeat:

            The problem with stupidity and arrogance is you never factor in the other persons feelings. You are not misogynistic (or racist or a troll) simply because you say you are not, regardless of what others observe and think of your behaviour. The fact you are still flogging this point proves that you lie.

          • Russell Byrd

            And wrong again. Nothing screams troll like an unwelcome dirtbag that continues to espouse off-topic ideas that have been continually debunked by multiple posters. The fact that you are still here just screams troll. I have every right to pursue you and point that out. As you said before, you would be gone, but like any troll, you lied again. In fact, you returned again and may even still be posting. The fact you like responding to me in that manner “screams” poignantly of “Leave me alone!”

          • Russell Byrd

            And lastly, you did play the race card, you are a mental midget, and you are a textbook definition of TROLL. I will keep following you around. As is my usual practice, I create trouble for no one, except the troublemakers.

          • angelsinca

            You are imagining again. So, along with your list of ruinations and fantasies, you are also a stalker too. Goodbye Russell Byrd. You are boring. Playtime is over. Bye-bye.

          • Russell Byrd

            You have left seven times by my count.
            I am a stalker? You are one sick troll. I am not stalking you, you are doing that for yourself. I just do not tolerate a prick like you.

            I am glad I am boring, maybe you will quit trolling.
            Your entire series of posts have just been fantasies and you are the one complaining about ruination.

            Playtime is not over just because you say so. Why? Because you will not be able to resist continuing to troll. Bet you cannot make an hour without returning to “play.”
            As I said before, I only trouble the troublemakers.

          • jovan1984

            I see right through your kind’s doublespeak. You claim you are for less government, but you want the government to invade women’s privacy and their uteruses. That is not less government, that is big government under the strict definition of the term.

            I’m not fooled by the conservatives anymore. I will speak truth to power about misogynists like you.

          • angelsinca

            “I see right through your kind’s doublespeak”

            As an adult you are free to imagine whatever you want. Including the crazy notion the GOP wants to take over uterus. I have three mothers, one daughter several sisters and many aunts. The only thing mysoginistic about me is how I sometimes leave the toilet set up. In a house full of women, I get a little confused sometimes.

          • jovan1984

            Here is the truth, MISOGYNIST: the GOP, far right and DINOs ALL want to take over women’s uteruses. Senate Bill 5 in Texas rings a bell? Or how about the North Dakota law? Or the Arkansas law?

            Three pieces of clear evidence that you absolutely ignore!

          • angelsinca

            Where do you get that I don’t like women? If you are a man, I am now feeling more like a misandrist.

          • jovan1984

            Your actions. That is where I got that you don’t like women from. Actions speak a lot louder than the words you type.

          • angelsinca

            Please be more specific. This should be good.

  • kanawah

    The word “hypocrite” does not even start to describe these fools.
    Then add to this, their endless efforts to limit access to birth control, and you have a real disaster on your hands.

    The only way to fix this problem is to eliminate all republiCONS and Transylvania tea bag from Washington.

  • Russell Byrd

    Dear mike and Mulligatonney:

    The topic is “GOP Ignores Children Once They’re Outside The Womb.”

    Wikipedia defines: a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows
    discord on the Internet by trying to start arguments and upset
    people.[1].They may do this by posting deliberately inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or
    off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room,
    or blog, with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional
    response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

    This describes you, your methods, and your goals, perfectly.

  • tax payer

    I’ll post one time only. Once they are out of the womb or in the womb the parents are responsible for them and not the GOP or the tax payers. I am glad I can choose where to comment and be gone before the leeches attack.

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