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Arithmetic For Republicans: Why Boehner’s ‘Offer’ Just Doesn’t Add Up

Memo Pad Politics

Arithmetic For Republicans: Why Boehner’s ‘Offer’ Just Doesn’t Add Up


If President Obama honestly wants to negotiate an agreement with Republicans before the year-end fiscal deadline, he must be deeply frustrated. And if he doesn’t really want to negotiate with them, then he should be delighted, for the same reason: Their latest “offer” laid before him by House Speaker John Boehner demonstrates again their refusal to reveal their true intentions — and their inability to do simple arithmetic.

Consider their treatment of Medicare, the popular social insurance program for seniors that Republicans have always despised. They have just emerged from a long national campaign in which they repeatedly and falsely claimed to “protect” Medicare from the president — whom they accused of wanting to slash $716 billion from the program — but now they complain that he won’t cut it enough. The Obama cuts were mythical, but the Boehner budget proposal  includes at least $600 billion in Medicare and Medicaid reductions.

Worse still, the Republicans propose to perform this crude surgery on Medicare without the slightest explanation of where they would cut. Washington rumors suggest that they would achieve some of those cuts over the next 10 years by raising the eligibility age by two years to 67 and by increasing premiums for more affluent beneficiaries.

As Robert Greenstein of the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities pointed out on Tuesday, however, those changes would not begin to achieve the savings required by the Boehner proposal.

The same problem undermines the other aspects of Boehner’s proposal, which includes $600 billion in additional unspecified cuts.  Either their arithmetic doesn’t work — or, as Greenstein worries, they mean to inflict severe cuts in health and other services that would harm elderly and poor Americans, but want to conceal those consequences from the public.

Yet there is an even deeper problem with Boehner’s arithmetic. The Republicans are fighting to extend all the Bush tax cuts to the wealthiest two percent along with everyone else — but their alternative proposals are utterly inadequate to compensate for the $1.3 trillion in revenues lost by continuing those cuts for the rich. To “offer” $800 billion in new “revenues” obtained by eliminating deductions rather than raising rates simply doesn’t work, as a matter of basic math. It isn’t nearly enough money.

If Republican leaders cannot do the arithmetic, then it is impossible to negotiate with them.  If they can do the arithmetic but insist on falsifying the answers,  then it is both unwise and impossible to negotiate with them.

Unless and until the Republicans start talking about real numbers that can actually add up, there is nothing to be gained from pretending to negotiate. Nor should the president start negotiating with himself, as he has sometimes done in the past. Instead, he ought to make sure that the opposition understands what will happen when they fail to act responsibly. After January 1, he will bring them an offer they cannot refuse, to restore cuts for the 98 percent — and they will be held accountable for any consequences caused in the meantime by their stalling.

Photo credit: AP/Carolyn Kaster

Joe Conason

A highly experienced journalist, author and editor, Joe Conason is the editor-in-chief of The National Memo, founded in July 2011. He was formerly the executive editor of the New York Observer, where he wrote a popular political column for many years. His columns are distributed by Creators Syndicate and his reporting and writing have appeared in many publications around the world, including the New York Times, the Washington Post, The New Yorker, The New Republic, The Nation, and Harpers.

Since November 2006, he has served as editor of The Investigative Fund, a nonprofit journalism center, where he has assigned and edited dozens of award-winning articles and broadcasts. He is also the author of two New York Times bestselling books, The Hunting of the President (St. Martins Press, 2000) and Big Lies: The Right-Wing Propaganda Machine and How It Distorts the Truth (St. Martins Press, 2003).

Currently he is working on a new book about former President Bill Clinton's life and work since leaving the White House in 2001. He is a frequent guest on radio and television, including MSNBC's Morning Joe, and lives in New York City with his wife and two children.

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  1. Budjob December 5, 2012

    With all of the talk about going over the “fiscal cliff” and, everyone must be equal in sacrificing to achieve a fiscal resolution beneficial to all,my question is what if anything are our congressional representatives,both democrats and republicans going to concede?They have MUCH to give back.

  2. Toni Anthony December 5, 2012

    here we go again.

  3. Jim Lou December 5, 2012

    Back to school.

  4. jarheadgene December 5, 2012

    I find it impossible to believe that, as much as it is easy to vilify Speaker Boehner, he really can’t be stupid enough to believe the stuff he is saying. If that is the case….”Throw him out of the BAR !!!”

    1. idamag December 5, 2012

      Jar, I don’t think he believes what he is saying. I think he is scared of the tea party subversives.

  5. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

    Don’t Believe A Word The GOP/Tea Party American Taliban Say!! Not One Word!!! They All Are A Bunch Of LIARS!!!

    1. old_blu December 5, 2012

      Yes they are Fern, I hope President Obama sticks to his guns, I’ll jump off the cliff with him.

      Good morning Fern.

      1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

        Good Morning My friend!! :0)!!!

      2. CYNICALZ December 5, 2012

        Go ahead, jump!

        1. BigTurd December 5, 2012

          Hold on I’ll get to jumping just as soon as I connect my bungee cord/or rope, and fold and pack my parachute

          1. CYNICALZ December 5, 2012

            The fiscal cliff? Impressing.

        2. old_blu December 5, 2012

          Oh you’re going to jump with me, you just don’t know it. *grabs hand*

          1. CYNICALZ December 5, 2012

            I don’t accept invitations. Thanks!

          2. neece00 December 5, 2012

            you may not have any choice

          3. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012

            neece-With Obama at the helm, your choice will diminish as well.

          4. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012

            Taking “Dirty Harry” with me to the poor house.

          5. puzzled21 December 5, 2012

            It’s not an invitation, it’s a proclamation, we all have to participate. Wake up, do some research, do your own thinking for a change.

          6. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012

            Puzzled-This came directly from Brietbart of which I hold more in value than your information.

          7. puzzled21 December 6, 2012

            What are you talking about? I don’t care where you received the information from, the cliff affects us all. We don’t have a say if it is allowed to happen.

          8. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012

            puzzled-So be it.

          9. puzzled21 December 6, 2012


          10. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012


          11. myfanwy December 6, 2012

            The more fool you.

          12. MRD1056 December 6, 2012

            You don’t accept facts either. Your a Republican!!!!

          13. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012

            Pleeeease, inhibit your injudicious rational by separating facts from myth. And, there in judgment my political affiliation is not with party, but in constitutional preference, not Social/Marxist ideology.

          14. puzzled21 December 6, 2012

            Since you drug the Constitution into this battle, please clearly delineate how the Constitution affects the cliff, and how it supports your position.

          15. CYNICALZ December 6, 2012

            Get off the sofa and broaden your world. Read Article 1 – Section 7, constitution states boldly:

          16. puzzled21 December 10, 2012

            I took your advice and looked up that Article. After reading it several times I still don’t see how it supports yopur position surrounding the cliff.

          17. CYNICALZ December 10, 2012

            On the web site, key in “On the Fiscal Cliff and a Constitution in Crisis”. Creators saw this as a possible problem and had the foresight to warn congress of its consequences.

            This may clarify you question as it applies to current affairs, and provides the economic definition of the Fiscal Cliff, and inception of a bipartisan bill signed by Obama.

            I am not going to comment as it would be unfair to influence your read.

          18. puzzled21 December 10, 2012

            Unless I am missing something, or pulled up the wrong site, this informatiion serves to support the Presidents position on wealth in this country.

          19. CYNICALZ December 12, 2012

            It identifies the Presidents spending philosophy and leveraged control of the house as a peril to the Nations economy.

          20. foolsdance December 5, 2012

            haha! thanks old blu.

          21. puzzled21 December 5, 2012

            Right on Old_blu, isn’t it amazing how well brain washing works? Of course it does require a brain to wash.

          22. old_blu December 5, 2012

            It is amazing.

          23. AMADAL December 6, 2012

            I’m jumping with you, at least when we go down we will all go together like we’re supposed to

          24. idamag December 6, 2012

            Amadal, I’m with you and Old-Blu. At least we understand togetherness and what it means to Democracy.

          25. Richard Holmes December 7, 2012

            old-blu me good. You jump first.

      3. Richard Holmes December 7, 2012

        Jump off the cliff first. The right will see how big a splat all you socialists make. Then we ill laugh at you.

    2. Samuel Allen December 5, 2012


      1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012


    3. idamag December 5, 2012

      Good morning, Fern, you are so refreshing after reading that lana ward on another rant.

      1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

        She Just Another Racist Troll That Keep Popping Up On All The Web Sites With Nothing But Lies And BS!!

        1. Doctor T December 5, 2012

          Yes, Fern, she is really “out there” — a one woman freak show!

        2. BDC_57 December 5, 2012

          Fern I heard today if the rebuicons dont vote for Obama’s. Deal thay going hurting big time.

          1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

            We Will Unite And Get Rid Of These Old Senile Bastards Come 2014!!

          2. idamag December 7, 2012

            Some of our problems are senile old bastards, but some of them are young tea party subversives who do not owe their loyalty to the people, but to the godfather.

    4. kdisg December 5, 2012

      UN-AMERICAN is the new gop and have lost our votes because who wants people like that wanting medicare gone, instead of fixing he problem like Obama wants in balance, they just want to pad the pockets of big oil and the rich, who are mostly in favor of raising the taxes on them.

      1. Stephen Juliano December 5, 2012

        Without just googling it, tell me, who is John Locke?

        1. kdisg December 5, 2012

          Olympic swimmer

        2. BigTurd December 5, 2012

          Sorry Stephen, while I’m not as educated as ou or kdisg, I googled John Locke, and boy what an educational read that was. I’d suggest everyone here read it.

        3. Brensea December 5, 2012

          Who cares?

        4. myfanwy December 6, 2012

          An 18th century liberal philosopher.

    5. gahoof December 5, 2012

      I don’t think they even realize that they’re lying. They really believe that they are right. That’s what’s so freakin’ scary!

    6. Plznnn December 5, 2012

      Strange that you would call the Party that offered Obama the exact same offer that Obama said he wanted last year, Liars isn’t it Fern?? You do the math, Boehner has offered revenue increases MUCH more from closing tax loopholes than the 8 days worht of money from taxing the “so-called” wealthy. Just who will be held hostage when the middle-class gets stiffed by the huge tax increases they will get when we go over the cliff? BO and the Dems have already said that they “PREFER” going off the cliff! Huh???

      1. myfanwy December 6, 2012

        Unfortunately one can’t do math without knowing some important little details like which loopholes, how many such loopholes must be closed in order to come up with the requisite amount of revenue, who will be affected by said loophole closing, and what effect this loophole closing will have on the rest of the economy. Mr. Boehner has chosen not to describe this plan (these are the same tactics Romney and Ryan employed as they tried to sell the American people the same pig in a poke). Only an idiot would agree to bargain under such circumstances, and Obama’s team is not lacking intellect, both qualitative and quantitative.

      2. idamag December 7, 2012

        Plznn, saying that Boehner’s offer adds more revenue sounds good, but you don’t see any numbers in his proposal that will work.

    7. Richard Holmes December 7, 2012

      The left are true liars. lying is the only thing they know. They will follow a fool into hell because they are told they really want to.

  6. nobsartist December 5, 2012

    republiCONs are stupid. Thats why the demand should be for a 6% medicare and ss tax on ALL earnings both earned and investment with NO ceiling and a 39% MINIMUM tax on ALL earnings over 1 MILLION.

    Plus, all corporate jet usage MUST be taxed as INCOME with a special 60% tax rate and we need a SPECIAL walmart tax on ANY corporation or individual that transfers pensions into the “pension guarantee fund”.

    After all, how can it be fair for a guy like romney to transfer 100 million in pensions to the “pension guarantee fund” when he is worth over 250 million himself?

    that math dont work.

    1. Kishmir Intuches December 5, 2012

      I think you need to try living in France for a while. Experience the joy of true socialized living. I don’t believe taxing the top 2% higher rates will create any calamity but it’s impossible to tax your way out of excessive spending. It just can’t be done.

      And ‘fair’ is a meaningless way to measure life because the indices are endless: is it fair some are tall, attractive and smart while others are short. ugly and dumb?

      1. old_blu December 5, 2012

        What did you call me?

        We should be closer to fair than we are now that’s for sure, right now we aren’t even close.

      2. nobsartist December 5, 2012

        I think you should study economics and history and occasionally leave the la-la land that you inhabit.

        life is not fair. just look at how stupid republiCONs are.

      3. Dominick Vila December 5, 2012

        Nobody is proposing to replace our socio-economic system with socialism. I did not have the pleasure to visit France, but I lived in England and Spain, and saw first hand the benefits of combining traditional capitalist practices with some social programs. Moreover, we are not proposing tax rates that come even close to those in some European countries.
        Yes, we are not going to solve our fiscal and economic problems by raising taxes. In fact, if that was the only “solution” it would guarantee a sequel to the Great Recession we just left behind. What is being proposed is leaving the tax rates for 98% of Americans and 97% of small businesses the way they are, and changing the tax rate for the top 2% of earners back to Clinton era levels. That proposal also include calls to reduce government spending, including Social Security, MEDICARE, and MEDICAID. I oppose SS and MEDICARE benefit reductions, in part because the benefits that seniors like myself get are covered by FICA contributions rather than general funds, and also because I believe society in industrialized nations benefits from programs/services that allow some of its most vulnerable citizens to live with a modicum of dignity, without becoming a burden to their children.
        Does the GOP really want to cut spending? Explain why the U.S. Navy needs 13 carrier groups when the rest of the world combined, including our allies, have the same number? Why do we need military bases in the USA and overseas that have been rendered obsolete by technology? Why do we insist on wasting trillions in crusades and nation building in a part of the world where people hate our guts? Why do we spend billions in foreign and military aid to countries that are prosperous and don’t need our help? Why don’t we combine government agencies with similar charters to reduce overhead costs and improve efficiency? Why don’t we cut the budgets of ALL Federal departments/agencies by 5% effective immediately? Why don’t we reduce the civil servant/contractor ratio? Why are we willing to spend money we don’t have rebuilding countries we destroyed and refuse to rebuild our own country? Why do we insist on retaining laws that reward outsourcing instead of punishing companies that do so and reward those that invest and create jobs at home? Why did the GOP filibuster the Veteran’s Jobs Act?
        I am not worried about life in France, I am concerned about the inefficiencies and inequality I see right here in the USA.

        1. Lisztman December 5, 2012

          And WHY doesn’t Dominick Vila ask these questions of his Senator and Congressman? (I suspect he already has…) 😉

          1. idamag December 5, 2012

            Lisz, this is how it works in my state. My Republican representative is a pretty decent guy and he answers my letters, whether he agrees with me or not. One of my Republican senators sends this message in answer to any letters I have sent, “Thank you for sharing your thoughts with me, I always want to know what my constituents think. The other Republican senator never bothers to answer any letters. Truth: most of them could give a rat’s a as to what you think. Thier backs were turned on the American people when they bowed down to the big money and gave pledges to the godfather.

        2. idamag December 5, 2012

          I spent some time in Germany. If one of their children gets a serious illness, they don’t have to wonder where to get the money to treat it. They don’t have to choose between medicine and bread.

          1. myfanwy December 6, 2012

            I spent 7 years in the UK. I had both my children there; no money exchanged hands, despite 2 C-sections and hospital stays of 10 and 7 days duration respectively. Pregnant women receive all prescriptions and dental care free, children get their meds free up to the age of 16. I had a midwife check on me weekly for about a month after each of my children was born to help with breastfeeding, colic, check sutures, screen for possible depression and other postpartum issues. My own mom was 4,000 miles away, so I was glad to have someone available to give advice. In the UK doctors make house calls for sick children. The health service manages expenses by investing in prenatal and early childhood care, providing a well-organized support system in community centers, where children get the well-baby checkups, formula is available at discount, nurses and doctors handle immunizations and dispense advice. Mom and toddler playgroups usually meet in the same location as the clinics. Taxes are proportionately high, but when I think of what we would pay for similar care in the US, I think it was well worth it.

        3. Mary Martinez December 5, 2012

          Why did the GOP filibuster the Veteran’s Jobs Act?

          I was wondering if any body has heard the reasons.

          1. old_blu December 6, 2012

            Because the current administration wanted it.

          2. myfanwy December 6, 2012

            Because it was President Obama’s idea.

        4. myfanwy December 6, 2012

          Social Security is self-funded and is therefore not included in these deliberations. Your post is refreshingly comprehensive and in my humble opinion, right on the money–particularly the last paragraph where you so eloquently express the questions many of us would like to ask our representatives. Thank you.

      4. Doctor T December 5, 2012

        Would you be referring to McConnell ? short, dumb, and very ugly!

        1. idamag December 5, 2012

          Turtle comes to mind.

    2. Dominick Vila December 5, 2012

      Expensive dancing horses should not qualified as a deduction because of therapeutic considerations. Riding horses does help people afflicted by some debilitating illnesess, but do they really need a $50K horse, housed in a lavish stable far away from home, and cared for by full time groomers and trainers?
      Yes, the tax code needs to be changed, but since that worthy goal will take six months to a year to accomplish, partly because of opposition from special interests, it should be a mandatory part of the compromise – after the tax rate of the top 2% is raised to Clinton era levels. If the GOP is willing to save $200B by “adjusting” the CPI so that seniors don’t get a 2% pay raise on a meager Social Security check, surely they should not have a problem asking the likes of Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Mitt Romney, the Bushes, the Kennedys, and the rest of the elite to pay an extra 3.6% in taxes. Then again, I have the feeling I am giving those whose loyalty is limited to protecting and advancing the interests of their donors, too much credit. Why should we ask a Wall Street broker to cancel a weekend shopping spree in Paris when it is so easy to throw grandma under the bus?

      1. Happy2bback December 5, 2012

        Many of the people you named have said raise my taxes, it’s the Trumps Roves and the like that want to keep their money just as it is. Don’t forget how much money was spent by the Corporations to beat Obama the Koch Brothers sure bet on a loser but they obviously thought that if Mitt won he would back their special interests. Now let’s insure that they have less to spend next election and start collecting the taxes these Corporations tried so disparately to have remain unchanged

      2. kokuakaumanua1 December 5, 2012

        Dominick, you mention ‘special interests’ and I am wondering if folks know that there is a rider that has been attached by Monsanto, to get GMOs into uncontrolled use, and no one to stop them if this bill regarding our fiscal budget which has nothing to do with GMOs (and yet is a rider on this bill) is allowed to go through because of a ‘must vote’ on the taxes.

        Such riders should be outlawed along with lobbying period. But that is another fight. There is a petition going around to get our Senators to vote against this rider being attached to any ‘must vote yes’ type bill right now. Because this is coming up just before the holidays, it is apparently the intent of those in Big Ag to try to get this OK’d because the Senators will be distracted by plans to be with their families, so it is their hope that this part of the bill will be passed over rather than questioned and rejected as part of the vote, because our elected officials will have their minds on things other than their job at the moment.

        Please write to your Senators and ask them to stop Monsanto from attaching this rider! Senator Inouye from Hawaii is apparently in favor of GMOs being given total access to our food supply and yet he comes from a State (Hawaii) who’s motto is ‘The life of the land is preserved in rightceousness’ ( u’a ma’u ke i’a o ka a’ina i ka pono) How rightceous is it to mess with Mother Nature?

    3. CYNICALZ December 5, 2012

      No, it “dont work”. Don’t forget to tax the two out houses. They are the libraries for visiting democrats.

      1. nobsartist December 5, 2012

        Gu Huh

        1. CYNICALZ December 5, 2012

          nobartist- ?

    4. Stephen Juliano December 5, 2012

      The rich would just leave the country and revenues would significantly decrease. Great Idea!

      1. johninPCFL December 5, 2012

        Sure, just like they did in the 1940s when top rates were 90%. Oh, wait, they didn’t.

        Maybe I was thinking of the 1950s during Ikes term when the top rates were over 75%. Oh, wait, they didn’t leave then either…

        Maybe after Reagan raised taxes for the 13th time…nope.

        Maybe after GHWB raised taxes…nope.

        How about after Clinton raised taxes…nope.

        Come to think of it, they always THREATEN to leave, but then figure out that this is a better place than the rest of the world. Then, they stay.

  7. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

    The only “numbers” that don’t add up are the presidents’….formed a “jobs council” he never met with; record high unemployment for 4 years; Never worked in private sector, so no possible knowledge of job creation; costs American taxpayers $188,000 per hour to fly around globe with staff, jets, fuel, etc; more than 4 inaugural balls at same time while he advises citizens to “do with less.”?????

    1. Eric Tovar December 5, 2012

      Get a life weirdo

      1. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

        I notice you never disputed the facts outlined. WHY?

        1. Independent1 December 5, 2012

          Because the be quite honest, all your supposed facts are meaningless; virtually every argument you’re making isn’t even worth responding to from someone who has one shred of common sense.

        2. Independent1 December 5, 2012

          And have you noticed, that in all the times I’ve viewed your meaningless comments over the past weeks, very rarely have I ever seen even 1 person give your comments a LIKE; doesn’t that tell you something???

          1. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

            Still changing the subject, instead of addressing the facts. Of course, most liberals like yourself are never going to agree with “another” point of view, especially from what you consider to be the opposition. No matter, the chips will fall where they are headed. Naturally, when liberal “ideas” go astray, it wlll seem logical to you to blame someone else. Just like a psychotic, it’s not you who is at fault, it’s the “world.”

          2. neece00 December 5, 2012

            What about the shoe on the other foot, have you ever stopped to listen and actually think about the facts on the other side (and try to do this without the influence of Fox, Rush, Trump, Rove, O’Reilly or Beck).

          3. Lisztman December 5, 2012

            Ok, mct: I’ll answer your questions.

            “A “jobs council” with which he never met…” The government, or any agency, or corporation, etc., has all KINDS of “councils”, “work groups”, and the like. That doesn’t mean the CEO runs around supervising and/or meeting with each and every. That’s why s/he also hires competent managers.

            “Record high unemployment for 4 years.” Still beating that drum, eh? Like it or not, Mr. Obama inherited a disastrous marketplace that STARTED in 2008 (I recall that, at the time, there was a different President). His attempts to bring this under control have, for years, especially the last two, been met with the most extreme opposition from the right — Senate filibusters and absolutely outrageous performance (or, actually, lack of same) by the House.
            The unemployment rate has been on a too-slow but steady decline since he took office. Unfortunately many of the factors that drive the unemployment rate were already in place — most notably the migration of manufacturing jobs to overseas cheap labor (not to mention no health or retirement, lax environmental control, questionable infrastructure (see fire in Bangladesh, e.g.).
            Until the underpinnings of corporate activity are adjusted to encourage American activity for American corporations and discourage the outsourcing of jobs, there is little the President can do. This requires changes to the tax code — and I can virtually guarantee that any such activity will stay bottled in the House for at least the next two years.

            “Never worked in the private sector, so no knowledge of job creation.” IOW — all those lawyers in Congress know more? Listen to what you’re saying — lawyers don’t know.
            Now let me tell you that I’m an engineer. I have NO desire to be a manager because actually DOING same? I’m lousy at it. Unless it’s “my” project — in which case I’m outstanding. But I recognize good management when I see it. I understand basic economics — probably more than yourself.
            One does NOT need to be an expert in a field to understand its principles — or to make astute judgments upon appropriate consultation with advisors who ARE schooled (and experienced) in the details.

            “188K/hr to fly around the globe…”
            I did the math (obviously you didn’t — you see a “big” number like that…)
            If the President and his entourage spend 8 hours per week in the air, EVERY week (all 52) of the year — that adds up to $78.3 million PER YEAR. Kind of a minute number for Washington, isn’t it?
            In the meantime — do you think Netanyahu flies to the US for free? Does Vladimir Putin visit the UN on, what, expenses paid by India?
            Leaders go places to meet, face to face, to discuss issues. Meetings are actually SCHEDULED to occur on a “tour” (as Romney did, e.g., to England, Israel, Poland) to ameliorate the tolls upon time and expense.
            And, like it or not (I know you don’t) — Mr. Obama is OUR President — and has that responsibility to work out issues of international interest. So, yes, he will make periodic trips abroad. And, unless you’re proposing that he fund these himself (???), how is it that you propose that he change the system to reduce that cost?

            Inaugural balls are NOT underwritten by your taxes, or by mine. They are funded by private (or semi-private) sources. They’re held every four years regardless of who was elected.

            MCT, you’re tilting at windmills. Grow a set. If you have some genuine ideas toward reducing significant (which I’ll define for you as greater than 0.1% increments) reductions in spending or significant increases in revenue, we’ll all listen.
            In the meantime, I’ve now just wasted 15 minutes trying to get you to shut up. Now please shut up.

          4. old_blu December 5, 2012

            Ahh, it wasn’t a waste I enjoyed it very much.

            Thanks for the morning smile.

          5. idamag December 5, 2012

            Me, too.

          6. idamag December 5, 2012

            I am not a liberal, nor am I a conservative. I feel like James Madison and George Washington did about political parties. They divide and cause chaos. However, when it comes to facts, you have a bit of dogma that you thinks is facts and anyone who has a different opinion is psychotic. Not being a partisan, I feel that the Democratic party is more American. When Bush got elected, I did not see a bunch of subversives trying to secede. I didn’t see a congress that refused to work with him. At that time, it wasn’t considered virtuous to be ignorant.

            You betcha, a pit bull with lipstick is still a pitbull.

          7. Sand_Cat December 6, 2012

            When there are some facts, they’ll be addressed.

    2. John Sehler December 5, 2012

      Look up the cost of your boy Bush who holds the Record for vacations taken by any sitting President and I can assure you he didn’t stay in Washington.

      1. Independent1 December 5, 2012

        Yeah John! I’m so tired of hearing these mentally incompetent Republicans spouting out endlessly about Obama playing golf, or going on a vacation. Knowing full well that none of them ever made such comments, when Bush was flying to Texas almost every other week to spend time on his Ranch, taking well over 200 days vacation his first term; and even Reagan flying several times a year to his ranch in Calif where he took close to 200 days vacation during both his terms; and even Bush Sr. who was running up to Kennebunkport almost evry week to spend time there taking well over 150 days off. I’m not certain of Obama’s total vacation days to this point but as of the end of his first 3yrs in office he had taken 88 days vacation; far less time than any of these GOP presidents that are directly responsible for morel than 90% of the country’s 16 trillion in debt. It’s like suddenly Republicans have become totally ingnorant with respect to how being the president works; and apparently expect that he’s suppose to have a ball and chain tied to his desk and isn’t suppose to take any time off; despite the fact that he probably works harder in one week than the majority work in a year and think that they deserve 4-5 weeks vacation each year themselves.

    3. Joshua December 5, 2012

      What in the dickens are you talking about/ You seem to be repeating all of the complaints that the republicans used during the election, but I got a news flash for you……they and you LOST!!!!. Why are you complaining about the POTUS never having worked in a public sector for. Is this something that has a point or do you just hate the POTUS and have no other way to say it. What other secured way would you have the POTUS travel you idiot. Its been done this way for years and for a reason. The POTUS won the election because we did not want your rhetoric or your fake solutions. No solutions but division of the American people and we saw right thru your lies and elected the POTUS with overwhelming numbers so give it a rest and try helping to solve problems for the country that you SAY you love so much.

      1. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

        Sorry I was unclear…..my point is, we are asking a man who never held a job in private sector to help CREATE JOBS in our very weak economy. This is like asking a man or woman who has never cooked to go into the kitchen and create a banquet for thousands (or in this case millions)….what are the chances for success????

        1. old_blu December 5, 2012

          It’s too late he is in there he won so we have to make it work, also I don’t think the country should be ran as a business, the large busineeses of today don’t care about the people, (ie. Wallmart) and America has to have some compassion.

          The business man got voted out, the people have spoken.

          1. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

            Liberals may try to demonize firms like WalMart, but fact is they employ MILLIONS of US workers….would you rather have a moderate-paying job, OR no job??? WalMart not only offers jobs to American workers, but real economical products and prices to many millions of families who can’t afford the big brands & big prices! Of course, I’m sure liberals would rather act like the Union representing the Hostess workers….strike and LOSE ALL 18,500 JOBS. Makes lots of sense doesn’t it?????

          2. neece00 December 5, 2012

            But you and I pay the healthcare for the employees of Walmart, have you stopped to think about that?

          3. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

            Why should we be worrying about paying the healthcare bills for Wal Mart, when we will be paying the health care bills for 50% of Americans shortly???

          4. neece00 December 5, 2012

            No you have that wrong, we are paying the healthcare for every person who does not have healthcare even though they or their company has the ability to provide it. In a few months these people or companies who have the ability to obtain or provide it but choose not too, will be forced to step up to the plate and do what is right. Which is what the rest of the country does when we provide an inurance card at the time of the visit.

          5. Independent1 December 5, 2012

            No No, see you’re too stupid to understand the facts; we’ve been paying the medical bills of millions of American’s ever since Reagan signed that bill that said hospitals have to treat anyone who comes to the ER even if it’s not an emergency and is something that could be treated tomorrow in a doctor’s office. This has allowed 40 million plus American’s to choose not to buy insurance, millions who could well afford to do so. Fully implementing Obamacare is going to fix that when everyone is required to have insurance starting in 2014. But then, then that concept is too complex for simpletons like yourself.

          6. idamag December 5, 2012

            Ind, don’t confuse middleclass with facts. His mind is made up. He wouldn’t even try to process the fact that $800 out of every $2500 you pay in medical costs goes to pay for those who don’t or won’t.

            An emergency room visit at the cost of $5000 also is paid by you and me.

          7. idamag December 5, 2012

            We also pay for thier food stamps.

          8. Independent1 December 5, 2012

            Walmart is the most corrupt/evil corporation on the planet. It deliberately does everything it can to stuff more m illions into the pockets of Sam’s heirs that already have more money than the 100 million lower income Americans. It deliberately manipulates the working hours of more than 90% of its workers so they are not qualified to receive full-time pay and benefits; making the average income of those workers $15,600 per year; a large numer of whom are single parent working mothers who forced to live just above the poverty level; And it maintains warehouse facilities in Calif, that work it’s staffs just about like slave labor; with minimum wage incomes , long hours and high production demads. On top of that, it negotiates with foreign countries to build a lot of the products it sells knowing full well that the majority of these products are being made by child labor working in slave labor conditions. And on top of that; despite it’s already humogous size, it continues it’s unrelenting expansion knowing full well that when it penetrates a new market that it’s only focus is to drive all it’s competition out of business. Walmart has absolutely now redeeming qualities; it is a monster that needs to be eradicated. And fortunately, there’s light at the end of the tunnel. With the help of American consumers and the internet, Walmart is starting to see it’s business share dwindle as consumers like myself realize that we can purchase many of the goods Walmart sells on line, cheaper even than Walmart’s prices and get them in our homes almost the next day; which certainly beats going into the den of the Devil.

          9. old_blu December 5, 2012

            They can afford to do better but they choose not to.

            Hostess was the same it has been going bankrupt for years, yet the CEO still gets his big cut even after the employees took a 8% hit to try and keep Twinkie alive, and no one puts Twinkies in their lunch anymore.

          10. middleclasstaxpayer December 5, 2012

            Bankruptcy is NOT chosen because of frivilous notions…it is created when income does NOT cover expenses…in Bankruptcy, everyone loses, even the CEO….there is NO big payout when a firm closes in bankruptcy. This was caused by unrealistic Union demands, similar to the unionization attempts in NYC, where unions DEMANDED a more than 100% increase in hourly pay for fast-food workers. What do you think would happen if EVERYONE expected to be paid more than twice what they were currently being paid??? If you’re a liberal I suppose this makes sense, but for everyone else it’s madness.

          11. old_blu December 5, 2012

            Oh now we really disagree cuz bankrupt is just the rich man’s welfare, look at how many times that loud mouth Donald Dump has filed bankrupt, and how Robme wanted the auto industry to file and then regroup. (someone pays for that, us)

          12. idamag December 6, 2012

            Old Blu, did you notice they gave out obcene bonuses before they stiffed their creditors.

          13. idamag December 5, 2012

            And middleclass is crying, “Waaaaa, you didn’t let me win.”

        2. idamag December 5, 2012

          I should think being a college professor is a job in the private sector.

        3. Lisztman December 5, 2012

          The direct answer — if he’s good at figuring out who does what, what the pecking order is, asking the right questions, and analyzing the data, he’ll probably do a damn good job of it. He’s not the line worker. He’s the CEO.
          And, BTW — he has held as much of a private-sector job (as a lawyer) as any other lawyer in Washington — and there’s a damn large pile of ’em in Congress (“your” side of the aisle included).

    4. old_blu December 5, 2012

      The elections over, (you lost get over it) you can’t change my mind who to vote for.

    5. idamag December 5, 2012

      mct, in 2009, unemployment was 9.3 percent. It is not 7.8. It should be better and could have been better with cooporation.

  8. John Sehler December 5, 2012

    A math lesson to the GOP Is like selling Ice to the Eskimos It just gives them more mumbers to play with. We need to make them walk the “Plank, ” something they can’t play with.

  9. John Sehler December 5, 2012

    Don’t confuse the Repubes with Facts, their mind is made up. They want to make the rich people richer and the poor people slaves.

  10. kajfla December 5, 2012

    As the majority in Congress do not feel the need to do the job that the electorate sent them to Washington to do, maybe a pay-cut is in order for all, there would be a significant cost saving in that, not to mention discontinuing benefits for life once they leave Congress. Why do they get rewarded for doing lousy jobs, when the rest of us find ourselves out of work or demoted if we failed to do the jobs that we were hired to do, and when we leave a company, we are forced to go without benefits, or pay on our own with COBRA. Why should Congress be any different

    1. ribbet124 December 5, 2012

      Totally agree, should be up to voters when and if they get a pay raise, and what benefits they recieve. term limits on the good old boys, would correct many of the problems we see today. if they can not do right by the country and the american people …….FIRE THEM

  11. Joshua December 5, 2012

    Because ignorance begets more ignorance. Its not worth responding to. We have more issues to deal with then to sit around and continue the same rhetoric that was used before and during the election. The POTUS is who we wanted and thats who we got. Sorry you are such a sore loser and yet you call yourself American!. Why don’t you move to Iraq or iran where they always fight if the lose an election or cannot get their way.

    1. idamag December 5, 2012

      Josh, my mantra has been, “Greed and ignorance are the two greatest sins and greed feeds off ignorance.

      1. neece00 December 5, 2012

        Very well said!

  12. Debbie Kiesel-Ryan December 5, 2012

    Another con game from Boehner. He doesn’t understand we didn’t believe what came out of Mitt’s mouth about not cutting Medicare or Medicaide and now the truth comes out. That is why the President was reelected, we just don’t believe anything the republicans say!!!!!!

    1. Doctor T December 5, 2012

      That’s because what they say are outright lies.

  13. Kishmir Intuches December 5, 2012

    You don’t need to do drastic surgery on Medicare to simply means test it. Same with Social Security. If two of the three biggest drags on the budget can be means tested why not do it? The way they’re reducing benefits, prolonging eligibility and probably eliminate COLA it’s no longer the FDR version of Social Security. With continued swipes at physician reimbursement it won’t be LBJ’s Medicare because doctors will stop participating. The least painful attempt to attack the two programs is by means testing. If Democrats won’t make any attempt at reducing spending then I would agree with Republicans because you just can’t simply tax your way out of this. And Obama knows it that’s why he’s proposing an additional stimulus package and asking for a permanent rise in the debt ceiling without Congressional approval. Our government is simply addicted to spending. It’s unsustainable. You’ll wind up being given subsistence wages by your employer while the majority of your paycheck will go to pay for government spending.

    Reality check: If Bill Clinton were president he would not take the tact that Obama is taking. He would meet Republicans halfway and raise taxes on top earners but he would also cut spending. He did it before and wound up with a budget surplus. Obama’s approach is not the only one available, it’s just the only one Obama is considering because he’s deluded into believing his reelection means coronation.

    1. idamag December 5, 2012

      Kish, you need to do a lttile more studying. The subversive tea baggers have refused to meet the president halfway. Social Security is not coming out of the budget. It is funded until the year 2034. It has been borrowed from to finance wars. That money should be paid back. Gutting social security to avoid paying the money back is like you destroying your bank to avoid paying your mortgage. Obama cares a lot more about the common folk than the tea baggers.

  14. alsoavietnamvet December 5, 2012

    Bobby Jindal said the Republicans need to stop being the stupid party; they’re not listening!! George Bush introduced the tax cuts to the rich so the economy would be bolstered by “trickle down” economics; job creation from the rich. Where are those jobs? Where is the trickle down effect? Everyone (EXCEPT the Republicans) can see that IT DID NOT work!! Yet, they still insist on retaining the Bush tax cuts for the rich. I think Bobby Jindal gave his party the wrong message; the Republicans need to stop being the CRAZY party!!

    1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

      Let Me Tell You Where The Jobs Are The Trickle Down Effect Created They Are In China India And Where Ever They Can Find The Cheap Labor And The Sweatshops!!! Then They Hide And Invest The Profits In The Cayman Islands!!! That Goes To Show You They Give Less Than A Damn About America Or The American People!!!

      1. neece00 December 5, 2012

        Tom Coburn was asked this morning on Morning Jo, why is it that the republican party is now putting the needs of the country and the American people second to winning or losing in a debate. He couldn’t answer the question.

        1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

          Plus The Fact That Their (GOP/Tea Party Are Just A Bunch Of Traitors, Racist And Terrorists To America And The American People!!!

          1. neece00 December 5, 2012

            You’re right Fern, and we are supposed to buy all the trash.

      2. idamag December 5, 2012

        Fern, China uses prisoners, free of charge and India uses slave labor. And the wingnuts say that we asked for wages that were too high. Could we live in this country on 83 cents an hour?

        1. Fern Woodfork December 5, 2012

          You Better Know What They Really Want To Turn This Country Into Just Another Third World Country!! Full Of Sweatshops Where Everybody Will Be Working For 2 Dollars An Hour And The Rich Rein Over All The Peasants!!! 🙁 We’re Not Going To Let That Happen!!!!!!!

  15. Dominick Vila December 5, 2012

    Republicans are not stupid, they are irresponsible and loyal only to their donors. Suggesting that $800B in additional revenues by revising the tax cuts and eliminating deductions and loopholes not only falls short of the $1.3T in additional revenues gained by raising the tax rate for the top 2%, it is also impossible to do in 3 weeks. Modifying the tax cuts is a worthy endeavor that deserves to be done – in addition to raising the tax rate for the wealthy – but that will take anywhere from 6 months to a year to accomplish. Part of the compromise should include a promise that the tax code will be modified before FY14.
    Promising an additional $600B in savings without offering specifics is classic Republican campaign strategy. Unfortunately for them, the time for pie in the sky panaceas is over.
    The worst part of their proposal is their promise to save $200B by “adjusting” the Consumer Price Index. The CPI is used, among other things, to determine whether or not seniors will get an annual raise in their Social Security payments to keep up with inflation. The hypocrisy of those who claim class warfare when someone suggests raising the tax rate their benefactors pay, and don’t hesitate to deny people trying to survive on $900 a month a raise exemplifies the difference between Republican and Democratic values like nothing else would.
    Incredibly, millions of Americans who will be adversely affected by the proposed GOP panaceas, support the GOP agenda, against their best interests, ostensibly because of ideological leanings, ignorance, or reasons that should not be part of our decision making process.

    1. alsoavietnamvet December 5, 2012

      The Republicans keep insisting that the President cut spending. I think the first spending cut should be the medical coverage for members of Congress (and their dependents); let them pay for their coverage!! Or, let them pay a 20% co-pay, like most citizens (who are fortunate enough to HAVE medical insurance) have to pay.

      1. idamag December 5, 2012

        Damn straight!

    2. Doctor T December 5, 2012

      Wasn’t Boehner mockingly chastising the President last week by saying his offer wasn’t “serious”? Funny how his pals’ offer smacks of just that, right?

  16. Fran Perry December 5, 2012

    I love coming on here to hear people that are very intelligent people…that are good people that care about the middle class and the poor…it is such a relief..I am going to let our President know..to let’s go over the cliff…that I will join him…it is enough..that when you see how the republicans don’t know their math or arithmetic…and how ignorant they are …I say…have the taxpayers stop paying for the payments on their homes..and stop giving them spending monies to go on vacations and espensive trips…or let’s just suggest cutting their salaries…in the Congress and the House and the Senate..and take all that money and help the middle class get health insurance and to help the programs with that money they are using from the people that are paying into social security..and working hard for a living…we know that the middle class pays more of pay-roll taxes than the rich do…just sitting there making their investments and not earn a living by the sweat of their brows…I cannot tolerate the Speaker of The House, Boehner…at all with those pretty ties he wears..he uses body language to try to manipulate and control others to do his will..it isn’t about him in the first place..it is the will of the American people and their needs and it was the vocie of America that was heard on election day…I cannot stand to think..what would happen if he heard they were going to cut his pay-check in half..and to have the taxpers monies stop making those payments on his home and to cut his spending money in half..and that they were going to take that money and put into the programs for the poor…I would say…that he needs to realize that one of these days..he just might now be the Speaker Of The House any more..I am going to be praying for that day…so, again, Fern…and others on here it is such a comfort to hear everything you have to say..

  17. William Deutschlander December 5, 2012

    The ignorant Republican Cartel is on their way to joining other fossils, extinct!

  18. raymond December 5, 2012

    Time to get rid of this bunch of whinners, they do not care about the poor and middle class in this nation. The poor and middle class is the ones that has made them wealthy. Now they want the middle classs to pay there share of taxes. Boehner needs to go along with all his repubs that support him. Especially Cantor.

  19. Jim Johnson December 5, 2012

    Yes, they should start talking about some real numbers…
    We should increase the rates on the most wealthy AND reform the tax code to eliminate loopholes and cap deductions so we can get the spoiled 1% to pay more for their hijacking of the American dream.

    And, seriously, these “job creators” need to stop whining and complaining about Obama, creeping Socialism, liberals, muslims, ACORN, takers, moochers and other figments of their money-loving imagination and get back to work and rebuilding a decent future. Most of them are wallowing in piles of cash, record profits, huge bonuses and foolish SuperPAC donations, but they are mostly just sitting on their hands, complaining about Obama and the Democrats and crying about paying too much to our great country.

    The Republican grift has been exposed — get over it!

    1. Doctor T December 5, 2012

      The Fat Cats have been spoiled for the last 10years and now it’s like taking candy from a baby.

  20. Rvn_sgt6768 December 5, 2012

    First off, Republicans are unable to do the basic anything. Secondly it is unwise and impossible to do a deal with them as past history has shown. If they pass any legislation they then do not fund it and the next cycle start the repeal process when the only thing wrong with the bill is their participation. Look how long they have tried to kill Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and how many anti-abortion bills they vote on. Their obsession is what haunts America. Even when the SCOTUS affirms an issue they just look for a different way to undermine it. They are truly EVIL and should be considered as such when confronting them.

  21. Colleen Klemp December 5, 2012

    What makes the rich elite so special? Why do they get a break & not have to pay Medicare taxes after the magic number of $110,000? Everyone else has to pay Medicare taxes on all of their earnings? The answer is that the special elite are the ones writting the rules. i.e. I don’t have to play by the rules because I make up the rules as we go along.

  22. 426tt_64 December 5, 2012

    The Koch- Norquest- Teapublicans are the shame of the USA. This group is not for representing the USA they are strictly for the wealthy/corporations. They want to betray the Contract that the USA Government has made with it’s citizens, Social Security. As we began are working days/years, we entered a contract with our Government, that contract said we the government will take money from you and your employer every paycheck during the years that you work, in exchange your Government will put it into an Interest Bearing Account that you can begin to draw on, when you are either 62 or 65 years old until death. Also almost the same contract was set up called Medicare and the Government took money from us and our employer and put it into and Interest Bearing Account for us to begin to use at age 65, however we and the Government agreed that we would continue to put money into this account until we died also.

    These two contracts, are the target of this KNTParty group. They have spent the USA into a huge hole (16 trillion dollars) with their tax breaks/welfare for the wealthy/corporations. Any Jackass knows that the USA can not eliminate this debt with out a strong middle class and upper class Tax Base. We the people did not cause this debt, the congress past and present caused it and now want to make the poor, the seniors and middle class to pay their debt off, while the Wealthy/corporation get wealthyer.

    To President Obama and those in congress that are there to help the Citizens of the USA, do not break these two Contracts. Reinforce them so those citizens that are working today and tomorrow will have the same quality of life that we seniors have today.

  23. Olstakobo December 5, 2012

    What is new, they expect President Obama to take the blame for the economic stagnation in America, while Boehner and his chaperons do nothing but play games at the expense of the people.

    Speaker Boehner and his men are still enclosed in their Republican shady bubble. Deceitfully, they claimed to see the rest of the world from there. They must know that their Hitler mentality or the time for gerrymandering politics are things of the past in our modern history.

  24. kdisg December 5, 2012

    Hey Fern: listening to the Tea Party is like watching a FOX make it all as they go along news reporter and trusting them. Because we know almost every story is made up especially when the name OBAMA is in it, fact checking the stories as I have shown a consistant bullsh_t story coming from everyone in that newsroom, GEE I wonder what it could be that made them HATE him even before he ever took office. hmmmm

    1. idamag December 5, 2012

      What I remember about the brilliant reporters on faux news is when that dippy blond called Chris Christie while he was on the coast with his people and asked him if he was going to give equal time to Romney, after Obama did the presidential thing and went to New Jersey. Chris Christie’s response should go down in history as a classic answer to an airhead, “I don’t give a damn about presidential politics, I have 141 million people without power.”

      1. kdisg December 5, 2012

        Idamag: I think Christie was perfect during that situation. I also think he showed alot of CLASS treating Obama like we have always treated the president of the us and leader of the free world which the republicans have forgotten because they treat himm as if he was just a next dorr shmo. Forgetting he is a harvard laww grad, summa, and awarded the law review which is why the gop hates him even more, because the truth is Obama is and has been smarter then them. ALOT!!! lol BUT Christie is one of the onlyrepublicans I would even listen to anymore because the gop is UN-AMERICAN NOW. Just look at what they voted NO to this year alone. thats not people working for us. seems like they think of us like a 47% would!!!!

        1. old_blu December 5, 2012

          You are absolutely right he did a fantastic job, I think he would make a good Democrat, and if Rush and Fox News keeps throwing him under the bus he just might be.

    2. Stella53 December 5, 2012

      Hee-hee. I’m still trying to figure that one out – NOT!

  25. Jim Bull December 5, 2012

    once again it has become obvious that the republican party only cares about grabbing power and imposing their views on an American public that does not agree with their proposals. If there is no meeting of the minds I hope the people of this country understand who deserves the blame.

  26. karinursula December 5, 2012

    Lets see, how many days did congress work this year? They receiving their salary, probably the best healthcare, also they must have scores of paid vacation time and they don’t want me to have medicare. If 53% of the American people believe that it would be the GOP fault if we go over the cliff, why on earth did they vote for these yahoos?

    1. Robin O'Brien December 5, 2012

      Many of the ‘yahoos’ weren’t on the ballot this election. Believe me if they don’t resolve the ‘fiscal cliff issue’ soon they WILL all be voted out of office come 2014!

    2. johninPCFL December 5, 2012

      They just posted the House calendar for next year. 126 working days for $174,000 in pay.

      1. Stella53 December 5, 2012

        Wow. How disgusting.

      2. idamag December 5, 2012

        John, that might be an avenue to cut expenditures, pay them by the hour and require they punch a time clock.

  27. Michael Ross December 5, 2012

    Once again the G.O.P. is banking everything on Americans being stupid. This is the exact same crap Mitt Romney tried to pull on us and failed, and yet here they are trying to pull it again not even one month after Romney’s defeat.

  28. Samuel December 5, 2012

    Republicans want to go back to slavery in Washington, and build a nation on the back of the poor. There is no other explaination for their actions against unions, teachers, education as a whole,public employment, federal work, protecting the rich, forgeting about the elderly. They have an rediculous moral understanding about how to run a nation. This is a great nation of all kind of people. Republicans standard for Christianity does not add up with the bible in many ways . Further more his name is President Obama not Pastor Obama. He is the Prisident for all the people not just the people in your club . President Obama has a plan that you dont want to see come to past because of your jealousy and insecurity because of him being who he is as a black man,anybody with eyes can see that, its a shame that Washington Republicans will destroy the nation because of this one fact. I have never all my life seen such mess in Washington mainly on the right as I do now, May God have mercy on us all.

    1. Progressive Patriot December 5, 2012

      Amen Brother!

    2. Stella53 December 5, 2012

      Well stated. So true. If they (the GOP) were honest with themselves, they would have no choice but to admit their bigotry. That is the root behind this mess – bigotry.

  29. howa4x December 5, 2012

    Paul Krugman, our noble prize winning economist, was on New Hour last night and once again stated that the defict is not a problem in the short term and a stimulas is far more important. The tax cut to the middle class will boost the economy since they spend it. The 2% don’t spend it they invest. He also said they could carve out the middleclass tax cut as well as extend the unemployment insurance program now, and deal with the upper 2% later. The drastic cuts the republicans want will kill the recovery and plunge us back into recession. Changing the medicare eligability age from 65-67 won’t save much money since the real health problems and costs start later.He also said that Obama care will bend the cost curve in health care, and calls for cuts in medicare/caid.

    The reality is we need to fix our infastructure and nation build here. The institue of medicine did a long term study and found 700 billion of waste, fraud and abuse in the Health care system. So this can be cut with out hurting patient care so liberals have to be resonable also. We have an overblown defense budget with no real enemy. Giant cost over runs on procurments are common, and do we really need a new generation for fighter jets at a cost of 1 billion/plane, to fight who? Once we leave Afganistan, we can draw down the DOD budget. Future conflicts really only call for drones and special forces, not a giant land based army. To the contrary of Republican myths we are not going to fight China or Russia since they are our trading partners and buy our debt.
    My son was in the navy on a ship stationed in Japan. When the ship was in dock it cost 2 million/day.That is where the money goes.
    We really have to think about whether our strength depends on a giant defense that spends more than every country in the world put together, or do we want to spend it at home prorecting our food supply, creating energy independence from petro-dictatorships, investing in the health of our population, and having a 21’st century transportation within a green ecomony and energy grid
    This is what the conversation should be about

    1. idamag December 5, 2012

      The deficit is caused by a lack of revenue. Give a man a job and he will help pay down the deficit.

      1. howa4x December 5, 2012

        You are watching way too much Fox news. The majority of the current deficit was caused by Bush II. He was handed a surplus by Clinton and proceeded to start 2 unfunded wars that were the longest in US history, which we borrowed the money from China for, tax cuts for the wealthy, whose wealth rose 256% costing 1 trillion dollars, also borrowed and an unfunded drug program for seniors also unfunded. When bush left office he had an 8 trillion dollar deficit. Then the economy crashed , and he handed the TARP program, 700 billion to Obama to administer. Part of the defict that Obama was tagged for was the unfunded wars. One he closed out one and the on the other is ongoing at a cost of 1 billion/day. His contribution was small and involved the stimulas to save the economy from depression and the inability of anyone in DC to get a balanced budget.So the defict is not made by poor people but rich ones that don’t need the money. Now you can go back inside your Fox bubble

        1. idamag December 5, 2012

          How, I don’t understand. I don’t watch faux news. I do realize that the deficit was inherited. Two wars, one an unprecidented attack on a country using lies, and big tax cuts increased spending without increasing revenue.

          1. howa4x December 6, 2012

            Sorry I misunderstood you

          2. idamag December 7, 2012

            how, that’s okay. I have a triple-digit I.Q.; therefore I would never waste time on faux news.

  30. Debra Brumm December 5, 2012

    Why raise taxes on anyone this will only help for 8.5 days then what tax them more?? What ever happened to “fair share” maybe the unemployed should go out and work and start paying taxes!! Maybe Obama should be meeting with the congress and see if there is anything they agree on!! This is OBAMA’s economy now not Bush’s any longer it has been 4 years start taking responsibility for what has been happening!! Election is over start being the President not campaigner!! GOP leaders and Democratic leaders all have their issues but they “work” for us and well if you can’t see it yet the President was elected and also the GOP still has the house…seriously quit putting ALL the blame on the GOP –really do you want the Dems to have full access to any amount of money they would desire?? Do we want overwhelmingly debt–as if it isn’t bad enough and NO WAY to pay for it!! Does Obama have any cuts to anything —NO any plan to cut spending –NO he wants to spend more and tax the 2% now then when they are taxed out to the max then where will it end??
    PLEASE ALL Liberals realize this is OBAMA’s economy…and it is his responsibility!!!

    1. Progressive Patriot December 5, 2012

      OK Debra, let’s call it The President’s economy. Now, let him solve it.

      The Right should cooperate for once. He’s done a good job in the face of historic obstructionism to this point. Come along a bit, and watch things get even better.

      The fear is, that if the Repubs. don’t dismantle the New Deal now, they may not get a chance for a very, very long time. I know that you are genuine in your concern for this country. So are we.

      The top 1-2% are going to be just fine. The middle and working classes have sacrficed for the last 30 years. We will continue to contribute in a fair manner. Just look at the charts that show massive profit growth for business, while middle class income has dramatically declined. Now that is real redistribution of wealth.

      The economy is OUR responsibility. Business and the Oligarchs have stolen control of our political system, rewritten the rules, and have reaped the benefits at our expense for the last 30 years, while the American Dream has begun to wither on the vine.

      Don’t worry, we’ll address the deficit, and we’ll all take our fair hit. But we MUST make sure that ALL of our citizens have access to the American Dream, not just those who already have so much at the expense of an historically productive Middle and Working Class.

      1. idamag December 5, 2012

        progressive, the tea party wants to dismantle the government as we know it. Electing presidents, by vote, has been our right. Now, if their choice does not get in, secede. How unAmerican!

        1. Progressive Patriot December 5, 2012

          I know, Idamag. I’m at a loss for words. 🙂

    2. idamag December 5, 2012

      Debra, if you keep informed by reliable sources you will have a better idea of what is real and what is rhetoric. Obama has had many meetings with congress. I heard Mitch McConnell say on the news shortly after President became president, “The Republicans number one goal is to make Obama a one-term president.” On the first day of congress, they set the program to super majority and filibuster. This kept Obama from accomplishing anything. When he put forth stimulus packages, the never made it to the table because of the filibustering. And, yet, sixteen bills on abortion made it to the table. It is okay to starve the babies and children that are already here to save the fetuses.

    3. Elisabeth Gordon December 5, 2012

      Turn off Fox News and take a nap….

    4. Sand_Cat December 5, 2012

      I could be wrong, but I believe unemployment compensation is taxable as income. The unemployed also pay state and local taxes such as sales taxes, and most of them pay Federal gasoline taxes.
      You’re definitely out there claiming Obama is responsible for the slow recovery of the economy when virtually nothing he attempted to address its problems passed as a result of Bush’s friends in the Senate and the House.
      And I’m sure you’re also one of those who voted to assure this wouldn’t change, so why don’t you just crawl back into whatever slimy place you crawled out of.

      1. idamag December 6, 2012

        Sand, and a person who is forced on unemployment circulates the entire amount. They have to as it is not enough to stash in the Cayman Islands. Circulating money creates a healthy economy.

    5. Stella53 December 5, 2012

      Deb, please stop watching Faux News cause it shows. You and the GOP could give a rat’s bhind about “spending.” You didn’t give a darn about it when Bush was “spending” into oblivion. And Bush will get the blame 50 years from now as far as I’m concerned – that’s how bad he messed up! You neo-cons expected Obama to do what no one else would have been able to do and that is fix what Bush messed up on day one of his Presidency. Obama said it may take more than one term to fix Bush’s mess. You should have been listening to the truth instead of the hateful rhetoric of Faux News – unless you’re hateful to begin with.

  31. Fubom December 5, 2012

    If we go off the “fiscal Cliff” the world will not end on Jan. 1. What will happen is that the Bush tax cuts will expire, and we will never have to deal with them again. Even Bush said that those cuts could not be permanent because they would devastate the economy. Let the new congress deal with the problem in the new session. This do less than nothing congress is worthless.

  32. Fubom December 5, 2012

    The fiscal cliff thing is red meat for the media. The cliff does not exist any more than the edge of the world did before Columbus crossed the Atlantic.

  33. William December 5, 2012

    I don’t understand how people can support a party who’s only loyalty is to someone like Grover, the self appointed leader of the Rep Party.

  34. JAYROSE December 5, 2012

    I only get 465,dollars a month . in s.s. 800 dollars that my husband paid in for me before he went to heaven . I think the sen. and congress get paid mim. wages,

  35. idamag December 5, 2012

    President Obama, don’t cave. Let the tax rates expire. I am willing to pay a little more. This is my country.

  36. craig December 5, 2012

    bho has a lot of leverage here, as the electorate is behind him, and the gop is fighting with itself.

  37. montanabill December 5, 2012

    It is quite amazing that Joe Conason is complaining about bad math. He claims Boehner’s math doesn’t add up, but he’s been a cheer leader for increasing taxes on the wealthy, which also clearly don’t add up to any real reduction in the deficits the President is running up. The President now says he wants $1.6 trillion in higher taxes (over 10 years). But folks, that is only $160 billion per year against annual deficits that run to $1 trillion or more. Clearly, there is more than one person in Washington who can’t do math!

    1. Sand_Cat December 5, 2012

      So you support the idiot proposals that will not come even as close as you claim the president will.

      1. montanabill December 6, 2012

        I’m assuming you are referring to limiting deductions. If so, no. I’m in the school that says, let’s consider new revenue when, and only when, there have been enacted significant real cuts to current spending and meaningful entitlement reform. If then we find that new revenue is needed, throw out the current tax code and enact a truly ‘fair share’ code.

    2. Stella53 December 5, 2012

      Really? Then the President should raise taxes for the wealthy even higher! The wealthy need to pay their fair share.

      1. montanabill December 6, 2012

        Your post simply invites questions. Do you know what percentage of income taxes those high income earners (top 5%) pay now? (58.7%) Do you know what percentage of the income high income earners earn? (34.7%)

        Do you know that even if they were taxed 100% it wouldn’t come close to covering the deficit?

        What is their ‘fair share’?

  38. roncaone December 5, 2012

    I wonder what would happen if our Senate and House Reps could add a little better if they knew they were going to lose their entitlements because they are not/have not done their jobs in the last 4 yrs. They have sat on their hands and let Norquist and others work their mouths ignoring what we the people want….would like to dump them all under the bridge for 4 yrs, better yet for 12 yrs they have ignored everything that has been going on…I do not blame GW for staying away from the blood suckers he got his. They need to grow up and take responsibility, they do work for us The People of the USA.

  39. frigate December 5, 2012

    Fiscal Cliff? Fiscal Myth!

  40. Jackmack December 5, 2012

    I wonder if the Republicans went to school for math maybe they need to be retrained

  41. Jim Bullock December 5, 2012

    Boehner and the Republicans will fully exposed themselves as the obstructionists that they have been for the past 4 years. Pres. Obama has the win and the people are behind him.

    1. Progressive Patriot December 5, 2012

      Liked your comment just as much the second time. 🙂

  42. Jim Bullock December 5, 2012

    Boehner and the Republicans will fully exposed themselves as the obstructionists that they have been for the past 4 years. Pres. Obama has the win and the people are behind him.

    1. idamag December 7, 2012

      Jim, you would have thought they learned something from the election about what the people want.

  43. truthhunter13 December 5, 2012

    Trying to keep the tax cuts for the rich is like me trying to convince people that Osama Bin Laden is a Saint. The GOP has lost its common sense. There’s no point in trying to negotiate with them. If they think they’ll bully the president like they did in 2010, they’re in for a big surprise. Do not waver Mr. President. We, the people who care about this country, are with you.

  44. ridemybroom December 5, 2012

    Boehner really looks stupid….i always knew he knew nothing about math…the man couldnt add….multiply….divide if his life depened on it ! what a wuss of a man !

  45. one_veteran December 5, 2012

    GOP works budget numbers like they see poll numbers that made them think they were going to win the election. They use rose collerd glasses. Any numbers the GOP dosen’t like, they just change them to some pre kindergarden math they like.

  46. Sa Janes December 5, 2012

    Returning to Italy after a celebrated visit to his friends and mentors, J.P. Morgan and Prescott Bush, Benito Mussolini began even more radical reforms in Rome. He was now riding upon waves of money, knowing that the common citizen could not fight against such wealth and power–especially if they were somehow kept from being able to unite and bargain collectively. Union busters Morgan and Bush schooled him well in this regard.

    Mussolini’s money knew no morals they wouldn’t corrupt or laws they wouldn’t break in the name of ensuring the country was completely in their grasp. He bankrupted the National Bank by transferring millions of the public’s money to the private sector and closed down many publicly beneficial programs–he and his National Fascist Party were now on the way to creating a powerful wealthy elite with complete control of the government and a servile worker class with few rights of redress or the ability to collectively bargain–the latter being the only way the common citizen could remain on an equal footing with the wealthy industrialists and other of the country’s monied elite.

    Mussolini and his family were dragged through the streets and hung in St. Peter’s Square not long after his party had made it all but impossible for the average citizen to register to vote.

    For nearly a hundred years, US republicans fully believe that a Fascist-like plutocracy is the only way for them to protect their wealth, status and power–‘average Americans’ are just in their way.

    …and they say “It can’t happen here.”

  47. rustacus21 December 5, 2012

    … & as the specific reason each & EVERY time that conservatives are in any majority – state, local, national, executive, judicial, the SAME THING HAPPENS, as the numbers, policies, agencies, processes, ALL go to H#%L! What is of greater intrigue is why there are conservative voters voting for these sorts of irrational illiterates, who obviously can’t count, see, understand or even think in ways remotely ‘NORMAL’? Just curious…

    1. lana ward December 5, 2012

      All the Dems policies have ruined our country, morally and financially

      1. rustacus21 December 5, 2012

        … instead of just throwing out these ‘irrationally’ off-base… words (can’t really call this a ‘comment’ of substance…), please be specific & itemize the THINGS of which U speak, please. Surely, there are at least 2 examples to justify your ‘accusations’… & just to show what a nice guy I am, I’m asking for ONLY 2. I can’t begin to count the ways in which Liberal/Progressives have saved America, but we can start at the beginning w/the Constitution & in the last decade of the 20th century, President Clinton’s splendid performance, rescuing the nation from 12 years of Republican incompetence, division, war & degeneration (morally, economically, civically, institutionally). I included the ‘moral’ dimension as was reflected in the re-emergence of the virtue of sacrifice by American’s, in giving their all to their nation, in a time of desperate need, not w/standing President Clinton’s personal failings, which were his own, not the nation’s, as U woefully confuse the 2…

        1. lana ward December 5, 2012

          Just open your eyes-moral decline and financial decline because of Dem policies. Watch how much worse things will get with 4 more years of Obama

          1. rustacus21 December 6, 2012

            To: Lanaward; we’ve actually been watching… as supply-side, conservative trickle-down economics has actually been the “REAL” declining instrument in the demise of the nation’s overall economic, civic & infrastructure standing. All I’ve seen w/our President is conservatives standing in the way his 1st term & mired in confusion at now, having to actually get to work & do something other than obstruct the progress of the nation’s recovery. & in spite of that reality, President Obama’s administration (it’s not his doing ALONE mind U) has ‘STILL’ been able to make headway, w/2 & 1/2 years of job growth, a booming stock market, the end of 1 & winding down of a 2nd unnecessary ‘conservative’ war & stablized banking & investment sectors, over & above the 2001-2009 period. The ‘decline’ – moral/financial/political, if U’r paying attention, is all happening to your political right, as the T-party/Republicans/conservatives are in free-fall (& eating each other alive, no less!!!) ~ But disagreement w/proven facts are welcome, if U dispute any of the above…

          2. idamag December 7, 2012

            No, no, Lana, you don’t say, “open your eyes” without giving examples of moral decline. Back in the by-gone days when there was supposed to be high morals, terrorist roamed and burned crossed, hung people, refused to let them have basic anmenties and made them walk in the street instead of on the sidewalk. Back in those days, a fourteen year-old boy was beaten to death by four of these terrorists using 2X4s. President Lyndon Johnson sighned the civil rights act to protect people. If you are citing gay marriage as an example of moral decline, gay marriage is less violent and hurts less people than the KKK did. I think if two males or two females had a lasting friendship it wouldn’t bother anyone, but since their mind is on what they are doing in private, the problem is people’s noses in other people’s crotches.

        2. idamag December 7, 2012

          rust, that is what I would like to see Lana do. She threw out a source on another board and it was just another uber right wing blog.

  48. racer_tim December 5, 2012

    Bravo, The repigs haven’t been able to add for years.

    1. lana ward December 5, 2012

      Didn’t Obama say we have 57 states? It’s the Dems that can’t add

      1. idamag December 5, 2012

        lana, in case you didn’t read it on the other board, I did a profile of you. Let me know how close I come.

        1. You are very particular about your appearance and care about your image.
        2, You are also particular about your children and they are well cared for.
        3, You come from a broken home.
        4. One or both of your parents was very rigid and did not allow for dissenting oppinions.
        5. You like a good time.
        6. You either married early and had a child or you had a child without being married.
        7. You went on public assistance and they saw that you got training so you could enter the workforce.
        8. You, too, have been divorced.
        9. You live in a rural community that is solid red.
        10. Many people, in your community, are racist.
        11. If you graduated from high school you were not on the honor society.
        12. If you are in a crowd of educated people, you feel that the conversation is missing you.
        13. You like country music.

        1. lana ward December 6, 2012

          1- I don’t go overboard-ever. 2 -my kids were well taken care . 3- My mom and dad were married 59 years until my dad passed away. 4- My parents, never rigid.Let all 5 of us have our own opinion. 5- A good time is being with my grandkids. 6- I married at 17 and had my first son when 18. 7- I had a part time job, went on assistance for awhile when divorced. 8 Yes. 9- I live in Michigan(hardly red). 10- I don’t know anyone who is a racist, not even my black friends. 11- I graduated with c’s. Most people I know are educated, half are Dems. I like all music- except that rap crap, christian music is the best.

          1. idamag December 7, 2012

            Lana, darn, I really messed it up. I had you pegged for younger and am surprised you have grandchildren. I think I am losing my touch. I really thought you lived in a southern state. As for the community you live in, isn’t it rural? Even Michigan has rural communities.

          2. lana ward December 7, 2012

            I live in Lansing. Born in Lansing. I am young?? Where does the time go? I don’t hate Dems, I just know you are all being mislead by Obama. He does not have the countrys’best interest at heart. All he cares about is himself. Keep watching,see what happens. Time will tell

  49. Downing Gary December 5, 2012

    While we can all say jump over that cliff, what we are missing here is the fact we have a Congress we pay to work with our president and they just walk off the job. John Boehner says we have nothing to vote on so go home. We need to make real changes when they don’t work they don’t get paid. That means all year. They need to work for a wage of about $20.00 a hour, plus of course the travel and houseing they have already got, they also need to be dropped from the best health care in America and put on a regular group health plan for them and their families. When they leave office any pension they are expectiong should all go into SSI as that would be a very nice additive and when they hit 66 or in some cases a later age they could collect it. If they cannot do the job they are put in office for and cannot vote on issuse they need to be removed. We put them in office to work on issues of Americans not the rich or the Corporations. While Wal Mart keeps hireing workers they pay minimum wages, not enough hours for benefits, so all of us,
    THE AMERICAN TAX PAYERS PAY FOR THEIR HEALTH CARE AND FOOD STAMPS. That is correct. AMERICAN TAX PAYERS SPEND OVER 3 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR TO SUBSIDIZE WAL MART EMPLOYESS. So that good deal you just got at that store that saved you about $20.00, just add that to what we have to pay for the welfare for the employees. I don’t want to see them go out of business, but I do want to see them pay a living wage with health care.

  50. Joan December 5, 2012

    If the Republicans want to do away with Medicare and Social Security. First they have to give up their Free Medical program. They need to pay for their own health care. Second, when they leave either the House or the Senate for retirement or voted out, they no longer be allowed to collect their so called pension of a life time of their wages….Their children from now on have to repay all their student loans…Gee, I wonder how much money this will save the country…Mr Obama, needs to put this on the table first. They need to agree to this before any other cuts or concessions are made. Then and only then should they even think about discussing cuts to the medicare and Social Security System. Both the Republicans and the Democrats have had a free ride on the American Public for far to long. Time to do something about this. Voice your opinion to your congressment

  51. daniel bostdorf December 5, 2012

    Montanabill and others who post here with this belief and similar views are absolutely off base and have no idea about what is on te table. The statement is so bizarrely simplistic, we all need to ignore this from montanabill:

    “It is quite amazing that Joe Conason is complaining about bad math. He claims Boehner’s math doesn’t add up, but he’s been a cheer leader for increasing taxes on the wealthy, which also clearly don’t add up to any real reduction in the deficits the President is running up. ”

    This is absolutely false in its belief. This is an illogical of an analysis of the facts. At least it goes past a “bumper sticker” phrase….interestingly….it mimics far right wing neo-fascist-GOP thinking at the Teaparty level.

    The purspose of this article is summed up quite rationally by Conason when he states:

    “Unless and until the Republicans start talking about real numbers that can actually add up, there is nothing to be gained from pretending to negotiate. Nor should the president start negotiating with himself, as he has sometimes done in the past. Instead, he ought to make sure that the opposition understands what will happen when they fail to act responsibly. ”

    This country has endured the McConnel politics of inaction as well as a first time in the history of this country a “default” leading to a downgrade.

    This mess was inherited by Obama from the GOP and it continues to be a mess.
    The GOP collectively is a mess, and the American people have inherited that.

    Go over the fiscal cliff? “go ahead—-make the 47%’s day…”

    The GOP is basically a dead party, and if they FAIL to understand that the American people have had enough of the Rove/Koch/Teaparty neo-fascisim…well…

    There will be an “American Spring” this spring if we go over “the cliff”…and I assure you those of us who are poor and near poor middle class will be in the streets.

    It is time for the American people to rise up against Boehner and the demented GOP.

    GOP…montana bill and friends….You and your Teaparty friends don’t count anymore.

    You lost.

    Here is what you and Rove and your other right wing friends tried to do to the REAL AMERICAN people—-straight out of the fascist propagandists playbook.

    Hitler’s Mein Kampf lays out blueprint of fascist propaganda efforts. 
Hitler writes in chapter VI:

    “Propaganda must always address itself to the broad masses of the people. All propaganda must be presented in a popular form and must fix its intellectual level so as not to be above the heads of the least intellectual of those to whom it is directed. The art of propaganda consists precisely in being able to awaken the imagination of the public through an appeal to their feelings, in finding the appropriate psychological form that will arrest the attention and appeal to the hearts of the national masses. The broad masses of the people are not made up of diplomats or professors of public jurisprudence nor simply of persons who are able to form reasoned judgment in given cases, but a vacillating crowd of human children who are constantly wavering between one idea and another. The great majority of a nation is so feminine in its character and outlook that its thought and conduct are ruled by sentiment rather than by sober reasoning. This sentiment, however, is not complex, but simple and consistent. It is not highly differentiated, but has only the negative and positive notions of love and hatred, right and wrong, truth and falsehood.”

    The American people saw through the GOP and the propaganda that was in the guise of “truth.”
    The GOP can’t do the math because they can’t handle the fact that 1+1=2. They want it to equal 3.

    Conason staes it best with this:

    “…there is an even deeper problem with Boehner’s arithmetic. The Republicans are fighting to extend all the Bush tax cuts to the wealthiest two percent along with everyone else — but their alternative proposals are utterly inadequate to compensate for the $1.3 trillion in revenues lost by continuing those cuts for the rich. To “offer” $800 billion in new “revenues” obtained by eliminating deductions rather than raising rates simply doesn’t work, as a matter of basic math. It isn’t nearly enough money.”

  52. nobsartist December 5, 2012

    500 BILLION JOBS PLAN, 6% tax on ALL income investment and earned with NO ceiling, 39% tax on all income over 1 MILLION with NO DEDUCTIONS.

    Accept nothing less.

  53. Charles D. Hearne December 5, 2012

    What is wrong with this picture? they want to make cuts to Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and then give the wealthy more tax breaks?Wow, talk about math problems. The simplest way to stop going over the “Cliff” would be to raise the taxes on the wealthy, or those that make $250,000 and up. Paying their fair share would greatly reduce the deficit, but they would rather “STEAL” money from programs that help those in dire need, like the elderly, and those on a fixed income. If they don’t fix this(Republicians) then there would be a worst reseccion, then they are going to blame Obama, when it wouldn’t be his fault, because Boehner doesn’t want to lose his kick backs. Just a though.

  54. FeFe Fox December 5, 2012


  55. BDC_57 December 5, 2012

    Well said.

  56. charleo1 December 5, 2012

    Personally, I don’t care if raising taxes on the wealthy results in any deficit reduction.
    They’ve had an excellent run. And they are better off for it. Good for them. But then,
    when their trickle down economics, combined with Wall Street trickery runs the economy
    in the ditch, they turn, and get nasty with the working poor about food stamps, and Medicaid.
    In fact, some of them are acting like their money entitles them to run the Country!
    It’s worse than greed. The destruction of small towns runs completely across the entire Nation.
    Millions of lives disrupted. Homes lost, businesses in families for generations, gone.
    Proud Americans, needing a little help. Many for the first time in their adult life they’ve ever
    ask anyone for anything, being called lazy, and dependent minded. The fact that most ask,
    only because they have children depending on them. It is beyond any arrogance I’ve ever
    witnessed. Actually the Country don’t need their money nearly as much as they need taken
    down a notch or two. That would help the Country immensely. Almost as much as
    another Democratic drubbing in 2014!

  57. alsoavietnamvet December 6, 2012

    I agree!! This congress is worthless!! I wish we could put term limits on the members of Congress. They don’t care about their constituents; their only “care” is keeping their job, and their Party agenda. I’ve contacted Jon Huntsman (when he was campaigning for the RNP blessing to run for president, he stated he was in favor of term limits), Al Sharpton, and a local newspaper editor, to find out what I need to do to TRY to get term limits into a bill. I have not received a reply from either of them. Do any of you know how to get this started?

    1. idamag December 6, 2012

      also, the common taxpayer cannot get an answer to a letter to their representative, but the godfather can get them to sign pledges.

  58. TheOldNorthChurch December 6, 2012

    This country was never built on class warfare. That being said I believe the Democrat Lite’s in Congress should give Obama his tax increase on the higher wage earners. The Middle Class is already getting their increase with the $350 Billion in the Unaffordable Care Act on January 1st, so why should the wealthy be exempt? As for Arithmetic let’s see those employment numbers tomorrow. Hope they are at least 250,000 so we can start to really recover,

  59. empaty1 December 6, 2012

    The GOP must think they are the President. What disrespect of this office they have been practicing is unreal, for the last four years until now. Can’t they show the world they can work with this man who is trying to do his job? How deep can disrespect and hatred be? Better yet, why don’t they cut their salaries and no-tax paying selves, with great insurance and all kinds of perks so they will understand how poor people, middle class, on the edge, etc. really struggle everyday.

  60. Debbie Brady December 6, 2012

    The President is acting like a man who just won an election. I am glad to see him dig in his heels and reject the Republican fuzzy math.
    They insist on pushing the same Ryan Budget that lost them the last election and The President is right to reject it
    Now we just have to get the Democrats and moderate Republicans in the House to come on board.
    Call your Congressman and tell him the consequences for not cooperation with the President! I have and I will again.

  61. rustacus21 December 6, 2012

    The whole idea behind taxation, at levels above that levied on the poor and Middle Class, is exemplified in the case of Sheldon Adelson (see > http://wwwdothuffingtonpostdotcom/2012/12/05/sheldon-adelson_n_2245666dothtml <) & others like him, who are attempting to work, from behind the scenes, in ways to undercut Democracy, in order to achieve preferred status as a 1% prima donna. Over the entirety of this century so far, Democracy has diminished in America, as if it's some foreign concept – w/money as the primary reason for this demise. Fortunately, American's have found their 'reasons' to believe that their own Middle Class/working poor 'self-interests' are greater than the interests of those seeking to install the ancient 'royalist' hierarchy – pre-Revolution, which Adelson & his Republican supporters would feel rite at home in. The situation is now to continue pressuring the administration & Senate to maintain their initiative in protecting already slashed-to-the-bone social services & ensuring the 12 straight years of close to 9 trillion dollars by the wealthy, be made whole (or at least in part)! It would be interesting if a figure could be attached to this loss in national revenue over the 2001-current timeframe, so if any 1 knows a closer number-accounting, please feel free to post here…

  62. FeFe Fox December 6, 2012


  63. Robert Macklin December 9, 2012

    Tired of this bu77$h!t. Its time to put Congress and Senates salarys and benefits including Cadillac health care and ridiculous retirement benefits on the negotiation table and then see how these pompous SOBs attitudes change concerning cuts and who is getting to much from the government. In 8 to 10 years in Washington they can retire getting more than 60% of Americans make while they are working. Don’t tell me about entitlements these political dead beats got their hand out 24/7 and they have the audacity to want to cut one dime from Medicare, Medicaid or Social Security. Or raise retirement and eligibility to age 67. Enough is enough.


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