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Wednesday, October 26, 2016

Carly Fiorina might be kicking up a feud with Donald Trump, but it turns out the two both have something in common: They could become the candidates of choice for the deranged anti-vaccine movement.

The Washington Post reports on Fiorina’s appearance at a town hall meeting with voters in Iowa:

Fiorina’s comment came in response to a question from a mother of five children who said that because of her religious beliefs, she will not allow her children to receive any vaccines that were created using cells from “aborted babies.” Fiorina told the woman that parents must be allowed to make such decisions.

“We must protect religious liberty and someone’s ability to practice their religion,” said Fiorina, receiving a round of applause. “We must devote energy and resources to doing so. Period.”

Fiorina also recounted the story of her daughter, who refused to have her own young daughter vaccinated for HPV, a sexually transmitted disease that can lead to cervical cancer. “And she got bullied. She got bullied by a school nurse saying: ‘Do you know what your daughter is doing?'” The daughter responded: “Yes. I do, actually.”

Afterwards, Fiorina sought to clarify her position to reporters, affirming that schools really can require vaccines for certain diseases: “When you have highly communicable diseases where we have a vaccine that’s proven, like measles or mumps, then I think a parent can make that choice — but then I think a school district is well within their rights to say: ‘I’m sorry, your child cannot then attend public school.’ So a parent has to make that trade-off.”

Also, as Time reports, Fiorina also criticized her old home state of California for recently passing legislation to eliminate religious liberty exemptions for children being vaccinated. “California is wrong on most everything, honestly. I’m not at all surprised that they made that mistake as well,” she said.

It should be noted that this is not Fiorina’s first time wading into the vaccine-libertarian bog. This past February, as BuzzFeed reported, she voiced a similar skepticism about vaccinating children for HPV — or even for measles — and she touted her own past sicknesses: “I think vaccinating for measles makes a lot of sense. But that’s me. I do think parents have to make those choices. I mean, I got measles as a kid. We used to all get measles… I got chickenpox, I got measles, I got mumps.”

There is in fact a bit of truth to the claim from the woman at the rally, that vaccines are created using cells from “aborted babies.” To be more exact, many modern vaccines are cultured in one of two lines of replicating cells, which have been maintained for 50 years. The origins of those cells were two fetuses that were electively aborted in the early 1960s.

By now, of course, the original fetal cells were used up a very long time ago, while the cell lines continue. But this does raise a question: For someone who believes abortion is so evil and that no benefit should be derived from it whatsoever, what would it matter when the fetal cell line began?

And going back to Fiorina’s point about schools requiring a measles vaccination: The measles vaccine is indeed one of those vaccines that has a basis in fetal-derived cells.

Republican presidential candidate and former Hewlett-Packard CEO Carly Fiorina responds to a question at a Fox-sponsored forum for lower-polling candidates held before the first official Republican presidential candidates debate of the 2016 U.S. presidential campaign in Cleveland, Ohio, August 6, 2015. (REUTERS/Brian Snyder)

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Copyright 2015 The National Memo
  • Darsan54

    This new “religious exemption” for almost anything is insulting both to the state and churches.

    • S1AMER

      Also insulting to people with brains.

    • dpaano

      As a Christian, these evangelicals are an embarrassment!!!

  • Looner

    That’s right Fiorino, insult the state with the biggest population in the U.S., California. Of course, it will be a cold day in hell she even gets close to any political office…. Unless she moves to a deeply red tea bag state. Of course she won’t, because she is too urban and too phony. I dislike her so much I prefer Palin over her.

    • stcroixcarp

      Palin is stupid and ignorant, Carly is smart and mean to the bone.

      • Bren Frowick

        Carly is a SALESWOMAN. Period. She made her career telling people what they wanted to hear, and totally flamed out when given an opportunity to actually RUN things, at HP.

      • Eleanore Whitaker

        Women in corporate life do learn to be mean. After all, they know that the glass ceiling over their head is their prison.

  • Bren Frowick

    Freedom! Freedom! Freedom! All the way to the early grave… One assumes Fiorina will continue to be happy with her daughter’s choices if and when her granddaughter develops cervical cancer…

    • dpaano

      She’ll probably blame it on Obamacare or Benghazi!

  • FT66

    Of all the people, Carly Fiorina thinks she can sit in the Oval Office as POTUS of the greatest nation on earth! Am laughing all the time seeing her talking,and at those who are promoting her. Don’t they have something else to do?

    • Independent1

      She appears to be very much like Trump; like Donald she has far too high of an impression of her own abilities and personal worth.

      • FT66

        Who is interested in their wealth? If money is everything to them, why can’t they go straight to the White House and sit there, instead they are begging votes from us. To hell with their money.

        • Independent1

          By ‘personal worth’ I didn’t mean to refer to wealth, but rather like Trump, and actually like most of the clown-car GOP candidates, Carly has a totally misguided and overrated idea of the value (worth) that she could bring to America if we were stupid enough to elect her.

  • Former CEO’s show that they are imminently qualified to have common-sense effaced from their minds, perhaps more so than the average GOP believer.

  • Independent1

    What pro-birthers, like the woman who refused to let here children be vaccinated with a vaccine that was developed using fetal tissue fails to realize, is (1) that given that that those fetal tissue cells being used to develop often life-saving vaccines were harvested before Roe vs Wade, the abortion from which those cells were harvested, was most likely allowed in order to save the life of the woman (it was most likely not just an abortion of convenience); and 2) she clearly doesn’t see the hypocrisy in the fact that she’s so adamant against abortion, but yet supports politicians who have virtually no regard for human life aside from a fetus. Politicians who will deliberately cut budgets and pass laws that deprive ‘living humans’ the food, healthcare and even housing they need to live. And then 3) she clearly doesn’t see the enormous sin in what’s she’s doing in living a lie – pretending to be so concerned about human life on the one hand, while totally disregarding it on the other by supporting politicians whose governance have shown they support premature death.

    And in the middle of that is Carly, doing everything she can to play up to both sides of the issue. Saying on the one hand – that parents should have the right to decide on vaccinating their children; totally disregarding the dangers that doing that place the children and even adults of others who may socialize with unvaccinated children and adults. People who are much more susceptible to diseases; while on the other hand Carly is saying that schools should have the right to refuse to teach children not vaccinated for very contagious diseases. Talk about being duplicitous; wanting it both ways.

    • idamag

      And pro-life politicians who are quick to send these babies to be killed when thy reach 19.

      • Independent1

        Ida, if you haven’t seen it, here’s a recent statement on fetal tissue research from the New England Journal of Medicine that puts this whole fetal tissue issue in the right perspective.

        • idamag

          I went to the article. Unfortunately, so many people cannot not read and comprehend an article like this. Reading comprehension seems to be a lost art in todays’ society.

          • plc97477

            I did have a lot of words larger than 4 letters that might explain their problem.

          • dpaano

            It’s not so much a lack of reading comprehension as it is lack of intelligence. The GOPers don’ want to believe anything that goes against the party’s platform even if it’s proven to be wrong. They have no concept of believing the truth on their own….that would take too much intelligence..

          • idamag

            I have a theory, not proven, so I can’t say for sure: I think to stay mentally sharp you have to have mental stimulation. You also have to have diversity. Greed took away the stimulation we might have gotten from television. Then there are these rural pockets, like around Arco, Idaho, where the farmers meet for coffee and complain about the go’ment while dipping flies out of their coffee. This is the same goverhment that gives them generous subsitides and parities.

          • dpaano

            You have a point there. Unfortunately, these individuals are the ones that are most subsidized by the government and would be the ones most affected (or is it “effected,” always get those mixed up) if the GOP gets a president elected in 2016. But, that’ll be too late!

          • idamag

            Their idea of balancing the budget, is to eliminate social safety nets, except those which they receive and to privatize everything else.

  • Eleanore Whitaker

    This is NOT about vacinating kids or abortions. It is 100% pure GOP Control freak need to make decisions for the rest of us. And, at what point in time did we elect control freaks to become behavioral adjustment professionals?

    If they did their damn jobs and took care of the business of the country and not their favorite campaign donors, they’d actually be worth what our taxes paid them.

    The joke as most of us recall is that these same BS artists hated, loathed and despised hippies. Have you seen what the relic hippies on Duck Dynasty look like? Or the Great White Adventurers on North Woods Law? Your’d think these loonies were faking their inner hippie. This from the bunch who hated long hair and beards?

  • Eleanore Whitaker

    Wealthy people are the most grossly insecure on the planet. They have B$ill$ons of reasons to be. They know their human imperfections and their history of screwing up. The problem today is that they know one other thing: Their greed and a single ripple effect screw up won’t get them on dime from taxpayers unless they have a GOP president ready to hand them our tax revenues.

  • drdroad

    Well Carly, one of the best things to happen to and in California was the utter superior beating you took in your attempt to be a Senator here! Millions of smart Californians figured that out pretty clearly.

    • plc97477

      I would have given California a high five but it is not easy to give a state a high five.

  • gococksri

    Quite frankly, I just don’t get why any parent would not stand in line with his/her daughter to make sure she got the HPV vaccine. It’s crazy. And, it’s bad parenting to not avail your child of every protection possible—be it protection against an unwanted pregnancy or protection against an STD that can lead to cervical cancer.

    And, while Fiorina’s daughter may think she knows what her daughter is doing, let me issue a word of caution: All of our parents thought they knew what we were doing and, well, they didn’t.

    • idamag

      Florina’s daughter may not be active, now, but does she intend to get married?

  • gococksri

    Fiorina will end up being a third-tier also-ran, but I would love to see her on a debate stage, one-on-one, against Hillary Clinton. Fiorina thinks highly of herself—that’s fine. But she’s not ready for prime-time against Hillary. Not even close. Talking points just don’t do you any good in a one-on-one debate. You’ve got to know the issues inside-and-out because you can’t be issuing “clarifications” on national television. Hillary knows the issues.

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  • republican demographic

    Troubling that she is bragging about her daughter denying her granddaughter the HPV vaccine. I wonder how proud she will be when her granddaughter is enduring multiple procedures for cervical dysplasia or cancer? Is the denial based on fear of vaccines (baseless); confidence that they know this young women is not sexually active and they will know when she is (laughable); or is it glee at adding a real physical threat to the whole twisted virgin obsession (abusive). Picture a mother putting her daughter at any other health risk this serious and it would prompt a child welfare investigation.

    • Allan Richardson

      Even if (according to the conservative ideal) her daughter DOES manage to remain a virgin until marriage and remain totally faithful to her husband, there is still a chance she could be infected by (a) a husband who cheated on her when she was unaware, or (b) a rapist. And the vaccine works best when it is given LONG BEFORE sexual activity, not as an “engagement present.” The idea that a girl who WOULD have remained “pure” without being vaccinated against an infection which would hurt her DECADES later, would become a promiscuous “slut” WITH the vaccination, despite the more immediate reasons not to do so (such as pregnancy, other STD infections, and HER OWN STANDARDS), is as ludicrous as the idea that teenagers will avoid smoking ONLY because of the danger of getting cancer in their 50s. Teenagers generally DO NOT weigh the long term consequences of their behavior, because they are TEENAGERS.

      Oh, and the same argument applies if you reverse the gender labels: BOYS should also receive the vaccinations before puberty, as well as girls, to protect the women they will care about later in life.

      I do not see how someone who does not believe in science could have become the CEO of a company BASED upon science, but I CAN see how, AS the CEO, she could ruin the company. The founders, Mr. Hewlett and Mr. Packard, who started off building the highest quality electronic test equipment, are surely rolling in their graves. Fortunately, HP is now recovering from her mismanagement (and probably paying her a golden parachute for causing the damage).

  • Insinnergy

    Too bad there’s no vaccine for idiocy.
    Perhaps we could have saved Fiorina.

    I think that the Anti-vax movement may just be the most stupid thing I have ever seen humans do… and that includes being a Tea Party Republican…. for the following reasons:
    1) Extensive historical evidence of efficacy.
    2) Nobel Prizes given to vaccine inventors and researchers.
    3) Personal and biographical stories and data from the time prior to vaccination being prevalent explaining in simple heartfelt words the pain of having multiple children die before reaching teenaged years.
    4) The Internet allowing easy access for anyone online to proper scientific information, research and methodology.
    5) The appallingly poor qualifications and quality of evidence of those people pushing, and in some cases, profiting off, this movement. All available there to see, without even moderate investigation.

    Perhaps the Anti-Vax movement needs their “Kansas” experiment?
    Kansas: The place where ‘Trickle Down Economics’ is busy destroying it’s economy and the future of it’s people.

    Perhaps we need a state willing to stop all vaccinations (I nominate Kansas for obvious reasons) to compare to the one next door that still vaccinates.
    After ten years we will find that the Anti-Vax state has had ~40% of it’s children die horribly to preventable diseases, and both have the same rates of autism (when counted proportionally to those who survived childhood).

    I’m sure that the fact your dead children did not develop autism (although not because of what you believe is the case) will be a great comfort.

    • idamag

      One example is pre-polio vaccine. I saw a little boy, in the room next to my child, die in an iron lung. Big noisy contraption. Polio was so rampant that my child was being held overnight for a fever that turned out to be tonsillitis. What kind of parent will endanger their child to make a statement? I remember my grandmother telling me of the numerous deaths from diphtheria, including her four-year-old child. Thanks to vaccine, it is just a medical word, now. Ignorance is dangerous.

    • dpaano

      I just read an article that says that autism is caused by women who take antidepressants during pregnancy. That should put the kibosh on the vaccination debate!!! Let’s hope that they find out that this is a valid argument!!! I know a few of my friends who took antidepressants during pregnancy, and one of them has an autistic child. Makes you wonder, doesn’t it? As a note, the baby was noted to be autistic BEFORE getting vaccinated for measles, etc., so they certainly would find it hard to blame it on that.

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  • idamag

    Nancy catalano is a scam.

  • dpaano

    I wonder if this idiot has EVER had any type of a vaccination; i.e., flu shot, shingles shot, etc.? A lot of our vaccinations for other things besides measles, mumps, etc., have been founded on cell research. Fiorina sees to be just another Michelle Bachmann, and I thought we’d gotten rid of her!!!