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When Liars Debate, The Truth Always Loses

Editor's Blog Featured Post Politics

When Liars Debate, The Truth Always Loses

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Watching the second Republican presidential debate on CNN and its aftermath, millions of Americans learned again what we already know about the candidates: These people embellish, prettify, and fabricate their own biographies without hesitation, from Donald Trump’s much-parodied boasting about his business acumen to Carly Fiorina’s super-selective accounting of her tenure at Hewlett-Packard to Chris Christie’s highly romanticized account of his appointment and record as U.S. Attorney to Jeb Bush’s wildly inflated claims about the Florida economy when he was governor.

But as Christie himself pointed out – in a remark targeted at Trump and Fiorina – why would anybody even pay attention to the tall tales told by these politicians (or the self-styled political “outsiders,” who sound exactly like politicians) about themselves? While the bickering is sometimes amusing and mostly annoying, does anyone believe that it matters?

For these characters to prevaricate endlessly about their résumés and achievements is neither surprising nor important. Of much greater consequence are the bat-winged lies they emit about issues that affect all of our lives, as well as the future of the United States and the world.

Evidently all of the Republicans on the stage at the Reagan presidential library wanted us to believe that Planned Parenthood should be shut down everywhere because its clinics sell post-abortion fetal body parts for profit. That is a false and outrageous accusation, disproved in the same videotapes that they cited as proof. Attacking the venerable women’s health organization, Fiorina went even further, furiously describing a scene in those videos supposedly showing a “fully formed fetus” with legs kicking and heart beating while someone prepares to “harvest its brain.”

Such horrific practices, she declared, “erode the character of our nation.” What erodes the character of our nation, in fact, is Fiorina’s blatant chicanery, repeated by her the next morning on ABC News. The video she claims to have watched does not exist, according to Vox.com reporter Sarah Kliff, who viewed all 12 hours of those videos.

What exist in reality are hundreds of thousands of women who will lose access to health care if fanatics like Fiorina and her fellow Republican candidates ever succeed in wrecking Planned Parenthood. Having “harvested” tens of millions of dollars from Hewlett-Packard for nearly wrecking the company, however, she doesn’t need to worry about medical care for other people.

Nearly every Republican on that stage brayed his or her opposition to the Iran nuclear agreement – and every one of them falsely described that deal. Typical was Senator Ted Cruz, who warned, “We won’t know under this agreement—there are several facilities in Iran they designate as military facilities that are off limits all together…the other facilities, we give them 24 days notice before inspecting them.”

None of what Cruz said is true or relevant. All of Iran’s designated nuclear facilities will fall under continuous video and electronic monitoring in addition to physical visitation by inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), who will also monitor any movements of nuclear materials or equipment there. Hostile to scientific facts as they are, Cruz and his fellow Republicans are probably unaware of how easily as little as a billionth of a gram of radioactive dust could be detected by IAEA inspectors, as the Center on National Security at Fordham University noted in a factsheet.

These examples represent only a few of literally dozens of mendacious statements about crucial public issues, usually bordering on absurdity, broadcast by CNN with little contradiction on Wednesday evening. Senator Marco Rubio insisted that we can do nothing about man-made climate change without destroying the economy, when every reputable study shows that the economy and the world will be destroyed if we do nothing. Christie promised to “save” Social Security from insolvency by denying payments to wealthy recipients, when that won’t significantly improve the system’s finances – and the “crisis” he touted is overblown anyway. Trump insisted that life-saving vaccines cause autism, complete with anecdotal “proof” from an “employee” whose “beautiful baby” contracted a fever and then “became autistic” after being vaccinated.

Not only did Trump concoct that sad story, but there is little doubt that his own children, including little Barron Trump, have received proper vaccinations. (Manhattan private schools don’t accept the unvaccinated.) Disgracefully, neither of the two physicians on stage, Rand Paul and Ben Carson, had the guts to forcefully contradict him.

Try as they will to reject Trump, he fits in perfectly among Republicans – and not only because he worships money, spews xenophobic nonsense, and encourages callous bigotry. Like them, he relies on fabrications and falsehoods, manipulating the prejudices of ill-informed voters.

The Republican rejection of reality – which these candidates will act out in debate after debate for months to come – inflicts grave costs on this country every day. It is hard to imagine the damage that will be done if one of these deceivers comes to power.

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Joe Conason

A highly experienced journalist, author and editor, Joe Conason is the editor-in-chief of The National Memo, founded in July 2011. He was formerly the executive editor of the New York Observer, where he wrote a popular political column for many years. His columns are distributed by Creators Syndicate and his reporting and writing have appeared in many publications around the world, including the New York Times, the Washington Post, The New Yorker, The New Republic, The Nation, and Harpers. Since November 2006, he has served as editor of The Investigative Fund, a nonprofit journalism center, where he has assigned and edited dozens of award-winning articles and broadcasts. He is also the author of two New York Times bestselling books, The Hunting of the President (St. Martins Press, 2000) and Big Lies: The Right-Wing Propaganda Machine and How It Distorts the Truth (St. Martins Press, 2003). Currently he is working on a new book about former President Bill Clinton's life and work since leaving the White House in 2001. He is a frequent guest on radio and television, including MSNBC's Morning Joe, and lives in New York City with his wife and two children.

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284 Comments

  1. Paragryne September 17, 2015

    After that debate, the truth can be declared legally dead.

    Reply
  2. joe schmo September 17, 2015

    Ahhh….you don’t know conservatives very well do you, Politico. The lie always comes to the truth and the people can see right through it.

    Every poll done on debate last night, from Drudge to Newsmax to Time Magazine, had Donald Trump winning in a landslide. #MakeAmericaGreatAgain!

    Reply
    1. Insinnergy September 17, 2015

      I’m not sure what point you’re making but I’d like to clarify that this is not “Politico”.

      If your point is that “lies lead to the truth” you may be right, but not in the cases described above where the truth is clearly known already and is diametrically opposite to the candidates’ ridiculous opinions.

      Also note that use of the words ‘never’, and ‘always’ generally denote someone who believes so strongly in what they are saying that they are not interested in edge cases or exceptions, and will generally ignore evidence of such.
      …Or to put it more succinctly… intelligent people understand that real absolutes are very very rare… using them shows blind belief and/or argumentative laziness.

      Reply
    2. The lucky one September 18, 2015

      First off, that was not a debate. Debaters are not allowed to use blatant lies to make their points. But whatever it was Fiorina (and Rubio) is the one that made the most ground. She exposed Trump as the bully and fool that he is. Drudge and Newsmax, hahaha really reliable sources. Newsmax is an online poll where knuckleheads like you Joe can vote as much as they want for their hero. I imagine Trump has paid lackeys doing exactly that.

      Reply
  3. Daniel Jones September 17, 2015

    Joe.. it’s time to start shaming CNN an the other that keep relaying this bullshit unchallenged.
    They don’t decry it, they supply it.

    Reply
    1. Theodora30 September 18, 2015

      And the NY Times goes along with right wing smears against Hillary and shows disdain for Bernie which trivializes both of these much more substantive grown ups.

      Reply
    2. stcroixcarp September 18, 2015

      I agree. CNN did not ask any questions of substance and did not follow up. CNN hasn’t been a news organization since Ted Turner was forced out.

      Reply
    3. plc97477 September 18, 2015

      cnn has already gotten the nickname of fox light. or faux light.

      Reply
  4. 1standlastword September 17, 2015

    “For these characters to prevaricate endlessly about their résumés and
    achievements is neither surprising nor important. Of much greater
    consequence are the bat-winged lies they emit about issues that affect
    all of our lives, as well as the future of the United States and the
    world.”
    **********************************************************************************
    Americans care more about truth in advertising when they’re buying goods and services than when they endorse a politician who lies like a rug:

    What could be worse?!

    The disdain we have towards politicians is certainly of our own making when we devalue a candidates capacity to be truthful because we believe s/he will cheat in a way that favors our own interests

    Reply
  5. Dominick Vila September 18, 2015

    When it comes to the second GOP debate what became clear after just a few minutes of watching that show was the dichotomy between GOP preferences and how far they are willing to go to achieve their ultimate goals, and win elections. The truth was AWOL from this event.
    With the possible exception Kasich and Paul, the rest marched in lockstep when it came to their determination to deny the 15 million Americans that benefit from the ACA the benefits they rely upon to have a healthy life. They reaffirmed their determination to reject the Iran nuclear agreement, if they are elected, because denying Iran the ability to enrich weapons grade uranium and develop plutonium capabilities at the Arak plant means that we are giving them a nuclear weapon, and that unfreezing the Iranian deposits in European banks means that we are giving them $100B. Since they are the self-designated defenders of our laws, they want to change the Constitution to ensure they can deny Latinos birthrights and can deport them. Since they are for smaller government, they promised that, if elected, the new Republican government will go after sanctuary cities and punish them for their audacity and for the freedom to exercise their rights. They promised to defund and shut down Planned Parenthood because of a video made by a right wing organization that shows the dismemberment of fetuses and embryos…and omits the cancer screenings and parental guidance that organization offers to millions of women.
    The truth, after watching the two GOP debates, is that reality is nothing more than a chimera, an illusion, that gets lost when we hear rhetoric reminiscent of what happened over half century ago, and in so many Third World countries ruled by totalitarian regimes.

    Reply
    1. 1standlastword September 18, 2015

      I was stunned when Ted Cruz looked into the camera and said–without a facial twitch- “and the Iranians get to conduct the inspections themselves”

      Wow! You could have heard a pin drop in the place after that megaton sized lie.

      Intellectually, I understand why there wasn’t a challenge from his contenders since no one would come to the defense of a policy they’ve all agreed is toxic but for the moderators to let it stand makes the media an incubator for this “big liars club”

      How much more glass can we eat?

      Reply
      1. Dominick Vila September 18, 2015

        I heard that assertion, and like you, I could not believe the moderators did not challenge it. I guess that for most of the GOP candidates, and for the audience, inspections carried out by UN IAEA inspectors, w include foreigners, constitutes evidence of unacceptable surrender. Don’t forget that we are dealing with xenophobes.

        Reply
        1. Charles van Rotterdam September 18, 2015

          AAH Dominick, if the moderators had challenged the candidates to only tell the truth then you would have had 3 hours of silence.

          Reply
      2. Karen Bille-Golden September 18, 2015

        Someone mentioned yesterday there was no push back by the moderators. That is a grave toxic mistake as you pointed out. I watched the debate last night in Canada between the leaders of the 3 major parties and their moderator was mentally involved in what was being said. What good are these debates if they can go on and on without being challenged and without any clarification. Challenging a falsehood should be a moderators responsibility. By not doing so, they are condoning and also keeping others from actual facts.

        Reply
        1. dtgraham September 19, 2015

          That moderator got seriously involved for sure. The Green party should have been included, and Elizabeth May participated by Twitter all during that debate. She’ll be included in all future debates, French or English. Their support in BC alone demands it, let alone in the rest of Canada.

          Reply
      3. David September 19, 2015

        Well guess what? Iran gets to pick the inspectors. Guess this is another Demorat plan that you have to pass so you can find out what is in it.

        Reply
    2. David September 19, 2015

      “Third World” country? Isn’t that what you Demorats are trying to make us by throwing open the borders to illegal immigration?

      Reply
  6. charleo1 September 18, 2015

    Remember the good ol’ days when voters on both sides of the isle insisted on the truth When Gerald Ford was said to have lost a major debate, and then the Presidency to a peanut farmer from Georgia, all because he insisted Poland was not part of the Soviet Block. Well, there was the pardon of Nixon. But still, Ford was eviscerated by a watchdog press for his mistake. Not today my friends. It’s all laissez-fare, buyer beware, sold as is, politics today. Where there is no penalty whatsoever for telling one whopper after the next. The bigger lie the better. No retraction ever necessary, or ever called for. An interesting thing about the two tiered debates is there is more truth telling at the kid’s table, than the major event. And the political death bed confessions by politicians such as Rick Perry, have been a virtual fountain overflowing with the hard gospel truth. This, after it no longer matters. “It,” being the truth. That’s not to say Republicans never tell the truth. They really do want to cut corporate taxes to zero, and increase the subsidies. They really are opposed to universal healthcare, public schools, most environmental regulations, and would love to privatize Social Security, and hand out vouchers to help struggling Seniors they’ve already screwed out of their company’s retirement, pay for a less than adequate private Medicare plan. And would have no Constitutional problem with putting expectant women under the purview of a gov. bureaucrat. If it guaranteed the support of the evangelical coalition, and they could ride that to the WH. Ditto that with agreeing to merge Church, and State. Or adopt a huge round ’em up, and deport ’em immigration strategy, if that would work. And they really do despise labor unions. Not because they necessarily oppose people organizing, pooling their money, backing political organizations, or even buying politicians. Their own lobbies do this all the time. It’s just that labor, and trade unions support the Democratic Party, and they get in the way of so many of their plans for the Nation’s future.

    Reply
    1. 1standlastword September 18, 2015

      Recall how confidently Paul ‘Ly’n Ryan and $hit Romney lied. It was so thick, so profuse and transparent people didn’t have to wait on the fact checked reports.

      The rating for the entire rally could have been ‘building on fire’

      Reply
      1. Eleanore Whitaker September 18, 2015

        The only answer to why the GOP continuously lies and distorts facts is that they they think we won’t take the time or trouble to get at the truth. I realize the Lil Abners and Corn pones in their states may not be as educated, but that still is no reason to assume people in the rest of the country are incapable of knowing lies from truth.

        Reply
        1. plc97477 September 18, 2015

          The only reason they lie is because they couldn’t get elected to dog catcher if they told the truth. They have to hope that enough voters believe their lies to win a few races.

          Reply
          1. David September 19, 2015

            Maybe like those “few races” in 2014?

            Reply
      2. plc97477 September 18, 2015

        That would have taken care of a lot of our countries problems wouldn’t it.

        Reply
  7. Eleanore Whitaker September 18, 2015

    Lies, corruption, crooks….You expected less from the GOP? When you can’t win a plum opportunity one way as a Republican, you make up wild stories and play to the DogPatch audiences you know fall for BS faster than long horns can drop it.

    The reality is if you called ANY Republican to court to prove what they say, they can’t. That and only that is always the defining line in their need to distort, contort, game the system and try to push their GOP propaganda.

    How is it the GOP always finds a bunch of losers for candidates? Trump and Fiorina are both losers. One has had 4 bankruptcies he dumped on taxpayers and the other was a token female CEO of HP for 2 years. Not unlike Bush ’43 with his 3 bankruptcies to his reputation.

    Reply
    1. 1standlastword September 18, 2015

      Conservative voters have lost faith in their traditional conservative leadership a long time ago so they snuggled up to a Tea Party contingent they now feel has let them down AGAIN so now they are thinking let’s support a non-politician type.

      Trump resonates with an angry MOB!

      The truth is modern conservatives are poor judges of character, they’re often too naive (if s/he loves Jesus s/he is one of us) they lack intellectual curiosity and don’t do critical thinking which is why they’re stuck in a pattern of voting away their true interests

      It doesn’t matter who they trust with their party, those people leave them feeling frustrated and betrayed.

      They vote for the skillet one season, the frying pan the next

      I think it’s just a matter of time before Joe Six Pack exchanges his ballots for his bullets!!!

      Reply
    2. David September 18, 2015

      Eleanore!!!! Lies? Hmm…. Let’s think about some. I know!
      Dodging sniper fire in Bosnia.
      A movie caused the attack in Benghazi.
      We left the Whitehouse flat broke.
      I thought that the things we took from the Whitehouse were given to us.
      I found those Rose Law Firm billings in a closet in the Whitehouse.
      Do you think she may be starting to exhibit some of the characteristics of many spinsters her age?

      Reply
    3. plc97477 September 18, 2015

      The problem with the gotp is there is no way they could get votes by telling the truth, so they have to lie in the hopes that enough voters will believe them to give them another chance.

      Reply
  8. Eleanore Whitaker September 18, 2015

    Here’s how you can tell when the GOP is putting out lies and tripe. Watch the words the use. You’ll see that the same 3 or 4 words punctuate their misguided diatribes.

    The current one to smear Hillary? “Hillary is “TANKING.” So, now “tanking” is their new ploy to try and get rid of Hillary. Too bad, we already know how wrong they are.

    If Hillary is “TANKING,” how it is she already has ALL the electoral votes she needs to win the election?

    The only thing tanking is this country, thanks to the GOP. The only tanking going on is the GOP party.

    I find it quite amusing that the same pundits who have maniacally focused on getting rid of Hillary use a word like “tanking.” You know exactly where that comes from? Tank? Oil tank? Oil? Koch Industries?

    Reply
    1. FireBaron September 18, 2015

      How can you tell when a GOP candidate is telling a lie? His (or her) lips are moving! The real scary thing is they are following Joseph Goebbels’ old belief – if you tell the same lie often enough and loudly enough people will believe it to be the truth.

      The GOP does not encourage its followers to find out the real story on their own. They continually shout loud enough that their followers believe every word that pours out of their oral orifices! Often the quality of what they spew becomes interchangeable with that which exudes from the other orifice!

      Reply
      1. Eleanore Whitaker September 18, 2015

        The face and back room agenda of the GOP today is to turn the US government into a corporation headed by a CEO. Every word out of the GOP’s mouth is linked to corporations. And why not? When every dollar of corporate campaign donations is the only reason the GOP is able to remain in government?

        At present, the GOP flies ever closer to anarchy. When you sabotage not 1 but 2 Dem presidents, threaten both with impeachment, obstruct and slash and burn everything the Executive branch tries to do for the people of this country, you bet that’s anarchy, however veiled the GOP tries to pretend it isn’t.

        Give the GOP a chance and we will all have no retirements, work 12 hour days for minimum wage and end up handing back 90% of our paychecks to taxes that only support corporations.

        At what point did it EVER become the obligation of US taxpayers to keep businesses in existence?

        Reply
        1. David September 18, 2015

          Eleanore!!! You mean that the Demorats don’t get any campaign donations from corporations? If we continue to give the Demorats power, we will all be part-time workers and handing 90% of our paychecks to pay for Obomocare.
          At what point did it EVER become the obligation of US taxpayers to keep the illegal aliens comfortable, housed, clothed and fed?

          Reply
          1. jmprint September 18, 2015

            SInce your ancestors arrived in American.

            Reply
          2. David September 19, 2015

            Sorry DA, my ancestors were NOT illegal aliens. How is your burrito?

            Reply
          3. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

            David is a liar. His state is Texas. There isn’t a Texan in that state who doesn’t have Mexican blood. David, like all right wingers is a liar.

            He’s no Mayflower descendant. He’ll tell you he’s TEXAN…what the hell is that if not from Mexican immigrants who were in TEXAS before this David asshats ancestors EVER got there.

            According to the these Texas blowhards, being Texan is a breed that came from inbreeding with their Mommies, sisters and aunties. In other words, they try to prove pure Texan blood. IN their dreams. Either they are bred from Native Americans, Mexicans or their ancestors were indentured slaves from England. Take your pick little cowboy.

            Reply
          4. David September 19, 2015

            Eleanore!!! “Little cowboy”? I am at least 5’0″ tall. That is a cruel, hurtful thing to say. Shouldn’t the PC term be, “vertically challenged”?
            Actually, quite a few of the early white immigrants to Texas were from Tennessee, e.g. Davey Crockett. Our ancestors were from many of the southern states that were part of the Union at that time. There were those who bred with the Texican women who were here. You know how women can be. They are always spreading things around and conniving to get their way. We men have been having to deal with women since Eve.

            Reply
          5. charleo1 September 19, 2015

            Well there you go! I can’t speak for everyone. But that women have a way of dealing with these things of yours, did it for me!

            Reply
          6. jmprint September 20, 2015

            What you don’t realize is that most signers of the Texas constitution were in TEXAS illegally. Yes they were illegally in TEXAS

            Reply
          7. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

            They were not pure bred Texans unless you are from an incestuous relationship from your Mutton Chops Big Daddies. What a phony you are.

            Reply
          8. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

            Jim …David is a blowhard, phony cowboy from Texas. He hasn’t seen the assend of a cow in his entire life. He got religion after a wayward youth like all male Texas blowhards who spent their youth boozing, womanizing, gamblin’ and visitin’ that little house out on the range.

            He lives in a world of denial. He’d have you believe that his pedrigree is pure Texan. Think about that. Texas was Mexican territory for centuries and Mexico was the land of the Aztecs and before that the Mayans.

            David’s ancestors were likely indentured slaves shipped to the Colonies because his grandpappies owed tons of money they couldn’t pay. He’ll brag, blow his horn, show off and mouth off like all Texan men always do.

            But the truth is there is NO SUCH THING as a pure Texan.

            Reply
    2. itsfun September 19, 2015

      Maybe her poll numbers?

      Reply
  9. itsfun September 18, 2015

    Telling lies is not unique to the Republicans: If you like your doctor you can keep your doctor, if you like you health insurance you can keep your health insurance. I did not have sex with that woman. The Benghazi attack was caused by a u-tube video. Lies are common to both sides and have become a terrible part of our political system. Probably one of the reason the “outsiders” are doing so well in the Republican polls. I sense the same would be true if a “outsider” was running for President on the Democratic side of the aisle.

    Reply
    1. pisces63 September 18, 2015

      I really get tired of lies and half truths. Obama did not sell those insurances, gather premiums, pay claims, etc. HE did not drop them. The greedy insurance companies did. White men at the helm. Why didn’t you go after them? MY company used that time in between passage and implementation to revamp our insurance products. It started with extending coverage to children on their parent’s contracts. I have had my same insurance since 1987 and had my primary physician through 1997. She moved up and I got another in her group. since then, now, 2005, I have had ten and it had not one damned thing to do with ACA. Benghazi is trumped up lunacy because a black man was in office, period. If the right REALLY cared, they would have demanded investigations into the 10+ under Bush II with close to 100 dead. Most lies are caused by bigots and idiots. Those who pick and choose what to complain about but ignore worse atrocities. One other physician I loved just retired. Another moved to their Florida facility.

      Reply
      1. itsfun September 18, 2015

        Yep; the evil white males are just terrible. Just keep playing your BS race card, it doesn’t work anymore. People are sick of you kind of BS. Everytime someone doesn’t agree with obama, you call them bigots or racists. Keep up you name calling, it just show how much of a racist and bigot you are.

        Reply
        1. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

          You play your BS card and I will continue to knock hell out of your lies and distortions. Your GOP has proven what a bunch of nut freaks they are.

          They and you can’t be reasoned with, refuse to act like grown men and then you want to bash Obama who saved you and your inbreds from disaster your GOP president caused in the first place. Don’t bother to try to rewrite history. We lived it.

          The GOP is going down in flames and it’s their own fault.

          Reply
          1. itsfun September 19, 2015

            You just know how to play the race and gender card. You keep posting your BS and I will, as I did last week prove you are wrong, and educate you. By the way, where is my thank you for teaching you the difference between impeachment and removal from office?

            Reply
          2. David September 19, 2015

            I also had to teach Eleanore that Texas was an independent nation from 1836-1845. She is factually challenged.

            Reply
          3. itsfun September 19, 2015

            She is a piece of work.

            Reply
          4. David September 19, 2015

            Actually a divorced spinster living in New Joisey!

            Reply
          5. itsfun September 19, 2015

            What man could stay with her? As much as she hates men, I am surprised she married one.

            Reply
          6. David September 19, 2015

            Apparently no man could stay with her! I don’t blame him!

            Reply
          7. midmo September 19, 2015

            You are quite the little troll.

            Reply
          8. David September 19, 2015

            Eleanore!!! Did the GOP go down in flames last November? We need some more of that! If that happens many more times, there won’t be any more Demorats to talk about?

            Reply
    2. charleo1 September 18, 2015

      The truth is 99% of people did keep their doctor, and the company insurance plans. Obamacare didn’t change that. And has provided coverage to 16 million, and slowed the increase in cost of all healthcare across the board. And lying about an affair you’re having with an adult aid, is kind of like lying about WMDs. Except in the one case, no one was killed. And there actually were riots over an inflammatory anti-muslim video throughout the entire Mid-East. Including in Tripoli, Cabal, Bagdad, Cairo, and in the West Bank of Palestine, the very day the embassy in Benghazi Libya was attacked. So why did they attack the embassy?Do they need an excuse? And why does it matter so much to the Right Wingers? And did George Bush really keep the Nation safe?

      Reply
      1. David September 18, 2015

        What? Obomo even admitted that he lied! You honestly think 99% are keeping their doctors and insurance plans?
        Check out: nationalcenter.org
        Bloomberg.com
        dailycaller.com

        Reply
        1. David September 18, 2015

          They admit that a “movie” didn’t ignite the Benghazi attack. It was planned and well organized. “But at this point, what difference does it make?”.

          Reply
          1. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

            How many Benghazi embassy attacks occurred on Bush’s watch right under his and your stupid nose? By the DOD’s count? 11…in just 8 Bush years. Some of which resulted in deaths and injuries. But who expect a big mouth blowhard Texan liar like you to know the truth or have the balls to admit it? Keep living in fantasyland. We all know your days of booze and glory are over.

            Reply
          2. David September 19, 2015

            Eleanore!!! Booze and glory? Specifically, what booze are you referring to? And, what glory? Are you referring to Scotch? Are you referring to the fact that the same people you relentlessly attack in your daily rants built this country?
            At least none of the attacks that occurred during the Bush administration were caused by a movie.

            Reply
      2. itsfun September 18, 2015

        Every country in the world said there were WMD’s. Have you done any research on the obama health care tax? You must be the only person left in the world that is blaming a u-tube video for Benghazi. Americans were murdered in Benghazi, maybe that is why right wingers care. Maybe Americans don’t like the fact the President and the Secretary of State lied about Benghazi.

        Reply
        1. jmprint September 18, 2015

          Billions of dollars later (your tax dollars at work) there is still no proof.

          Reply
        2. dtgraham September 19, 2015

          During the George W Bush administration, there were 13 attacks on various American embassies and consulates around the world. Sixty people died. How many of those did right wingers care about? Do you know?

          Reply
          1. itsfun September 19, 2015

            I would hope everyone would care about the people killed. I doubt if anyone wants to see people murdered. But as you seem to believe all right wingers, want to push seniors over the cliff, hate all minorities, are waging a war on women, etc.

            Reply
          2. dtgraham September 19, 2015

            I don’t recall hearing anything about the embassy attacks and deaths during the Bush Presidency from Fox News or any other conservative media outlet, be it talk radio or the internet.

            Reply
          3. itsfun September 20, 2015

            Same can be said about attacks and deaths during the Obama administration. MSNBC liberal talk shows and liberal internet sites.

            Reply
          4. dtgraham September 20, 2015

            Wrong. If there was no Fox News, I’d still know one heck of a lot about Benghazi from MSNBC. They’re good at picking up the fake puffed up bombast from the right. The kind that Fox ignores from the left, even though the left’s concerns are generally more rooted in reality.

            Reply
          5. itsfun September 20, 2015

            Every day FOX news has interviews with both a left and right winger going at it. FOX doesn’t ignore the left at all. The best way to learn what each side stands for is to watch interviews and debates with both sides of a issue.

            Reply
          6. itsfun September 19, 2015

            Looks like Obama has had his share of attacks since he took office.

            This is a list of American embassies attacked. This list is from wikipedea.org/wiki/attacks+on_u.s._diplomatic.facilities.

            It hasn’t been updated to include the attack on 8/1/15 in Istanbul, Turkey.

            Attacks on U.S. diplomatic facilities

            From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

            (Redirected from Terrorist attacks on U.S. diplomatic facilities)

            The United States maintains numerous embassies and consulates around the world, many of which are in war-torn countries or other dangerous areas.

            Contents

            1 Diplomatic Security

            2 Attacks on US diplomatic facilities

            3 See also

            4 References

            Diplomatic Security

            The Regional Security Office is staffed by Special Agents of the Diplomatic Security Service (DSS), and is responsible for all security, protection, and law enforcement operations in the embassy or consulate. The Regional Security Officer (RSO) is the senior DSS Special Agent in country and is the principal adviser to the Chief of Mission (generally an Ambassador or Consul General)
            on all security, law-enforcement, and counter-terrorism issues for that
            country or region. The RSO is responsible for liaising with the host
            government’s security and law enforcement officials. The RSO is
            supported by technical security specialists and a force of local guards.

            Attacks on US diplomatic facilities

            This list is incomplete; you can help by expanding it.

            18 July 1924
            Tehran, Sublime State of Persia
            An angry mob of led by members of the Muslim clergy and including
            many members of the Iranian Army beat Robert W. Imbrie, United States
            Consul in Tehran, to death. The mob blamed America for poisoning a well.[1]
            mob
            1

            27 January 1958
            Ankara, Turkey
            Bombing in embassy compound[2]

            none

            January 31, 1968
            Saigon, Vietnam
            As part of the Tet Offensive, Viet Cong commandos forced their way onto the US Embassy grounds and surrounded the building until US reinforcements arrived.
            armed assault
            5 US security

            20 attackers

            26 September 1971
            Phnom Penh, Cambodia
            Attack on embassy softball game[3]

            1

            1972
            Manila, Philippines
            Attack by communist group, Marine guard wounded[4]

            none

            19 August 1974
            Nicosia, Cyprus
            Riot outside Embassy; Ambassador and assistant shot by sniper

            2

            4 August 1975
            Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
            Japanese Red Army gunmen raid Embassy

            none

            1979
            Tehran, Iran
            Iran hostage crisis

            21 November 1979
            Islamabad, Pakistan
            Islamist riots destroy Embassy (see 1979 U.S. Embassy Burning in Islamabad)

            2

            2 December 1979
            Tripoli, Libya
            Islamist riots destroy Embassy (see 1979 U.S. Embassy Burning in Libya)

            none

            18 April 1983
            Beirut, Lebanon
            Islamic Jihad car bomb destroys Embassy (see April 1983 U.S. Embassy bombing)

            63 (of which 17 were Americans)

            12 December 1983
            Kuwait City, Kuwait
            al-Dawa truck bomb outside Embassy

            6

            20 September 1984
            Beirut, Lebanon
            Hezbollah car bomb outside embassy (see 1984 United States embassy annex bombing)

            24

            November 1984
            Bogota, Colombia
            Car bomb outside Embassy planted by drug cartel

            1

            February 1986
            Lisbon, Portugal
            Popular Forces of 25 April car bomb outside Embassy

            none

            14 May 1986
            Jakarta, Indonesia
            Japanese Red Army mortar barrage

            none

            9 June 1987
            Rome, Italy
            Japanese Red Army mortar barrage

            none

            17 September 1989
            Bogota, Colombia
            RPG fired on Embassy by unknown assailant

            none

            27 July 1993
            Lima, Peru
            Car bomb outside Embassy planted by Shining Path
            bombing
            none

            13 September 1995
            Moscow, Russia
            RPG fired on Embassy by unknown assailant
            bombing
            none

            21 June 1998
            Beirut, Lebanon
            RPGs fired at Embassy by Hezbollah
            bombing
            none

            7 August 1998
            Nairobi, Kenya
            al-Qaeda simultaneously attacked both Embassies with truck bombs (more details)
            bombing
            213, including 10 US personnel and 2 US security

            Dar es Salaam, Tanzania
            11

            22 January 2002
            Calcutta, India
            Harkat-ul-Jihad al-Islami gunmen attacked American cultural centre, which included public affairs office of nearby US Consulate (more details)
            armed assault
            5 Indian security

            14 June 2002
            Karachi, Pakistan
            al-Qaeda truck bomb detonated outside Consulate (more details)
            bombing
            12 Pakistani civilians

            12 October 2002
            Denpasar, Indonesia
            Consular Office bombed by Jemaah Islamiyah as part of the Bali bombings
            bombing
            none

            28 February 2003
            Karachi, Pakistan
            Unknown gunmen attack US Consulate (more details)
            armed assault
            2 Pakistani security

            30 June 2004
            Tashkent, Uzbekistan
            Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan bombs US Embassy
            bombing
            none

            6 December 2004
            Jeddah, Saudi Arabia
            al-Qaeda gunmen raid diplomatic compound
            armed assault
            5 Saudi personnel

            4 attackers

            2 March 2006
            Karachi, Pakistan
            Car bomb explodes outside Consulate, killing a US diplomat (more details)
            bombing
            1 US personnel

            1 Pakistani personnel

            1 Pakistani security

            1 attacker

            12 September 2006
            Damascus, Syria
            Gunmen raid US Embassy
            armed assault
            1 Syrian security

            3 attackers

            12 January 2007
            Athens, Greece
            RPG Fired at Embassy by Revolutionary Struggle
            bombing
            none

            18 March 2008
            Sana’a, Yemen
            Mortar rounds missed US Embassy, hitting nearby school
            bombing
            2 Yemeni civilians

            9 July 2008
            Istanbul, Turkey
            Armed attack against Consulate (more details)
            armed assault
            3 Turkish security

            3 attackers

            17 September 2008
            Sana’a, Yemen
            A coordinated attack resulted in a 20-minute battle with security (more details)
            armed assault
            6 Yemeni security

            5 Yemeni civilians

            1 US civilian

            6 attackers

            5 April 2010
            Peshawar, Pakistan
            An attack near the U.S. Consulate in Peshawar, Pakistan, kills two consulate security guards and at least six others (more details)
            armed assault
            2 Pakistani personnel

            1 Pakistani security

            1 Pakistani civilian

            4 attackers

            11 September 2012
            Cairo, Egypt
            Protestors scaled the walls of the Consulate and replaced the US
            flag with an Islamist banner before being driven back by Egyptian
            security (more details)
            mob
            none

            Benghazi, Libya
            A group of terrorists storm the US Consulate in Benghazi, Libya —
            killing the U.S. Ambassador, one staff member, and two security
            contractors (more details)
            armed assault
            4 US personnel

            14 September 2012
            Sana’a, Yemen
            Protestors stormed the US Embassy and set fire to several vehicles before being driven back by Yemeni security (more details)
            mob
            5 attackers

            Tunis, Tunisia
            Tunisian police fought back protestors who attacked the US Embassy in Tunis (more details)
            mob
            2 attackers

            1 February 2013
            Ankara, Turkey
            A suicide bomber attacked the US Embassy in the Turkish capital,
            Ankara, on Friday, detonating himself inside a security entrance to the
            compound (more details)
            bombing
            1 Turkish security

            1 attacker

            13 September 2013
            Herat, Afghanistan
            A group of 7 Taliban militants attacked the US Consulate in Herat,
            Afghanistan using truck bombs, assault rifles, and rocket-propelled
            grenades, killing 2 Afghan security guards and wounding 20 others (more details)

            Reply
          7. dtgraham September 20, 2015

            We know all this. I don’t know what the point of your post is other than to say that as long as the U.S. keeps consulates in dangerous unstable parts of the world that don’t particularly like Americans, there will always be attacks and deaths. Republicans only care about the attacks and deaths that happen during Democratic administrations.

            Reply
          8. itsfun September 20, 2015

            All I ever read here is about the 13 attack during the Bush administration. I have never seen anyone post about the attacks during the Obama administration except for Benghazi. I don’t know how many people are Republicans or Democrats, but I find it hard to believe every Republican doesn’t care about the attacks when Republicans are in office. Are you saying Democrats only care about deaths and attacks when Republicans are in office?

            Reply
          9. dtgraham September 20, 2015

            Wrong again. The left never makes this an issue because it’s assumed on our side that whatever administration happens to be in office, they have the best interests of the diplomats at heart and wouldn’t purposely put them in harm’s way.

            This kind of thing only became an issue on Sept 11, 2012 due to political reasons. The left only brings up the Bush embassy attacks whenever the right drags out Benghazi again. It’s simply in response, to show how baseless Benghazi is. Otherwise we don’t fault Bush for those attacks.

            Reply
          10. itsfun September 20, 2015

            I said I haven’t seen anything on here about attacks during the Obama administration. I haven’t seen anything, so I am not wrong.

            Reply
          11. dtgraham September 21, 2015

            You won’t either because it’s not an issue. Republicans never used to make this an issue until Sept 11 2012. They didn’t during the Clinton 90’s, which is one of the precious few things that they didn’t during that time, but the hyper-partisan ante keeps getting upped.

            Reply
          12. itsfun September 21, 2015

            Republicans didn’t make 9/11 an issue. Some on the left to this day blame George Bush and even say it was something he planned. That is as stupid as blaming FDR for Pearl Harbor.

            Reply
          13. dtgraham September 22, 2015

            No wonder Republicans didn’t make 9/11 an issue. Look who the President was. Democrats didn’t either. I think that was the right thing to do although they could have made a little hay out of it in the years to come, if only to combat this ‘Bush kept us safe narrative’.

            When Jeb Bush told Trump in the last debate that his brother kept us safe, Trump should have looked at Jeb and said, “on Sept 11 2001 who was the President?” That’s exactly what I was thinking at the time.

            Reply
          14. JPHALL September 21, 2015

            So post them and forget Benghazi!

            Reply
          15. itsfun September 21, 2015

            I did post them, but I won’t forget Benghazi.

            Reply
          16. JPHALL September 22, 2015

            YOU NEVER POST VERIFIABLE LINKS.

            Subject: Re: Comment on When Liars Debate, The Truth Always Loses

            Reply
        3. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

          No liar boy…EVERY country of the world did not. The Iraqi government said over and over they didn’t have WMDs. What the hell did you think that meant?

          As for your cries of desperation to lob Benghazi on Hillary, I see how unable you are to face the reality that during the Bush Administration 11…go that Joy Boy? 11 embassies were attacked in 8 years and there were dozens of deaths. Where the hell was your mouth then? Or do you just look for ways to ignore your own irresponsible, reckless behavior?

          Reply
          1. itsfun September 19, 2015

            So, you believe the Iraqi government over the American government and other governments. Maybe you are living in the wrong country. Are you saying Hillary didn’t say the attack was caused by a video? Its a terrible thing when our embassies are attacked during any administration. My mouth then was saying kill the attackers. If someone breaks into your house with the intention of murdering you, its a good idea to kill them first. By the way do you need anymore education on the constitution? You never did thank me for educating you.

            Reply
          2. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

            No..I believe the US 9/11 Commission’s findings that there WERE NO WMDS.

            You are the one living on the wrong planet. You voted twice for a 3-time Texas failure who lied about WMDs. But now, you are assuming only you know the truth? How insane are you?

            I’m saying that you are persisting in trying to get rid of Hillary. What Hillary did or didn’t saying about that video is all you really have to nail her to the wall.

            Are you as willing to do the same to that EFF up Wyoming ASShat VP, Cheney? who lied, made back room deals with thugs of Halliburton to get himself into the White House where only you deny he was the real back room president?

            How about you get an education not provided by the CONfederate school books? Many people around the world said the very same thing about that video. You are a real jerk aren’t you?

            You are not going to get rid of Hillary. When she is YOUR president, Mr. Testosteronie, men like you are going to be suffering terminal constipation. Nothing you say or do is valid. Nothing you post is valid. Nothing you try to do or say about Hillary is going to change her position as the No. 1 choice of sane, rational Americans. Eat your heart out.

            Reply
          3. itsfun September 19, 2015

            I have never posted one word about Cheney or how I feel about him. I have posted who I voted for and won’t. Unlike you I believe in the secret ballot. No one needs to try to get rid of Hillary, she is doing a great job of that her self.

            Reply
        4. charleo1 September 19, 2015

          That was Bush’s excuse. That everyone else thought there was an effort afoot by the Saddam regime to reconstitute a nuclear, and biological weapons program. But that assertion does not fit the facts. Nor does it explain why there was such a push for any evidence supporting the idea of WMDs. Or the acceptance as fact of even untrustworthy evidence, like the yellowcake from Niger, or the aluminum tubes. Both disproved as false before Bush presented them as fact to the Nation, in his State of the Union speech in early 2003. The facts show, not an administration looking to get at the truth, but an administration seeking any ‘excuse’ they could find, to puff up, and make a case for preemptive war. And of course the harder truth is, when a President, any U.S. President, commits 150,000 troops, spends north of 3 trillion dollars, hundreds of thousands of civilians are killed, and millions more are displaced as a result. And, an entire region in one of the most volatile regions in the World is turned upside down. He had better get it right, period. And, in my opinion, these so called Conservatives in this Country, after Iraq, had better start taking a serious look at themselves. And do some reevaluating on what it is they choose to care about. Why did they attack our embassy? They hate us. How does that strike you as reason enough? Why does it matter? Does the Right believe the reason is so important, we should sit down with them, and ask? So please tells us, why did you attack our embassy? Have they invited any of this terrorist group to appear in front of the now years long Benghazi inquiry, and ask them? It’s ludicrous! The entire Benghazi thing is so politicized at this point, they should be embarrassed to carry on with it.

          Reply
          1. itsfun September 19, 2015

            When someone breaks into you home with guns and wants to murder you, its probably a good idea to kill them first.

            Reply
          2. charleo1 September 19, 2015

            Right, if they are breaking into your home. However, if they just happen to live in the same general neighborhood, but had nothing to do with your home being burglarized, But do coincidentally have some nice things you’d like to get our hands on. Then, I think to accuse them of wanting to break into your home, and going to their house and shooting them for what you think they’re going to do, is an entirely different thing. Who’s the criminal in that scenario, is my point. Let’s not completely overlook the fundamental fact here. Saddam Hussain was telling the truth, and Bush was wrong. And why is that so important? Because now, many of the same people, same political affiliation, are back making much the same charges, claiming to have the same slam dunk proof against Iran, they once claimed to have with Iraq. Again using their own private sources. And again asking the American public to trust them. That they have it right, and everyone else that signed the deal has it wrong. That the President has it wrong. The UN has it wrong. That the IAEA has it wrong. So we’re supposed to ignore all these others, and trust those, that already got it absolutely wrong before. See where I’m coming from?

            Reply
          3. itsfun September 19, 2015

            Are you saying Saddam was telling the truth, even though it has been proven he used Chemicals on his own people? Do you have any idea how easy it would be to bury chemicals in a hole in the sand or just put them in a truck and send them Syria or another neighboring country? Now you believe Iran is just a wonderful government and they will completely abide by this deal. Obama and Kerry couldn’t even get 4 American hostages back. How do you think they will get Iran to not build a nuclear bomb (who knows, they may already have one). How will they use the 150 billion? Maybe to get North Korea to give them the knowledge to build a bomb or just buy one from North Korea. Those people hate America and have vowed to murder all of us.

            Reply
          4. charleo1 September 19, 2015

            You haven’t addressed the main point here. That there were thousands of ongoing inspections lasting years after the first Gulf War. Long after the chemical attacks on the Kurds took place, a short time after the end of the first Gulf War. These weapons were stock piled and destroyed in the mid nineties. And verifiably so. No one disputes this. The case the Bush team was trying to make, was Saddam was reconstituting his WMD programs, both nuclear, and biological. For which there was no empirical evidence to this fact, only speculation based on testimony, as we found out later, elicited from an Iraqi ex-pat code named curve ball. Who hoped for a green card to relocate in Denver CO. This info was all kept out of the press, and away from the Congressional Committees charged with oversight of the intelligence concerning WMDs. The word from the Bush Administration was trust us. We haven’t got a smoking gun exactly. But, if you insist we wait on that, “the smoking gun could be mushroom cloud.” Their words.
            So no, I don’t trust the Iranians. And I don’t think of them as wonderful people. But to a point in their favor, they’ve yet to lie to me. Which is more than I can say for the Neocons.

            Reply
          5. midmo September 19, 2015

            This right here shows, to me at least, your other comments are lies. You don’t care about both sides lying,you only care what your right wing leaders tell you to care about.

            Reply
          6. itsfun September 20, 2015

            How so?

            Reply
          7. JPHALL September 19, 2015

            So where are these weapons? The Iraqis could really use them now.

            Reply
          8. itsfun September 20, 2015

            They won’t need them, they will have a nuclear bomb soon enough. Seems like I read that one of the terrorist groups used chemicals in the last 30 – 60 days.

            Reply
          9. JPHALL September 21, 2015

            Where did you read this? Please submit the source for your statement, and I hope it is not some right wing cess pool of misinformation. Subject: Re: Comment on When Liars Debate, The Truth Always Loses

            Reply
          10. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            In my line of work what itsfun exhibits is called “cognitive slippage”

            Definition: Cognitive slippage is a symptom of several psychiatric diseases and mental disorders associated with cognition and formal thought disorders. It is manifested in patterns of speech, where categories and lists become overly broad as concepts unrelated at first glance become related through tangential connections.

            This is why I advise people here take care avoid getting to agitated with this kind of poster

            Reply
          11. JPHALL September 21, 2015

            I believe that is true.

            Subject: Re: Comment on When Liars Debate, The Truth Always Loses

            Reply
          12. David September 19, 2015

            You are right! At this point, what difference does it make?

            Reply
          13. charleo1 September 19, 2015

            It serves to enforce a politically motivated narrative. See, the Right didn’t set out to merely defeat Obama, But to, as Jim DeMint, the then Senator from S. Carolina put it, “To break him.”
            So in this narrative, Obama was to be a fraud, an illegitimate usurper. In short, a liar, that they the Patriots on Right, intended to expose. So by this, they claimed he lied about his birth certificate, his college education, his religion, to close Gitmo, about not trying to take over the economy, to own GM. Or trying to turn us into Greece, by redistributing wealth. So the attack on Benghazi, or any incident of like kind here or abroad, would have been politicized. As Benghazi was immediately by Romney the very following morning, before any of the facts were in. Can we imagine the Right, if the Ben Laden raid has resulted in deaths, or capture of Special Operations Troops? Instead they downplay it’s success as a given. Obama’s decision to go in, as a low risk no brainer, a child could have made. It’s a form of propaganda.

            Reply
    3. 1standlastword September 18, 2015

      Apparently, this is all too subtle and sophisticated for you. You might be one of the first to exchange your ballot for the bullet

      Reply
      1. itsfun September 18, 2015

        I was pointing out how both sides lie.

        Reply
        1. 1standlastword September 18, 2015

          Get back to us after the democratic debates and then let’s talk specifics

          Reply
          1. itsfun September 19, 2015

            Benghazi was because of a video for one.

            Reply
          2. Bren Frowick September 20, 2015

            You can keep on making that claim, but it has long since been disproven. In fact, the attack on Benghazi WAS inspired, at least in part, by the video, according to both the testimony of one of the leaders of the attack, and in the context of the time, when it had inspired protests across the Arab world. To keep on claiming “it’s a lie” is, itself, a lie of the first order, flying in the face of all the facts, logic ,and reason.

            Reply
          3. itsfun September 20, 2015

            Oh come on man. Next you will tell us he didn’t say you can keep you doctor if you like your doctor. You can keep your insurance plan if you like you insurance plan. How about drawing a red line. I suppose he didn’t say that either.

            Reply
          4. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            It appears that what’s fun for you (itsfun) is getting the other people’s panties in a bundle with your perpetually vapid sophomoric commentary.

            I won’t dignify it!!!

            And they too should stop.

            So consider yourself on ignore until you get serious of get brains whichever comes first!

            Reply
          5. itsfun September 20, 2015

            Never let the facts get in your way. Go ahead and ignore me, I really couldn’t care less.

            Reply
    4. jmprint September 18, 2015

      itsfun, America is a GREAT country, it is just as great if not better then 2005, 2006, 2007. The only problem is that people are more vocal about their hate, and the religious right think they have the market on heaven. You have been repeating yourself for over three years, same three subjects, that don’t change the greatness of this country, but with those three: Benghazi, Insurance fault, and you still haven’t gotten over Clinton’s fondling, really that’s all that you can cry about. You really need to grow up, and grow a pair and become a productive, loving citizens. Democrats are pretty solid in their opinion, they believe the government is for the people, by people and not for the corporations by the corporations.

      Reply
      1. itsfun September 18, 2015

        I will comment on what I want to. If you don’t like it, just don’t read my posts. My post was saying both sides tell lies. I pointed out some lies by democrats because everyone else was posting lies by republicans. Its really none of your business what I want to post on. I just love how the people like you preach tolerance, then can’t practice it. Many would say democrats are for high taxes and give away programs for those who earn nothing. Just to make sure you understand I WILL POST WHAT I WANT AND WHEN I WANT.

        Reply
        1. jmprint September 18, 2015

          Didn’t you hear the lies last on Wednesday? This is what you call current, and your cries are history.

          you say: Many would say democrats are for high taxes and give away programs for those who earn nothing

          Do you really think we want to pay more taxes. Think about this; The rich have been getting richer for a long while. The profits and rules have changed tremendous toward the top pay, and the workers have been stagnated, by not increasing minimum wage. If minimum wage had been raised with inflation, as it was before, we would not have this inequality. When the middle and lower income make more money the economy is better. When the rich get richer, they invest overseas, and that does not help our economy. They do not deserve to make 1000% percent more then you and I, when we do all the work, most of those ceo’s are employees as well. The republican want to pass a bill that decrease the amount of tax the rich pay, and when they do that, you and I have to make up the difference.

          Now on giving away free stuff, first please understand that there is greed, and laziness and every office has employees that are not up to potential and fraud happens, but the programs that we support are programs to help the needy people.

          I never before voted party line, I voted for the individual, but since the conception of the tea-party a lot of hate, bigotry and lies being told to advance their agenda mainly false religion, I cannot and will not vote for any republican especially, because they are told what to say and what to think.

          itsfun, I am not one to tell you that your opinion doesn’t matter, it’s just not right to not tell the truth.

          Reply
          1. itsfun September 19, 2015

            Its not right for any politician to lie to us. That was my point. People were and are saying only one side has lied to us, my point was to show that both sides lie to us. You talk about the Democratic lies being history, have you read the responses to be about Bush? That must be history also. I have said many times that we are not voting for a individual, but for party leaders, because they all do what the party tells them to do. If they don’t do what the leaders tell them to do, then they get no more money for campaigns, do not get put on any committees, and generally have no say about what is going on. I truly believe that is why the “outsiders” are doing so great in the polls. People are sick and tired of sending people to Washington to watch them fall in line for the leaders. Its okay for us to disagree on the issues, that is what our way of life and government is all about. That is how compromises are made. Both sides need to be heard and actually listened to. Now we have votes that are almost completely or completely party oriented. That’s the party leaders getting in the way of Democracy.

            Reply
          2. Karen Bille-Golden September 19, 2015

            I hear what you are saying which I believe is, we need campaign reform. Meanwhile, what choice do we have but to vote on party platform hoping something we believe in will be accomplished? It’s disgraceful that the party I oppose can’t even feign interest in something being put forth by my party. The system is rigged and we should be outraged by that fact.

            Reply
          3. itsfun September 19, 2015

            You are right. Maybe getting more outsiders on ballots would help, but is hard to get outsiders on ballots, because they don’t have the money like Trump, Carson and Carly have. Getting rid of lobbyist should help. Our politicians are being bought. Look at their net worth when first elected and then look at their net worth after being in office. They get paid huge fees for speaking at a company party and that is legal. Then you see them vote for something that company wants. You are right the system is rigged.

            Reply
      2. David September 19, 2015

        Demorats believe that “…government is for the people…”!!! Ha! What absolute tripe! Demorats believe in government- the more, the better.

        Reply
    5. jtxl September 20, 2015

      that tired old excuse doesn’t work for educated people. Same as always doctors have the option to change which policies they will work with. This changed all the time in the past. I certainly had to change doctors 20yrs ago because my doctor stopped taking my insurance. The reality is that same as always, you can keep your doctor still applies as written in all the old policies. You always could and still can keep your doctor but you will have to pay the bill yourself. Nothing changed there. The only changes to policies has to have made them better. I have not met anyone who does not have a better policy than before. The old policies allowed them to be dropped for becoming ill. The old policies had a max out price that would not cover after a specified amount was spent. The old policies did not cover chronic illnesses. Why exactly would you want to keep that policy? For people who don’t want to spend anything on health care, there is a basic plan that costs $18 per month. It includes a yearly full checkup, physical, and blood work. The plan will also cover catastrophic so if you are in a fire and need long term care you will not lose your home. You will have to pay for doctor visits through the year if you have an ear infection or whatever but the money you spend on the policy pays for the services you get and at a very fair price. At an awesome rate if there is a catastrophe.
      You really care about Bill Clinton’s sex life??? seriously?? Maybe we should look in to your sex life and decide if you should be fired from your job, right? This makes me wonder why you are fantasying about Bill, really. If you want to be technical, He did not legally lie by the standards that were set by the republicans. The republicans specifically qualified the language sex to only cover intercourse and no other sex act. There never was intercourse so he did not lie. Again, why are you fantasying about Bill Clinton’s sex life? It certainly does not affect his job. Hillary has been found again to have not been at any fault in Benghazi. If you truely want to point fingers, point them at the republicans who defunded automatic Marines security and made them have to fill out forms and go thru red tape to get it back. This was actually done 3 times though ad the Pentagon approved Marines a 3 times. It was The ambassador- Scott Walker who turned down the Marines saying that he wanted to hire the local militia to do the security. This has never been allowed, having foreign troops provide sensitive government offices security so the answer was always no to which the ambassador would again apply for the same militia security. This would never have happened if the republicans had not defunded the security in the first place. What has come out of all of the investigations though is that several of the attackers were in that militia and if they had inside access, there would not have been time to burn and shred documents on American troop movements and identities and locations of spies. The only thing Hillary is guilty of is trying to protect the reputation and name of the ambassador by not blaming the victim even though it was his fault. These same facts come out no matter how many times the republicans investigate. There is nothing there. Should we reference when condoleza rice lied over and over saying saddam hussein caused 911 even though we knew this was not true. That saddam had weapons of mass destruction and that we had proof? Should we reference the fact that bush2 administration still today denies the fact that there was molten metal in the ruins of the World Trade Towers that could not have been caused by any jet fuel or contents of the buildings? Should we reference the fact that they said an airplane hit the pentagon and there were no airplane wreckage or even damage to the building where the wings should have hit? Should we reference that the offices that were hit held evidence and documents and witnesses to crimes by bush2 and cheney? Seriously.. who is the liar??? And you are thinking about what Bill Clinton does with his we we

      Reply
      1. itsfun September 20, 2015

        As much as you are preoccupied with a mans sex life makes me wonder if watch gay porno. My money in on you do.

        Reply
  10. pisces63 September 18, 2015

    I turned to the debates but when the question was asked of a participant, so and so said this about you, what do you think. I said are they kidding? These are adults and not elementary schoolers? I could just picture Suzy on the playground saying Lisa does not like you, nyah, nyah, nyah!!! I turned to Criminal Minds. I went back and forth but apparently missed nothing of substance.

    Reply
  11. Böcker September 18, 2015

    Tapper was more interested in starting fights between the candidates then to fact check them.

    Reply
    1. Jinmichigan September 20, 2015

      Fact check? We are talking about CNN here are we not? Fact check, is not in their vocabulary.

      Reply
  12. docb September 18, 2015

    Adolescent and childish…Attempting to pit on against the other..This is about the Future of America…Not a CV drop or he said she said lies!….Thought what I watched was abhorrent but to be expected from fux lite and the stumble-bum on stage!

    Reply
  13. jmprint September 18, 2015

    Next time Trump has a speech, look at his audience, they actually look like they do not want to be there. If you get a glimpse of the last one where the idiot mentions Obama as a Muslim, the audience is not liking his response, they are restless and looking everywhere else except the camera. Almost as if they are forced to be there, they are definitely not listening.

    Reply
    1. Karen Bille-Golden September 18, 2015

      I always look at his audience, many look stone faced and few are clapping

      Reply
    2. 1standlastword September 18, 2015

      Zombies

      Reply
    3. charleo1 September 19, 2015

      My guess is we’ve probably seen the last open mike night at a Trump rally. The question about what are you going to do about getting rid of the Muslims got all the press. But the other one about squatters using public lands, being unfairly charged for their use, was just as nutty. It’s called, let’s meet the Trump supporters! UGH!

      Reply
    4. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 20, 2015

      and the DONNY DUMP CLOWN talks about looks thy had 6 pack pics of him and his childish faces a true clown and needs to grow up . at the end of this all DONNY DUMP when he loses will set back and say OMG are you kidding me ? I won in the way I wanted to win I won because I didn’t want to win in the first place are you kidding the way I was to every one and talking all the B/S crap I was talking . cant you people see and know I never wanted to win this thing ? I just did this all so I could make back some money I lost on the gambling deal I messed up and never got in FL. so now I use all this PRES. B/S and its my write off for the IRS ( mark my words tis or something like this will be said by DONNY DUMP at his failed and fall at the end )

      Reply
      1. jtxl September 20, 2015

        I really don’t understand the support for trump over economics. He has gone bankrupt several times and screwed his debtors. The bankruptcy laws have changed making you still have to pay back the debts. Is his real motivation to run so he can get the law back to the old way so he can wipe his debts clear again?

        Reply
        1. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 21, 2015

          understand Donny Dump for what he is a CLOWN . I thought going bankrupt could only be done every 7 years . but his 4 times I believe was 2001, 2002.2003 and 2007 . im not rs but I be all 4 times was in less then 7 years . look at that face (of his ) ugly , childish , and heck while on it hanging down to his shoulders and going down fast from there lol

          Reply
          1. jtxl September 21, 2015

            it is kind of funny that he is so comfortable spewing insults about other peoples looks while he has such a distorted view of himself when he sees his own reflection. He has spent most of his life being told he is good looking by women he is paying to do so that he actually believes it. The comb-over didn’t used to be true, he had wolfman hairline like his sons where the hairline is halfway down the forehead and would camouflage that but now I see the side part very very low so I am not so sure anymore. He says he has plenty of money so why doesn’t he just get a transplant and if it is the low hairline, why not get electrolysys to get rid of it or transplant the forehead hair to the top of his head.

            Reply
          2. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 24, 2015

            for some reason he thinks making his mouth hang down to his shoulder he looks good ( in his mind only )he looking idiot . and the only bimbo now is his wife the other wqifes were bimbo’s but thy redeemed them self but getting away from him and are the smart ones that took the money from the clown he is the best move thy could of made

            Reply
        2. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 24, 2015

          as far as Donny dump see’s things he is the best thing he has ever had .

          Reply
  14. Eleanore Whitaker September 19, 2015

    The GOP showed who and what they are. I think Hillary’s commercial put them in proper perspective…a bunch of lunatic egotists all hogging the spotlight for their 10 seconds of fame.

    They never once mentioned a single issue that ALL Americans care about most. They can’t. If they did that, their billionaire campaign donors would be on their butts like white on rice.

    Reply
    1. David September 19, 2015

      Eleanore!!! Just what could be that “single issue that Americans care about most”? Well, for female Demorats, it has to be “Where does Hillary get her hair done?”.

      Reply
      1. Yvonne Phelan September 20, 2015

        Spoken like a true “Sexist”.

        Reply
        1. David September 20, 2015

          At $1200 per hair session at the salon, she’s the true “champion of the middle class”!

          Reply
          1. Bren Frowick September 20, 2015

            Are you shilling for the Fiorina campaign? She tried that “Her hair care is too expensive!” BS when she ran against Barbara Boxer for Senator in California. And we know how well THAT worked out…

            Reply
          2. David September 20, 2015

            Actually, laughing at the Demorat followers who idolize that insipid liar!

            Reply
          3. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 20, 2015

            now she just want through a car wash and YESSSSSSSS look at me now lol even DONNY DUMP says im beautiful

            Reply
          4. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 20, 2015

            and she looks good 😉

            Reply
          5. David September 20, 2015

            Not too bad — for her age!

            Reply
          6. Susan McGraw Keber September 20, 2015

            It sounds as though you work in the salon where she has her hair done but she’s not your client. By the way, are you a Kardashian fan?

            Reply
          7. Dominick Vila September 20, 2015

            Should we assume that you are also interested in The Donald’s hair style, and how much he pays for them?
            There are more substantive issues to discuss than haircuts.

            Reply
          8. David September 20, 2015

            How about discussing her proclivity for lying?

            Reply
          9. Dominick Vila September 21, 2015

            Would you care to mention some of her lies? Assuming that the attack against our consulate in Benghazi began as a result of an offensive Republican video was not a lie. It was acknowledged by al-Libby, the leader of the attack after we captured him entering his house. She acknowledged she had used her private server to send and receive e-mails, and that she had deleted personal, private, e-mails. BTW, the deleted e-mails were not scrubbed from her server and can be retrieved. Again, what “lies” are you talking about?
            Perhaps you should consider the crystal ball predictions being used to reject the Iran nuclear agreement, instead of focusing on the terms of the agreement. Or the justifications used to invade Iraq. Or the rationale used to replace Sunni Baathists with Shias aligned to Iran. Or giving a free-pass to Saudi Arabia, the homeland of the leader, planners, financiers, and most of the terrorists that carried out the 9/11 attack. Or the Iran-Contra scandal, and letting a Lt. Col. assume responsibility for U.S. foreign policy. Among other things.

            Reply
          10. David September 21, 2015

            I am so glad you asked!!! Let’s start cataloging SOME of Hildebeast’s lies. How about:
            Dodging sniper fire in Bosnia?

            Reply
          11. Dominick Vila September 21, 2015

            Is that the best you got? Hyperbole and opportunism are essential components in the art of politics, especially while campaigning.
            BTW, if VP Biden decides to run I will support his candidacy, otherwise I am leaning towards Bernie Sanders.

            Reply
          12. David September 21, 2015

            Not the best, just the first. “Hyperbole and opportunism”? Why not what it is — a lie?
            How about “flat broke when we left the Whitehouse.”?

            Reply
          13. Dominick Vila September 21, 2015

            That all depends on what her interpretation of being broke is. Needless to say, both her and her husband have done very well, financially, since they left the White House. Not because they have done anything wrong, but because of their intelligence and hard work, something that seems to be lacking in many Republicans.
            You are really preaching to the choir when you tell me things about Hillary. I am not impressed with her campaign and many of the decisions she has made, and I am not talking about trivia.

            Reply
          14. David September 21, 2015

            I am not impressed with her either. “Flat broke” and able to buy two multimillion homes (New York and Washington, D.C.). Maybe she knew how to live within her budget? You already mentioned the lie that “a movie” incited the attack on the Embassy. How about “I finally found those Rose Law Firm billing statements in a closet in the Whitehouse.”

            Reply
          15. Dominick Vila September 21, 2015

            I am a lot more concerned with her recent move to the far right on the Iran nuclear weapons agreement, than Rose Law firm statements.

            Reply
          16. David September 21, 2015

            Let’s leave it at we both have concerns about her!

            Reply
          17. jtxl September 20, 2015

            actually,that is a great example. She works hard for her money and if she gets a pricey haircut, she is paying someone in the middle class a good check. She is spending her own money, as much as the republicans love to take away our freedoms, she is still allowed to pay what she wants for a hair cut.

            Reply
          18. David September 20, 2015

            “Take away our freedoms”? Which is the party of big government?

            Reply
      2. Susan McGraw Keber September 20, 2015

        Apparently you need to explore the Democratic party and what their goals are for the American people. We’re hardly concerned with hairstyles and deeply concerned with the serious issues this country and planet face.

        Reply
        1. David September 20, 2015

          The main goal of the Demorat party is to turn the U.S. into another banana republic. They are doing a pretty good job. How is your burrito this afternoon? Press 1, if English. Press 2, if Spanish.

          Reply
          1. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            And what party was in office when the great recession happened?

            Or, was that a small fry event to you!??

            This party was also in office when the world suffered the Great Depression and you’re right…it did look like a banana republic

            Reply
          2. David September 20, 2015

            That is the equivalent of me reminding you of what party was in office when WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam involved us. Just remember what the Demorats say, “Vote early and vote often!”.

            Reply
          3. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            Obfuscation

            Reply
          4. David September 20, 2015

            Kinda like what you did!

            Reply
          5. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            You’re out of your league!

            lastword…cabrón

            Reply
          6. David September 20, 2015

            If you mean that because this league is comprised mainly of unthinking fools, then you are right!

            Reply
          7. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            Let me rip your azz one last time. Because you express yourself like a bigot you are naturally narrow minded and can’t help yourself…But let me assist!

            Commonly, people associate a banana republic with abject civilian poverty, thus my drawing your blunted intellect to the party of (G)reedy (O)ld (P)ricks that sponsored the two greatest economic disasters the modern world has ever seen

            Now I’m done!

            Reply
          8. David September 20, 2015

            “Sponsored”? Kinda like the Demorats “sponsored” war?
            Pack it in DA, YOU are out of YOUR league!

            Reply
          9. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            Naturally narrow minded and fatally stupid!!

            Financial affairs are sponsored and wars are prosecuted.

            Go back to your woods!!!

            Reply
          10. David September 20, 2015

            Where did you dream up that BS? “Sponsoring” and “”prosecuting” are exclusive to financial affairs and war.
            Still in school?

            Reply
          11. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

            Of course it doesn’t make sense to you…like I said…you’re out of your league

            And I’m bored playing tiddly winks with you…so long

            Reply
          12. David September 20, 2015

            Go play tiddlywinks elsewhere.

            Reply
          13. jtxl September 20, 2015

            the funny thing is that when racists like yourself get dna tested, you find out you are very much mixed race. When the test comes in, should we do as you would want and execute you?

            Reply
      3. jtxl September 20, 2015

        you are clearly confusing democrats with republicans. What we women care about are the actions that Hillary has taken. An example is that when she was 1st lady in Arkansas which had the highest infant mortality rate in the country, she completely turned that around. There was not tax money available for programs in such a poor state so she spent her own money and hired people and traveled through the mountains looking for the children who were raising children and taught them how to breastfeed, How to hold a baby. She taught nutrition and gave resources to these mothers so they could keep their children safe. That is only a very tiny example of the important work she has dedicated her life to. Apparently you have not seen many pictures of Hillary through her life to see that her hairstyle is not at the top of her list or the lists of her supporters.

        Reply
        1. David September 20, 2015

          “Important work”? Was that when she was taking care of”bimbo eruptions”?

          Reply
    2. petemobtv September 20, 2015

      Hillary Clinton? You STILL back Hillary Clinton? Jonathan Gruber is right. Most voters ARE stupid. You are proof.

      Reply
      1. jtxl September 20, 2015

        Hillary has spent her entire life working to make our lives better and to make the world a better place. When tax dollars were not available to pay for programs she thought were necessary, she spent Millions of her own money to pick up the slack. What exactly has any of the republican candidates done for us or the country? One thing for sure, they manage to line their pockets pretty heavily.

        Reply
        1. petemobtv September 20, 2015

          You make a good candidate for Jones Town.

          Reply
  15. Karen Bille-Golden September 19, 2015

    When we fall into the trap of calling one another liars, we need to step back and remember the definition of the word lie. There is lying and then there is making excuses. We’re good at offering excuses and not so much at detecting downright lies.

    Reply
    1. Jinmichigan September 20, 2015

      Fiorina is a flat out liar. At least on two subjects. 1. the outcome of her tenure at HP. 2. Anything she says about Planned Parenthood. None of what she said on either are excuses. Just flat out bold face lies.

      Reply
      1. Karen Bille-Golden September 20, 2015

        Likewise, as I responded above to esmith.. I agree she lied and I made a feeble attempt to point out that many people don’t recognize a lie when they hear one. Rather than calling out lies, excuses are made.

        Reply
        1. jtxl September 20, 2015

          I sometimes think this way but then I have to keep reminding myself that NOBODY can be that stupid

          Reply
          1. plc97477 September 21, 2015

            I beg to differ. The gotp is full of folks that are just that stupid.

            Reply
      2. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 20, 2015

        and she calls Mrs. Clinton one so much too funny I can lie and its ok but if you lie (and not proven ) your worse lol

        Reply
      3. silas1898 September 20, 2015

        The worst computer I ever owned was a Fiorina HP. It outlasted the warranty by two whole weeks.

        I’ll never buy another HP product.

        Reply
    2. esmith334 September 20, 2015

      Mrs. Fiorina reflects the broader misconceptions about “American exceptionalism” that Republicans crow about. As a contemporary of Mrs. Fiorina at AT&T in the 1980s, I witnessed how thousands of young, white women, like Fiorina, were recruited and placed on the so-called “fast track at AT&T and pushed up the management ranks at a breathtaking rate. Many of these women benefitted from a 1973 federal consent decree ruling that, among other things, allowed for the hiring and promotion of fifty white women before the hiring of one black male. I, a black male, discovered this when I filed a discrimination suit against AT&T following the breakup of the company. Scores of talented black men and women were passed over for promotions to implement that ruling. I don’t know how exceptional Mrs. Fiorina was at the time to warrant such a fast rise at AT&T, but a lot of black people didn’t think so. Forgive us, then, if we tend to hesitate in giving kudos to American exceptionalism.

      Reply
      1. Karen Bille-Golden September 20, 2015

        I apologize if my meaning wasn’t clear. I wasn’t in any way defending Ms Fiorina. My point wasn’t very well stated. I was trying to point to the fact that many are overlooking obvious lies.

        Reply
        1. esmith334 September 20, 2015

          Thank you. There is no need for an apology. Your point was well stated, as far as I am concerned. I simply was making another point.

          Reply
      2. jtxl September 20, 2015

        If I were around any of the republican candidates when they start spewing what they know are lies like what fiorina did with the tapes, I would be the first to stand up and call them out on “bearing false witness”

        Reply
    3. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 20, 2015

      or changing the truth and or making up truth that is I one’s simply mind . never close to the truth but thy think so . as for Christ CRISBY go’s save the country and fall asleep on jersy shore and have green peace roll you back in the water . OMG no good idea either could very well mess up the whole Sea

      Reply
  16. ivory69690@yahoo.com September 20, 2015

    sad when it come’s down to these GOP gang of idiots and racing to be front clown just saying what people want to hear . talking what one wants to hear and being able to do something about it and those things don’t matter first reason why is thy truly don’t want to do it anyways. and thy cant . now I say this and not many like it but still think of what for the country and not how you might feel about the person . the thing this country needs is a Bill Clinton move to put the country in a surplus . what ever Billy did when he left office this country had money in the bank and didn’t owe anyone nothing . thy should be talking about how to do that . and not just talking showing how it can be done . as it is now by owing China so much money to me I feel that it loses power on trade deals .

    Reply
    1. jtxl September 20, 2015

      When Bill Clinton was in office and the country was doing so well, The republicans were saying that bubba was to stupid to do so well and that Hillary was really the one running everything. What I would give for a montage tape of that.

      Reply
    2. jtxl September 20, 2015

      Well you know, sex is a capital crime……..personally, I don’t believe his sex life is my business and mine is not his business. The funniest thing is that Bill’s activities were normal but when the republicans are found out, it’s always some creepy deviant thing they are involved in. Like tapping your feet in a bathroom stall to get some strange. HA!

      Reply
  17. Carolyn Kay September 20, 2015

    We’ve already seen what happens when a lying liar is installed by the Supreme Court in the White House. Why would any American want that to happen again?

    Reply
  18. petemobtv September 20, 2015

    The biggest liars are Democrats. Shut up, nationalmemo…..you are helping destroy the GOP. At least THEY are pro-America.

    Reply
    1. charleo1 September 20, 2015

      The GOP don’t need no help from the NM in destroying themselves. They’ve got Trump.

      Reply
      1. 1standlastword September 20, 2015

        Moreover, their invitation to the Holy Father won’t amount to be like the big circle jerk they had with the Bibi orgy

        I expect it to bruise pretty badly!!!

        These people are experts at creating bad situations for themselves. If they crucify the Pope for upsetting their marketplace, turning over Koch money tables–they could loose the Catholic vote

        Paul Ryan and Johnny B not-so good might need absolution this week

        Reply
        1. jtxl September 20, 2015

          as a Catholic run out of my republican bigoted parish, I don’t think they will lose the Catholic vote. I do enjoy the scolding they get from the Pope but they are such deep hypocrites, it rolls right off. I still go to Mass but anonymously to other parish’s and not as often.

          Reply
        2. silas1898 September 20, 2015

          The Pope is only infallible when he agrees with Republican insanity.

          Reply
      2. petemobtv September 20, 2015

        “..don’t need no help”? You sound like you need a little more than an eighth education…I hope you don’t vote. You are dumb.

        Reply
        1. jtxl September 20, 2015

          I think you are being way to generous with the 8th grade education. I hear that from toddlers with no education but that is usually fixed by 1st grade.

          Reply
          1. charleo1 September 20, 2015

            I believe you’re supposed to stun your opponent with your cutting wit, and sarcasm. That was very lame.

            Reply
          2. jtxl September 20, 2015

            no just reality

            Reply
        2. charleo1 September 20, 2015

          I don’t have Trump, YOU have Trump. Now who needs an education?

          Reply
    2. Susan McGraw Keber September 20, 2015

      The GOP is imploding because they pander to the TEA PARTY zealots who are destroying the party and this country. Pro-America? War should not be “pro-America” and neither should be keeping the poor and disenfranchised down and out. If you want to be a proud American vote for what is right and just for ALL people. I’ll wager you need the very help the GOP/TEA PARTY is fighting to eliminate.

      Reply
      1. petemobtv September 20, 2015

        Grow up, Susan. The GOP is what the Dems USED to be, before they went Socialist (and by the way, Bernie is a Communist). The Tea Party is what the GOP was MEANT to be. Try reading a little bit more and don’t be one of the low information voters that you appear to be. You sound like one of those that Jonathan Gruber called out as a ‘stupid’ American. oh…war should not be ‘pro America’??? Seriously?

        Reply
        1. Harbinger08 September 20, 2015

          When Gruber was talking about stupid voters he was referring to the Republican ones, so actually he has been proved correct. You can argue with facts, but you’re still an idiot who won’t listen to reason and argues with facts. That sums up the average Tea Party voter. Good thing you’re in the minority now.

          Reply
          1. Siegfried Heydrich September 20, 2015

            This clown is just a troll. After reading about 4 or 5 of his posts, I blocked him. He’s not worth trying to converse with, as he’s really not interested in anything resembling a conversation.

            Reply
          2. petemobtv September 20, 2015

            That is because you live in a bubble and wouldn’t know what is truth if it bit you in the @$$! Democrats are sooo low life.

            Reply
          3. jtxl September 20, 2015

            democrats have been medically proved to use the parts of their brains used in higher thinking when discussing politics and republicans use only a very tiny part of the brain used for fear response when discussing politics. Sometimes we just have to accept that maybe you just aren’t capable of higher thinking and send you some cat videos to keep you entertained.

            Reply
          4. TZToronto September 20, 2015

            Uhh, what’s wrong with cat videos? Hey, I’m on your side, but cat videos are good entertainment!

            Reply
          5. jtxl September 22, 2015

            thanks for the humor. I needed that!

            Reply
          6. Harbinger08 September 20, 2015

            You are right, of course. When I find myself falling for it it is with the same sense of slight revulsion and lack of self control as when I catch myself picking at a scab that is better left alone.

            Reply
          7. petemobtv September 20, 2015

            Ummm, he was talking about the ObamaCare lovers, you dolt! You know, the same stupid people who voted for it when Pelosi said, ‘we can’t let you we what is in in (the bill) until we pass it”. Now what kind of sense does THAT make? Only to stupid Democrats. Incredible.

            Reply
          8. jtxl September 20, 2015

            you can actually go to healthcare.gov to read the law in it’s entirety. It is not very long in itself as the law. The very long part which is the part Pelosi referenced (- is all the details of how it would be implemented such as the forms and the offices which would handle different parts and the procedures to implement the law.- ) We had the details of what the law covered before the vote. It has been available for years on the healthcare.gov site so if you don’t know what it says, that is your own fault for not reading it and instead watching cat videos.
            The actual law is very short and says we get affordable healthcare and have the protection of not being dropped for getting sick or having a pre-existing condition or that maximum limits can not disqualify you from treatment. It says that the insurance companies can no longer price gouge us and are only allowed between 25-30% profit margin which is fair compared to the former 80%+ profits from ripping off policy holders. If the policy holder has not been sick all year, they get part of their premiums refunded.

            Reply
          9. Harbinger08 September 20, 2015

            Gruber was talking about the people would object to the ACA because they were easily manipulated against it and were too stupid and uninformed to understand the improvement it really was. That describes you perfectly. Besides, the ACA is just a step in setting up a single payer system that will be in the direction of opening Medicare for all US residents. The insurance companies agreed to go along with the ACA and not fight to block it if they were allowed to suck on the public’s neck for a few more years. Once the Clinton administration starts you can be sure they will be working to move that along. The Pelosi “quote” is not a real quote and you clearly don’t understand what she was talking about at the time anyway. And I’m never wounded by insults from trolls that are clearly less intelligent, so you’re wasting your time there. Insult all you want, though, I’m sure it’s the closest thing you can get to having a real life.

            Reply
          10. oldtack September 21, 2015

            “we can’t let you we what is in in(the bill) until we pass it” Wow- your command of the language is ???. It is little wonder why you are so screwed up.
            In the Marine Corp those of your ilk are called dumb F-heads. You fit the bill.

            Reply
          11. petemobtv September 22, 2015

            oh, wow, a typo sends you over the edge. In the marine corps you would be dead from friendly fire….

            Reply
          12. oldtack September 22, 2015

            No F-H typos don’t bother me. It is the non-researched drivel you spew.

            In the Marine corp – you wouldn’t survive the screening process.

            Reply
          13. oldtack September 22, 2015

            petemobtv

            By your comments on this forum I “Assume” you are an ardent conservative Republican trolling an ardent Liberal site. And that’s Okay.

            I don’t know your perception of our present “news” Media but I take all of the ,Liberal or Conservative Stations, with a “grain of Salt”.I think they base their “reporting” to appeal to a certain group whether it be in Politics or Religion. They attract a following which increases their ratings which sells Ads… They pay their “news staff” handsome salaries and in return they reap vast profits. It’s called “Business”.

            As for this present race for the Presidency – it is interesting and will be more so in the coming months on both sides

            I think it is interesting and revealing when I see the front runners all political outsiders. Not one, Trump, Fiorina or Carson are part of the Beltway crowd. I think if we had an outsider in the Democrat “race” we would observe the same thing.

            It displays a general distrust by the mainstream for all Politicians. There is unrest in this Country that eventually will erupt unless cool heads and good leadership emerges.

            Sniping contests are fun sometimes but they really serve no purpose so, with that -Enjoy your pursuits in defense of your political choice and have a good day.-

            Reply
        2. jtxl September 20, 2015

          Do you even know what socialism means? Socialism is where the citizens own nothing ( no home no car no land, even your tools are not yours) and the government divvies up everything as they see fit. If we were socialist, the government would have seized everyone’s homes and businesses and everything else long time ago. What the republicans want is closer to communism where the government/business owners run everything including the media. They kinda float somewhere between fascism and communism. They want the worst of both.

          Reply
          1. charleo1 September 20, 2015

            No, they really don’t know what Socialism is. They’ve been taught it’s the boogyman. They have a lot of those bug-a-boos, Communism, public schools, unions, scientists, and also things that go bump in the night. It’s all fairly Medieval, and feudalistic.
            They dream of a billionaire king to protect them.

            Reply
          2. jtxl September 21, 2015

            I still haven’t found any of them who would willingly give up their SSI or medicare. They do however want to take it from the next generations and continue to make them pay. They always use 50 as the cut off age but what about the 49yr and 11 month old person who paid benefits? will they get a full cash refund of all of the FICA they paid in? right. Will they give refunds to same sex couples since they want to keep them from taking part in full marriage benefits through ssi? or Taxes or inheritance rights? No they want to collect the cash and not give them full citizenship. The saddest part is that their minds are so simple that they believe the fairy tale that a king will rush to their rescue and take care of them. Actual history is that the kings took and took and then took the rest. Most people were not eligible to own land and nobody got a vote on anything. After years of asking republicans to help me understand their thought processes, the only conclusion I can make is that the republican party has openly been racist and implemented racist policies and they will sell their next 10 generations for the honor of watching darkie being abused in every ugly sort of way.

            Reply
      2. jtxl September 20, 2015

        I finally had to walk away from friends because it is all republican where I live. They have no clue what they are actually voting for but love to blame President Obama when they loose benefits. One woman went into a tirade over he daughter not being able to use the free women’s clinic anymore. Her daughter has a lot of serious issues down there like cancer. So the mother goes into a rage that it’s Obama’s fault. All I can do is tell her that it happened because that is what she voted for when she voted for a republican governor who ran on the platform of denying medicaid funds- the very funds that were taking care of her and her cancer and other female issues. She voted to close all those clinics. There was medical transport to a teaching hospital a few hours away. It wasn’t free but everyone paid some and it was great when someone needed a procedure and could not drive. The riders voted republican and blame President Obama. It was these same medicaid funds refused that partially funded this program. After having advised a family for 2 years that when her husband was eligible for medicare, to steer clear of the private republican advantage plans because her husband would lose his medical treatments, she signed him up for an advantage plan and complained that Obama took her husband’s medicine. I had to actually get in to a pretty loud argument with her so her husband at least looked in to my advice and found that I was right, that Medicare did cover him and he kept his doctor. She never did get it that her husband was diagnosed with rheumatoid after the early parts of the affordable healthcare act took effect. At a very high price of $1000 per month, he was covered and was able to fill his $4000 per month enbrel prescription only because of the law- my family couldn’t get insurance before because once you were diagnosed, you would be dropped right away or as soon as the treatments that didn’t work started damaging organs. Without the afordable care act, he would have not had coverage because it would be considered a pre-existing condition. How do we fight this stupidity? I’m surrounded by it and I don’t think I have been able to change anyone’s mind. It absolutely looks like they are willing to sell the future of generations of their grandchildren to stick it to the scary black man who wants to rape them- Racism is so much deeper than anyone wants to admit.

        Reply
        1. Susan McGraw Keber September 20, 2015

          The very issues the constituents of the GOP / Tea Party are most in need of or concerned about are being taken away by the party they remain loyal to. Why these people don’t see this is odd. The GOP party is NOTHING like it used to be…it is run by Tea Party fanatics. Take from the poor and middle class and keep taking until they’re unable to get ahead at all. Keep the people poor and uneducated and strip them of their legal rights…that is what today’s GOP party stands for…and it is the billionaires who are running the country…not the GOP or Tea Party…they are merely the conduits of the billionaires who use them as puppets to do their work. Power is money. We have an oligarchy…we need to educate the poor and middle class. Sadly the south is where you find the headstrong who don’t see the truth. America is an amalgamation of immigrants from all over the world. We are under siege and must vote for candidates that understand they represent the people and not corporations or billionaires. This is why Citizens United MUST be overturned.

          Reply
          1. jtxl September 20, 2015

            I wish I had downloaded and saved a video of some republican somewhere getting a lot of tea party support for reminiscing about the good old days when you could get paid with company tokens and the employer would provide everything you needed. He was saying that this was a freedom lost because of the policies democrats. Sure I am ok with being blamed for saving workers the horror of having their entire lives controlled by their boss and to have been kept in deep debt because the company store cost more than their paychecks. Total and complete insanity.

            Reply
    3. jesse September 20, 2015

      Drinking the tea mixed with STUPID?

      Reply
      1. petemobtv September 20, 2015

        Umm…no….But if you don’t see how the Democrats are destroying the country I guess you are one of those voters who Jonathan Gruber described so eloquently (and aptly) as stupid. And how is ObamaCare working for you, dim wit? Hillary and her emails and server? Gawwd, Democrats are dumb. So dumb that they don’t even realize they are turning our country towards Communism. Democrats are a disease that must be eradicated.

        Reply
        1. jtxl September 20, 2015

          The only shortfalls in the patient protection and affordable healthcare law is that the republicans blocked the public option allowing everyone the ability to buy medicare which is non profit. The republican options ie: those medicare advantage plans they think is a great alternative to medicare and national healthcare do not cover chronic illnesses like autoimmune diseases which have skyrocketed because of the pollution in our air, water and foods. Those private plans do not cover these medicines or the doctors who treat them. I know, I have this medical issue.

          Reply
          1. petemobtv September 20, 2015

            And, undoubtedly, you are one of those nuts who rail against Big Pharma……Can’t see the forest for the trees….

            Reply
          2. jtxl September 20, 2015

            only when they are ripping us off. I get my medicine at a big discount but for others I can reference several medications that have been around over 50yrs and were affordable at less than $20 per month that are now each over $100 per month. We have to get the law dropped that bush2 put in not allowing medicare to negotiate drug prices like every other country in the entire world. We are the only country that must use taxpayer money to pay whatever price the drug companies ask for no matter if it is a fair price or not. The ONLY country so we are subsidizing the entire world at the expense of the American taxpayers. The imuno-suppressant drugs now saving lives research was paid for with over 100 million dollars government grant in just the 1st installment but these drugs cost over $4000 per month and the same drug in Canada costs a fraction because they negotiate.

            Reply
          3. Harbinger08 September 20, 2015

            Jxtl, dont waste your time trying to reason with primitives like pete here. The only thing they are interested in is the enjoyment they get from being obnoxious. Instead, ignore them and put your energy towards crushing them and everything they stand for out of existence in the upcoming election. Like the racists of the Old South defeat is the only language they understand. Cooperation is not in their vocabulary.

            Reply
          4. jtxl September 20, 2015

            thanks Harbinger08, it’s like these idiots think that if the repeat the lies enough, a Bush will show up on their doorstep with 20 million dollars and become their best friend. It’s really hard to fathom the depth of stupidity and hate.

            Reply
        2. jtxl September 20, 2015

          My family has a small business and because my mother had rheumatoid arthritis, no insurance would cover her or any employees. Now the family and employees have access to affordable healthcare. Are you saying that when you become eligible for ssi and medicare, you will refuse the benefits because they are commie? First of all what stupid republicans like yourself call entitlements and socialist and communist, are benefits we pay in to separately from our taxes. These are insurance policies and they are earned, not a handout. Any shortfalls are because the republicans love to drain the saving and not replace the money or the interest it would have earned. Both JFK and Johnson borrowed money from the fund but they were as one time withdrawals with a set payback date with interest. Reagan pushed through legislation to drain the fund any time they want with no payback. Reagan emptied the fund and it wasn’t until Bill Clinton returned the money only to have bush drain it again. How is obamacare working for me? My family finally has health coverage. For generations we could not get insurance because rheumatoid arthritis runs in the family. Very few get the very destructive form but all of us were denied coverage. I paid $50 per week for my portion of a pepsico self insurance but I was not covered for anything they could theoretically link to arthritis or auto immune diseases because that was a preexisting condition because it is genetic so we were born with it. The only things covered for me was an ear infection and pinkeye. I eventually had to leave the job because I did have arthritis and the early intervention that would have been cheap and easy was denied.
          Democrats are destroying this country? How about the republicans have already destroyed the country and the democrats are fighting to save us. Reagan sold us out by hiring a scientist to formulate crack to poison American citizens and stop the civil rights movement. He then used his drug money to finance both sides of wars in Nicaragua and the middle east. Reagan financed the rise of the ayatollah extremists to overthrow Iran which was educated, progressive and a beautiful vacation destination. Reagan paid to have our American hostages held until he took office. All proved in the iran/contra drugs for guns congressional hearings but because reagan was senile, he could not be jailed. This all worked so well, bush’s 1&2 also dipped in to the future of our country financing wars which funneled trillions of tax dollars through halliburton which we have no accounting for. The few at the top are collecting trillions of our tax dollars- this is republican policy- perpetual war while our infrastructure and education quality crumbles. You are a perfect example of the lack of quality in education since you are not able to grasp the differences between a government for the people/ by the people and communism. You just repeat whatever the latest lie of the day is and do not seem capable of critical thinking. Critical thinking- you know that pesky thing where you look at actual facts and weigh both sides and make decisions for yourself. I know it must be sooo hard for you with your undeveloped republican brain. Here’s another fact, brain scans have proved that republicans make their political decisions using a tiny place deep in the brain that rules fear response while democrats use the parts of their brains used for higher thinking.

          Reply
          1. petemobtv September 20, 2015

            Ha! You are funny!!! And totally uninformed. Oh, by the way, access to health care is not in the Constitution. Sorry you have bad genes, but it is not my fault and I should not have to pay for it.

            Reply
          2. jtxl September 20, 2015

            more stupidity, When there is early intervention, it is easily controlled and cheaply controlled. The reality is that it makes me immune to cancer. It is not bad genes, it is a gift that we have learned to control. Some people still get cancer but there are types of chemical exposures that nobody can fight. I have more T-cells than I need and they are supercharged. I have not had even a cold or flu since I was a child. What science has learned from studying rheumatoid and psoriatic arthritis is what is going to cure cancer. It was not about being entitled to healthcare but that the insurance companies were scamming policy holders by denying coverage by making a 80% profit margin by ripping off policy holders. I was forced to pay for pepsico insurance even though it would not cover me.

            Reply
          3. jtxl September 20, 2015

            what you are too stupid to get is that we have already paid when the emergency rooms are filled with people using it as their primary care doctor. We already pay for it when people have to go on disability because they did not get early intervention treatment that would have kept them in the workforce paying taxes. Who do you think paid for my 80,000 reconstructive surgery when private insurance that was paid for would not cover it? Taxpayers paid for it. Because of this bull crap, we have been way down the list of countries that are the best places to live for a very long time.

            Reply
          4. petemobtv September 20, 2015

            Why don’t you move to those great countries and then you can find out how great socialized medicine really is….IF you live long enough while waiting to get it. You obviously have never spent much time out of the country.

            Reply
          5. jtxl September 20, 2015

            I am on medicare and my socialized medicare is absolutely great and the reason I am alive. I only wish everyone had the same opportunities I do.

            Reply
          6. TZToronto September 20, 2015

            In Canada, the “medicine” is not socialized, but the insurance is.

            Reply
          7. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

            Your tour on Gilligan’s Island is not what I would call having tangible knowledge of other countries. Although in your bubble world it might suffice but not here in the real world.

            Reply
          8. KnoKnees September 22, 2015

            1. Australia, ranked 1st last year. It seems that a sense of community is what makes Australians happy because they spend an average of six minutes a day volunteering well above the OECD average. Also, 65% of citizens have helped a stranger, which is above the OECD average of 47%.
            2. Norway, ranked 5th last year. Norway really doesn’t believe money doesn’t buy happiness as the average citizen rates their happiness a 7.6 out of ten (one of the higher rates in the OECD), yet the average household worth is $6,197. This number is below the OECD average of $36,238.3.
            3. United States, ranked 7th last year. When it comes to the American dream, money seems to be the key. Surprisingly, Americans have the largest amount of disposable income on the list. The average American makes $38,000 after taxes, where as the OECD average is $22,387.

            Reply
          9. charleo1 September 20, 2015

            You do realize most people in this Country are trying to have a civilization fit for raising children? And we will, whether you like it or not.

            Reply
          10. TZToronto September 20, 2015

            “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a
            more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility,
            provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare . . .” What are those last four words again?

            Reply
          11. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

            Where is your proof to the contrary?
            You don’t even know what’s in the Constitution so how do you know that it cannot be interpreted as being there?
            No one is asking you to pay for anything. You are just over estimating your worth to the country.

            Reply
          12. plc97477 September 21, 2015

            He is also over estimating his worth to the Nation Memo.

            Reply
          13. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

            Too True!!!

            Reply
        3. jtxl September 20, 2015

          you are absolutely stupid- Hillary did nothing illegal and in fact by using her own server kept everything safer with all the hackers and insiders leaking information, no one was able to hack Hillary’s server- much safer. Not illegal- where is this outrage that Colin Powell and Condaleza rice also used private email? Where is your outrage that under the direction of bush2, carl rove deleted hundreds of sensitive pentagon emails on government servers? Get your sh..t together idiot, know your facts.

          Reply
          1. petemobtv September 20, 2015

            A true believer…..Your head is so far up your @$$ you will never be able to pull it out. Talk about knowing facts…..

            Reply
          2. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

            Present some facts that back up your asinine claims.

            Reply
          3. KnoKnees September 22, 2015

            “I promise 100% transparency in my administration.”.

            “I promise NO NEW TAXES on a family making less than $250K a year.”.

            “I will allow 5 days of public comment before I sign any bills.”.

            “I will remove earmarks before I sign any bill.”.

            “I will end Income Tax for seniors making less than $50K a year.”.

            “I’ll put the Health Care negotiations on CSPAN so everyone can see who is at the table!”

            “I’ll have no lobbyists in my administration.”

            “I’ll close Guantanamo Bay.”

            “I’ll resign if I don’t cut the deficit in half by the end of four years.”

            “I believe marriage is between one man and one woman.”

            “I won’t seek re-election unless unemployment falls below 5%.”

            “I’ll unite the people of this great country.”

            “If you like your insurance you can keep it”

            “If you like your doctor you can keep it

            Reply
          4. petemobtv September 22, 2015

            Notice you got no response from these Democrats. They are BRAIN DEAD.

            Reply
          5. TheSkalawag929 September 22, 2015

            Yawn… Most of what you just listed was either blocked or negated by recalcitrant republican ideological stubbornness with the main goal of making this president fail rather than work of the good of the people and the country. This is evidenced by the fact that on the evening of Obama’s inauguration then republican leaders from the house met to block everything that newly elected President Obama would propose.

            http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/06/08/1098434/-Eric-Cantor-Paul-Ryan-Kevin-McCarthy-Plot-To-Sabotage-US-Economy-with-Frank-Luntz

            http://swampland.time.com/2012/08/23/the-party-of-no-new-details-on-the-gop-plot-to-obstruct-obama/

            If you want to take pride in that then go ahead it just shows how shallow YOU are.

            Reply
          6. KnoKnees September 22, 2015

            Yawn. Still 100% of it is well documented, undisputed quotes made by Obama.
            I’d love to hear how republicans somehow “blocked” him from being transparent (while his administration regularly ignoring FOIR’s), forced him to have lobbyists in his administration, blocked him from allowing 5-days of public comments before signing any bills (while Congress isn’t even provided any input), how Republicans blocked Obama from ending Income Tax for seniors making less than $50K, how they blocked him from closing Guantanamo Bay, and best of all, how did those ever-so-crafty Republicans (having zero input in the matter) manage to block people from keeping their own insurance plans and their personal doctors when they liked them?
            Your wholly biased opinion bears no facsimile to reality. Nor does pride have anything whatsoever to do with the facts. Now please go back to sleep

            Reply
          7. TheSkalawag929 September 23, 2015

            I will grant you that the President did over promise on some things to get elected but that’s par for the political course. All politicians do that and he is a politician.
            How did Republicans blocked Obama from ending Income Tax for seniors making less than $50K?
            By not allowing President Obama to raise taxes on the top 1% he was unable to end income taxes for seniors making less than $50K.
            “…how did they blocked him from closing Guantanamo Bay,”
            http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/dec/8/congress-deals-death-blow-gitmo-closure/?page=all
            As to the insurance plans that people were not able to keep they were junk plans that didn’t provide the coverage that people thought they were paying for and really not worth the paper they were written on. Their main purpose was to make insurance companies richer. If you want to complain about that then go right ahead.
            Yes I admit that I am bias, as are you. And yes pride does play a part. It causes republicans like you to distort and or ignore facts. I won’t bother to give you any examples because you will just distort or ignore them.
            Oh and you might want to look up some of your words before you use them (facsimile) that way you’ll look more like you know what you’re talking about.

            Reply
          8. KnoKnees September 23, 2015

            Facsimile:
            1. replica, likeness. duplicate.

            I’ve always been an independent voter and have voted both ways, whenever I deemed it to be appropriate. I’ve always voted for the individual, not the party.
            Unlike most people my bias is against all “career” Politian’s. Because they all do lie to get elected. Therein lies the basis of my bias.
            A previous commenter asked for (facts) e.g., examples of Obama administration lies. I simply provided a very small sampling of the countless well documented lies perpetuated by this administration. Those are the facts. To say otherwise is disingenuous. Therefore, I obviously do know what I’m talking about.

            Reply
          9. TheSkalawag929 September 23, 2015

            “Facsimile..:” If it works for you. I think likeness would have been a better first choice of words.
            “I’ve always been an independent voter …” If you say so.
            If you’re satisfied that your list fulfills the commenter’s request then good. I disagree.

            Reply
          10. KnoKnees September 23, 2015

            “Facsimile” specifically conforms with Webster’s definition, as referenced in meaning “a likeness.” Therefore it conforms nicely with known word usage rules, regardless of your personal preferences.

            I’ll quote you: “It causes republicans like you to distort and or ignore facts. I won’t bother to give you any examples because you will just distort or ignore them.”

            I’m not, nor ever have been a registered Republican or Democrat. More so, you’re clearly the one attempting to distort and/or ignore the examples of the facts I previously provided to you.

            Just a little hypocritical, if I’d say so..

            Reply
          11. TheSkalawag929 September 24, 2015

            ‘I’m not, nor ever have been a registered …” As I said previously, if you say so. It really makes little difference to me. I’m just pointing out that for someone who is so vehement in his denial you sure do seem to espouse the republican party line and talking points quite readily.

            Reply
          12. KnoKnees September 24, 2015

            When did recounting factual, well documented quotes somehow become construed as “espousing the Republican party line?”

            And I simply corrected your baseless assumption that I was a Republican. And since you continue to imply that I am, you must actually know me better than I know myself.

            It must be true, if you say so.

            Reply
          13. TheSkalawag929 September 24, 2015

            Yes it is.

            Reply
          14. joe schmo October 8, 2015

            Yes, we know. The emperor is a lying moron.

            Reply
          15. SecludedCompound September 28, 2015

            Yeah, but what about the part where Hillary isn’t being investigate for any criminal activity? What about the part where everything you say about her is a fabrication that you’re too stupid to recognize as such?

            Reply
          16. petemobtv September 28, 2015

            Of COURSE it is all made up. Of course it is…isn’t it time for you to go to bed now little fella? The Sandman is on his way.

            Reply
        4. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

          Other than inside your pea brain how are Democrats destroying the country.
          ObamaCare is working quite nicely for me. Thank you very much for asking.
          You seem to personify what has become the republican mantra. If the truth doesn’t back up your claims make sh>t up that will.

          Reply
        5. Cypher September 21, 2015

          The oligarchs are sitting back and laughing at you people squabbling over Democrat vs Republican. Its the old “divide and conquer” that is as old as the Roman Empire. Pull yourself out of the matrix and open your eyes. They own both parties.

          Reply
          1. jtxl September 21, 2015

            they may own a few of the democrats but I have a lot of experience with democrats in office who are fighting every day to make our lives better and suffering the consequences. I have a lot of experience with democrat candidates who are running so we can stop the bleeding the republicans cause. They don’t own everybody and they don’t own Hillary ad they don’t own Bernie and they don’t own Elizabeth.

            Reply
          2. KnoKnees September 22, 2015

            They don’t own Hillary ad they don’t own Bernie and they don’t own Elizabeth because nobody in their right mind would even consider such an unimaginably horribly thing! The “bleeding” you refer to is solely the responsibility of the party currently in charge. Hint: that’s not the Republicans.

            Reply
        6. anothertoothpick September 23, 2015

          The Obama doing a bad job at destroying the country.

          Well, after 12 million new jobs, a stock market that has more than doubled, deficits that have been cut by two-thirds, health care inflation at the lowest rate in nearly 50 years, manufacturing coming back, auto industry coming back, clean energy doubled.

          Reply
        7. jesse September 24, 2015

          Hahahahaha! You would not know a Communist if he or she bit you on your butt! I see your brain has been eradicated from your head!

          Reply
      2. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

        I’d say petemobtv is consuming copious amounts of stupid with just a hint of tea.

        Reply
        1. jesse September 24, 2015

          Yes it is destroying the little brain cells he has left!

          Reply
    4. jtxl September 21, 2015

      Pro America?? seriously? the republicans are responsible for the lost generations to crack, to the lost thousands to made up wars to funnel trillions of dollars thru halliburton to themselves by financing both sides of wars in the middle east. They are using fracking to poison entire counties and leaving the homeowners hanging when there is no clean drinking water and whole towns are being eaten by sink holes and earthquakes. Homeowners are not getting paid for the loss of their homes and the illness of their children. They are actually fighting right now to take more native American land for strip mining and on and on and on

      Reply
      1. joe schmo October 8, 2015

        LOL, who got us in to the Vietnam War? Who owned Huey? Who got us out of Vietnam?

        We started that escapade in the ME and should have seen it through. We should never have gone in and killed all the small dictators.
        The XL pipeline has nothing to do with fracking in this country.
        While we implement alternative energy, we need to use our energy resources until the others are transitioned into place.

        Reply
    5. Sand_Cat October 9, 2015

      Keep projecting, idiot. You and your friends obviously hate everything about the USA that differentiates it from the dictators and lunatics we face overseas. All you can do is take all of your rotten traits and project them on those who oppose you.

      Reply
  19. petemobtv September 20, 2015

    The National Memo…..This media is a joke! Amazing, the idiots below that swallow this crap. Democrats really are incredibly dumb. Jonathan Gruber is right. And he is on YOUR side! That ought to tell you something….

    Reply
    1. TheSkalawag929 September 21, 2015

      Opinions are not proof. So far ALL YOU have is your opinions and they ought to be flushed along with all the GOP crap that is being thrust upon the American public.

      Reply
    2. SecludedCompound September 28, 2015

      Please rebut the specifics that are in this article, if you can.

      Reply
    3. joe schmo October 8, 2015

      They are ‘useful idiots.’

      The term “useful idiot” is thought to have been coined by communist mass murderer Vladimir Lenin. It describes naive communist sympathizers in the West (liberals). While Lenin and the Soviets held these stupidd liberals in utter contempt, they also saw them as useful tools for dispensing propaganda.

      You will often find useful idiots (aka liberals) lounging about in a Starbucks with friends, discussing the shortcomings of America over a frappuccino. Useful idiots are a mix of urban hipsters, brainwashed college kids, busy bodies, self righteous do-gooders, silver pony-tailed hippies, (now college professors), quirky wannabe-intellectuals, hysterical females, girly-men, and Michael Moore devotees.

      Useful Idiot Liberals aren’t necessarily bad people, and in many cases, are exceptionally warm and kind hearted. Many have high IQ’s and hold advanced degrees. They can hold files full of factoids in their brains, but lack the capacity to weave them together to find a coherent pattern. Though they fancy themselves as “free thinkers”, they are actually the most authority worshipping (politically correct) and servile creatures you will ever meet. When it comes to independent critical thought, they are astonishingly stupid …..and very dangerous! Liberals are “the unwitting hand maidens of the Communists.”

      Reply
      1. Sand_Cat October 9, 2015

        Wow, very impressive. You guys are “useless idiots.”

        Reply
  20. John Murchison September 21, 2015

    It is truely frustrating to see pols lie continuously and deliberately with few to call them out. And when they are called out, we rarely get an acknowledgement of ever being wrong.

    Reply
  21. Sterling Harris September 21, 2015

    Trump insisted that life-saving vaccines cause autism, complete with anecdotal “proof” from an “employee” whose “beautiful baby” contracted a fever and then “became autistic” after being vaccinated.

    Not only did Trump concoct that sad story, but there is little doubt that his own children, including little Barron Trump, have received proper vaccinations. (Manhattan private schools don’t accept the unvaccinated.) Disgracefully, neither of the two physicians on stage, Rand Paul and Ben Carson, had the guts to forcefully contradict him.

    Try as they will to reject Trump, he fits in perfectly among Republicans – and not only because he worships money, spews xenophobic nonsense, and encourages callous bigotry. Like them, he relies on fabrications and falsehoods, manipulating the prejudices of ill-informed voters.

    The Republican rejection of reality – which these candidates will act out in debate after debate for months to come – inflicts grave costs on this country every day. It is hard to imagine the damage that will be done if one of these deceivers comes to

    Reply
    1. Sand_Cat September 24, 2015

      OK, you can cut and paste. We’re all suitably impressed.

      Reply
      1. joe schmo October 8, 2015

        You never even do that. You people usually say nothing…. So what’s your point.

        Reply
        1. Sand_Cat October 9, 2015

          Why should we bother to have futile arguments with die-hard political blockheads? That’s as good a point as any you’ve ever made.

          Reply
  22. petemobtv September 22, 2015

    To all you very, very stupid, low information Democrats: What would YOU know about truth as you continue to support the greatest liars of them all….Obama, Clinton, and Kerry? Your brainwashing is complete; you don’t recognize that they are destroying the country.

    Reply
    1. anothertoothpick September 23, 2015

      A new study from the nonpartisan Center For Media Affairs has concluded that since the beginning of President Obama’s second term, Republicans have lied three times more often than Democrats.

      The Center For Media Affairs (CFMA) at George Mason University found that PolitiFact rated Republican claims as false three times more often than Democratic claims. Not only do Republicans lie more often, but Democrats are more truthful. By a 2 to 1 margin (22%-11%) PolitiFact rated Democratic statements as completely true. The CFMA also found that, “A majority of Democratic statements (54%) were rated as mostly or entirely true, compared to only 18% of Republican statements. Conversely, a majority of Republican statements (52%) were rated as mostly or entirely false, compared to only 24% of Democratic statements. Despite controversies over Obama administration statements regarding Benghazi, the IRS and the Associated Press, Republicans have continued to fare worse than Democrats, with 60% of their claims rated as false so far this month (May 1 – May 22), compared to 29% of Democratic statements – a 2 to 1 margin.”

      Reply
      1. Sand_Cat September 24, 2015

        Nice thought, but you’re wasting your time giving him facts. That’s a dirty word to the GOP.

        Reply
        1. anothertoothpick September 24, 2015

          I cannot let their stupid posts stand without pointing out how ignorant these scum of the earth are.

          Reply
          1. Sand_Cat September 24, 2015

            Yes, I have the same weakness: I answered him, too.

            Reply
          2. anothertoothpick September 24, 2015

            Today’s republican lies become tomorrows half truths become the next day fact.

            Good for you _Cat.

            Reply
    2. Sand_Cat September 24, 2015

      Nice brainless parroting of GOP lies and BS, projecting their (and your) own faults on someone else.
      But why should we have any different expectations from a zero-information idiot who buys the GOP party line?

      Reply
    3. SecludedCompound September 28, 2015

      We know enough to know that when there are specific instances of people telling untruths that you ignoramuses can’t refute, so you appeal to generalities and ad hominem.

      Reply
      1. joe schmo October 8, 2015

        You have the most corrupt liar running for president ever! It’s so frickin obvious what she did and you people are still in denial.

        Reply
        1. SecludedCompound October 9, 2015

          Please list the instances in which President Obama has been investigated and found to have committed this “Corruption”.

          Anxiously awaiting your response.

          Reply

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