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Wednesday, October 26, 2016

I have a question for my Republican friends.

Yes, that sounds like the setup for a smackdown, but though the question is pointed, it is also in earnest. I’d seriously like to know:

If Republican fiscal policies really are the key to prosperity, if the GOP formula of low taxes and little regulation really does unleash economic growth, then why has the country fared better under Democratic presidents than Republican ones and why are red states the poorest states in the country?

You may recall that Bill Clinton touched on this at the 2012 Democratic Convention. He claimed that, of all the private sector jobs created since 1961, 24 million had come under Republican presidents and a whopping 42 million under Democrats. After Clinton said that, I waited for PolitiFact, the nonpartisan fact-checking organization, to knock down what I assumed was an obvious exaggeration.

But PolitiFact rated the statement true. Moreover, it rated as “mostly true” a recent claim by Occupy Democrats, a left-wing advocacy group, that 9 of the 10 poorest states are red ones. The same group earned the same rating for a claim that 97 of the 100 poorest counties are in red states. And then there’s a recent study by Princeton economists Alan Binder and Mark Watson that finds the economy has grown faster under Democratic presidents than Republican ones. Under the likes of Nixon, Reagan and Bush they say we averaged an annual growth rate of 2.54 percent. Under the likes of Kennedy, Clinton and Obama? 4.35 percent.

Yours truly is no expert in economics, so you won’t read any grand theories here as to why all this is. You also won’t read any endorsement of Democratic economic policy.

Instead, let me point out a few things in the interest of fairness.

The first is that people who actually are economic experts say the ability of any given president to affect the economy — for good or for ill — tends to be vastly overstated. Even Binder and Watson caution that the data in their study do not support the idea that Democratic policies are responsible for the greater economic performance under Democratic presidents.

It is also worth noting that PolitiFact’s endorsements of Occupy Democrats’ claims come with multiple caveats. In evaluating the statement about 97 of the 100 poorest counties being red, for instance, PolitiFact reminds us that red states tend to have more rural counties and rural counties tend to have lower costs of living. It also points out that a modest income in rural Texas may actually give you greater spending power than the same income in Detroit. So comparisons can be misleading.

Duly noted. But the starkness and sheer preponderance of the numbers are hard to ignore. As of 2010, according to the Census Bureau, Connecticut, which has not awarded its electoral votes to a Republican presidential candidate since 1988, had a per capita income of $56,000, best in the country, while Mississippi, which hasn’t gone Democrat since 1976, came in at under $32,000 — worst in the country. At the very least, stats like these should call into question GOP claims of superior economic policy.

Yet, every election season the party nevertheless makes those claims. It will surely do so again this fall. So it seems fair to ask: Where are the numbers that support the assertion? Why is Texas only middling in terms of per capita income? Why is Mississippi not a roaring engine of economic growth? How are liberal Connecticut and Massachusetts doing so well?

It seems to suggest Republican claims are, at best, overblown. If that’s not the case, I’d appreciate it if some Republican would explain why. Otherwise, I have another earnest, but pointed question for my Democratic friends:

How in the world do they get away with this?

NOTE: In a recent column, I pegged the indictment of Texas Gov. Rick Perry to his “Democratic opponents.” Though the indictment did come out of Austin, which is a blue island in the red sea that is Texas, I should have noted that the judge who assigned a special prosecutor in the case is a Republican appointee and the prosecutor he chose has, according to PolitiFact, ties to both parties.

Leonard Pitts is a columnist for The Miami Herald, 1 Herald Plaza, Miami, FL, 33132. Readers may contact him via email at [email protected]

AFP Photo/Mandel Ngan

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  • TZToronto

    “Facts, schmacts,” the GOP would say. Since when did facts have any meaning for the GOP? If grinding poverty is the goal of the GOP, then they’ve done really well in the red states.

    • I’ve taken to referring to the Tea Party instead as the T-Party, and saying that the T stands for “Tory.” Because, when you look at what they actually did with the slew of voter ID laws (and damn near nothing else) they introduced immediately after coming to prominence, it’s pretty clear the T-Party’s real ambition is to abolish democracy and replace it with a permanent plutocratic ruling class.

      So yes, grinding poverty is the G.O.P.’s goal. After all, the more of us get sick or starve to death, the fewer of us will be around to vote against them every November.

      • latebloomingrandma

        Plus, when unemployment is high, people will take any job at any wage, thus keeping wages low. More $$ for them. There is ample evidence of this occurring now.

      • bob bear

        Bush’s goal was to break the Federal Gov’t. so Corporate America would rule the country! And Bush was supported with a right wing Supreme Court that abolished limitations on money in politics stating ‘money is speech’!!!

        • pisces63

          I would pay good money to fine out who gave him the name John Roberts. He is so young for this post on the court and could last along time and depending on his back up singers overs the years to come, do a lot of damage.

        • Russell Byrd

          Well said. I had heard several right-wackjob politicians back during Clinton’s time clearly state that they wanted to spend the Federal government into oblivion, and then they could “kick it into the gutter.”

          I heard and read that a number of times, and I could write a small book just sitting here tonight on how that is wrong on so many levels.

  • It’s simple, really. Democratic policies benefit the poor and middle classes, who use their financial gains to pay off debts, go shopping, invest, educate themselves and/or their children, etc. IE: One way or another, money given to poor and middle class Americans will stay in America.

    Republican policies, on the other hand, are designed to benefit the richest 1%, who deposit all of their financial gains in offshore bank accounts. IE: Money given to the richest 1% immediately leaves America.

    The G.O.P. knows this. They’re just hoping we’ll never figure it out because they have offshore bank accounts of their own they hope to fill.

    • One Cool Chick

      Excellent post Michael. It’s really just that simple. But conservatives ( Russell Brand has an excellent commentary on what they’re trying to “conserve”) want to continue to convolute the conversation with this crap about the 1%’ers being “job creators”. You can create as many jobs as you want; if the other 99% don’t have money to purchase the products and services offered by the so called “job creators”, those jobs go away. So if the 1%’ers want to be seen as “job creators”, then the other 99% should be seen as “job sustainers”. This is basic economics 101.

      • joe schmo

        ….And Russel Brand is the biggest Communist that walked the modern earth…. By !%, I believe that Brand can put himself in that category and what about all the other 1%er’s

        If the shoe fits….What a bunch of hypocrites!

        • One Cool Chick

          I don’t know what proof you have of Brand being a communist…and frankly I don’t care. It doesn’t affect my life one way or the other. And I doubt it affects yours. And let me be clear: I don’t begrudge any man or woman JUST because they are rich. It’s a wonderful thing. I wish I was. My issue is with rich people who are greedy, unpatriotic, money hiding, wage suppressing, tax dodging, job outsourcing SOB’s who feel they don’t have an obligation to at least pay their fair share of taxes in the homeland of their success. NOT Mr.Brand. You my friend are just a typical conservative attempting to convolute the discourse about the REAL issues.

        • Hey look, the little cowardly Tory whore who doesn’t even want anyone reading his other Discus troll posts is still here.

          So tell me whore, how does that G.O.P. bleach taste?

          • joe schmo

            Bet your happy to be able to attempt to bash me. Never works. Such a stupid child! News for you moron, there are more of us slinking about now on the Memo. Watch out:)

            Of course, I will be dead by the time your reach my age. If things don’t change by then, the government will own your ass…. LOL

          • Once again, whore, you have failed to say anything of substance whatsoever.

            The last time you and I exchanged words, it ended with you taking three whole days to come up with the Internet equivalent of “you suck, I’m leaving.” This time will assuredly be no different.

            It also doesn’t matter for jack how many of you whores are “slinking about now” on the Memo, because you’re still as reality-impaired as ever. No majority constitutes truth, and as Stephen Colbert wisely said, truth has a well-known liberal bias.

            You’re still too damn cowardly to show your face, to use your real name, and to let anyone see what other kind of B.S. you’re flinging elsewhere on the Internet. You’re a pathological liar who has made claims that are literally not possible within the realm of reality. More likely than not, I have already surpassed you in age (the way you behave, I’d be surprised if you’re even old enough to see Guardians of the Galaxy by yourself).

            And FYI, the only way the government will ever “own my ass” is if we slack off and let the wannabe plutocrats who already own your ass back into the White House. You are a filthy whore to tyrants, thieves and wannabe monarchs, and no amount of kicking, screaming and/or lying your worthless ass off on your part will ever make that inconvenient truth go away.

          • joe schmo

            Are you repeating my words. Try thinking for yourself for a change.

            ‘Truth has a well known liberal bias…. How loud do you want me to laugh…..Comrad:)

            They are not truthful to you because you are young and just don’t get it. You have been brainwashed by your Liberal education. Don’t tell me I don’t know this because I have gone through the same system and then some….. Yes, if things don’t change, the GOVERNMENT will own your ass. History always repeats itself and it has a tendency to want to go in the direction of a Kingdom. Your side will make everyone poor and beholden to King Government.

            Yes, and that inconvenient truth is the fact that you don’t believe it and won’t believe it… Good luck on that one. Believe me you won’t be kicking if the Government owns your soul. They will kill you if you speak out or try to express yourself. You know, kind of like Hunger Games. I think you can relate to that.

          • You still haven’t said jack crap, whore. After all this time, you still can’t do anything except pretend you’re laughing, then pretend I said something else entirely like you think nobody will notice the stark difference between what you are responding to and what you are pretending to respond to (because, again, you seem to have forgotten that people can still see the posts right above your own).

            The only smidgen of truth in that massive bout of self-felattio is the bit about “history always repeats itself,” but once again, the truth is not even remotely how you intended. History does indeed repeat itself, and our entire nation’s history (as I have explained to your worthless ass before) can be summed up as a series of events in which we, the liberals, moved the country forward, while you, the conservatives, kicked, screamed and threatened to murder anyone who tried to change anything.

            In 1700s, American progressives were willing to fight and die for a country represented by the people, for the people, while the conservative Torys fought to preserve their trade relations with the British Monarchy.

            In the 1800s, American progressives worked tirelessly to abolish slavery while trying to preserve the union, while the conservative Confederates seceded from the union in order to preserve the institution of slavery.

            And in the 1900s, American progressives fought for women’s rights, fought to end racial segregation, fought for freedom of speech, and fought in World War II, while American conservatives arrested women and lynched blacks of they made any attempt to vote, and applauded at the top of their lungs Joseph McCarthy for his staunch oppression of anyone who even listened to new ideas whenever they weren’t applauding Adolf Hitler and his master race.

            And now, in the 2000s, we, the progressives, are fighting for economic rights, reproductive rights, marriage equality, religious freedom and energy independence, while you, the tea-bagger whores, are threatening to violently overthrow our democratically elected leaders, imposing draconian restrictions on voting rights when you are not threatening to gun down anyone who attempts to support the aforementioned causes, tripping over each other to be the first to fawn over Vladimir Putin every day of the week, and even trying to figure out how you can twist the death of Osama Bin Laden into somehow NOT having been a victory for America.

            You worthless conservative whores have always been, and always will be, America’s greatest enemy. You have always been hellbent on trying to destroy everything that has made America great — always been trying to sabotage its government, kill off its people and suck its resources dry.

            History does indeed repeat itself, whore. You, the conservatives, from the Torys to the Confederates to the McCarthyists to the Segregationists to the Tea Party, always have been, and always will be, sworn enemies of America.

            So I say to you again, whore, that it’s time to get your worthless ass back to Russia and start kissing the tyrant’s dick in person.

          • ddobbz

            You are so ignorant. Go read a read a real book you moron!

          • Once again, you have failed to say anything whatsoever of any actual substance. Once again, the only way you know to respond is to get angry and say something stupid.

            Off to Russia with you, whore.

          • ddobbz

            Your history is a mystery moron. Who is your mentor? Putin?

          • Get bent, whore. Last I checked, it was you and your ilk that had raging boners for Putin.

            Once again, you’ve failed to say ANYTHING. You’re even worse than Joe Shmo — you’re too stupid even for B.S. All you know how to do is get mad, throw a tantrum and say something stupid.

          • Will

            Couldn’t have put it better myself! KUDOS!! The truth IS stranger than fiction…unless you are a conservative with an IQ barely over room temperature.

        • angryspittle

          That has to be the fucking stupidest goddamn thing I have read in weeks.

          • joe schmo

            Too bad for you…. Your ignorance is showing. Isn’t it blissful….Spitface. Too bad what I uploaded is true…Booo hooo hooo. Try to disprove me.

            “I think the very concept of profit should be hugely reduced. David Cameron said profit isn’t a dirty word, I say profit is a filthy word. Because wherever there is profit there is also deficit. And this system
            currently doesn’t address these ideas.”

            Is ‘profit’ really a dirty word? I can tell you one person who doesn’t think so: Russell Brand. That’s Hollywood star Russell Brand, worth an estimated $15 million. He has gone from a dirt poor drug addict to an exceedingly wealthy man, and he did it through accumulating profit.”

            Why doesn’t Brand put his money where his mouth is and give it ALLLLL away. What a hypocritical Commy.

          • Russel Brand makes income, not profit. He earns a salary in exchange for a service, unlike the wannabe tyrants and plutocrats you so gleefully whore yourself out to.

          • joe schmo


          • Stop trying to put words in my mouth, whore. They’re all written up above: Everyone can see what a lying sack you are.

            Yes, there is a difference between income and profit. Income is what you earn for a service. Profit is what billionaire investors make while sitting on their asses because they bought off Republicans who gamed the system to favor them no matter what kind of crap they pull.

            You also seem to still be desperately clinging to the notion that you can confuse the difference between being opposed to corporate graft and being opposed to capitalism. Which you never will be able to do because, unlike you, liberals CAN recognize the difference between an honest or dishonest living.

            Bill Maher already explained this to Mitt Romney — already explained that the reason liberals idolize other billionaires like Henry Ford, Bill Gates and Steve Jobs while having absolute disgust for people like Romney is because they had PRODUCTS — things that they made BESIDES money.

            You tea-baggers, on the other hand, want to pretend that all money is made honestly for one simple reason: You’re a bunch of worthless thieving whores who want that money.

            It’s not going to happen, whore. You still haven’t succeeded in convincing anyone but yourself that you’re not a worthless lying thieving asshole.

          • Lucky for you the cowardly little whore has his Disqus activity blocked. He’s a literal fountain of stupidity.

            My favorite was when he said everyone should be working 24/7. Apparently, tea-baggers now believe sleep is a communist plot.

    • joe schmo

      Again, your assumptions are wrong! The 1% are not Conservatives or Manufacturers….. We no longer are producers my friend. As far as the ‘offshore bank accounts.’ Citizens are not allowed July 1st took care of that. Corporations yes and I believe they should follow the same rules as those that one person has to abide by.

      You are way to young to even understand Capitalism or Nationalism. The schools indoctrinated that out of you.

      • gmccpa

        Offshore accounts not allowed? Where did you pick up that bit of misinformation? And the fact that some liberals get rich does not make them hypocrites. Warren Buffet acknowledged that the tax code favored the wealthy….and incurred the wrath of the RW.
        The RW simultaneously claims that liberals are ‘takers’…then claim they are also the wealthy. Meantime, most liberals are not against people being wealthy. But against policies that favor the wealthy, at the expense of the poor and working class.

        • 788eddie

          You are correct, gmccpa.

          And it was Warren Buffett who famously said, “It is class warfare, and my class has won.”

        • You’re wasting your breath. This little twerp once tried to argue to me that people should work 24/7, and even stuck by that after I’d explained to him that doing so was literally impossible. His hatred of democracy is so great that he has completely detached himself from reality.

          For everyone who keeps their head on the outside of their asses, gmccpa has the right of it. Liberals don’t dislike Mitt Romney, Donald Trump and Bernie Madoff because they are rich, but because of HOW they got rich.

          Take it away Bill:

          Republicans do not understand this — do not understand the difference between having money and earning money. They just assume that anyone who has money deserves that money.

          There is a difference between venture capitalism and vulture capitalism, and it is a difference all the practitioners of the latter spend every waking moment of their lives trying to deny.

          • Russell Byrd

          • Russell Byrd


        • Russell Byrd


      • charleo1

        Commenter Michael Ross was not assuming anything. He
        was only pointing out what the record clearly shows. That the economy produces more jobs, and therefore more growth, under Democratic economic principles, than those policies pursued under Republicans. So the old adage that we all do better, when we all collectively do better, is a fact everyone should know. It’s not indoctrination thru the Public Schools, unless they start off in kindergarten propagandizing math. What would you think of a brother-in-law, that constantly spent all of his pay gambling, and buying drinks for his cadre of buddies? Then expected you to hand him more than twice what he actually earns, so your sister, and their kids have a roof over their heads, food to eat, and a doctor when they get sick? And you paid it, because it’s your sister, and you’re the kid’s uncle, and it’s the right thing to do? Then, what would you think about all that? If your brother-in-law was constantly running his mouth, about how far in debt you were? That you did nothing but waste money. And the only way you could be thought well of, was by giving away free stuff. But, there he is, every month, with his hand out. You keep giving, and he keeps needing, and taking. Says you’ve a spending problem, boy! Your budgets ought to be more like mine, he says. All balanced and conservative like! What would you think? That your sister married a jerk wad, a Republican Governor, or both?

      • Ignore this little whore. If he wasn’t such a coward that he needs to keep his Disqus activity locked, you’d see plenty of reality-challenged “arguments” he’s tried to make.

        My favorite was when he said that people should be working 24/7, then excused himself from not doing any work at all for being ill.

      • RobertCHastings

        Who has been indoctrinated,and regarding what. Use the words you actually mean in the fashion you mean to use them so we can decipher your jibberish. Capitalism, as it was first delineated in the1800s, is NOT the capitalism of today, which is NOT capitalism but oligarchy. Our upper echelon have become increasingly similar to the oligarchs that rule Russia today and, American “democracy” is starting to look more like some corrupted form of fascism, especially in regards to suppression of peaceful demonstrators. We have MORE people in our prisons than any other country on the planet and a higher rate of incarceration. The US is NOT the happiest nor the healthiest nor the smartest country on the planet. When the wealthy took away our rights and corrupted our Constitution, they assured that we would soon become a second-tier country, while they became wealthier. The organizations created decades ago to assist poorer nations in achieving prosperity and independence have become proselytizers for the selfish capitalism that rules this country, assuring that profits made ANYWHERE will end up in the banks of the wealthiest 1%, where ever those banks may be located.

    • FT66

      Any idea Michael Ross why their fellow republicans continue to vote for them, while they know they are poor and those they give their votes are rich? Is it because of being committed to the Party or what? Is this not the place where voter suppression should be applied more than any other places? I am knocking my head because I really don’t get the answer.

      • One Cool Chick

        I know that your question was not posed to me, so forgive me for responding out of turn…but I’ve had this discussion many times with many people and I have a few theories:
        When you see enough people who look like you that are super successful, you start to believe you could be as well…just by virtue of ethnicity. they want the tax code to stay as is so that they may benefit from it when they strike it rich…
        Republicans pretend to be concerned with social and cultural issues that many in their base obsess over: abortion, 2nd amendment rights, gay people getting to close to them and being afforded the same rights, keeping scary Black people away from them and perpetrating the myth of lazy Blacks on welfare taking all their hard earned taxes and buying steak and lobster while they struggle. ..
        Their obsession with these issues keep them blinded to the fact that republicans only care about one thing…keeping the 1% from having to part with any additional money in taxes and regulations. But they know that these tactics always work. And the proof is that they go to these same wells every election cycle. Their base won’t wake up until they realize how their being f’d.

        • FT66

          Brilliant and many thanks for your vivid explanation. I do appreciate it.

          • One Cool Chick

            Thanks for allowing me into your conversation without being invited, Lol..

        • Allan Richardson

          “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.” – John Steinbeck

          His Okie characters probably believed they could be wealthy with hard work, but the plot outline came out against them, just as GOP policies in real life.

          Antebellum Southern plantation owners used racial prejudice to (a) keep poor Southern white workers content with their lot, and (b) ensure their cooperation by turning in runaway slaves. After Reconstruction, the Jim Crow regimes did much the same thing.

          • One Cool Chick


        • Sheri Crosby

          I agree with your theory. I also think you left out one important factor. Enfolded in the reasons given for why poor republicans continue to vote against their own best interests is the republican party’s use of the media (aka Fox, Limbaugh, etc.) in making those same folks believe that the reason they are poor is not because of republican policies, but because of another ethnic group either immigrating or demanding to be treated equally and thereby preventing those poor republicans from success. That’s why they keep their base fired up by telling them that they are poor because everyone else is taking from them. H8te is the fuel that keeps their stupidity burning.

      • One Cool Chick more or less has the right of it. But the short answer is that they have shallow hopes that, after democracy has been abolished and the old European plutocracy reinstated, the G.O.P. will reward them for their loyalty.

    • ddobbz

      Like George Soros’s money stays in America? Only the money he donates to liberal socialists.

      • Then why are you and your ilk so eager to give George Soros and others like him more tax breaks?

        This is that circle you Tory bastards have never been able to square. You know George Soros’ name and love throwing it out there (even though you know jack crap about him beyond his name), but its still you, others like you, and especially the greedy party-before-country whores you support, who coddle people like George Soros the most.

        The fact that the G.O.P., the party of the richest 1%, does not even have all of the richest 1% behind it should be an embarrassment of catastrophic proportions to you and your ilk. It should be the clearest indication possible that your policies are flawed when even the people they are designed to coddle cannot always swallow it.

        • charleo1


        • Independent1

          And what has to be even more galling for these GOP creeps is that the party of the truly wealthy – those that have ‘HONESTLY GOTTEN RICH’ via hard work and honest gains, is the Democratic party. By far, the legislators who represent the counties that house the majority of America’s wealthiest are Democrats. These wealthy are smart enough to realize that it’s under Democrats that their wealth truly rises.

          The wealthy that support the GOP are primarly those who have accumulated wealth via dubious means – such as running casinos or companies that leverage buyout America companies that are foundering and who have no quams about destroying them, pocketing as much of their wealth as possible while leaving millions of Americans without jobs because they’ve shipped the pirated company overseas; or like the Koches, they inherited it from Daddy and are using their wealth to plunder America. Those who have gotten wealthy while really doing virtually no hard work.

          • Also because, simply put, wealth doesn’t trickle down. Just the opposite: It trickles up. The richest 1% who actually DESERVED that status got rich as they did with the commerce of a robust, well-supported middle class.

        • ddobbz

          I know plenty about him moron.  So you admit dems are one percent people.  Back at you, your the one who made that a bad thing.

          From my Android phone on T-Mobile. The first nationwide 4G network.

          ——– Original message ——–

          • Is that even REMOTELY CLOSE to what I said? No, it isn’t. You’re not even in the ballpark you stupid tea-bagger.

            You’re putting words in my mouth because you’ve once again proven too stupid to deal with anything in reality.

    • mike
      So all these Liberal Billionaires who give to the Democratic Party and represent part of the 1% are also evil, Right?

      • Tea-bagger, do you not realize you’re doing EXACTLY what I was talking about?

        No, not all billionaires are evil. Billionaires who made their money honestly and who recognize that their money was made thanks to a robust middle class deserve everything their success.

        It’s only the arrogant trust fund babies who waited for their parents to die and now spend millions trying to buy elections for politicians who will help them rob the poor blind (IE: the people you Tory traitors gleefully whore yourselves out to) that I consider evil.

        And once again, you tea-bagger whores are deliberately trying to confuse the difference between earning money and just having it; trying to lump Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg and Oprah Winfrey into the same category as Sheldon Adelson, Donald Trump, the Koch Brothers, and all the other ill-gotten millionaires you live to suck dick for.

        Get over yourself, whore.

        • Russell Byrd


        • Russell Byrd


    • joe schmo

      Seems you don’t understand the difference in wealth creation. In case you didn’t get it the first time:

      “Today in America, the majority of rich people statistically are not
      Republicans but are liberal Democrats, many of them on the far left.

      This runs contrary to the media fiction that the rich people in America are Republicans. This fiction is repeated over and over in the media in order to win over ignorant people to the Democrat party. And there are plenty of them, mostly among the angry, envious poor; in the agitated and shrinking middle class; and in the perpetually enraged labor union movement.

      The capitalist rich are generally Republicans. They “make things” and “build things” and “manufacture things” and provide basic resources like coal or timber in the ‘hard’ side of the economy. Henry Ford is an example of the old Conservative rich.

      But today as manufacturing moves abroad, we have fewer and fewer of the old-school capitalist rich, and the middle class is shrinking as the wealth to support it is eroding away.

      And why is this happening?

      Because of Democrat party attacks on wealth-creating, capitalist
      private business through excessive taxes, regulation, lawsuits, enviro restrictions and labor union agitation.

      Replacing the shrinking class of capitalist rich are the socialist rich
      who do not actually “make things” or “provide resources” that the
      society needs. In fact, the socialist rich largely shun production

      You never will see a liberal on the frontier with his sleeves rolled
      up. Or surveying a railroad line through the wilderness. Or exploring for an oil deposit in the bug-infested jungle.

      Indeed, after wealth is created through hard work the socialists at
      every level set up shop. So, for instance, the moment that a capitalist company becomes economically successful, you will see the unions moving in to get as much of that wealth as possible. But those unions never take any of the risk involved or put in the long hours to build that company up.

      Or once a company is successful you will find the government taxing it relentlessly; or the Democrat trial lawyers seeking any grounds for alawsuit. Because liberals are in love with money more than any capitalist ever was.

      Easy money, that is… Money that they can “take”, not “earn”.

      LOL, you stupid little shrill. What will you do when the rich liberals that only have a mouth can’t feed yours?

      • Get over yourself, whore. This shit didn’t work the first time you tried to pull it on us, and it’s not magically about to start working this time.

        You still are deliberately trying to confuse the difference between millionaires who recognize that America’s economy works from the ground up and who consider paying taxes to be patriotic, and the frauds and thieves tirelessly trying to game the system that you so gleefully whore yourself out to.

        You’ve also fallen back into a familiar tea-bagger habit: Faulting Democrats for the exact same things you give Republicans a free pass for. Today, you demand that we disavow the Democrats for being a party of everyone, including the rich, while simultaneously continuing to whore yourself out to the Republicans, a party EXCLUSIVELY for the rich.

        That, whore, is what is commonly known as hypocrisy. You can’t attack Democrats for ALLEGEDLY doing the very things you revel in frequently and openly.

        • ddobbz

          YOU ARE AN IDIOT!

          • That the best you can come up with, Tory? Spoken like a true tea-bagger: Without anything to back it up whatsoever.

          • Joyce

            Michael, stop engaging these trolls. They are all joe schmos! He thinks he’s so slick but he reminds me of my old Mafioso uncle who just hated the world, including himself

  • Dominick Vila

    Promoting substandard non-union jobs, dependence on Federal government handouts while being among the states that contribute the least to the Treasury, neglecting education, fear of change, and refusal to accept new social programs that would benefit their most vulnerable citizens is the legacy of most red states. Their insistence on the preservation of socio-economic policies that defy common sense and that are counter productive to their well being, is influenced by ignorance, ideology, and the arrogance and greed of those who manipulate the naive masses in Southern states and the Bible Belt. The problem for the latter is that, sooner or later, their flock will wake up, and when they do it will be payback time.

    • FireBaron

      The other thing, based on your Bible Belt comment, is the Republicans will use Conservative Evangelical Ministers speaking “off pulpit” to their benefit. Until Democrats do the same with mainstream ministers not concerned with their $100 haircuts and $2000 suits more than they are with the actual needs with the people, the GOP is going to continue taking the lead in the “culture wars”.

      • Dominick Vila

        Culture wars that include men of the cloth who refer of the victims of huge natural disasters as heathens who deserved what they got…and some people continue to donate and see nothing wrong with their anti-Christian overtures.

        • Get over yourselves, tea-baggers. It isn’t anti-Christian to suggest that non-Christians should enjoy the same rights as Christians.

          There are no anti-Christian overtures. You dicks just yammer on about them nonstop in a shallow attempt to disguise the G.O.P.’s blatant push to abolish democracy in favor of fundamentalism.

      • bob bear

        In case you haven’t noticed Republicans are now losing the culture war, they lost the last 2 National Elections, and in 2016 it will be 3 straight!
        Who funds the tea baggers? Koch, the richest privately owned company in the country who has been exposed multiple time to talk stupid to the tea baggers, and then screw them for his personal gain!

        • Another liberal win like the last two elections will result in revolt.

          • bob bear

            OK seriously, the majority have spoken, and I’ll tell you the same that was said to Democrats in 2001, ‘if you don’t like it, leave’, revolt that!

          • Which majority? The majority of dead people voting? Americans do not want to live in a country that is “ruled”. We are supposed to have a government that works for the people. Our government does not rule. Our government has become corrupt and too powerful. Our elected officials have forgotten that they work for us. We have an Emperor that feels he is above our laws and our constitution. He feels he is divinely ordained to rule over America. He is not. Americans will stand up and fight for their rights, just as they did when we had another tyrant.

          • jmprint

            If you don’t want a country that is ruled, then stop voting republican. You just have a hard on for our hard working President.

          • You do mean hard golfing, not hard working?

          • jmprint

            Even the President is allowed to take a break and a vacation, or is that not allowed because of his color of skin?

          • One Cool Chick

            Don’t you get days off? If you don’t, you’re doing something very wrong.

          • Russell Byrd

            Keendweeb does not need days off. He does no work to begin with.

          • Independent1

            You just never give up do you LOWLIFE!!


            And you’re clearly such a lowlife and low IQ idiot that you still keep bringing up that TIRELESS NONSENSE!!

          • Russell Byrd

            As we both know, keendweeb just comes here to troll and lie. The one tragedy of the internet is he knows he can come and destroy conversation, and no one will kill him.

            But, I do swear, Memo and MJ are going to have to take action sooner or later. If later, they will have no business at all. Readership is down compared to what it was 6-7 years ago. I believe, mostly do to the hostile environment these scumbags intentionally create. Of course, our trolls are always carrying on about that being our fault. They have rights that we don’t have.

          • Yet you Tory bastards had no problem with George W. Bush, a man who set the record for the most vacation time taken by any president in 2003.

            Admit it, tea-bagger. Your problem is not with what Obama does in his spare time. It’s with the fact that he was wearing party colors other than your own when he was elected.

            Barack Obama is proof that democracy in America is still alive, even despite you Tory bastards having spent the last fifty years doing everything you can to try to kill it.

          • Russell Byrd

            Cool, Bush golfed twice as much, but Obama is bad because he played a game. Well, Bush would have golfed twice as much, if he had ever learned how to hold a club.

            Why don’t you just go away loser, or find another test bed for your lies. You know, even with all the practice, you don’t even lie all that well.

            And seriously, Bush and Cheney took at least twice as many vacation days. Even look at the gang of embezzlers that make up the Repub House. HOW MANY days have they failed to do anything, how many days have they only spent trying to repeal the ACA, and how many days have they just take off. We should ask all Repubs for a refund.

            And like a current petition has it, our law enforcement should be warranted to arrest all those bastards for embezzlement, extortion, and just general thievery. And maybe throw in treason to boot.

          • Steven Webster

            jm making up story adding a little lie here and there calling people racist for wanting this POTUS to follow the law

          • jmprint


          • Independent1

            Let’s hear you make up these fake laws that Obama is supposed to not be following – THERE ARE NONE!
            Obama has done absolutely NOTHING that every president before him hasn’t done 2 or more times as much!!! YOU are the LIAR!!!!!

          • Steven Webster

            How long did Baroke repeat you can keep your Dr., you can keep your ins. Not a smidgen of corruption at the IRS. These are a few of the lies I posted about, you liar.

          • Independent1

            Obama DID NOT lie about keeping your doctor – and even if he did, that was in NO WAY breaking the law.

            It was THE INSURANCE COMPANIES that LIED!! And they did so INTENTIONALLY.

            During the development of ACA by Congress, the major insurance company CEOs met with Obama and promised to support the roll out of ACA. But when the time came for ACA to take effect, they started their lies about why they were terminating millions of policies – which they always did each year, but in 2013 they made claims that it was because of ACA WHICH WAS A LIE!!! It was because, like every year, THEY TERMINATED POLICIES THAT WEREN’T MAKING THEM MONEY!!!!

            And despite every effort of Issa, the most corrupt legislator in Congress, and spending millions of dollars, Issa has not been able to prove ONE OUNCE OF CORRUPTION IN THE IRS!! Not ONE OUNCE!!!!!

            When the IRS scrutinized conservatives’ applications for tax free status, THE IRS WAS SIMPLY DOING ITS JOB!!

            And they scrutinized liberal and progressive and other applications JUST AS MUCH as the conservatives, and the only apps denied were those of liberal/progressive organizations!!!!!!

            Go stuff it!!!!!!

          • Russell Byrd

            Barack misspoke depending on your interpretation, but the real cause has always been known to be malfeasance on the part of the insurance companies. They cancelled policies that they did not have to. NOT Obama. So, the problem is with the capitalists that you shitsticks worship so much. Shows not only your blatant, indefensible racism, but your lack of intelligence in supporting people that are giving you the shaft. Dumb, real dumb.

            And no, no one, including all the Rumpbuggercons spin wizards, could prove anything was wrong at the IRS. Just wishful claims, but no facts.

            The raw truth is, the IRS should have denied EVERY Teabugger application, but you shitsticks have everybody afraid of the media storm tantrums that you throw when you don’t get your way. The IRS was not approving these applications very fast, because even the real conservatives knew they should all have been turned down out of hand. And I said “real” conservatives to differentiate from fascists like you.

            As for all these supposed insurance cancellations, I have not yet heard of one credible case where people were worse off. Even after all the lies you Bozos told.

          • Independent1

            Russell, Obama did not misspeak. During the development of ACA he met with insurance industry CEOs and they had promised Obama that they would comply with the ACA grandfathering of policies and doctors. So when he would tell Americans that they could keep their insurance and doctors, he assumed that the insurance companies WOULD KEEP THEIR WORD!! The promise THEY had made to him.
            It was the insurance companies that LIED!!

            Obama did not misspeak and HE DID NOT LIE!!

            There are numerous articles that point out that the insurance companies falsely cancelled policies that should have been grandfathered and they tried numerous ways to con their policyholders into accepting higher premium policies without informing them about the options they had to find cheaper policies on the exchanges.

          • Russell Byrd

            Yes, thank you, but my post indicated that the reason that Obama did not express himself accurately, i.e. misspoke, was the malfeasance of the Insurance companies

          • Independent1

            Russell, good point. Guess I’m getting too quick to try and rebutt all these rabid RWNJs lies and distortions. Or to even remotely agree with their distorted/fabricated statements.

          • Russell Byrd

            Forgive me, I should have been kinder and less terse.

            You woke me from my typical stupor, and I am kind of conflicted in even remaining in these blogs. I had it out the other day with one of the “good guys.” I am getting tired of being trashed for lambasting our vicious trolls. Especially, when the one making the criticism just finished a long session with one of those trolls. How hypocritical.

            Like when I said I has criminal evidence against angelstench, I did/do, but why should I bother with his extortion and misrepresentative of government documents. As well, if he did what he claimed, he was lying to the FBI. That should be good for seven years, and I am in a position to know. Of course, he never filed any such report, but he did forge a FBI document to try to threaten me. The idiot forgot to change the original date. The filing date was the week before he claimed to have made the report.

            Yet, no one said one word. Neither encouragement, nor any STFU. No one seems to hear. As well, the reason NM and MJ are in the backwater, is all the low quality posts. In my view, the low quality posts are not being made by the “good guy,” but by trolls getting their sick jollies and wanting to shut these blogs down.

            Look at Daily Kos, a shoestring operation that gets over twice as many hits as the more prestigious NM and MJ combined. It is kind of hard to post there, but multiple trolling incidents are unheard of. You cause enough havoc, and you are gone. Regardless of which side you are on. Which would suit me fine. I was scrupulously careful not to even cuss, UNTIL i realized that a “moderator” was mythical creature unseen in ages.

            If the trolls would go away, I would go back to just reading and you would never know I was here. That was what I did for years and I bet I never made more than a dozen posts. It seems simpler to just write these blogs off. I already renounced my membership a couple of years ago. Of course, they still ask me for money, but with the current state of affairs, i am not going to give these blogs another dime.

          • Steven Webster

            Russell eat the cake

          • Russell Byrd

            Thanks. It is unusual that right-wackjob-wingers will actually admit they did not have anything but racism and hatred to advance their false argument. And that is what you just tacitly did.

          • Russell Byrd

            There was no lie there. Why do you have to lie and troll.

            And, what laws have Obama broken? I have never heard an answer yet. You vicious lying fucksticks have already been trying to destroy Democracy for years. Now, because a black man is in the White House (LOL), you have gone insane with hate. If not racism, then why?

            Oh yeah, you are going to repeat your lies, so once again racist, what laws has Obama broken?

          • highpckts

            Dead people? Seriously? You still believe that when many statiticians have proven you wrong? This is why you lose! You can’t think for yourself!

          • pisces63

            YOu must be mistaking them for the republican who voted 13 times over two years in Wisconsin. He voted under his name, his son’s name, his girlfriend’s son’s name, is a company CEO, and used multiple addresses including his parents. The federal government has determined this to be the worse case of voter fraud ever. So spare me the dead people. My dad was a retired precinct judge and my husband an avid voter. They both died 11 years ago and NEITHER are on the rolls any longer. We have no emperor, either. We have a black man you bigots cannot tolerate, just for his race and nothing more. Apparently when white folks lead you, it’s to war, bogus or otherwise. You fell for that hook, line and sinker. Didn’t you? Because Bush looked like you.

          • gmccpa

            Interesting about ‘dead people voting’. Because, despite the ‘unskew poll’ meme….the polling matched the results. Are dead people responding to polls as well?

          • One Cool Chick

            You sound delusional my friend.

          • 788eddie

            Hey, kenndeb, you’d better check your facts before opening up that argument.

            Isn’t it funny how, when the Georgia Republican State Party offered a bounty this past April to anyone who could show an example of voter fraud, they ended up with only five possible examples, and eventually that shrunk to two, and then to none, and they eventually quietly had their bounty offer “go away.”

            So, if you’re going to make that accusation, you’d better be able to back that up with fact, not emptiness.

          • WhutHeSaid

            Americans themselves rule — that’s what voting is about. The last 2 times they elected Obama, and you don’t like it — I know — but that’s too bad. You will accept what the voters say and that’s that.

          • Russell Byrd

            Government by definition “rules.” What else can it do? Of course, I understood long ago, you want a government that rules everyone that you see as inferior, while you just do what you damn well please.

            Grow up, life does not work that way.

          • Russell Byrd

            Actually, all the intentional voter frauds are being committed by Rumpbuggers. The real reason for all the hype over voter fraud from your side is to cover the real truth that you want to deny the non-white, non-male populace from voting.

            Like Acorn, which was a total lying fraud that was committed on the American people by Freitfart. That guy was just a drunken, lying, coke head, that deserved to stroke out. He should have been in jail instead of running a media outlet.

            Did you know about a year ago, one of the principals in those lies about Acorn, ADMITTED it as part of a settlement with an Acorn employee that had lost his job. AND it cost him 100k to boot for the pleasure. He was lucky to get the deal. He was scared shitless to actually go to court.

          • highpckts

            A revolt from who??? The people that vote for the GOP don’t have brains enough to know what revolt means!

          • Allan Richardson

            The TP candidates are already revolting … VERY!

          • WhutHeSaid

            Good, then we will just round your sorry, bigoted, revolting (in more ways than one) asses up and put you in prison where you belong.

          • Why don’t you come yourself?

          • WhutHeSaid

            You see? That’s the problem: You redneck goobers never think things through. Armed insurrection generally requires that you leave your Lay-Z-Boy and drag your sorry carcass into the street to actually do something — no walkers allowed.

            But you don’t want me to come, because then the big show would really be on. I always throw in a few extra for drooling bigots — just for good measure. No sir — you’d be much better off having Eric stuff your ass into the can — he’d be a lot nicer.

          • Russell Byrd

            I think WhutHeSaid’s idea is worth serious consideration. We need to finally force dishonesty and racism out of our politics and our society. Faux Noise could not exist without those traits in their broadcasting and in their viewers.

          • We honestly wish you tea-baggers meant that. Life would be so much easier if you would just secede and screw up your own little portion of the country instead of sticking around and screwing things up for all of us in turn.

            Go ahead, Tory. Revolt. Show everyone how much you respect the democratic process that has held our country together for centuries; show them how much you REALLY love your country.

          • Russell Byrd

            In which the majority will thin your herd of “animals” down to extinction. Even most Repuds won’t fight for you.

            Got a death wish?

            Bob bear has a real point. If you voted for your own self-interests, then you would never vote for a Rumpbuggercon.

            Here is the brief outline of what is wrong with America and you. The rich right-wing want to make America their playground. The Rumpbuggers have always been for sale. The rich spend the cash they have screwed the 98% out of, to buy all the Rumpbuggers, and probably half the Democrats. Then they sponsor lie mills like Faux Noise to keep your puny brains in turmoil hating your neighbors. Then, after all the lies you tell about being fair and independent, and that no one is worth voting for, you scamper down to the polls in droves, and VOTE for the rich to give you a good hard screwing. And you LOVE IT, as long as you so kindly believe that neighbor is getting screwed even worse.

            This is the very short version. Whether it makes you happy or not is irrelevant, because it just happens to be the truth.

            The only alternative is, you must be at least a member of that top 2%, if not of the 0.1% of the worst thieving assholes.

      • charleo1

        I hear you. But most people, who are either center left, or
        center right, prefer their religion straight up. The same way
        they prefer their politics, where religion is concerned, separated. I do think Pope Francis made it abundantly clear what he sees as the teachings of Christ, And the clear conflicts, with what is being proffered throughout the evangelical, and radical right.

        • 788eddie



          a few seconds ago

          Hey Charlieo, I’m center-right, a registered Republican and a white
          male, but it hasn’t stopped me from supporting Democrats since Clinton.
          In other words, ever since I figured out that my party had been taken
          over by dishonorable, right-wing nuts.

          And lately I’ve been
          supporting more liberal fights with my donations, too. I think that’s
          what should worry the GOP the most. Even though the Kochs can donate
          large amounts, if enough of us “little guys” are contributing even small
          amounts, we eventually can win in the end.

          • charleo1

            Very well said. And more importantly, It’s true. In spite of all the money, the gerrymandered districts, and purposefully trying to limit the input of those voters they know don’t support them. The poor, minorities, young people, thru voter suppression tactics. But in the end, those are all just temporary fixes to their larger problem. The growing reputation as the Party that only cares about the rich. That harbors, and tolerates racists, encourages greed, and would seem to be all right with a powerless society, rife with poverty, and no option but to cater to a White monied aristocracy. And there’s a lot more of us, than there are people who agree with that vision for the Country.

    • mike

      And yet 5 of the 10 have Democratic Governors, and 3 have democratic majority lower house legislatures. North Carolina voted for Obama 2008 and Montana has voted both parties frequently and because of geographic conditions has lagged behind, not because of Republicans.
      9 of the states are in the south where Democrats ran them for centuries, they focused on producing commodities, whereas the northern states more valued added goods, manufactured goods, capital intensive goods. One generation of Republicans can not be blamed for the disparity that has been there for two centuries.

      The democrats might have a point but lose it when one looks at the 10 poorest cities(250k+) in the US. Detroit, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Miami, St. Louis, El paso, Milwaukee, Philadelphia and Newark, all with very high unemployment rates. Only two had a Republican since 1961(Ohio), but not since 1980s, The rest have been controlled only by Democrats.

      • bob bear

        Because it has been the last generation of new Republicanism that is the problem!
        Remember ‘tricke down economics’ and tax breaks for the rich will benefit everyone?! And the Right is still believing in that garbage!

        • mike

          Funny but not true. So after all those years under Democratic control, all the ills are because of Republicans, Right?? LOL!!!

          • One Cool Chick

            All what years under democratic control?? America has been under a Republican administration for 20 years out of the last 34-35 years. Where do you live?

          • mike

            I think you need to read my post again and then reply, Cool Chick.
            FYI: it had nothing to do with America under republican administrations. It was about state and city governance.

          • Russell Byrd

            A lot of people used to think ol’ ms. julia mike was a paid stooge with the ever changing the subject techniques, and the never ending, constantly revolving blame games that he plays, but I saw through that from the start. He is just a shitstick moron with ADHD that is full of hate and lies just to hear them told.

            OR, another way to say it is: He was too ineffective to have been worth anyone’s money to pay.

            ROTFL! at a maroon that is clueless.

          • 788eddie

            Yeah, right. Like for six out of the eight G.W.Bush years where the Repubs had majorities in both Senate and House Of Reps, and control of the white house. That Democratic control?

      • Bill Quigley

        What are you talking about? Last time I looked, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Texas, Florida, New Jersey and Ohio had Republican governors. That right off the top of my head, some others may also have Republican governors as well.

        • mike

          I assume your response is to the 10 poorest cities, Right??
          Let me help you understand, All those cities were controlled by Democratic Mayors and party, it has nothing to do with governors.

          When did governors start running the cities???

          Nice try though.

          • pisces63

            When they stopped alloting the money they were supposed to by contract. When they kept money needed for road repair, schools, etc. When you have suburban schools with no money problems, now have to put a levy on the ballot because the republican governor stuck it to them big time and cut their usual funding from profit sharing and put it into a rainy day fund. There were some HOT mayors in Ohio and lot of them republicans. Here, in Cleveland, our mayor Jackson, created a balanced budget without laying off a soul and decimating services. Then, the republican governor cut the allocation for Cleveland. A governor can impact on the cities. No matter who is running a city, NONE control the businesses. NONE!! Voinovich was our mayor at one time. Jobs still left. I voted for him, too.

          • mike

            I guess the Curley effect has nothing to do with any of this, Right!!!!
            The lack of fiscal leadership plays the major role, others factors play a role when reality is ignored.
            I didn’t say cleveland one of the poorest, that was from the census.

          • pisces63

            You made the statement about governors and I just told you how one can impact on cities and you get Curley effect. You people, right wingers, never want to be wrong. I live here. I watched what this governor did and it hurt a lot of school systems and cities. They were fiscally responsible and then had to either cut services, projects for their schools or ask for money when they should NOT have had to. Districts that hadn’t had a levee in years, had to ask for levees. A governor did that, single handedly. Now, during election year, he is speaking of giving it back. Take that to Larry and Hey, Moe!!

      • Violet Knight

        And most of the richest cities have Democratic mayors as well, and more have at least a significant history of Democratic mayors. Because, obviously, urban areas of all kinds tend to go Democratic.

        What most of the poorest cities have is that they were heavily industrial Rust Belt cities, which have fallen as the economy has become more service-oriented. If you’re not going to blame ‘one generation’ of Republicans for ‘centuries’ of (then-conservative) Democratic rule, then it seems absurd to blame the Rust Belt cities for their declining fortunes.

        • mike

          I just pointed out that the poorest have almost never had a Republican mayor and it is total outrage on the left. but when a case is made that 8 of the 10 poorest states are cause by first generation Republicans it has to be the truth even though they were controlled by the Democratic party for hundreds of years.. Just Baloney!!!

          • pisces63

            No place is it written they caused a thing. A question was asked. If what republicans believe is implemented, why isn’t it working? It still should be working because, like here in Ohio, the state house and the governor are republican. No matter how long dems had control, it should work. Why isn’t it? The red states have had republican rule since Strom Thurmond and the dixie-crats turned republican. How much time is needed for them. Strom and Jessie and the rest are dead aren’t they? So this is maybe, second, third generation.

          • Violet Knight

            Not sure what that had to do with my post, mike. But I’ll bite. No, the Democratic party hasn’t controlled those cities for ‘hundreds’ of years. For the period since the 60s, I think I’ve put forth a reasonable explanation — but I think you may have the causal arrow backwards in any case.

          • mike

            First you are having a problem between States and Cities, My remark “hundreds of years” refers to States not cities.

          • Violet Knight

            Fair enough. Still wrong that those cities have “almost never” had a Republican mayor (look up, say, Detroit).

            And of course the Democrats in the South were extremely conservative through the Sixties, when Nixon brought out the infamous Southern strategy. Nor are their current Republican governors “first generation”. How long should it take for their policies to have an impact? Hundreds of years?

            For extra fun, check out the ten richest states….

          • mike

            I was talking since the 70s and 80’s and going forward. The last Republican was 1962 when the boom was still going.
            Why??? the articles were on the 10 poorest, to try and blame it on Republicans. What you might look at is the migration from those blue states to the red states and why. Go check out for the real numbers.

      • pisces63

        I live in Ohio, it has nothing to do with who runs a state. If manufacturing leaves, what can any governor do? My husband had this wonderful job, until 1981, just after the birth of our youngest child. We had bid on our first home. He received bonus’ of up to $5,000. at Thanksgiving. They moved out of the state and left us high and dry. WHY?? They could not come to an agreement with the local gas and electric companies. Foundries use a lot of fuel and this was just after the Arab embargo and prices went through the roof. This impacted steel. Automobile industry. We caught hell and the good people of Texas, in the midst of a boom, told us to go to McDonald’s. I have watched Cleveland, Ohio, go from a population of over a million to under 400 thousand. I remember when young men, in my high school, I graduated in 1967, getting summer vacation relief jobs at Ford, Chevy, GM, LTV, US STEEL, Alcoa, etc. I work for an insurance company and I remember 30 years ago, when we had dedicated units just for those groups. I did LTV. I am a democrat but even I know it has nothing to do with the governor. We once had no state or municiple income tax. We needed no school levies. The plants shut down because American’s wanted cheap. Republicans have controlled our state house for quite some time with a republican govenor, Kasich. The job growth promised by him has been less then stellar as in Wisconsin. Yet, I would rather keep him than that idiot FitzGerald.

        • mike

          Still can’t change the fact city was controlled by the Democratic party and mayors little fiscal irresponsibility.
          Can’t change the fact the Democratic mayors have had a lock on City Hall despite the once great and prosperous city stagnating on their watch. This the Curley effect in action.

          • pisces63

            So, sounds more like the anal retentive effect. I don’t care who was in charge, little green men from mars, democrats, republicans, independents, if the businesses move, they move. No one’s fault. Oh, I guess you are a great governor/mayor when you get low wage jobs for people who need SNAP to make ends meet such as in, uh, one of the richest states in the country, TEXAS!!. That’s fiscal responsibility. People with no health coverage, low paying jobs, basically no benefit. Perry has cut health benefits. So, what should these people have done. I know, hold a pistol to their heads and make them stay here, Detroit, Erie, Buffalo, all the industries that built this country. That would have worked. I betcha!! My husband and I used to visit friends in Flint, Michigan. They did not have a poor area at that time. Jobs. Well paying jobs with benefits.

      • JPHALL

        Cities that are full of people who left the Republican controlled states. Go to any of those cities and ask the people where they came from. Most will tell you the Red States. And the reason is the chance for more opportunities.

        As to those Democrats you talk about. Most of them were Dixiecrats in the 1960’s. They became Republicans because of LBJ and the Civil rights successes of the northern and western Democrats.

        • mike

          Such bull s_ _ t!!!
          Some simple facts.
          Income up in Red states
          Job growth up in Red States
          Lower home prices in Red States
          lower unemployment in Red States
          More people moving to red states
          Why? more business friendly, less taxation and regulations. Source: IBD

          Pathetic try JPHALL.

          • JPHALL

            Yeah, because people are retiring, in the north, west and east, and moving where they can get the most from their money. . Great inducement. Can not make the good money there, but can get more for your money earned somewhere else. Income up because foreign companies are moving there because red state labor and taxes are cheaper than in their own counties. Sounds like a traditional colony system. Something to brag about ha ha.
            It is funny that in California, a blue state, more jobs are being created than in red states but at higher wages and tax rates. When you have historically had low income, job growth , and home prices any increase is good. It is sad that all red states can brag about is that they are getting where blue states have always been.



            replied to


            on The National Memo

            4:40 p.m. Sept. 3

            Cities that are full of people who left the Republican controlled states. Go to any of those cities and ask the people where they came from. Most will tell you the Red States. And the reason is the chance for more opportunities.As to those Democrats you talk about. Most of them were Di…

            11:10 p.m. Sept. 3

            Such bull s_ _ t!!!
            Some simple facts.
            Income up in Red states
            Job growth up in Red States
            Lower home prices in Red States
            lower unemployment in Red States
            More people moving to red states
            Why? more business friendly, less taxation and regulations. Source: IBDPathetic try JPHALL.

            View comment on The National Memo

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          • mike

            I know you can produce the source for all those new jobs, Right???

            Here’s something to put in your brain.


            Still the Red States are improving while the blues states continue to lag behind.

          • JPHALL

            Things are great in red states only on right wing web sites. Try Googling and see what everyone else sees happening. As to your article, read what the Toyota exec said and not the right wing commentators’ interpretation. Subject: Re: New comment posted on If GOP Is So Right, Why Are Red States So Far Behind?

          • mike

            I see you haven’t provided the source. Interesting, you make a statement with questionable facts but just can’t seem to find the source.

          • JPHALL

            When have you never provided a non right wing web site as a source. We all know why. As to the retirees, I know because I am one myself. Many of my co-workers did the same thing. Florida, Georgia, Texas, Idaho and the Carolinas get a huge influx of retirees. See: for examples.
            Ask them why they moved south and places like Idaho and they will tell you the same thing. Their retirement money goes farther in those locations than where they earned them. And also that the states have changed since they left them and they do not have to work there. Many left the red states to make a decent living. And in the Black community, many return to their home cities in the south at retirement. This has been going on for years.
            That is why many of these states have pockets of blue and some are even going purple. When all these people decide to get involved in their new states, watch out red wingers.
            Subject: Re: New comment posted on If GOP Is So Right, Why Are Red States So Far Behind?

          • mike

            I have produced many articles from the center to center left. NYT, WP, LA times, ect.. Sorry mysanantonio doesn’t have what you want to hear. So they are lying? Right!!!

            You seem to want to deflect from jobs issue. Yes, the retiring Damn Yankees are heading south and have been or years. So what??? The issue has been about jobs.
            And the older they are the more conservative they are, not all but a great % of them.

            Still waiting for that documentation!

          • JPHALL

            Once again you lie. You have provided me with nothing but right wing fairy tales and opinion. I have not spoken about jobs other than the fact the the blue states have always led the red states economically. Today Texas and North Dakota are doing well because of new oil and gas supplies. But the others still lag the blue states. Google it. Subject: Re: New comment posted on If GOP Is So Right, Why Are Red States So Far Behind?

          • mike

            In your first post you said that people were leaving the red states and going to blue states for more opportunities. Yes, retirees have headed south for many reasons from weather, less taxation, and quality of life. Which means better opportunity to enjoy there later days.
            I gave you that shows that it is just the opposite. It is neither right or left, it is a number cruncher. It takes information and gives their members the necessary information to make intelligent financial decisions.

            Still waiting to see the source of your facts that dispute mine. Balls in your court, produce the source and documentation.

            The question is, Why are red states now out performing the blue states. Why are more companies moving to the red states. Simply, it has a more friendly attitude toward business.
            Why is NY State offering 10 years of no taxation to companies?? Is it because so many have left the blue state because of their unfriendly business environment!

    • bob bear

      I agree with you on everything except when they wake up, I don’t think they ever will !

      • joe schmo

        Better yet would be if ALL the Red States separate from those fewer Blues. You have to look at demographics. There are fewer people in most Red States, therefore more welfare.

        Glorious CaliMexico….I cannot wait until my state comes crashing down and believe me it will from all the weight and burden of an influx of ILLEGALS, a huge population of homeless, and tons of drug addicts. So many companies have already left the state and still leaving. It’s a cesspool.

        Payback time? What a crock. What comes round goes round…… LOL Detroit…….Atlantic City:) Any indication of the future…. and the Green Monster is waving it’s angry head in California. To its demise… its demise.

        • jmprint

          It’s a cesspool because you live there.

        • oldiugymnast

          As a Californian, I would be thrilled if the 250 billion dollars of our tax mine that is used to subsidize your banana republics in the red states were available for us. You are aware that the red states are subsidized by blue states – right?

          • Independent1

            You sure got that right – all 14 of the states that actually support America and get the least federal dollars back for the taxes they send to Washington are Blue States – although there are 3 red states that get less back than the pay, they get 96-99 cents/$1 back which means they’re contributing little to nothing with respect to support America.

            And that’s not the worst of it – when comparisons are made between America and the rest of the world, and America comes out looking bad, for example, with respect to longevity and infant mortality, the reason we look bad is because the Red State are nothing but DISASTERS!!

            People live 3-6 year shorter lives in Red States and 12 of the 15 states with the highest infant mortality are red states!!

        • Independent1

          California to its demise?? What a joke!! You do realize don’t you worthless that the California economy has outpaced every other state since Brown paid of a chunk of its enormous debts!!

          Texas has actually dropped to #6.

          You’re even a bigger idiot than even I believed!!

    • pisces63

      Then pointing their fingers at those same people and calling them the 47%-ers. Wanting handouts. On the public dole. Those same people think it is okay for Wal-Mart and the like to pay substandard wages which forces over half their workforce to get SNAP which is where Wal-Mart gets over half it’s bottom line. They felt the SNAP cuts, big time.

  • jamesowens

    if polticians are supposed to be ethical and honest lets pass a law that 3 strikes and your out . A poitician gets caugt lying to the public 3 times never able to hold office. See how many are left after a week.

    • FireBaron

      Oh, hell. That means we would need to replace the entire congress (and probably the president) every couple of weeks!

      • jamesowens

        how long and how many beofre they got teh message we want honesty

    • highpckts

      I think all members of Congress should be voted on Nationally! Let everyone have a say in how this country should be run! If left up to districts that are gerrymandered these greedy bastards will do anything to keep their seats. Not if the whole country sees them for what they are!

  • Independent1

    I find the notion the presidential policies have little influence on the economy and how it progresses suspect at best. Admittedly, the president can’t really influence gas prices, or many factors that influence how American runs, but on the other hand, as the author,Leonard Pitts, points out, the economic results under Repub vs Dem presidents over the past 100+ years says otherwise.

    In addition to what Leonard pointed out, if presidents don’t influence the economy:

    Why have more than 75% of the recessions Americans’ have experienced since 1900 come under GOP presidents? And even its one world-wide depression?

    Why is does one of the best GOP presidents, Eisenhower, lead all presidents in the number of recessions occurring during his presidency(3)?

    Why has the stock market performance been dramatically better under Dem presidents than GOP presidents, averaging 10% or better under Dem presidents and lest 1% under GOP presidents?

    Why has America’s debt soared under the last 5 GOP presidents while it’s been held in check and deficit spending decreased under all 3 of the last Dem presidents?

    And as Leonard pointed out, why is America really surviving because of the tax revenues from 14 Blue States?? 14 of the 17 states which drag the least taxes from Washington are Blue States, and the 3 red states in the list get back over 95 cents/$1 of taxes they send to Washington, so they’re getting back almost all they contribute.

    And why of the 456 counties who suck the most welfare and food stamps from Washington are 92% of them Red States (421)??

    And why do people in Blue states live 3-6 years longer than people in Red States if living in red states is so great???

    America’s red states clearly do prove the GOP rhetoric is a fantasy, just like their trickle-down economics fantasy. Virtually all red states are a disaster to live in – they also lead the nation in Violence and all forms of dying including auto accidents and even infant mortality.

  • rog363

    I do not care what any party says, as an American, I would like nothing better then to have government get the hell out of the private American citizens lives and stop their Dictatorial ways of dealing with the people. We, the people, have no one but our selves to blame for allowing, over decades, government to become so big and powerful that they believe their job is to be our Dictators, when, according to Lincolns Gettysburg address, we are supposed to be a country “of the people, by the people and for the people”, we have now been so corrupted by government and their rules, that we now are a country, of the Government, By the Lobbyists and for the big business. This goes for both Democrats and Republicans. We must turn our elected public servants back to what they are there for and that is to serve the people as Public Servants, to do as the people want, not to do what they believe is best for the people. I, as a seventy year old man, have been waiting for America to wake up and see what has been happening to the home of the brave and the land of the free and I give this Regime credit for one thing, and one thing only, and that thing is, waking up many Americans as to what has been and is happening to OUR country. A complete take over by a Marxist type of leadership, a big government where the politicians will be making your decisions for you because the people aren’t intelligent to make their own choices and politicians may be correct in their assumptions because look what the people elected as their leader, a complete unknown, an empty suit, a Community Organizer in Chicago and all people have to do is look at how well Chicago is doing to realize the mistake they made, not once but twice.

    • Independent1

      You are one MISGUIDED COOKIE!!

      All you have to check out to see what reducing government in people’s lives creates is look at red states in general, and especially Texas. Red states, most of which have worked to reduce government, are virtually disasters when compared to Blue States.

      Here are some statistics on Texas which are a few years back but haven’t changed much under Perry because he’s continued to cut back on government and focus tax dollars on trying to suck in new businesses:

      .Texas is 49th in the country in tax revenues collected per capita and 50th in revenues spent.

      .Texas is 44th in tax progressivity, which means it collects most of its taxes from working people and it comes in 50th in the percent of its population that have a HS diploma and Texas is 49th
      in what it pays its teachers.

      .Texas ranks dead last (50th) in having the most people without health insurance and also dead last in the number of children covered by insurance.

      .Texas is 49th in the support it provides to women & children in the WIC program, and it leads the nation in teenage births.

      .Texas ranks 6th in the nation in the number of people living in poverty and 50th with regard to the affordability of homeowners insurance.

      .Texas ranks 45th in the overall health of its population and 47th
      with respect to mental health.

      .The quality of the highways in Texas is ranked 42nd and its parks and recreation facilities are ranked 48th and environmental protection 46th

      . Police protection in Texas is ranked 49th and government administration 50th.

      .Texas comes in 3rd in the nation in the number of public officials that are convicted for a crime; while being dead last in the percent of voters who turn out for elections.

      .Texas is 46th in the hourly earnings of its workers and 48th in the payout of worker’s comp benefits.

      .Texas also has the worst healthcare services and delivery in the nation according to the federal Agency for Health Care Research and Quality

      .And Texas ranks as having the most polluted environment in the nation because of all the oil spills and toxic fumes that are spewed by all its oil refineries and coal-fired power plants.

      Anyway you look at it, Texas with all it’s reduced regulations including reduce police oversight, firefighter oversight, business oversight, healthcare oversight. etc. etc. is the cesspool of America. And not only that, but people in red states live 2-6 year shorter lives with their reduced governments!!!!

      • rog363

        10 poorest cities(250k+) in the US. Detroit, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Miami, St. Louis, El paso, Milwaukee, Philadelphia and Newark, all with very high unemployment rates. I am now saying no more on the subject because there are to many people out there that feel they are entitled to the same things I’ve got, without them having to work for it.

        • Independent1

          That may be, and the vast majority of them are CONSERVATIVES!!

          12 of 15 states that suck the most welfare dollars are red states. 421 of the 456 counties that suck the most ‘freebies’ voted for Mitt Romney in 2012.
          More than 75% of food stamps go to states and counties run by Republicans.

          So if you’re concerned about people getting welfare, tell your GOP representative, either at the state or federal level, to stop voting for legislation that disenfranchises Americans and puts them out of work, on unemployment and needing help! Which is exactly what the GOP has done since the beginning of the Great Recession – which THEY CREATED!!!

          • bob bear

            Because Republicans want a country of poor people led by our corporations!

          • rog363

            Now ask yourself this question, who instituted these programs? Democrat or Republican, both are nothing more then political organizations which have learned how to suck the monies out of Americans pockets so as to maintain the lifestyles they feel they deserve. Until Americans begin realizing this we will continue on the path of destruction.

          • Independent1

            Just because the Democrats have instituted legislation that helps people when they’re struggling, HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT!! It’s the political party that governs in a way that forces more and more people into having to use those lifeline programs – REPUBLICANS!!!

            Do you have any idea how many more millions of homeless would be roaming the streets in America if the Democrats didn’t institute Social Security?? Millions upon Millions!!

            Do you have any idea how much younger Americans would be dying if the Democrats hadn’t instituted some of those welfare programs and Medicaire – years younger.

            That’s already being proven by red states, where people die 3-6 years younger than people living in Blue States.

            Wake up clueless!!!!!!

          • Meg

            Sorry, but if you look at red states with republican gov. you will see the state is pulling out of the hole that a dem gov. left it in. A good example is what happened to Detroit after years of dem rule. If this adm. is so wonderful, why is half of the US population now on gov. benefits?

          • Independent1

            Sorry Meg, but that’s simply not true. The state of Kansas, run by a Republican, is in such financial trouble that more than 100 political Republicans have endorsed the Democrat candidate for governor in the upcoming election. Brownback in trying to tailor Kansas as close as he could to the Heritage Foundations idiotIe economic ideology has turned Kansas into an absolute DISASTER!!

            And it depends on what you call “pulling out of the hole” . If you mean by that, supposedly balancing their budget, that may be true, BUT AT WHAT COST??

            Virtually every red state balances its budget on the backs of its citizens. It cuts its budgets to the bone, which results in red states LEADING THE NATION in socio-economic measures like:

            Violence – the five states that lead the nation in overall violence are red states because they’ve cut back on police protection.

            Poverty – 20 of the 24 states that lead the nation with people living below the poverty level are red states.

            Industrial disasters – 8 of the 10 states with the most industrial disasters are red states, because the cut regulations and government oversight of business into order to SUPPOSEDLY save money.

            Homicides – all ten of the states which lead the nation in homicides are Red States – because once again, there’s lax police protection.

            Infant mortality – 13 of the 15 states with the highest rates of infant mortality (babies dying during birth of before their 1st b irthday) are red states because they’ve cut programs that provide healthcare to women who are expecting.

            Life expectancy – residents of red states live on average 2 year shorter lives than residents of Blue States and as much as 5-6 year shorter lives if you compare the 10 red states where longevity is only projected to 75-77 and compare them to the 9 Blue States where people live to 80 and 81 – only 1 red state has a longevity projection to 80 (Utah at 80.2 years).

            So you may thin Red States are pulling themselves out of the hole, but the last thing you want is for America to fall into the hole that is characterized by America’s red states – A DISASTER!!!!!!!!

        • highpckts

          Yeah and they are the GOP! They may not vote for more taxes but they will take everything else because of it!

    • Liberals do not want less government. They want more. More interference in our lives, because Americans aren’t smart enough to make their own decisions. More regulations to keep the American people in line. Less freedom because we need the government to take care of us. What happened to taking responsibility for yourself?

      • bob bear

        You are seriously not informed!
        Republicans are the party of big business!
        And their followers are ignorant mindless excuses for human beings!

        • Republicans suck almost as much as the democrats, but the road that the liberals are following leads us into communism. The mindless ones are those following a communist tyrant.

          • bob bear

            You have no knowledge of history, there has never been a Communist Country, just ‘dictatorships’ calling themselves Communists!

          • And that is what we are looking at with this regime and the liberals.

          • Independent1

            If you purport to be a Christian, open your bible and begin reading in Acts 4 vs 21 where it describes how the Holy Spirit led the first Christians into a communistic style of living.

          • Communism would be great IF humans were not involved. Unfortunately, humans are usually separated into two groups. One that will carry their own weight, and those that want everything done for them. Everyone has to work toward a common goal. It does not work.

          • Independent1

            Exactly, a communism form of living is actually what God would like to see his people live under. That was made clear when Luke described how the Holy Spirit led the people starting in vs 21 of Acts 4.

          • jmprint

            NO IT DOESN’T.

        • rog363

          Hey bud, did you work in your lifetime or did you collect Welfare from the biggest business in America, Government?

          • Independent1

            He’s not a Conservative, so the changes he’s been on welfare are far less than for a conservative. More than 75% of food stamps go to Conservative run states and counties; and 12 of the 15 states that suck the most welfare from government are Red States.

          • rog363

            I am sick and tired of people calling themselves conservatives or Liberals, I will always call myself what I am, an American, one who worked his whole life to get where I am and to have what I now have. I am proud to say that I have never been on Welfare, never collected food stamps and served my country proudly in the USAF, maybe if more people did this instead of being dependent on government, then, maybe, we could begin turning our country back around to being a world leader instead of the laughing stock it is becoming.

          • highpckts

            Well aren’t you just soooo lucky! You know bad things happen to good people! So don’t preach about how you pulled yourself by your bootstraps until you have walked in someone else’s shoes! God I hate arrogant people like you!

          • Independent1

            So because you happen to have been fortunate all your life and haven’t had the need of help, you think it’s okay to denigrate people who have. Your type is almost worse than the current GOP who purposely manage our government caring nothing about the fact that their governmental polices depress the economy, force people to work at wages which are not sufficient for them to survive.

            You think just because you never had to experience an unexpected downturn in your life, that it’s okay for you to feel superior to millions who have. There are thousands of people like you, that just a couple years ago probably said the same thing you are, until the Great Recession pulled the rug out from under them; and even though some were earning six figures a year, they’re now finding themselves temporarily needing a helping hand because the company they worked for went belly up.

            I have a hard time understanding why you seem to feel it’s okay for you to act so self important, and denigrate people who haven’t been so fortunate. You like millions of others really need to be more realistic, understanding that life can throw you some curves – whether they’re job or health related, and send your life into a tailspin.
            You’re attitude is that of very incompassionate individual and in my mind a totally worthless human being. Remember, Jesus said: think more of others than you do of yourself. Something you know absolutely nothing about!!!!!!!

          • rog363

            Your type is what is now wrong with America, you believe that government should take care of those who are unable to care for themselves. You call me fortunate and I may have been fortunate but I did it on my own. I relied on my abilities and my work ethics to get to where I was. I didn’t drop out of school because I couldn’t be bothered with something stupid like learning, I stuck it out because I wanted to be dependent on my self not be dependent on government taking care of me. I understand that there are many out there that do need assistance and over the years I have contributed my time and monies to organizations that were there to help those that truly needed it.
            I am from the old school and believe America was founded to give everyone that tried the opportunity to make something of themselves and I and many others like me believe that if you drop out of school for no good reason then you should not be expecting those of us who worked and paid taxes to now take care of you.

          • Independent1

            Oh really!! If the Blue States which are the ones that do a better job of taking care of their citizens are so bad as you state, why is it that it’s 14 Blue States that are actually supporting America??

            14 of the 17 states that get the least “federal help” are Blue States – and the Red States which have cut back drastically on social aid programs are BY FAR bigger suckers of federal aid than Blue States. In fact the 3 states that do get less federal aid than they pay in taxes BARELY MAKE THE LIST!! They get 96-99 cents back for each tax dollar they send to Washington and are therefore doing virtually nothing to really support America – they barely support themselves!!!

            And if it’s so wrong to provide help to the needy, Why is it that people in Blue States live 3-6 years longer than people in Red States?? Can you answer me that??

            And if it’s so wrong to provide help to the needy, why is it that Blue States have BY FAR less violence and homicides than Red States?? Red states clearly lead the nation in violence and homicides.

            And of the 10 states that studies have shown have the most miserable citizens, people who are constantly depressed, ALL 10 OF THEM ARE RED STATES!!! Doesn’t that kind of tell you something??

            That people such as yourself are not only totally worthless human beings, you’re also hypocritical, bigoted morons, who haven’t a brain in their head. And whose opinion isn’t worth one red cent!!! So go fly a kite somewhere CREEP!!!!!!!

          • rog363

            Red states, blue states, I wish knew where you lived fool because I live in what is known as the United States and as to your go fly a kite statement , if I’m not mistaken , they say that electricity was supposedly discovered by a person that flew a kite. I believe those of you who think that living off the hard work of others should seriously think about flying a kite or at least trying to contribute to the Welfare of America instead of trying to tear it down.

          • Independent1

            Normal HOGWASH rhetoric from a LOW IQ conservative!!! We need to make a distinction between red and blue states BECAUSE IT’S RED STATES THAT ARE TRYING TO TURN AMERICA INTO A 3RD WORLD NATION!!!!!!!

          • rog363

            One other thing you miserable excuse for an American, where in my statement above did I say anything at all about thinking it wrong to help those in need. That seems to be the problem with all Liberals, when they read something they will of coarse change it so as it makes the sender look foolish, regardless of what the sender said and as to your statement about people in blue states living 3 to 6 years longer the those in red states, the reason that is happening is because the blue states are trying to turn America into this

          • Independent1

            WOW!! Are you ever delusional!! You’ve made numerous statements that show you hate helping anyone in need – and I’m not the only poster that has called you on it!!! Now you’re even trying to weedle your way out of your own statements!!

            And somehow the fact that people in Red States live 3-6 year shorter lives is the fault of Blue States????

            What idiocy is that???? You are actually mentally incompetent if you expect anyone to believe that LIE!!

            See this:

            All 15 of the states with the lowest life expectancy in the U.S. are GOP-RUN STATES?? Such that there is a large disparity in longevity between Red States and Blue States: on average,
            residents of blue states live 2 years longer than residents of red states. To the extreme, the Blue State residents of 9 states with longevity projected to 80 and older, live as much as 5-6 years longer than the residents of the 4
            shortest-lived GOP-RUN STATES of MS,WV,AL & LA. Follow this: starting with longevity projections for red states of 75 in: Miss., W. Va., Ala. & LA.; to 76 in: Arkansas, Kentucky & Tennessee to 77 in: S. Carolina, Georgia, Missouri, Indiana, Ohio & N. Carolina; while no Blue State has a longevity projection of less than 78, and many Blue states have longevity projected to 80 and over: N.J., N.H., Vermont, N.Y., Mass., Calif., CT, Minn. & Hawaii; Only one red state has longevity projected to 80 Utah (80.2), while 2 Blue States have longevity projections of over 81 –Minn. & Hawaii)

            And if the fact that people in Red States live shorter lives, how about the fact that Red States lead the nation in a number of ways of DYING!! Like Homicides and even infant mortality!!!

            -11 of the 12 states that have the highest infant
            mortality rates in the nation are GOP-RUN STATES? With Mississippi having the highest infant mortality followed by Louisiana, Alabama, Tennessee, Arkansas, S. Carolina, Delaware, North Carolina, Georgia, Oklahoma, Indiana & Ohio.

            -15 of the 20 states with the highest average rates of homicide over the past 5 years are GOP-RUN STATES. With Louisiana being by far the murder capital of America followed by Mississippi, New Mexico, Maryland, South Carolina, Alabama,
            Arizona, Michigan, Missouri, Tennessee, Georgia, Illinois, Arkansas, Oklahoma,

            N. Carolina, Nevada and Florida.

            And if that’s not enough for you, how about the fact that the states with BY FAR the most people living in poverty because they’ve been ignored by their states are Red States:

            -20 of the 24 states that have more than 12% of their population struggling with incomes below the poverty level (the states that need the most welfare assistance) are GOP-RUN STATES. The only Blue States in the top 23 are California, New Mexico, and New York. While for 2013, the 8
            states with the highest average incomes, including the 3 with the highest minimum wage standard, are all Blue States.

            And how about the states that suck the most welfare and have the most outright violence:

            7 of the 10 most violent states are red states

            Violent Crimes per 100,000 Population – 2012


            of the 15 states that get back the most federal aid for the tax dollars they send to Washington are GOP-RUN STATES; And all 10 that get more than $1.75 back for each $1 they send to Washington in tax revenues are red states. Of the 17 states that get back less tax dollars in federal aid than they send to Washington in tax revenues, ONLY 3 OF THEM ARE GOP RUN STATES. All 10 of the states that get the least federal aid for the taxes they pay (less than .75/$1) are BLUE STATES.

            Sorry, moron. But you’re going to convince NO ONE on the NM that it’s Blue States that are responsible for most of America’s ills!!!

          • rog363

            You just said that I made detrimental statements toward the needy, I would like you to read over what I said and please copy and paste any detrimental statement in a folder and please don’t forget this one, “. I understand that there are many out there that do need assistance and over the years I have contributed my time and monies to organizations that were there to help those that truly needed it. I also stated in one of my statements that anyone who drops out of school for no good reason be they male or female, should not be eligible for Welfare or Food Stamps because if they believe they don’t need an education to get ahead in this country or the world, then don’t expect the hard working, tax paying citizens to care for them. Put everything in a folder and re-post it after the mid-terms because we may both be surprised. This mid-term will show whether the people in America want to once again become a country of producers and once more gain the respect of others or whether we will continue on down the road to becoming a Welfare country. You would be doing me a big favor by not answering this now because I and I’m sure many others are tired of your blathering, re-post after the midterms.

          • oldiugymnast

            Oh the irony!

          • jmprint

            What about you, has anyone in your family ever needed any help.

      • rog363

        I have to agree with you, now try convincing someone like independent1, who somehow feels big government is a replacement for education and hard work.

        • Liberals thrive on government handouts.

          • jmprint

            I don’t get government handouts, never have, but I have always thrived, so your remark is a LIE.

          • Independent1

            You know very well that is a BLATANT LIE!!

            The 14 states that are really supporting America and sucking the least welfare ARE ALL BLUE STATES!!

            12 of the 15 states that suck the most welfare are Republican led RED STATES!!


            The budgets of virtually EVERY RED STATE are structured assuming their residents ARE GOING TO SUCK THE MAXIMUM FEDERAL HANDOUTS THEY CAN!!!

        • highpckts

          BS to you and kennedeb! You damn arrogant people that think you can handle everything on your own! You will build roads, infrastructure, pass laws to protect you from people like you, allow small businesses to get a hand up, help those in need, etc. etc.!! What fantasy world do you live in???

      • jmprint

        Kenndeb you and rog363 don’t get it. Nobody likes living in poverty. Less government gives more power to people like Ted Cruz to empower the rich and leave the middle class and poor to be destitute and become their zombie workers. You can’t fight the rich and powerful without the government watching over them so stop thinking you know it all, because you don’t. If you have never needed any help, then how could you possibly know what it feels like, unless you are here just to judge the unfortunate.

      • highpckts

        Again, I say, if we left this government in your hands, we would be a third world country!!

    • highpckts

      wow! So you hate the President? Couch it in as many words as you want, try to sound bipartisan, it doesn’t work! Judging from your remarks, if we left the “running” of the country up to folks like you, we really would be in a world of hurt!!

  • Paul Sykes

    When you GIVE OUT handouts to people, they don’t give anything back….and they keep grabbing more! That is the problem! You want to improve our country; TAKE EVERYONE OFF WELFARE—and you do that by STOPPING IT completely! It is heartless to continue to keep people “salves” to the government. There ARE jobs available…but why give up welfare for a paycheck? We’ve become a nation of people dependent on the government and of those that have lost the vision of John F. Kennedy when he said, “Ask NOT what your country can do for you…..”

    • dave

      The first ones to get cut off the govt. teat had better be big business and the rich first. If big business and the rich paid a fair share of taxes,with NO loopholes and NO offshoring millions,everybody would be happy. Why is it that the people who have the most to lose are ALWAYS the first to suffer under repub rule?? Ask a person trying to survive on minimum wage how easy it is,especially when big business pays its ceo’s millions . Sorry paul,you seem to have missed the point here. With all the tax breaks and loopholes for the rich and big busi-
      ness its not surprising some of them pay very little or no taxes any-
      way without a strong middle class to make up for it,we’re heading downhill again. You will see the lower and middle classes lose even more compared to the rich. Check out the help wanted ads yourself paul,how many people are there applying for jobs,sometimes hundreds for 1 job. Now tell me there are ‘ lots ‘ of jobs,typical repub b.s. !!

      • One Cool Chick

        Ditto dave. Ditto ditto ditto.

    • One Cool Chick

      Right Paul. And many of the “jobs” that are available pay so poorly that the folks working them STILL have to seek out supplemental benefits. And let me guess… you don’t believe the minimum wage should be raised either…

      So…people like you don’t want a decent living wage for your fellow human beings, and yet you don’t want them on welfare either. Just what do you want? For people to swim and live or sink and die? …

      And while we’re “taking everyone off of welfare”, does this “everyone” include companies that receive millions every year in “government subsidies”…aka corporate welfare? How bout those so called”farmers”, aka Big AG, who receive millions in “farm subsidies” (WELFARE!!!) every year? Are they included as well?

    • bob bear

      I assume you also include Corporate welfare which makes up approx. 90% of welfare in America!
      Corporations take their money out of the country, while individuals receiving welfare spend it locally to survive!

    • Snertly

      Your caps lock key not withstanding, most people who receive public assistance were already giving back when something bad happened. And they will be giving back, by which I mean being a tax payer and economic participant, in the not too distant future.

      Keep in mind that the government is an institution of the people. By, for and of, remember? So when people need help from government, that is an example of people helping each other, not a parasitic leaching off an unknown sugar daddy.

      • Paul Sykes

        I agree with temporary assistance…..NOT life-long welfare! Put a limit on the time one can receive welfare so that they don’t become dependent on it! Otherwise, there is no incentive to look for a substitute.

        • Snertly

          Life long welfare happens, but rarely. More common, the concept is raised as a boogieman by “Conservatives”™ who’d rather live by Ayn Rand’s creed of greed than act as stewards of the public weal.

          If you think welfare offers such a cushy existence, look up the amounts granted per person in your state and fit your monthly budget to that.

    • jmprint

      Paul there is abuse in all program be government or not. People are greedy, the more they have the more they want. But you are totally wrong in your statement. Those government funds are circulated right back into the economy. If more people were left in the streets, there would be more thefts, more crimes, people will do what it takes to survive. So I do feel it’s better to keep America civilized.

    • highpckts

      Yeah? Then big corporations better quit asking for handouts, no big tax rebates for going to one state or another, penalize them when caught with their hands in the cookie jar, close their very generous tax loop holes, etc.!! They are the real “takers”!!!

  • FT66

    Even in our daily living lives, those who talk much, always do less. Republicans talk much, whine a lot but producing results never come even if one can use the microscope to see them. Take for example: Fox News. Oh! gosh, this News Network has sharp talking people than other News Outlet combined. Just go back and see what they have produced which has benefited people. It is totally WORK DONE ZERO.

  • paulyz

    Most of Federal Government spending for social programs go to big inner-cities where the real poverty is and growing worse, even with Trillions spent. Either credit or criticism must differentiate between who controls Congress or the White House, not pick and choose. Under Clinton we had a Republican Congress.

    • bob bear

      Actually that is not true!
      1) the vast majority of welfare in our country is corporate welfare, approx. 90%!
      2) the poorest states, mostly Red states, are mostly Southern, and midwestern states, that have very few cities, and have much higher %’s of their population on Federal Gov’t. programs then Blue states!
      Republicans talk against the federal Government, but they can’t survive without it!

    • Independent1

      Remember, that of the 24 states that have more than 12% of their residents living below the poverty level, 20 of them are RED STATES! You can yak all you want about cities, but fact is, the number of people in GOP governed states and counties that are POOR, FAR OUT NUMBERS the poor living in big cities!!!!!!!

      And remember this too, under Obama, poverty in the U.S. has dropped dramatically despite the GOP’s every effort to keep people poor. When Obama took office, there were 23 states with more than 15% of their residents living below the poverty level with 20 of those states being red states. Those 20 states still lead the nation with the percentage of their residents living in poverty, but instead of it being 15% to 24%, it’s now 12% to 20%!!! – a significant reduction in poverty under Obama!!!!!!

  • ESG

    When big business or any business for that matter realizes that we are a consumer driven economy and paying a decent livable salary allows people to consume the manufactured (hopefully in the US0 products everyone does well. It is when jobs are outsourced and there is a movement to limit a decent wage that our economy goes in the toilet. Overall fairness in both business and wages is the key to our success. But let us be real if it is left to business their shortsidedness will not allow them to pay a living wage hence labor unions and governmetn interject to level the playing field. Then they get greedy and overpowering which leeds to outsourcing and other extreme measures. So lets all promote fairness in both business and in labor and be fair with wages to allow profits for companies but not economic rent and fairness to allow people a living wage.

  • Bryan Blake

    I believe it was Winston Churchill who said (parahrashing): “Capitalism is the worst economic system there is. Except for all the rest.” Therein lies the problem. It is the only one that produces inovation and can take humanity to new heights in all fields of endeavor. But it has its major flaw and weakness – it is driven primarily by greed and the greedy q

    • Snertly

      The theory of capitalism is about the abstraction of value to facilitate trade. This is a good thing.

      The practice of capitalism is about accumulating wealth to facilitate the accumulation of wealth. This is a bad thing.

      The practice of capitalism is a bad thing because, if too much wealth is accumulated by too few people, the system fails with the financial equivalent of all the water being in wells too deep to drill.

    • joe schmo

      Well…..then what do you propose? Communism? Should I define that for you because, the direction in which liberals are headed in sounds a hell of a lot like the regime my Father escaped from to immigrate here. You have absolutely no clue.

      Innovation and small companies growing to bigger companies are part of what made this Country great. I suppose you want to lose that? Pure bullshit…..

  • pisces63

    Haven’t you noticed, at least i have since Reagan, they use race baiting. They speak of trickle down economics which did not work, on the one hand, and the welfare queen on the other. Do you really think their base will pay attention to anything else but ‘welfare queen’. Another was a released black criminal. Do you think the base grew a brain in that little time after? Now and since 2008, it has been a black president. The debt has shrunk and nothing is said. It would not cross the minds of the mentally challenged to question, why isn’t the debt discussed any longer? Wow!! We have job growth. These things are sure fire winners in an election year but not with a black president. Their bigotry knows no bounds. You have an ex-con calling to question his loyalty. Their base will listen to DeLay the phony christian. Any other president, even Hoover, would have been basking in accolades. This president, still isn’t treated as president by many. If Ben Carson REALLY thinks the right wing would vote for him……I have a couple of bridges, here, in Cleveland to sell him

  • ExRadioGuy15

    There’s a simple answer to the question posed in the article’s title:
    The Fascist and psychopathic Con GOP leadership consider everyone else in the party (those unlike them) to be “Useful Idiots”. The Cons spew Fascist propaganda, the Useful Idiots believe them and vote for Republicans.
    So, the best way to combat this? GOP Progressives and Moderates need to stop being Useful Idiots to the GOP and vote for Democrats.

  • Lynda Groom

    By using fear, hate and distrust of our cherished institutions they’ve managed to convince the rubes in those states the evil of the very government designed to serve them. They’ve (GOP) been very effective in this campaign of dishonest representations for decades. It started in ernest under Saint Ronnie with the ‘government is the problem’ twaddle. Far too many of our fellow citizens are so confused and frightened by modernity that they are willing to sallow the nonsense and vote against their own self-interest. In short the lies have worked, so they will continue until the ill informed finally figure out that the screwing they’ve been getting is self-induced.

    • ExRadioGuy15

      Actually, Lynda: the GOP’s Fascist “gaslighting” propaganda campaign started in 1920, to get the newly-minted voters of the time, women, to vote for them. With very few exceptions, the GOP have kept up this propaganda campaign.

      • Lynda Groom

        Agreed, it just went viral under Ronnie.

      • Mary

        But I thought the Republican Party of the 20’s (when the Democratic Party was in control of the South) was really the Democratic Party, and vice versa. It SURELY couldn’t have been TRUE Democrats who prevented the black vote, encouraged racist county sheriffs, and allowed the KKK to flourish. No, those were closet Republicans. Of course they were. And Lincoln was REALLY a Democrat. And…

  • Eleanore Whitaker

    If anyone was thinking Chris Christie for president, I’d advise you to consider what NJ taxpayers are getting stiffed for…$500/hr lawyers that sent Trenton a bill for $9.2 million in legal fees to launder Christie’s part in BridgeGate. And, this is just the tip of the GOP iceberg.

    When they force those on Main Street to subsidies Big Business who don’t hire and create jobs in proportion to the employees and other taxpayers who pay taxes that pay for those subsidies, the Gravy Train must end.

    If anyone thinks Burger King is leaving the US due to high taxes, why choose Canada where tax on business is equal to that of the US? Burger King, like Halliburton, know it isn’t about evading’s about escaping from the Bush ERA fraud they enjoyed. All good things must come to an end.

    So now these corporate welfare trough feeders are scared silly their little empirical games will see them in jail. we didn’t know this was coming.

  • phil1942

    and then there’s Kansas. . .

  • Tony Torres

    We can keep proving that the GOP does not have good policies but their base gets off it’s ass and votes. We will never change their ways until we vote sensible intelligent people that care more for the USA than themselves. The GOP has some rational people but the fanatics out yell them and us. Simple solution, VOTE and get these jackasses out!

    • alphaa10000

      The GOP base votes because they know the demographic runs against them, especially in the future. In contrast, the Democratic base still suffers the burden of ingrained political despair, enough to keep a downtrodden people down.

      In 2008, for the briefest of moments, we saw the power of hope, which terrified the GOP and corporate powers-that-be into a redoubled attack on the opposition.

      In red states, typically southern and agrarian, a really vicious, exploitive power structure will add abusive, irresponsible and unprofessional policing to keep the few who do protest in their place– exactly the same tactic used by any authoritarian state against those who disagree.

      The fact the same policing happens in LA and NYC does not make them red states, but demonstrates power elites resort to similar behavior everywhere. What is notable is the blue state police problem is more likely to be addressed at a fundamental level than a similar police problem in a red state.

  • Robert Mark

    Using your example, compare the cost of living in Stamford, CT to Jackson MS. By your logic, all the simple Mississippi folk need to do is elect some Democrats and they’ll double their incomes. Maybe it’s not that simple.

    • alphaa10000

      What is glaringly simple is the tendency of red states to lower taxes on corporations and the wealthy, while expecting the middle class to pick up the tab. Since the middle class wage earner of Mississippi is not like his counterpart in Connecticut, the poorer red state tax base struggles to keep even basic government running.

      As a result, the over-taxed red state middle class is not any more likely to push for capital improvements than the under-taxed corporate upper brackets, and so matters devolve into a third-world quality of life. (See South Carolina’s “Corridor of Shame”– )

      By sparing the red state corporate gentry from paying its fair share of taxes, there is a chronic shortage of revenue for all the things a modern government does, like improve education, build (maintain and repair) roads and bridges, airports and regulate commerce against thieves, fraud and corruption, police the streets, and build hospitals and the like.

      Call the result economic apathy or abject socio-political despair, but such a red state economy is markedly different than the typically more vigorous and prosperous blue state. It is a matter of progressive public policy– or lack thereof– responsive to all citizens, not simply the wealthy and powerful.

  • angryspittle

    The red states are way behind because they are generally inhabited by drooling mouth breathers who are so fucking brain damaged and bone crushingly stupid that they continue to send people just like them to their state houses and to Washington at the behest of people like the Koch’s. The fucking idiots berate those that have to rely of government bennies when they are the greatest recipients of those bennies. The GOP is a party of misanthropes who have convinced those dumbfucks they should be too.

  • Israel

    You realize that the cost of living in Connecticut is different than the cost of living in Mississippi? You make interesting point but leave out crucial details to try and legitimize your agenda. Dems will applaud you and GOP will fight you and all you care about is your little article got published, despite being completely factual. This article is basically a Left-Wing Infowars story… Another stat you forgot to leave out is that we’ve never had a higher unemployment rate and never had less individuals in the Labor Force… job creation is only happening in Red States… Maybe if you publish enough grap you’ll be in the 1% and not have to worry about it… good play

    • alphaa10000


      Israel said, “… Another stat you forgot to leave out (sic) is that we’ve never had a higher unemployment rate…”
      Not so, according to the US Bureau of Labor Statistics. In 2009, the unemployment rate reached 10.0 percent only months after G.W. Bush left office. The years 2009-2011, after the crash of the GOP demonstration project for deregulated capitalism on Wall Street, saw a cratered economy, with the rate between 9-10 percent.until the end of 2011. The rate gradually has dropped since then, and today (August, 2014) it stands at 6.1 percent.

      Israel said, “… and never had (fewer) individuals in the Labor Force…”
      The US labor market is not the same workforce it was over a decade ago, and has been declining in numbers as it grew in age. To compare the labor of 2000 with the labor of 2014 ignores changes in manufacturing and factors like off-shoring that shuttered factories and canceled jobs across the US. A president has little control over that, except when congress agrees to work with him to reform the tax code and other incentives that previously have led business to do inversion to escape
      taxes and build factories abroad. And “fewer individuals” is not exactly true, by context, because the nature of American jobs has changed from manufacturing to service and information, and there is both a lag on jobs retraining (which takes congressional money) and a downturn in the number of individuals in their prime years. As the Boomer generation enters retirement, we do not have a comparable legion of younger Americans to take their place. These are not factors directly related to
      Obama economic policy, but are generation-wide influences which affect all administrations.

      Here is a good discussion of that–
      US Bureau of Labor Statistics site–
      The Washington Post–

      Israel said, “… job creation is only happening in Red States…”
      Not at all true. Jobs are being added in both blue and red states. However, some may confuse job growth / gains as a percentage with actual jobs added, which is a completely different measure. If a state had doubled its jobs, that would seem impressive, but everything depends on the actual numbers with which the state began. Put another way, if a state had 200,000 jobs in 2004, and 400,000 in 2014, for a job growth percentage of 100 percent over a decade, that is still not as significant
      for the nation as a larger economy which added one million jobs in the same decade, but for a job growth percentage of only 30 percent.

  • Mary

    You neglect to mention that, except for a brief period in the 1870s, Mississippi has had a string of Democratic governors until Kirk Fordice broke the pattern in 1992. With one more Democrat (Ronnie Musgrove 2004-2012) it is now back in Republican hands. I personally believe the governor has more to do with state economics in many ways than the President, but I’m no Economics scholar. I wonder how many other “Red” states have deep blue roots? You’re the journalist. I think.

  • Mary

    I failed to mention that many of the poorest COUNTIES may have voted Democratic while their STATES voted Republican. Did you do any statistical research on that? If you really are interested in cost of living, here’s a link for you: And another: I can keep this up all day!

  • Jeanne Davison

    this article is written by a liberal and is bs