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Graham: Confederate Flag ‘Part Of Who We Are’ In South Carolina

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Graham: Confederate Flag ‘Part Of Who We Are’ In South Carolina

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Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC) is weighing in on the mass murder that took place at the historically black Emanuel AME Church in Charleston, South Carolina — and as a result, the presidential candidate is also having to answer tough questions on his home state’s tradition of flying of the Confederate flag.

“Well at the end of the day, it’s time for people in South Carolina to revisit that decision, would be fine with me,” Graham said — before then embarking upon a defense of the Confederate flag and its supporters.

But this is part of who we are. The flag represents to some people a Civil War, and that was the symbol of one side. To others it’s a racist symbol — and it’s been used by people, it’s been used in a racist way. But the problems we have in South Carolina and throughout the world are not because of a movie or a symbol, it’s because of what people, what’s in people’s hearts. You know, how do you go back and reconstruct America? I mean, what do we do in terms of our history?

Graham also defended the compromise that has been made in South Carolina, in which the state capitol building grounds have both a Confederate war memorial, which contains the flag at issue, and also an African-American memorial.

“It works here — that’s what the statehouse agreed to do. But you could probably visit other places in the country, and there’s some symbol that doesn’t strike you as quite right.”

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97 Comments

  1. Siegfried Heydrich June 19, 2015

    Yes, it’s part of who you are. And that part of who you are is despicable.

    Reply
    1. harviele June 19, 2015

      Or perhaps you are the despicable one. Try reading what he said without your blinders on. Read for understanding. For the majority of us from the south the flag has nothing to do with racism or slavery. We should not try to remove all trace of the fact that our country fought a civil war. Many men died on each side. The states lost to the federal government. The 14th amendment was written and ratified as a result greatly diminishing states rights. All the things you are angry with the federal government for doing now are a direct result of the civil war. Greater evil was done under the American flag during the civil war than was done under the Confederate flag. Read about Shermans march across Georgia where his troops burned and destroyed everything it their path. One thing that might be left out of the northern history books is the fact that not only did they burn everything in their path but they also raped and murdered women.

      1. Siegfried Heydrich June 19, 2015

        Traitors are as traitors do. Your hatred of your nation is noted, and despised. The biggest mistake the north made was in not hanging every signer of each of the Articles of Secession, as well as every member of the Confederate government. Perhaps then you would have learned your lesson. I have no sympathy for traitors. Nor for traitor’s apologists.

        Go find another nation that thinks as you do. Oh. wait, there aren’t any. We’ve move on, and gotten better. You seem to still be immersed in 18th century political theory. Say Hi! to the Whigs and Know-Nothings when you get to the garbage pile of history.

        1. harviele June 20, 2015

          I server our country honorably for 24 years in the Armed Forces. I am a Vietnam era veteran. What you are missing is that the same people who proudly wave the Confederate flag will stomp on you if they see you trampling Old Glory. We are willing to fight and die for our country which is something you probably were unwilling to do. In considering the Civil War, remember; The victor gets to write the history.

          1. Elliot J. Stamler June 20, 2015

            We Yankees love our country and the flag as much as you do and we also serve in the armed forces. Who do you think you arrogating all patriotism and loyalty to southerners? We Yankees who have education know the full history of the south right up until today. IN MY OWN LIFETIME I witnessed every prominent southern politician then powerful denounce and try to stop civil rights laws; uphold and commemorate segregation and Jim Crow and the prevention of blacks down there from even voting. AND–I witnessed how the tiny number of southern white politicians who would NOT go along with all this and stood up for the constitution and fairness had there political careers wrecked, e.g. Sen. Albert Gore, Sr., Reps. Weltner of Georgia, Smith of Mississippi, Elliott of Alabama, etc. Take your confederate crap and shove it.

          2. jmprint June 23, 2015

            I see the same thing happening now with all the republicans running for office, as they have been working only on laws that satisfy their ego.

          3. idamag June 26, 2015

            Much more so.

          4. harviele June 21, 2015

            I didn’t say all yankees. I said you probably were unwilling to fight and die for your country if necessary. Are you a veteran? Probably not. I was saying that while we celebrate our southern heritage we are also willing to fight and die for our country. It does not make us not American.

        2. idamag June 23, 2015

          Looking back, it should have been done.

      2. Independent1 June 20, 2015

        The Third Reich was a calamity in Germany 70-80 years ago. Do you see people in Germany tolerating the flying of the Swastika these days?? I don’t think so. Decent people put atrocities behind them and consider them the past and they don’t keep trying to relive atrocities that their forefathers committed. Unless of course your a southern and have no decency and can’t admit to the wrong that your forefathers committed.

        Instead of being proud of the Confederate flag, Southerners should be hanging their heads in shame for what it stood for, and that their forefathers were such outright bigots and hypocrites to commit the atrocities to other human beings that they did for generations!!!!!

        1. harviele June 20, 2015

          The Battle Flag of Virginia doesn’t compare to the Swastika used by Germany. The Confederate flag represented the war against Northern Aggression and the Federal Government taking away the rights of the states to govern themselves. The Confederate flag itself was not considered a racist symbol until many years after the war ended.

          1. Alvin Harrison June 20, 2015

            Nice try…but you know in your heart what that flag represents today to EVERYONE but you apparently…

          2. harviele June 20, 2015

            I know that for the majority of southerners the confederate flag represents pride in our southern heritage. There are a few bad apples who use it as a symbol of racism. The Cross is used more frequently than the confederate battle flag to represent racism and bigotry. I don’t see any efforts to ban the cross just because it is used by some as a symbol of bigotry and racism. What many don’t consider is the fact that while taking pride in our heritage, we will die for the American flag if necessary. Taking pride in our heritage does not compare with the Swastika used by Germany for a short time in history by an evil dictator who killed millions of innocent people. Our heritage goes back to the founding of our country, Without us, there would never have been a revolutionary war. But my main point now is that every time you complain about the federal government interfering in state governments, you have to only look back at the 14th amendment which greatly diminished states rights to self government. The 14th amendment was a direct result of the Civil War.

          3. jmprint June 20, 2015

            I also know a few good people that honor their confederate heritage, but these honorable people would have wanted to bring the flag down half staff, those that don’t are not honorable, they are arrogant, racist and promote hate.

          4. harviele June 20, 2015

            I thought about that but then the confederate flag is not an official flag of any country. Flying it at half staff would be elevating it to a higher status by recognizing it as an official flag. To me that would have been a bigger slap in the face to blacks than keeping it at full staff.

          5. jmprint June 20, 2015

            That would be the more reason to bring it completely down. That is a poor excuse to hide the real reason, arrogance and hate. Why don’t you ask a black instead of thinking for them.

          6. idamag June 23, 2015

            I remember a time during the Civil Rights movement, when some of those murderous, terrorist crackers claimed the Black man was happy under slavery.

          7. jmprint June 23, 2015

            Just like saying poor people like being on welfare.

          8. John Heitzenrater June 20, 2015

            Bullshit. That flag was born as a symbol of white supremacy, died as a symbol of white supremacy, and wasn’t reborn until after Brown vs. Board of Education in the 50s, once again as a symbol of white supremacy. If it was so important to “southern heritage,” why did nobody fly it between 1865 and 1956?

          9. harviele June 20, 2015

            Keep believing the BS you are spewing forth or go read the real history of it.

          10. John Heitzenrater June 21, 2015

            The new Constitution has put at rest forever all the agitating questions relating to our peculiar institutions—African
            slavery as it exists among us—the proper status of the negro in our
            form of civilization. This was the immediate cause of the late rupture
            and present revolution. Jefferson, in his forecast, had anticipated
            this, as the “rock upon which the old Union would split.” He was right.
            What was conjecture with him, is now a realized fact. But whether he
            fully comprehended the great truth upon which that rock stood and
            stands, may be doubted. The prevailing ideas entertained by him and most
            of the leading statesmen at the time of the formation of the old
            Constitution were, that the enslavement of the African was in violation
            of the laws of nature; that it was wrong in principle, socially, morally
            and politically. It was an evil they knew not well how to deal with;
            but the general opinion of the men of that day was, that, somehow or
            other, in the order of Providence, the institution would be evanescent
            and pass away… Those ideas, however, were fundamentally wrong. They
            rested upon the assumption of the equality of races. This was an error.
            It was a sandy foundation, and the idea of a Government built upon
            it—when the “storm came and the wind blew, it fell.”

            Our new Government is founded upon exactly the opposite ideas; its
            foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that
            the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery, subordination to
            the superior race, is his natural and moral condition.”

            -Confederate Vice President Alexander Stephens

          11. idamag June 23, 2015

            absolutely!

          12. pjm19606 June 20, 2015

            Exactly what heritage are Southerners proud of? Explain!

          13. harviele June 20, 2015

            If you don’t know then you are not southern.

          14. pjm19606 June 20, 2015

            Typical assinine dodge of a direct question. Enlighten us non-Southerners! Or don’t you have the gonads?

          15. harviele June 20, 2015

            You are not southern so you would be unable to comprehend it. But as close as I can explain that you might get it is: It is the same as Native Americans having pride in their heritage or African American having pride in their heritage or Irish or Italian etc having pride in their heritage. We still love America while having pride in our southern heritage.

          16. pjm19606 June 21, 2015

            Wow, you are a serious idiot. Those groups you mention DO NOT have their flags waving atop public government buildings.

          17. harviele June 21, 2015

            Neither is the Confederate flag. Now who is the idiot?

          18. pjm19606 June 21, 2015

            You are! They do in South Carolina!

          19. harviele June 21, 2015

            Nope, it is flown on the Capitol grounds, not over any government building. 15 or 20 years ago you would have been correct.

          20. JPHALL June 22, 2015

            Is not the “Stars and Bars” still displayed on at least one state flag? (Mississippi) I believe that flag still flies over the state Capitol and state buildings.

          21. jmprint June 23, 2015

            Be proud fly the flag at home. Not on government property, nor property paid with our tax dollars.

          22. idamag June 23, 2015

            I am proud not to be southern. Those hateful cretins.

          23. Elliot J. Stamler June 20, 2015

            Oh please…that whitewash won’t wash with any American today except those who are still closet confederates.

          24. harviele June 20, 2015

            That’s about the dumbest statement I have read all day.

          25. idamag June 26, 2015

            You are right. I met a lot of them in the South. Read, “Confederates in the Attic.”

          26. Elliot J. Stamler June 26, 2015

            I have – great book.

          27. Elliot J. Stamler June 20, 2015

            It is properly called the War of Southern Treason and anyone – that means you – who claims that the war was not fundamentally about retaining slavery is either a complete ignoramus of history or a neo-confederate apologist for slavery and southern rebellion and sedition.

          28. harviele June 21, 2015

            Obviously you don’t know the meaning of the word treason. If you were to call the south withdrawing from the union treason then you would also have to call the colonies withdrawing from the British Empire treason. It was the war of Northern Aggression if you live in the south. It was the war of breaking up the union if you live in the north. Or more commonly called the Civil War.

          29. Elliot J. Stamler June 21, 2015

            You obviously got whatever scant education you have in one of your fine make-believe southern schools like South Carolina’s (naturally) Bob Jones University. Our national revolution WAS treason to Great Britain from the latter’s standpoint and was so declared by the British government. Had we lost our revolutionary leaders WOULD have been convicted of treason. The constitution narrowly defines treason (so drafted for valid historical reasons…the definition of treason was so elastic under Britain that Henry VIII executed his wives for “treason”) and the southern rebellion was individuals collectively forming an entity at war with the United States and taking up arms for it and supporting and giving aid and comfort to it.
            The nub of this issue as I have written before is that to most (not all but surely most) white southerners..LIKE YOU..It is a dagger in the heart to take down the Confederate flag because when you see it flying in the wind it makes you think, “we were right back then..we were right!!”

          30. harviele June 21, 2015

            I can’t say whether we were right or wrong back then. All I know about it was from documents passed down generation to generation and never included in any history book. I do know that the 14th Amendment was written and ratified to give the federal government more power over the states right after the Civil War. It was a horrible war because it had brothers fighting brothers and friends fighting friends. What happened happened and can’t be undone. Had the states not seceded it is not a given that Lincoln would have ever issued the Emancipation proclamation and it is not a given that the Supreme Court would have ruled it as constitutional or if they would have ruled it unconstitutional at the time. It is probable that it would have been ruled unconstitutional. It wasn’t issued until after the war started. It is true that many Northerners fought to free the slaves and were not aware of any other issue. It is also true that most Southerners fought simply because they didn’t want the Yankees telling them what to do. They also were not aware of the other issues at the time. If the war were fought today, we would all be more aware of all the reasons for it being fought because we have instant information available. I got my history from documents passed down generation to generation and never included in any history book. I have not seen the documents since 1963 so I don’t know if they still exist or not. Let’s just say that most Northern Soldiers fought to free the slaves and most Southerners fought because they didn’t want the Yankees telling them what to do. The result was a much stronger federal government and a diminished right for states, all states, to self govern. Whether that was a good or bad thing depends on how you view the federal government and the issue at hand at the time and whether you agree or disagree with what the federal government is doing.

          31. JPHALL June 22, 2015

            Yes, I believe that many southerners bought the “States Rights” lie. But if you bother to read what their leaders said then at the time, you would realize that the only state right they were concerned about was the continuation and spread of slavery.

            So the truth of the matter is, like the German people and Naziism, your ancestors bought into, fought and died for, a lie.

          32. idamag June 23, 2015

            Why are you responding to that kluxer or obviously white supremist. If the only thing you can brag about is your complexion- then you have not accomplished anything worthwhile.

          33. jmprint June 23, 2015

            Right about what? This is the now, how about we start acting like it.

          34. JPHALL June 22, 2015

            Read what the founding fathers said about their revolution. It was treason if they lost!

          35. idamag June 23, 2015

            Actually, there were many people, in the U.S. Government, who wanted those treasonists punished. Abraham Lincoln pardoned them to promote healing. Well, it did not work. Look what we have today.

          36. JPHALL June 23, 2015

            You are so right!
            Subject: Re: Comment on Graham: Confederate Flag ‘ Part Of Who We Are’ In South Carolina

          37. idamag June 26, 2015

            I don’t even read what that white supremacist writes. I hate home grown terrorists. They are a malignancy to democracy.

          38. Independent1 June 21, 2015

            Sorry, the Confederate Flag and the Swastika were both developed as symbols representing movements intended for the same purpose: to inflict control over some segment of the people they were trying to dominate. The South was trying to advance its desire to oppress blacks, just like Hitler was trying to oppress Jews and even some other segments of the German population. The South’s intent to maintain its use of slavery to further its ‘lifestyle’ (which you seem so enamored with) was every bit as oppressive and hateful, as Hitler’s desire to enforce his beliefs on not only Germans but other nations and peoples outside of Germany.

          39. harviele June 21, 2015

            You are wrong. The Swastika is a Chinese symbol for peace and was used by the Germans thus making it a bad symbol because of their killing millions of Jews. The Confederate flag is the Stars and Bars and was created as the flag for the Confederate states. The flag most commonly seen and called the Confederate flag is actually the Battle Flag of Virginia and was used during the revolutionary war to win our independence from England. Many slaves were already being set free in the south before the civil war started. Some were not. The Northern industries wanted a source of cheap labor and thought that by freeing the slaves the blacks would all move up there and work. Little did they know that most of the blacks were unwilling to work unless forced to do so. The main issue for the Civil war was not slavery though. The main issue was about keeping the federal government a small one and let the states govern themselves. When we lost, the 14th Amendment was passed further diminishing states rights to self govern.

          40. Independent1 June 21, 2015

            What total HOGWASH!! The Civil war was fought for one reason and one reason only – states joining the confederacy refused to give up their practice OF MAINTAINING SLAVES!! It had nothing to do with the other states wanting ‘cheap labor’!! You are one brainwashed idiotic southerner!! You need to wake up and realized YOU’VE BEEN LIED TO!!! And stop listening to all that SOUTHERN PROPAGANDA!!!

            HERE’S THE TRUTH FROM WIKIPEDIA:

            Among the 34 states in January 1861, seven Southern slave states individually declared their secession from the United States and formed the Confederate States of America. The Confederacy, often simply called the South, grew to include eleven states, and although they claimed thirteen states and additional western territories, the Confederacy was never diplomatically recognized by a foreign country. The states that remained loyal and did not declare secession were known as the Union or the North. The war had its origin in the fractious issue of slavery, especially the extension of slavery into the western territories.[N 1] After four years of combat, which left over 600,000 Union and Confederate soldiers dead and destroyed much of the South’s infrastructure, the Confederacy collapsed and slavery was abolished. Then began the Reconstruction and the processes of restoring national unity and guaranteeing civil rights to the freed slaves.

            In the 1860 presidential election, Republicans, led by Abraham Lincoln, opposed the expansion of slavery intoU.S. territories. The Republican Party, dominant in the North, secured a majority of the electoral votes, and Lincoln was elected the first Republican president, but before his inauguration on March 4, 1861, seven slave states with cotton-based economies formed the Confederacy. The first six to secede had the highest proportions of slaves in their populations, a total of 48.8% for the six.[6]

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War

          41. harviele June 21, 2015

            Maybe you need to entertain the possibility that you have been lied to. Remember, the victor writes the history. The real history gets passed down from generation to generation until it is forgotten. The biggest evidence I have to prove my point is the fact that the 14th amendment was passed taking away much of the states rights to self governance. Abraham Lincoln would be a democrat if he were living today.

          42. Independent1 June 21, 2015

            You are one sad delusional human being. It doesn’t take anyone with 1/2 a brain to realize why a horde of lazy/corrupt people would want to maintain as many as 48% of their population in slaves just so they can continue their practice of living high-on-the-hog with a horde of slaves to do work they were either to lazy or to cheap to pay to do their work for them!!!

            I can see very clearly who’s being lied to and it isn’t me. Use you’re brain and realize that people are going to pass down what ever propaganda they can dream up to justify their practice of enslaving people to work for them for virtually nothing!!!!!!

          43. harviele June 21, 2015

            Well, you are definitely delusional. Most of the people in the South didn’t own slaves nor have any desire to own them. My family set their two slaves free long before the Civil War. But they decided to stay with the family they had became a part of and live on the land. Many did that. Only the plantation owners had slaves for the most part. It was a terrible thing but then sometimes good comes from evil. Had the slaves never been brought to the United States, they would have been killed in Africa. The blacks of today who are descendents of slaves would not exist had slavery not been a reality. Killing off the Indians and taking their land was also a terrible thing but had it not been done, neither you nor I would be here. Many things are done that have circumstances that no one ever thought of. I am not trying to justify what happened but looking at the side that if what happened had not happened today would not be as it is today. The victor writes the history. The Texas rebellion was seen by us as Texas fighting for independence from Mexico. The Revolutionary war was seen by the British as the American rebellion. There are always two sides to every event. The North sees the Civil war as the southern rebellion while the South sees it as Northern aggression. It depends on where you live and was raised as to which way you see it. Neither side is more right or wrong than the other side.

          44. Independent1 June 22, 2015

            “Well, you are definitely delusional. Most of the people in the South didn’t own slaves nor have any desire to own them. Only the plantation owners had slaves for the most part.”

            So let’s see, most southerners didn’t own them but somehow they were willing to go fight a war and die to allow this supposed handful of plantation owners to keep their slaves??? Sorry, I’m not buying that rot. Around 300,000 southerners died in the Civil war at a time when the population of America wasn’t all that great. I find it hard to believe that so many southerners not directly tied into owning slaves were willing to go out and die so somebody else could keep owning them.

            Sorry – I’m not buying your fairytale!!!

          45. harviele June 22, 2015

            It is true whether you buy it or not.

          46. Independent1 June 22, 2015

            Whether they owned them or not, they supported the ownership of them which is every bit as bad!!! If not more so, because those who may not have ‘owned them’ were willing to fight and die so someone else could own them!!!

          47. idamag June 23, 2015

            Many of those slave owners were people that England needed to colonize so they emptied out their prisons. I did a lot of proof reading for a genealogy group. We were doing census from that era. So many of those southern plantation owners could not even read and write.Margaret Mitchell’s fantasy about that time is just that, a fantasy.

          48. jmprint June 23, 2015

            There for a minute I thought you were talking about Walmart.

          49. Independent1 June 23, 2015

            Well, I guess Walmart could be considered to have been enslaving people. By paying them poverty level wages, that they know their employees can’t really survive on, but then by teaching them how to apply for welfare benefits that they are able somewhat to live on; Walmart is gambling that their employees will be hooked into continuing to work for them at the poverty level wages they’re willing to pay.

          50. Independent1 June 21, 2015

            You can’t really be as totally clueless as you post can you??

            You don’t really believe your ancestors would have passed down something like “Why yeah!! I was too lazy to do the work myself and too cheap to hire someone, so I went out and bought myself some slaves so I could get the work done for next to nothing!! Wasn’t that smart of me!!!”

          51. jmprint June 23, 2015

            And that is what makes Lincoln a good man. I don’t think the states should self govern, because then you end up with warped legislation as in Texas. Governor Abbott is a prime example, trying to take our state back to the wild, wild west.

          52. idamag June 21, 2015

            harviele, is like some people, I met from MIssissipi, when I mentioned what was happening in Mississippi, they blamed the media.

          53. Independent1 June 22, 2015

            What’s a bit disturbing to me is that as you sort of alluded to, Harviele isn’t especially out of line with the thinking of many of today’s southerners; who despite what many in America had hoped had been improvements in race relations, still have some inborn misguided pride, instead of sadness – that their ancestors thought it necessary to enslave people – rather than hire them as freemen to work around their farms and plantations. Even today there are millions of Americans who don’t fully see the wrong that was carried out in America for so long by even their ancestors, before the Civil Rights Act of the 1960s.

          54. idamag June 23, 2015

            I remember a picture in Life Magazine, during the 50s, it was a lynching. There was a big mob laughing about the swinging body of someone’s loved one. There were “women” in crinoline skirts among them. These hate mongering terrorists are the ancestors of those who still try to promote their hate. They were homicidal. They were low mentality. They were bullies. They were like hitler. They passed it on down.

          55. Independent1 June 23, 2015

            And as I pointed out last night to Firebaron on another thread, it’s not just blacks that many southerners will express their hate to; it’s also ‘Yankees’. We’ve had a number of friends and even family move into the mid Atlantic states – Virginia south, and had them return north in not too long a time, because of neighbors and even people who should be friends that share a common fellowship, have not been able to hold back that inborn or brainwashed hate that many southerners just can’t get around from expressing.

            As I said to Firebaron, it’s my feeling that there is just a large percentage of southerners that simply are not ‘decent people’. They’re egotistical, self-serving bigots, that as you point out, may have gotten that way simply because of very low mentality and what they’ve been brainwashed with as they’ve grown up. And this reprehensible Rebel Flag they seem to adore, just compounds the problem by keeping that sense of hate constantly in front of them.

          56. idamag June 26, 2015

            As graham said, it is who they are.

          57. Independent1 June 26, 2015

            Yes, unfortunately, a large percentage of the southern population are like Graham, egotistical hypocrites and bigots.

          58. idamag June 26, 2015

            And you can bet, if someone like bull connor became president, he wouldn’t hesitate to try and murder the Black population.

          59. jmprint June 23, 2015

            Any way you slice it still stands for white supremacy.

  2. Johnny Z June 20, 2015

    The U.S. allowing these Confederate throwbacks to fly the Dixie flag is no different from the Germans allowing the Nazi flag to be flown. The flag represents a traitorous regime known as the Confederacy, and we shouldn’t allow these present day traitors to get away with this kind of idiocy.

    Reply
  3. cpbis June 20, 2015

    The comments thus far indicate how flying the Confederate flag arouses anger. It makes no sense to allow this flag to cause such anger on both sides of the issue. This is the USA and no flag of any kind other than the country’s flag should be flown on federal, state or local government properties. The flag should unify not separate peoples of a country. Please, for those of you who feel strongly about your ancestors service to the Confederacy should fly the Confederate flag on your property(ies) if you so desire. The vast majority of Americans do not support your point of view. What if a large area of a community was Vietnamese, Muslim, Canadian or whatever should they be allowed to fly their former countries flags on any federal, state or local government property. I seriously doubt that would be acceptable. This is really no different.

    Reply
    1. Elliot J. Stamler June 20, 2015

      I’m sure you would agree that on state or local gov’t property the state and/or local gov’t flag should properly be flown also. The question is why the Confederate flag should still in 2015 be on any state flag?

      1. cpbis June 20, 2015

        Yes….thought that was a given, sorry!

  4. Allan Richardson June 20, 2015

    Unfortunately, Senator Graham is correct. The Confederate flag is, for too many Southerners, “part of who we are.” As for “states’ rights,” the states signed away their right to FULL self government when they ratified the Constitution to replace the Articles of Confederation; the War Between the States was essentially a tragic, very bloody, argument over just what degree of self government they retained.

    And as far as I ever heard in my history classes, or read in my personal reading over the years, the only states’ right the Confederate states FOUGHT FOR was the “right” to VIOLATE THE UNALIENABLE RIGHTS OF OTHERS by treating them as PROPERTY, NOT PEOPLE.

    Reply
    1. jmprint June 20, 2015

      Which is something they are still doing with all the laws against voting rights, abortion and LGBT. It is still discrimination and way you slice it.

    2. Elliot J. Stamler June 20, 2015

      I entirely agree with Allan. Sen. Graham is not a racist-he despises racism. His comments in their entirety are accurate insofar as what is in people’s hearts and I continue to maintain that what is in the hearts of a majority of the white people of the south is in fact nostalgic racism, white supremacy and segregation–they just don’t want in this day to come on out and say so. This doesn’t apply to Lindsey Graham who if you know his background is no racist.
      The problem is that because of what I have written above a majority of white southerners secretly look at the Confederate flag flying as an AFFIRMATION of what it stood for at the time of the civil war. This is why it’s a dagger in their hearts to see it taken down.
      As a proud yankee my feeling is that while any citizen should always have the right to fly the Confederate flag on private property, it’s display on PUBLIC property 150 years after the end of the civil war is simply revolting in principle and is a terrible thing to inflict on the black citizens of the southern states. If these supposedly all-so-religious white southerners with their Bob Jones University (in S.C.) etc. were really good Christians they would be following the golden rule (of all religions) respecting the feelings of their black fellow citizens: That which is hateful unto thyself do not do unto thy neighbor. (My own faith’s most apt phrasing.)

  5. Marv Nochowitz June 20, 2015

    The confederate flag is a symbol of white power. Blacks are part of that southern cultural Graham is so proud of. If Blacks had the political power I bet that flag would not be flying from any government institution. Talking about expressing South Carolina heritage, lynchings were a part of that heritage. I don’t see anyone lynched in front of the state capital. Aren’t you proud of that part of your white southern cultural Mr. Graham?

    Reply
    1. 1standlastword June 21, 2015

      American laws are much more effective than ropes for concealing intent.

      The agenda of “pernicious republicanism” behind such laws are less overtly but more covertly violent while at the same time less strikingly upsetting of the average human sensibility

      This is how the modern republican party continues to succeed at duping Americans

  6. pjm19606 June 20, 2015

    “It’s part of who we are…” Senator Graham? Just exactly who ARE you?

    Reply
    1. jmprint June 20, 2015

      Words could never describe the true them.

      1. 1standlastword June 21, 2015

        Yes…action speaks louder than words!

  7. Dennis Price June 20, 2015

    When is somebody finally going to out this clown so the teapublicans can drum him out of the ‘boys who haven’t been outed yet club”?

    Reply
    1. 1standlastword June 21, 2015

      His narcissism will spell his down fall during the coming debate season…it is now gaining momentum!

      I anticipate Graham will be cajoled into articulating a position on marriage equality and I predict his responses will lay bare his orientation as those responses will fuel media curiosity and drive the opposition at him even harder if he tries to obfuscate the matter. He won’t be allowed to tap dance with the usual political parlance employed for political cover

      In short, he’s not going to be able to keep his head low if he wants to be convincing

  8. booker25 June 21, 2015

    What Graham is saying is that he is a racist loser who refuses after what 150 years still supports a flag that represents treason and racial hatred. One that is locked on a flag pole, these people are so afraid someone will climb up and cut the f**ker off. He also called these murders motivated by religion. I think not jackazz. It was race and he refuses to acknowledge this.

    Reply
  9. Geir Hansen June 21, 2015

    For europeans, this discussion is weird!

    Weird, maybe like two or three countries insisted on keeping the Swastika, “for good ol’ sake”.

    Racists in the USA tends to even weirder than nazis, as it was their ancestors, who brought negroes to the states as SLAVES, not the negroes who willingly immigrated there in the first place. The whole world, including North Korea, Iran and many other regimes laughs at the USA where the government lets the population own military style weapons, to be able to overrun the government, if deemed necessary!

    And democratic countries just don’t know what to say, to a government who let even sick or dangerous people own handguns, even letting children play with them, like some child army in Africa. Western movies were cool when we were children, not so cool that it is still the same culture 100-150 years after. Like coming to the british Islands, Iceland or Norway to realise there are still vikings there!

    Reply
    1. FireBaron June 22, 2015

      Actually, Geir, the original Blacks brought to the colonies were brought as indentured servants with a Seven-year obligation. The problem arose when the White settlers realized they were going to be outnumbered by freed black men and women. That is when the indenture ended and total slavery commenced.

      1. idamag June 26, 2015

        And, you get this information where? I saw a documentary on U.S. slavery, once, it kind of contradicted what you say.

        1. FireBaron June 26, 2015

          Check out the historical department in Williamsburg, VA. They have done extensive research on the subject. As the first British settlement in the US where Indentured servants (both Black and White) were brought into the colonies, they have a bit more background than someone with an agenda. 90% of the “documentaries” you will see about Slavery get it wrong, due to the agendas of the documentarians. And if you watched it on History Channel, let me say one thing about their credibility: “Aliens!”

  10. IntelliWriter June 21, 2015

    So, you’re saying that you’re losers. The Confederate flag represents the losing side.

    Reply
  11. Justin Napolitano June 21, 2015

    Graham is proud of being a racist bigot. I’ll bet he has a collection of white pointy hats in his closet. I’ll bet he is a member of the KKK and has a few crosses ready to burn.
    How about you joing the 21st century instead of being proud of slave owner losers?

    Reply
    1. jmprint June 23, 2015

      And he should also come out of the closet and stop bashing gay.

  12. Carolyn1520 June 21, 2015

    “But you could probably visit other places in the country, and there’s some symbol that doesn’t strike you as quite right.”

    I’m racking my brain and can’t think of any symbol on federal or state property that offends quite so many as the confederate flag. It’s beyond not quite right.
    When current day white supremacists and paramilitary groups display it, it’s not to show pride in their heritage.

    Reply
    1. idamag June 26, 2015

      Idaho is a backward state, but we don’t proudly display hate and treason symbols. I have been to 27 states. You only see proud of ignorance and hate in the southern states.

  13. idamag June 21, 2015

    First, the Confederate flag is the flag of the traitorous group that started the war by firing on Fort Sumpter. Secondly, it is presently the flag of the KKK, a well-known terrorist group. So, if it defines who you are, Lindsey Graham, you are not such great people, are you?

    Reply
    1. FireBaron June 22, 2015

      And when you read the Act of Secession issued by every state that joined the Confederacy, they all point out the same thing – it was done to preserve their “peculiar institution” of Black Slavery. Even when the Cherokee nation joined the Confederacy, they stated the same – they express a desire to be allowed to keep owning slaves! Ironic that after the Civil War, Cherokee were placed on the same reservation lands as Lenapi (Delaware) who did not keep slaves and supported the Union, including serving in the Union Armies!

    2. docb June 22, 2015

      This is why it was designed and was adopted by the Union States….

      The actual racist origins of the Confederate States of America flag.
      In 1863, as editor of the Savannah Morning News,

      William T. Thompson proposed a design that would ultimately become the
      Confederacy’s second national flag, which would be come to known as the
      “Stainless Banner”. Thompson, the flag’s actual designer, referred to
      the flag’s design as “The WhiteMan’s Flag”, Thompson praised his design,
      as well as stating: “As a people we are fighting to maintain the
      Heaven-ordained supremacy of the White Man over the inferior or colored
      race; a White flag would thus be emblematical of our cause. (April 23,
      1863)
      … As a national emblem, it is significant of our higher
      cause, the cause of a superior race, and a higher civilization
      contending against ignorance,
      infidelity, and barbarism. (May 4, 1863)
      – Another merit in the new flag is, that it bears no resemblance to the now infamous banner of the Yankee vandals.”
      —William T. Thompson (1863), Daily Morning News

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